Scottish show disrespect for dead pope

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,Leadfingers
Date: 20 Apr 05 - 06:22 PM

Come on El Ted ! Have a go at this one !

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Apr 05 - 06:45 PM

Ya guess we're not real big on Iti's and poles.

Maybe you criminal and cowardly races would like to come up for a wee chat pursuant to this.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: kendall
Date: 19 Apr 05 - 08:16 AM

My experience of the Scots is that they are generous, kind, humourous and very decent folks.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: The Curator
Date: 18 Apr 05 - 03:34 PM

Don't know you Gibson, but anyone I have spoken to knows you. As for your hope that I get a rash, I doubt I have slept with anyone known to you.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: robomatic
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 10:58 PM

Now, (entirely voluntarilly), I wish to state that on a personal level I would have had no trouble keeping quiet for a minute, out of respect for the Pope as a man who did more good than harm, and also out of respect for those who saw him as their religious leader. Hearing a few yobs making rude remarks would not have boiled my blood, however. If, for example, there was a tragedy and we were having a moment of silence for someone in the American leadership, a few yob remarks would have definitely got my blood up.

Make of this what you will, it's my honest reaction. I guess what I'm most concerned about is how by attendance at a sporting event I may be subjected to an experience which will leave a bad taste in my mouth. But perhaps that's one of the risks one takes when one is part of a society.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Big Mick
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 10:56 PM

Tam, you should not speak of what you are ignorant of. I am a Catholic. I don't worship any man, other than Jesus Christ who was a man. Given that you are a born again Christian, I would presume you worship the same.

This the type of rhetoric that causes great grief, and it is ignorant.

Mick

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Once Famous
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 10:38 PM

I hope you all get a rash.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Tam the man
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 07:04 AM

I forgot the curator,

I hope you have a good day as well.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Tam the man
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 06:59 AM

Thank you

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: The Curator
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 06:50 AM

Agreed, Enjoy your day.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Tam the man
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 06:45 AM

The Queen is not the head of my faith God is.

I don't worship any man or woman unlike Catholics or Protestants, I worship God.

who do you worship eh! any this is bloody stupid, acting like children you have your faith and I have mine. You have beliefs and I have mine.

As I said let bygones be bygones.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Tam the man
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 04:44 AM

Anyway I'm fed up with this, this is like wee weans and as from now I don't anymore to do with it, enough is enough, if you want to bicker about the Pope and the people who didn't show respect for the Pope then go ahead.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Tam the man
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 04:41 AM

I am a born again Christian so I'm neither Protestant or Catholic.
there will be some out there who will say but are you a Protestant or Catholic Born again Christian, these are the bigots and fools in Scotland and else were.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,Murray on Salt Spring
Date: 17 Apr 05 - 12:47 AM

Robo is quite right on most counts. The response of the crowd [how many?] was not polite, and maybe out of place; but then the request for silence was also out of place. Those who compare the Pope to malign folk like Hitler are not so far off the mark. JPII was a bigoted hard-line conservative who didn't like the reforms of his church and made several plain statements (armed with Papal infallibility, no less) that tried to turn the clock back. Look it up.

That said, I as a football-scorning Scot have to deprecate the hooligans who made rude noises. As someone else says above there's a lot of sheer stupidity from football roughnecks, and European clubs have as poor an opinion of British fans as the world does of Bush.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: The Curator
Date: 16 Apr 05 - 08:26 AM

What has the Pope to do with Scotaland,you ask. There is a sizable number of Catholics living in Scotland, agree ? These Catholics held Pope John Paul as their spirtual leader, which is not against the law. Agree ? I am sure there have been people who died over the years who you may not have known in person, but respected and admired for their work. You would maybe want to express your sadness at their loss in public. This was the reason those responsible for this football match allowed a one minute silence. The man who died had almost 5 million at his funeral, and countless watching it on television, so he must have been pretty well liked. The Scottish people are allowed to express their sadness, sadly some Scottish people felt they should not be allowed to do so.What the Pope has to do with Scotland is, he was loved by Catholics living in Scotland. What has he to do with Scottish Football ? A sizable number of those in attendance at the match in question loved the man, hence the club respected their grief. That's your answer and I hope you understand it. I would like to add as an Irish Republican who many dislike on this site, If in the event Queen Elizabeth died, I would have no problem at all taking part in a one minute silence, to recall and respect her death. I may not agree with the actions of her government, but as her passing would leave the hearts of many who loved her feeling heavy, I would show a marked respect.I saw Scottish soldiers remove their glengarry's once as the funeral of a dead Irish Republican passed by them. There is professional respect and there is bigoted bastards. Where do you stand ?

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Tam the Bam (Nutter)
Date: 16 Apr 05 - 03:55 AM

If I lived in South Ireland for example then I would respect their laws and beliefs, however some Catholics want to Marjorty which are Protestants, of which I'm neither, I am not a Catholic or Protestant, but I do respect their beliefs and Laws, And as I have said what has the Pope got to with Scotland or Scottish football, not one person has answered that question, they talk about Bonnie Prince Charlie or Henry the eighth or something else which has nothing to do with Scottish football or Scotland.

Tom
PS I agree with Tam the Man.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Megan L
Date: 15 Apr 05 - 02:52 PM

The only person who showed any sense at culloden was the woman who poured boiling water over her mans feet so he couldn't go.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,anton
Date: 15 Apr 05 - 11:29 AM

As somebody who was a victim of the Catholic church's fascist education system in nineten sixties Britain, I support what Robomac is saying . If I had been at the football match I would have booed as well. To be anti the catholic faith and the church's mediaeval hierarchy is not the same as being anti the catholic people.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,weerover
Date: 15 Apr 05 - 11:05 AM

Haven't visited Mudcat for some time, so missed most of this at the time. The people most to blame for the disgraceful behaviour are the Scottish football Association. I read a few days before that there was to be a minute's silence, and everyone I spoke to agreed that what was going to happen was exactly what happened. Why did the SFA, who must also have known this would happen, go ahead?

wr

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Tam the man
Date: 15 Apr 05 - 10:11 AM

Well Bonnie Prince Charlie didn't win the 1745 rebellion and Henry the eighth did fall out with the church of Rome.

Tom

And that's why Scotland is a Protestant country, This is bloody stupid, I mean who gives a damn, the pope is dead let the dead rest in peace.

Tom

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: mindblaster
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 04:53 PM

Ho ho

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 08:50 AM

Very deep and gnomic as utterances go.
G.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,Tartan Filth
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 08:42 AM

Och why anyone like us, is it because we are the filthiest scum of the earth?

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: robomatic
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 05:31 AM

Giok: Holy Cats! The highlands are filling up with sassenachs?
Guest: As I will credit you with knowing, you're laugh is forced. I get all my history off the telly, and if "Highlander" was at the battle of Culloden, I know about it. Unfortunately in the present era he lives on a boat in France and can't make all the Hearts games. And he would never have disrespected the Pope. During the opening minute of silence, he'd still be in the parking garage fighting for his head.

There can be only one!

And he would never fail to identify himself.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 04:33 AM

It would have been nice if someone who was actually there or at something like it would have chimed in, but the thread filled up with other folks who were not at Culloden, so no help there.

We'll try and dig up someone who was at culloden for you robomatic. Thanks for the best laugh on a thread in a while. History not a strong point eh?

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 14 Apr 05 - 04:29 AM

True enough Robomatic, some highland villages now have in exess of 50% incomer population, while most of the big landowners are also foreign, and I don't mean English. Just local to me we have a large estate owned my Mohammed el Fayed the well known Egyptian grocer, who lives most of the time in Switzerland to avoid UK taxes. Still at least while he's over there our sheep are safe ;~)
Giok

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: robomatic
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 10:51 PM

I made me a rule I wouldn't get back into this thread unless it lasted another 50 ms or more, and for some reason it has.

It would have been nice if someone who was actually there or at something like it would have chimed in, but the thread filled up with other folks who were not at Culloden, so no help there.

I still think it is wrong to foist on the paying and captive public the necessity of honoring whoever the announcer wants. I've been to some public functions where we were supposed to fall silent for 'outrageous' prayer which was certainly not on my behalf. It is frustrating to pay money for attendance at an event and have it 'dedicated' to whatever with no option. It is anti-democratic.
There is usually no appeal. One would think the proper way to protest this is with a letter to the management and a letter to the paper. This costs effort and may not bring satisfaction.

Some folks allege that these kinds of moments of silence are common enough to be well understood, and that it kinda sorta woulda been nice for the predominantly Protestant followers of one club to illustrate sensitivity towards the predominantly Catholic followers of the other. I think whoever was in charge should have exercised more discretion.

It sounds like the actual noise was produced by very few people, so in titling the thread there was a bit of trollery involved.

And if we want to beat on the Scots, it's time to go back to the kilts and sheep jokes. After all, they've been colonized by wankers for a long time, as the bitching GUEST with no name should know.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: podman
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 10:49 PM

They were at a game. I suspect they were showing disrespect for anything that came up. And i also suspect that they wouldn't have been jeering if the Pope was there, he was known as a player wasn't he? And I suspect that wherever he is the Pope don't mind.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: mindblaster
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 09:08 PM

Aye!

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: akenaton
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 05:16 PM

Just a couple of points, I agree with Joe Offer, it was unbelievably stupid to ask for two minutes silence at a Hearts--Celtic game.
Hearts fans are the Edinburgh version of Glasgow Rangers supporters,who are are among the most enlightened, cultured and reasonable people on the planet.
They discuss literature, theology and philosophy at great length, and would find it extremely difficult to interrupt the thought process for more than a few seconds.

The other point is that sectarianism--bigotry-- religious hatred, is not a minority sport in Scotland but is in fact practiced to great effect and with no small measure of skill by the vast majority of the population. Different factions having their own musical genres and fancy dress.
Every so often ,high spirited punching kicking and knifing games can be observed in the streets of Glasgow,as the young bucks of the city show off their skills.

Visitors from other galaxies would be well advised to avoid dates like July 12th, as these youths have been known to consume up to two bottles of non alcoholic lager on this date ....to highten the buzz....Ake

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Donuel
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 04:27 PM

The Pope's last words

http://www.theonion.com/news/index.php?issue=4115

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Once Famous
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 03:59 PM

Guest, you are right. And on top of that he leaves lawyer slime when he stands up from a chair.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 02:16 PM

I've seen 'em... you'd NEED a broad brush to paint most of them...

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: DougR
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 02:06 PM

It appears to me the poster is painting the Scots people with a mighty broad brush.

DougR

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: The Curator
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 11:59 AM

The Ginger coloured piss is called Scotch.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,paddy
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 10:50 AM

Yes and Whiskey was invented by the Irish.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,Taff
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 08:31 AM

Being Welsh myself, I must agree that the scotch are really just english with funny accents and skirts.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 07:29 AM

Yes I know the sad story of Scots on both sides at Culloden Hughie, but the argument was that if the mostly Scottish side under BPC had won over the Scots/English side the likely outcome would have been a Catholic Scotland.
Giok.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,Scotsmac
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 07:28 AM

Did you know that piss from a ginger person is stronger than from a normal one?

They used to pay a penny a gallon for human piss and sixpence for ginger piss. It was used in the wool industry.

Scotch ginger and proud - that's me!

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,Hughie
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 07:14 AM

A couple of pedantic points. The Queen is not the head of the Scottish Church and Culloden was not between the English and Scots as it was more like a civil war with many 'scotch bastards' fighting on the government side.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST,wholenut
Date: 13 Apr 05 - 06:43 AM

Scotland is not a real country - it's north england. The scotch have always kissed england's arse. Unlike the Irish who had the courage to kick the english out. All the scotch that i have met in my life have been tight fisted, mean, scheming, arrogant, english worshippers. It does not surprise me that they behaved in such an obnoxious manner, it's in their scotch nature.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 08:06 PM

Jaysus Martin Gibson,
Now I understand why you can't stand Richard Bridge.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 07:07 PM

Pope was leader of a sect that has spawned some of the ugliest religious violence and sexual abuse in history.   He also abused his religious standing to interfere in internal politics in the USSR (compare US views about non-Christian religous leaders who pontificate (choice of word intended) on internal US civil matters). His teachings on birth control condemned thousands to lingering deaths and/or miserable lives.

Ought we universally to revere him simply because he is dead? Compare the hypothetical requests for silence for Hitler, or Hussein, or Pol Pot (etc, etc)? Certainly some deserve to be vilified as well after as before death.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 06:43 PM

Anyone can sell their principles for a peaceful minute. Some of us can't.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 06:27 PM

Gosh another one who would have trouble remaining quiet for a minute. Do you spend all day booing and hissing at everything you don't agree with?

I am sure alot of football fans there have no papal leanings one way or the other, but out of respect to the majority who obviously did, they managed to stay quiet.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 06:16 PM

Silences at football matches should be to do with football matters. I too would have found it profoundly difficult to maintain silence for a man responsible for so many things I thought wrong and backward. I would find it difficult to maintain a public silence for anyone associated with religion. And why should I? Belief is a choice I choose not to make, or honour.
I took my hat off and stood silent for the passing of Stanley Matthews

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: The Curator
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 05:21 PM

Tam the man do you feel the large Catholic community living in Scotland has no place there ? should they shut their mouths and not follow their faith ? I am not being funny, but in your words Scotland is a Protestant country and the Pope has nothing to do with Scotland.I am an Irish Republican and proud of it, but if the Queen who is the head of your faith died in the morning and I was asked to observe a moment of respect I would have no problem with that. As a mark of respect to the death of a lady and as a mark of respect to all my Protestant friends of whom she meant something to.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Once Famous
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 05:15 PM

Robo, I usually don't have a problem with most of what you say, but the guest pummelled you to a point where all you had left in your arguement was to accuse him of being a guest.

I think the Guest was right. I would be embarrassed by the behavior of my countrymen for not taking a moment to honor the memory of a revered world leader to many.

and Joe, so sorry you were so inconvenienced to stand for a playing of the National Anthem. It takes all of about a minute.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 04:54 PM

I understand what you are saying Joe, but don't think time limits between minutes silences are appropriate. If something 'big' happens that affects the world and people wish to mark that event, they should be allowed to.

We can't plan how often these 'big' events occur.

Subject: RE: Scottish show disrespect for dead pope
From: Joe Offer
Date: 12 Apr 05 - 04:48 PM

I suppose customs are different in different countries, but I think demanding a moment of silence at a sporting event is appropriate about once every five or ten years. And support for it should not be by a mere majority - it ought to be well-nigh unanimous. It was appropriate to have a moment of silence for the victims of the World Trade Tower. I suppose it might have been appropriate for the tsunami victims, although even that might not have worked. But for an old priest who died of old age, I don't think so.

Of course, I'm one who hated standing for the National Anthem before I could watch a movie in a U.S. Army theater.

-Joe Offer-