BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries

Subject: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Barry Finn
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 06:58 PM

I haven't seen this yet posted, I sorry if this is a repeat & surprised if hasn't been commented on.

I really do think that all the recent movies that are based on 9/11 really show a distaste in what the media thinks is tasteful entertainment & the same for a public that is entertained by it. With exception to the 2 French brothers that were onsite already making a documentary about the NYC Firehousse & just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time but only showed the events as they were happening. They were really recording a Historical Record of 911. As for the others they are only capitalizing on an open wound that hasn't yet stopped bleeding never mind that it's still festering.
BUT to air a story like this & to try to pass it off as a documentary or a docudrama & then further use it to convince/confuse a public with misinformation & to use it as a politically motivated campaign tool to try sway opinion of the facts of what actually happened is disgusting & is an outrage. ABC is of course owned by the Hearst Empire & therefore it's not surprising that it's coming from them. I've written them an e-mail to let them know why I won't be seeing their channel on my TV anymore. Not that that'll do much but I feel that at least I've told them.
How do you feel?

Barry


The following is a cut & paste. Included are sources.

Dear MoveOn member,

In a little over 48 hours, ABC will air a five-hour "docudrama" on the 9/11 attacks. The movie was written and produced by a right-wing
activist who fabricated key scenes to blame Democrats and defend
Republicans.^1 It's so partisan that even Rush Limbaugh was surprised
ABC decided to air it.^2 And an FBI agent who was brought in to consult on the docudrama quit because, he said, "they were making things up."^3

//Public outrage is mounting across the country, and Variety reports
that ABC is now "mulling the idea of yanking the mini altogether."^4 But we only have a little time to act. We'll start delivering this petition to ABC headquarters tomorrow at noon and continue as more signatures come in. So we're looking for 200,000 signatures TODAY.

Can you sign? Click here:
http://pol.moveon.org/abcdoc?id=8706-6985103-FDDUNp_zSsa1Wr22CdbZsg&t=4



Then please pass on this message to folks you know who can help.

The Path to 9/11 appears to be part of a coordinated push—including
speeches by President Bush and millions of dollars in advertising—to
exploit the five-year anniversary of 9/11 for political gain. That's not acceptable from anyone—especially not a news organization like ABC.

It's not just that ABC's movie is slanted. Big parts of it are simply
untrue. The producer himself even admitted to simply improvising a key scene which depicts the Clinton administration letting bin Laden go when they had him in their sights—a complete fabrication.^5 Last night, the movie's star, Harvey Keitel, said "It turned out not all the facts were correct."^6

It's really pretty simple: ABC shouldn't have any role in the political exploitation of 9/11. But this docudrama is designed to do just that—spreading a false message to millions of viewers across the country.

Sign the petition to tell ABC not to air partisan propaganda on 9/11.
Click here:

http://pol.moveon.org/abcdoc?id=8706-6985103-FDDUNp_zSsa1Wr22CdbZsg&t=5
*
*
Thank you for all you do.

P.S. For the most current information on the scandal involving this
film, and for more information on the movie itself, please visit our
friends at ThinkProgress:

http://www.thinkprogress.org

Sources:
1. "Writer of ABC's 9/11 'Docudrama' Is Avowed Conservative Activist,"
ThinkProgress, September 1, 2006
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=2047&id=8706-6985103-FDDUNp_zSsa1Wr22CdbZsg&t=6


2. "Clintonoids Prepare To Attack 9/11 Movie," The Rush Limbaugh Show,
August 30, 2006
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=2049&id=8706-6985103-FDDUNp_zSsa1Wr22CdbZsg&t=7


3. "FBI Agent Who Consulted On Path to 9/11 Quit," ThinkProgress,
September 7, 2006
http://thinkprogress.org/2006/09/07/fbi-agent-quit/

4. "Under fire, ABC mulls yanking mini," Variety, September 7, 2006
http://www.variety.com/VR1117949675.html

5. Greg Mitchell, Editor & Publisher, MSNBC appearance, September 7, 2006
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=2077&id=8706-6985103-FDDUNp_zSsa1Wr22CdbZsg&t=8


6. "Harvey Keitel speaks out on Path to 9/11: 'It turned out not all the
facts were correct'", Showbiz Tonight, September 7, 2006
http://www.moveon.org/r?r=2078&id=8706-6985103-FDDUNp_zSsa1Wr22CdbZsg&t=9

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Greg F.
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 07:19 PM

Anyone who would watch a show on the attack on the World Trade Center for "entertainment" is seriously sick.

Anyone who would watch a tv "docudrama" [what the hell IS a "docudrama", anyway?] in hopes of being presented with factual information is either deluded or a moron.

This has been panned - even by its promoters- as being riddled with inaccuracies and material and scenes invented out of whole cloth. They claim its "fact based" - hell, a good case could be made that holocaust denial is "fact based", but that doesn't make it accurate or true.

The series is utter crap, pandering to a puerile and prurient fascination with death and destruction.

Best thing anyone could do is turn off the TV for this turkey.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Bobert
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 08:10 PM

All I had to read was that this movie is being put out by the right wing Disney company an' Ed Eisner has had his head so far up George Bush's butt that it looks like Bush as two Adam's apples...

I'll take a pass on this bit of pre-election propaganda jus' as I'm tryin' to ignore all these front page headlines about Bush's latest efforts to sell his "used" war... I didn't want it in it's new shiney state and I sure as heck have no need for it now...

Yo, Ed Eisner.... Bite me, you partisan creep...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: dianavan
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 09:30 PM

They will be sued.

At no time did the Clinton administration have "Osama in their sights."

They have also slandered Madeline Albright.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: kendall
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 09:36 PM

I signed the petition and I e mailed ABC and told them I would be watching another channel.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: harpmolly
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 09:54 PM

Bobert...ROFLMAO!!!!

What a turn of phrase. I'm going to have to remember that one. :)

Yeah, I'm really disappointed to see Harvey Keitel tainting his career with this crap. Sigh. It's a long way from "The Piano", baby.

Molly

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: harpmolly
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 09:57 PM

P.S. And why the hell would anyone WANT to watch this when the SIMPSONS' SEASON PREMIERE IS ON??? Hello people, what is wrong with you?!?

OK, done now. ;)

M

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Don Firth
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 10:26 PM

I also signed the petition.

I think the Bushies are desparate.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Little Hawk
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 10:44 PM

Either that or disparate...

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: katlaughing
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 10:48 PM

Me, too, on signing the petition.

I am also doing some other volunteer work for MoveOn.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Alice
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 10:54 PM

Sent ABC a letter. I will no longer be watching that network. Shame on them for exploiting 9/11 and distorting/falsifying what actually happened.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: catspaw49
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 11:16 PM

It seems that things are now just hunky dory after five years so we can now tell all and show all of the stuff which we somehow had the good taste NOT to show then. And it is not just ABC although that particular piece of tripe needs to be shown up for what it really is (I did the petition too). There are probably 30-40 programs running during this period and they range from extremely well done with taste and the best information to all manner of conspiracy theories and outright bullshit.

When I see one on I generally check out some of it and you can very quickly separate the chaff from the grain....it runs about 99% chaff.....and I move on to something else. There are questions still to be answered but I doubt we'll ever have any.

I can never forget sitting right here and posting the thread asking if anyone else had seen the news about the plane and the WTC. What a change we have seen in the world........

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 11:35 PM

Now you all know that that the criticisms you write about this project are correct because you've seen the television show, right? What a bunch of blatherers you all are! Of course you all also object Oliver Stone's movies, and Michael Moore's 'documentaries'. Of course you do...not.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 11:48 PM

From that well-known leftist rag, the Wall St Journal, today 8 Sept 2006:

Even Scholastic, which had put on its website classroom material to help teachers discuss this blatant propaganda masquerading as a docudrama, has realized that its own material wasn't up to its own standards.

"We intend to have a new discussion guide complete with background information posted on Friday morning".

(It would be interesting to know if they did so.)

The previous information from Scholastic, according to Media Matters for America, "omits critical information regarding the Bush administration's pre-Iraq war weapons of mass destruction claims, falsely suggests a tie between Iraq and the Sept 11, 2001 terrorist attacks.... and asks students to debate whether the media 'hinder our national security' " (How's that for a loaded question, especially phrased that way?)

And remember, this is to be the educational aid.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: catspaw49
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 11:53 PM

Hey John, this is America!!! We are all entitled to an opinion, be it uninformed, biased, prejudicial, idiotic, naive, really friggin' stupid, and/or lacking in even the tiniest elments of logic or reality. I know this is correct because shitloads of people voted for Bush, many of them twice.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 11:59 PM

Oliver Stone's movies are basically not worth the time it takes to watch them. Especially the most recent one, I understand. Among other things he has a white actor (Nicholas Cage?) play the role done in reality by a black man. Also does not even try to discern any possible motive for the 9-11 attacks. I have not seen the movie--perhaps somebody else can confirm or deny. But I'm not about to waste my money or time on that.

Michael Moore's movies make some good points--and stretch others wildly.

But anybody who thinks they can understand history--even recent history-- just by watching movies--needs their head examined.

Of course, Bushites might find this miniseries right up their alley--thinking always was a terrible burden for them.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 12:03 AM

With Diebold in his back pocket, it didn't matter dick who voted for Bush.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 02:07 AM

In a related story in today's news:

Washington -- The Senate Intelligence Committee on Friday said it had found no evidence that Saddam Hussein had ties to al-Qaida or provided safe harbor to one of its most notorious operatives, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi -- conclusions contradicting claims by the Bush administration before it invaded Iraq.

In a long-awaited report, the committee determined that the former Iraqi dictator was wary of al-Qaida, repeatedly rebuffed requests from its leader, Osama bin Laden, for assistance and sought to capture al-Zarqawi when the deadly terrorist turned up in Baghdad.

These folks were interviewed on Colorado Public Radio, today: (11 Visibility. I didn't get to hear all of the interview, but I don't think they could be anymore far fetched than the shrub and his false claims which have resulted in so many thousands dead, including, what is it now, over 2000 US soldiers?

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 02:16 AM

Twenty times more than that in civilian deaths.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 02:58 AM

Oh, yes.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 07:19 AM

Sunset John--


   
One good point Michael Moore made in Fahrenheit 9-11 was the overwhelming enthusiasm shown by pro-Iraq war members of Congress for having their own family members fight in Iraq.

Since you're so enamored of this series, please be sure to come back and tell us--after you've wasted 5 hours of your life watching this wonderful cultural landmark of our time---what the good points of the series were.

So we can see to what extent your observations have the slightest connection with reality.


Thanks so much.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,Huey, Dewey & Louie
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 10:25 AM

A Barry Finn of Mudcat Cafe states: "ABC is of course owned by the Hearst Empire"

Of course, though, ABC is not owned by Hearst, it is owned by Disney.

At least, that's what Unca Donald told us.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 10:33 AM

Correct. ABC is now owned by Disney.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,282RA
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 12:08 PM

Histories are funny things. I was involved in a deadly military incident in the late 80s. And recently looked up that incident described on various websites. I was flabbergasted. Not one was right. Some version only mention one ship assisting but never mentioned my ship. Another version credited the other ship as being first on the scene when I am pretty certain my ship was and I found anoutehr website that said mine was. I was standing on the deck as we approached the incident and I saw a tug already there and no one else. It was night so I could have missed it but I don't think so.

These sources stated that the damaged ship was towed to Bahrain--false. They said it sailed back to Mayport, FL under its own power--false. None mentioned that my ship towed it back to Mayport even though that is what happened. One source said that the ship was rebuilt and made seaworthy again. While I haven't checked on that, I would find that extremely hard to believe judging from the unimaginable damage suffered in the midsection and the fact that it was so full of seawater. I find that very hard to believe.

So I can see how historical facts get entered into the record that simply are not true. It seems bizarre that this was allowed and even encouraged for the movie. Saying the series "is not a documentary" is equally misleading. Of course it isn't a documentary, any fool can figure that much out. It isn't true--that's the problem. Just because it's not a documentary is merely a statement of fact that in no way admits guilt over having factionalized the plot.

Nor does the ol' "we had to condense time and make composite characters" going to get them out of it. They are attributed false actions to real people and I hope those people sue. And the whole thing is so obviously an unbelievably cynical Republican election-year ploy that I hope like hell it backfires like a bastard. My god, they're still trying to blame all Bush's fuck ups on Clinton.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 12:15 PM

Liberals are upset that this miniseries points out that the Clinton administration had an opportunity to kill Bin Laden and decided not to. He was too busy not having sex with that woman, I suppose.

BTW, the actress that plays Madeleine Albright, Clinton's secretary of state who advised against taking out Bin Laden, is Shirley Douglas, the daughter of legendary Canadian socialist Tommy Douglas. She is also the mother of Keifer Sutherland and ex-wife of Donald Sutherland. Shirley is known for being pretty far left wing, so I wonder why she agreed to play this role for the evil-right wing Disney corp.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 12:40 PM

And Daddy Bush was too busy screwing the American public to take out Saddam Husein when he had a chance, which might've prevented 9/11 blah...blah...blah...let's take it on back to the founding fathers and blame them for everything.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 12:44 PM

BTW, the actress that plays Madeleine Albright, Clinton's secretary of state who advised against taking out Bin Laden, is Shirley Douglas, the daughter of legendary Canadian socialist Tommy Douglas. She is also the mother of Keifer Sutherland and ex-wife of Donald Sutherland. Shirley is known for being pretty far left wing, so I wonder why she agreed to play this role for the evil-right wing Disney corp.

They showed her the money.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 01:27 PM

For Catspaw--I do not recall saying that you or anyone here was not not entitled to express your opinion...you are...but obviously you don't think the writers and producers of the series are. I was just questioning the basis for the opinions and comments herein.

For Ron Davies--wrong conclusion, Ron. I am not enamored of the mini-series, nor even am I interested in it. It's uninformed comments like yours that lower the level of the discussion. If, and its a big if, I do watch the series I will give it a loving, glowing, uncritical review for you; you would expect no less. ;>)

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 01:59 PM

"Anyone who would watch a show on the attack on the World Trade Center for "entertainment" is seriously sick."

How is it any different than watching any of the hundreds of movies that endeavour to glorify WW2???? Or FN Vietnam movies?!?!?!

"I signed the petition and I e mailed ABC"
"I also signed the petition."
"Me, too, on signing the petition."
"Sent ABC a letter."
Know how much ABC'll care? Not ONE jot! You all just come off sounding like 'Abe Simpson'....

"What a change we have seen in the world........"
What change??

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: robomatic
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 02:01 PM

I look forward to Michael Moore's version so I don't have to watch that, either.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: 282RA
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 02:14 PM

>>Liberals are upset that this miniseries points out that the Clinton administration had an opportunity to kill Bin Laden and decided not to. He was too busy not having sex with that woman, I suppose<<

That is certainly not the issue. The issue is that the accounts have been fictionalized so as to be false. It is certainly libelous. If Clinton is in anyway to blame, why can't they depict instead of lying.

It's high time you Bush-loving cut-outs understand that you are the only people left who think blaming Clinton has a shred of credibility. The rest of the country wants real answers.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 05:08 PM

You're right, John,, it's uninformed comments like yours--assuming that everybody who has shall we say, minimal respect for Mr. Bush, will adore Michael Moore and Oliver Stone--which lower the tone of the discussion.

But have fun wasting 5 hours watching "The Path" tripe--and, as I said, please be sure to tell us its good points--so we can see if there is any connection with reality.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 05:11 PM

Well, Ron, irony is certainly wasted on you.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: kendall
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 05:12 PM

CH, I did it not for them who couldn't care less, I did it for ME.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Donuel
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 05:13 PM

Yeah I posted it 6 times.

I found a story that makes Plamegate look like a case of the hiccoughs.

Even I found this SHOCKING ! even for Bush
http://www.rense.com/general73/jour.htm

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 05:22 PM

Looking forward to your review of the show, John.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,282RA
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 05:24 PM

>>BTW, the actress that plays Madeleine Albright, Clinton's secretary of state who advised against taking out Bin Laden, is Shirley Douglas, the daughter of legendary Canadian socialist Tommy Douglas. She is also the mother of Keifer Sutherland and ex-wife of Donald Sutherland. Shirley is known for being pretty far left wing, so I wonder why she agreed to play this role for the evil-right wing Disney corp.<<

RW answer before November:

"Because they're all muddleheaded idiots who are too stupid to know when their actually spitting on their own cause. She just showed what a bunch of opportunistic morons libs and lefties really are!! All I can do it laugh at them!! HAHAHAHAHA!"

RW answer after November:

"Because that series was a liberal hackjob designed to make republicans look bad in front of the public. The very fact that a known far left celebrity took a role in that cesspool of a production should tip everyone off. I can't believe America fell for that cheap shit. Boo hoo hoo hoo!"


>>Know how much ABC'll care? Not ONE jot! You all just come off sounding like 'Abe Simpson'....<<

I don't necessarily agree. The big networks get really cold feet about grassroots boycott threats. Take them far more seriously than they should. It's this cynical attitude that nothing changes so why try that keeps handing RW Christian nutjobs one political victory after another. While everybody is staying home rationalizing their apathy that if voting really mattered it would be illegal, the nutjobs are down at the polls giving us the worst Congress and president this country has ever seen and likely ever will see for a long time. We can blame them for this even though they either deny having participated in it or are like the idiots in here who think everything Bush does is great and above criticism. But WE are to blame because we let these assholes do our voting for us. We stay home and act all jaded and cynical and taking ourselves right out of the process and leaving it wide open to them. That's out fault not theirs. We have a chance to finally make ourselves heard in a couple of months and I highly suggest we not waste it this time.

"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance." --Ben Franklin

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 05:26 PM

Or are you willing to admit that it's going to be worthless agitprop--this time from the Right--and not worth anybody's time?

If you are willing to do so, welcome to the land of the literate.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ebbie
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 05:37 PM

Donuel, Lindauer comes across as less than credible.

"But psychiatrists say Lindauer suffers from delusions of grandiosity and paranoia, including beliefs that she is an angel and that the intelligence community blew up her computer modem. At least a half-dozen mental health professionals, including a psychiatrist retained by the government, have found Lindauer incompetent to stand trial, U.S. District Judge Michael Mukasey said.

There's More Here



"Lindauer says that she has been subject to intense surveillance, threats, and attacks since she began meeting with Libyan officials in 1995 to discuss her knowledge of the Lockerbie bombing. "Someone put acid on the steering wheel of my car on a day I was supposed to drive to NYC for a meeting at the Libya House. I scrubbed my hands with a toilet brush, but my face was burned so badly that 3 weeks later friends worried I might be badly scarred," Lindauer told MEIB. "Also, my house was bugged with listening devices and cameras -- little red laser lights in the shower vent. And I survived several assassination attempts."

Yeah. Right.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 06:03 PM

Worst part, of course, is that bozos who voted for Bush will see themselves vindicated by this garbage. But of course they can't be expected to do anything but get their "facts" from this kind of source--or Mr. Bush himself--equally reliable.

Sure is good to know this does not include you, Sunset John.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 06:04 PM

Gee, Ron, you're really on a roll!
You argue by telling me I'm out of touch with reality...ooh stop that hurts.
You presumed I am enamored of the mini-series because I did not bow to the alter of the Church of Hate Bush. I told you you were uninformed in making that comment, but you choose to persevere in that fantasy.
I tell you tongue-in cheek that I will write you a particular type of review you take it seriously.
And if I do not agree with you, I am not literate...jeez you got me again.
Lastly, you call a movie you probably have not seen a piece of 'agitprop'. That is a great '40s Stalinist phrase...you aren't from the forties are you?...designed to stop open discussion.
I am open to the possibility that some parts of the 9/11 movie may not be accurate, or even fair. But I fear that you are too doctrinaire to admit that Stone and Moore indulge in the type of license you are accusing ABC of doing.
BTW, if you tell me I'm not tall it will be the first accurate thing you've written to me.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 06:11 PM

Try reading carefully for once, John. I know it may be an effort for you, as a good Bushite, to do so. But it really would help the discussion.

"Michael Moore's movies make some good points--and stretch others wildly."

Guess who said that.

And I have also stated that I believe Oliver Stone's movies to be not worth the time it takes to see them.

Any disagreement?

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 06:19 PM

I missed that one, sorry. And I accept those statements and do not disagree. I do wonder how many other anti-Bushites are open enough to agree with you. Sorry I missed your comments, but there are so many comments posted, and, you know, I'm not too literate.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 06:44 PM

282RA, that last paragraph was well said. Thanks...I may quote you!

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 08:17 PM

Well, for me it's like Wes Ginny Algebra...

There are 4 major networks: CBS, NBC, Fox and ABC...

NBC fired Phil Donahue and replaced him with a Bushite when Phil Donahue had the balls to challenge Bush in the mad-dash-to-Iraq...

Fox, well, is Fox...

Now ABC has brought forth their offerings to the king...

CBS, on the other hand, delved into why Bush didn't complete his military obligation and we know what happened there...

So, accordin' to the Wes Ginny Slide Rule A+B+C>CBS...

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 12:00 AM

" I did it not for them who couldn't care less, I did it for ME."

So it was a total WOMBAT.....

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: katlaughing
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 01:47 AM

Does he really think people will believe this:

"We learned the lessons of September 11," Bush said on Thursday in the latest in a round of speeches on the subject. "We're working to connect the dots to stop the terrorists from hurting America again."

Somebody get him a colouring book!

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: dianavan
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 02:23 AM

"Liberals are upset that this miniseries points out that the Clinton administration had an opportunity to kill Bin Laden and decided not to."

Thats just the problem. There is absolutely no proof of that statement.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 10:06 AM

THe last I heard, FCC rules prohibited the broadcasting of political messages unless clearly labeled as such, and required equal airtime for responses.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Bobert
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 11:12 AM

I've been thinkin' the same thing, Dick...

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Greg F.
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 11:37 AM

That was before the FCC came under Republican control.

Rules? We ain't got to follow no steenkin' rules!

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: katlaughing
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 11:40 AM

If they use profanity or someone bares a breast, maybe they'd at least get fined.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Big Mick
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 12:52 PM

That's the rules, Dick, but it seems there is only money for enforcement when it suits the Republicans.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 03:05 PM

Either elect a good government in 2006 and 2008 or the USA is going down. You will lose your democracy--such as it is--and your freedoms.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: SINSULL
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 07:30 PM

Have any of you seen the ridiculous dramas about Pearl Harbor that have proliferated since WWII? Why should this event be treated any differently? This is not a news report. It is TV for the masses.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,resneps
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 08:11 PM

Looks like Clinton's house of cards will finally start crashing down tonight. Once all his lies and ineptitude are made public maybe some of the idiots on the left will wake up.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ebbie
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 08:39 PM

Yep, Guest respneps, I agree that the idjits will soon meet their comeuppance. Hope you don't get hurt too bad.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,random thoughts
Date: 10 Sep 06 - 10:23 PM

I think anything that puts it in our faces again and again and again is okay...it's not going away. We've obviously blundered about in global politics like egotistical idiots with no regard for reality. We are reaping what we sowed. The more people who can become educated on what we have done from WWII on and the continuous blunders. Clinton also totally ignored the massacre in Rwanda. I have to wonder if all the politics with Monica was not going on, would it have been any different? America just doesn't seem to be able to focus because the attention is all on politics, money and power. We need to be reminded and educated about why America is so hated by so many. How else will we ever change?

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 12:11 AM

Jumping in from near the front:

At no time did the Clinton administration have "Osama in their sights."

Actually, they did. I heard Clinton talk about it on an interview in the last year. But they decided that because he was in a populated area that the casualties among the civilians would be too high.

I heard a discussion of this on talk radio on Friday (surfing channels, looking for local news). The caller suggested that the movie was slanted heavily against Clinton, highly favoring Bush. The talk show host interrupted: "Rush saw it. He didn't think so. . ." Duh. That says it all!

I haven't been watching the program, I just glanced at the initial commentary in this thread, to see what people make of it. I'm glad to see it being discussed. I just dropped in to offer this point--I don't know if it helps or hurts the case being made against Clinton these days or in this slanted movie telling of things. The guy was all right. And his folks did try to warn Bush, who wasn't listening.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 12:17 AM

Why does resneps spell his name backwards? Man, this place is becoming very weird.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: katlaughing
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 12:44 AM

It is rather rich that they try to blame Clinton for being so pre-occupied over Monica, when it was Ken Starr and the GOP who really obsessed over her! If there was distraction going on at the White House, I am sure it wasn't a one-time blowjob, but rather then endless years of harassement from Starr et alia.

That, and as SRS said, Bush not listening. Of course, he probably dind't care as he was planning his course on turning our country into his own kingdom.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: robomatic
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 02:39 AM

Well, I watched most of it tonight (after watching the Simpsons, of course). It seemed to replay themes that crop up again and again in certain docudramas (which this did not claim to be) and real life, that of the field agent who knows the situation, and his/her frustration with the politicos that hold or withhold approval of necessary actions. There was a lot of atmosphere to liven it up, and quite a few creditable actors, Harvey Keitel as John O'Neil, f'r'instance.
It was definitely critical of the folks in the offices back in Washington, during the Clinton administration. Let's see how Shrub fares tomorrow night.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: beardedbruce
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 08:04 AM

thread.cfm?threadid=71099#1215807




BS: REVIEW Fahrenheit 9/11
BS: Election Thoughts-Michael Moore (34)
BS: Michael Moore laughs to the bank (31)
Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website (67)
Fahrenheit 9/11 responses (146)
Fahrenheit 451-The LAST Song (81)
BS: Fahrenheit 9/11 - UK (3)
BS: Can't wait for Fahrenheit 9/11 (39)
BS: Fox News review of Fahrenheit 9/11 (16)
BS: Congratulation, Mr Moore (90)
Michael Moore and georgie (9)
BS: Mickey Mouse Mugs Michael Moore... (5)
BS: Thank you, Thank you, Michael Moore! (156)
BS: Michael Moore's letter to Bush (48)



I guess it all depends on what you have already decided you want to believe.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Bobert
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 08:42 AM

The differnce here, BB, is that Michael Moore's movie was not broadcast on the public airwaves... And that is a big difference...

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Wesley S
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 09:17 AM

The whole point of the program was about one thing. Selling burgers. Selling burgers, smoothies, toothpaste and toilet paper. TV is nothing but a place to put ads. Nothing else. My guess is the only thing on the minds of ABC executives this morning is "How were the numbers? Did we beat CBS and NBC?"

So don't expect anything else from TV folks. As rapper "MC 900 Foot Jesus" once said - "Truth is out of style".

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 09:22 AM

I am so pissed off that I missed this. I was really looking forward to watching. I know there has been controversy, but I still think it would have been worth watching. Why didn't anyone remind me that the Simpsons premiere was on? I can't believe I missed it!!!

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,Desdemona
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 10:43 AM

We watched the Simpsons, assiduously skipped the 9/11 stuff. I think it's deplorable for Disney, the networks, or anyone else to capitalise on *any* tragedy, simply because our nation's lamentable mental weakness and predilection for recreational grieving makes it so damned easy.

~D

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Donuel
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 11:23 AM

ABC is eating $53 million since they can not "find" a sponsor.

I think I know the real sponsor.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Barry Finn
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 02:19 PM

I did watch Ted Kopel. Though he did present some decent questions most of his panel was key far right wing past or present government players while only a few of the many invited side lined presentors were from the left. I was very disappointed in Ted's set up. Nothing substantial was aired except that more debate was needed. DUH!

Disney should be boycotted. I for one, in the future, will walk away from anything they support.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 05:23 PM

I'm not a fan or Mr Moore (too shrill for my taste), but I don't recall his films including any components that were fictional. Unlike the Docudrama under discussion.

If folks (on either side) are lied about, or portrayed inaccurately, I'd hope, for everbody's sake , that they'd sue and follow up the suit energetically.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,282RA
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 05:29 PM

Are they trying to blame Clinton for not foreseeing that bin Laden would mastermind 9-11 a few years down the road?? What use is it to them to blame Clinton for not nabbing bin Laden? He just wasn't quite the wanted man he would later become and it was the CIA director who nixed it and he probably had good reason to and that CIA director was retained Bush when he took office.

Even republicans and conservatives I know at work are getting tired and frustrated with the Bush administration and the GOP in general trying to blame everything in the Bush administration that has gone wrong (which would be everything) on Clinton. This strategy is hurting them. Not even the American public can remain stupid and blind forever (though god knows they try). At some point, the GOP has stretched their credibility to a point where even the average American dumbass just isn't buying it anymore.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: dianavan
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 09:25 PM

SRS - "I heard Clinton talk about it on an interview in the last year. But they decided that because he was in a populated area that the casualties among the civilians would be too high."

Sounds like Clinton was trying to convince the public that he is a compassionate guy, unlike...

However, I have seen no evidence that U.S. intelligence had bin laden in their sights or had any reason to believe that he would launch an attack on the U.S.

btw - Why hasn't the Bush administration been able to capture bin Laden if they're so almighty powerful? I'm sure they wouldn't let a few insignificant civilians stand in their way.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 09:43 PM

BIG CHART OF LEFT GATEKEEPERS AND THEIR MONEY TRAIL:

http://www.leftgatekeepers.com/chart.htm

Your "left" mouthpieces work for the big money "right" interests. This is a simplified chart. It's all verifiable if you search. Google won't do it anymore, though. Try yahoosearch.com. Not yet controlled by the US govt.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Ron Davies
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 09:48 PM

Sunset John--


Thanks.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: DougR
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 10:19 PM

Never read such moaning and groaning in my long life! What a hoot!

I suppose had the docuwhatever had a left slant with a smashing bashing final episode blaiming the Bush crowd for 9/11 you moaners and groaners would be in your living room chairs, clutching ice cold bottles of your favorite brew screaming ...RIGHT ON!

And those of you who didn't bother to watch ...of what worth is YOUR opinion of the film?

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,282RA
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 11:01 PM

>>I suppose had the docuwhatever had a left slant with a smashing bashing final episode blaiming the Bush crowd for 9/11 you moaners and groaners would be in your living room chairs<<

Nice try but still too transparent. Your statement is contrived to make it seem like blaming Bush is as ridiculous as blaming Clinton. Wrong! Bush IS to blame for 9-11. Why? Because it happened on his watch, that's why. In the military, they teach you that in boot camp. When you're the man in charge, you take the bullet. If it happens on your watch, you're responsible. Doesn't matter what the guy you relieved did or didn't do. You took over the watch and therefore the responsibilities of that watch. Bush may not be military (not that he ever was) but he is the top dog in every miltary man's chain-of-command. It applies to him more than anybody. He is where the buck stops.

So was Bush responsible for 9-11? Damn right he was!

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,282RA
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 11:05 PM

I'm going to assume that GUEST posted his little leftwinger chart as a joke. If you didn't, GUEST, don't respond. Quit while you're still ahead.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: TIA
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 11:13 PM

I think DougR just admitted that it does, in fact, have a right-slant.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 11 Sep 06 - 11:42 PM

However, I have seen no evidence that U.S. intelligence had bin laden in their sights or had any reason to believe that he would launch an attack on the U.S.

Ah, of course. Because you didn't see it, it didn't happen. Right.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: DougR
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 12:40 AM

TIA: I admit nothing of the sort! IF you watched the program you would know that the Bush Administration was not shown it the greatest light possible. It made errors too. Just not as many as the Clinton Administration.

The problem with many of you is you didn't watch the show so you only know what the left-wing press has written about it (who probably didn't see it either).

I think it should be required viewing in public schools myself.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,Wilhelm der Zweite
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 01:16 AM

I agree with one of the earlier posts, this movie did not only bash Clinton's administration. It showed the mistakes of both sides. Clinton's side just had more errors, just as was true in real life. You whinny democrats are too scared and angry to admit that you share part of the blame too. The first time WE get OUR side of the story out there, you start bashing it and trying to get it banned from the air. You are blinded by your hate for President Bush to see what is really going on. You whinny losers have not been there and seen it over in the middle east and until you do, you can't say anything. The Al'Queda are EVIL and MUST be removed.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: 282RA
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 09:12 AM

Is it just me or is anyone else wondering why it was supposed to be Clinton's job to get bin Laden when the guy had not pulled off 9-11 yet.

They seem to ne blaming him for not foreseeing this tragedy so that beloved Bush would not have turned America into cesspool of belligerant stupidity.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: TIA
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 04:47 PM

You "whinny" Bushites all screamed "Wag the Dog" when Clinton did actually attempt to get UBL. Freakin' hypocrites.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: robomatic
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 05:33 PM

Considering the amount of heat Israel has taken in this forum over 'collateral' damage, I think Clinton's estimate of the political fallout over bombing Bin Laden and either taking him out with a lot of other folks, including family members, or missing him and taking out family members, was accurate, if not justified.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 06:07 PM

A stunning indictment of Mr. Clinton. Would have been even more impressisve if it were true.

Heckuva job, Georgie

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 06:38 PM

"You whinny democrats are too scared and angry to admit that you share part of the blame too."

Wilhelm: has anybody told you lately that you are SOOO good looking when you try to think? It's 'whiny' BTW.

Get that right next time: W H I N Y

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: TIA
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 06:56 PM

Clinton tries to kill Osama = "Wag the Dog" = doing nothing to prevent 9/11

Bush actually does kill thousands of people who have absolutely nothing to do with Osama = "Central Front in the War on Islamo-Fascism" = protecting us from British men of Pakistani heritage in the British Midlands.

I think we are through the looking glass.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 07:52 PM

Alice was right then?

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Don Firth
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 07:58 PM

Members of the Clinton administration tried to warn Bush that bin Laden and his Merry Men could be dangerous, and that something was brewing, but the Bush League wasn't interested (beyond figuring that if something did happen, they could probably blame it on Saddam and that would give them an excuse to do what they wanted to do right from the day Bush was inaugurated--invade Iraq). Trouble is, the scam is pretty transparent. And since Bush never admits a mistake and refuses to accept the blame for anything, he's got to try to divert attention from himself. It's probably not too politic for him to try to blame his confreres, like Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, et al (who pointedly ignored what people who had been in the Clinton administration, including, for that matter, the CIA, were trying to tell them), so he's trying to divert the responsibility from himself, and about all he's got is Clinton.

But that's just as transparent. Pathetic, in fact. Except, of course, to the True Believers.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 08:11 PM

The Clintons work for the Bushes. We have one party in America. By supporting one team, you just enrich the team owners. Snap out of it.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 08:23 PM

Clinton got blowjobs. Bush gives them.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: dianavan
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 08:55 PM

According to the latest figures, football was more interesting to the average American than this 5-hour miniseries.

I'm not sure what that means except that maybe the majority of Americans didn't want to be force-fed a bunch of lies.

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: Don Firth
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 09:01 PM

Clinton's workd for the Bushes?

Documentation, please.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The Path To 911/ABC 5-hour miniseries
From: GUEST,282RA
Date: 12 Sep 06 - 09:17 PM

Hellya, I watched Sunday Night Football! I wanted to see the Manning bros. match up. Helluva lot more interesting than Path to 9-11, I bet. I saw one bit where Osama was on a bunch of monitors. At first I thought they were watching a newsclip since that is obvious what it came from. But I realized it was infamous scene where the Clinton guy won't give authorization to take bin Laden out. All I could think was that there was no way they had him onscreen in that kind of resolution and clarity. Get real! So I went back to football and Peyton was showing Eli what older brothers are all about.