Yet another capo thread

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Will Fly
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 03:27 AM

There's a very expensive capo made in the US called the Thalia, which can come with a set of rubber grips/inserts, allowing the capo to be used on 6-strings, mandolins, 12-strings, etc. They look good but are very expensive.

However, as far as 12-string playing is concerned, you could try fitting or adding a cutout rubber strip to your capo so that it would sink on to the strings to a greater degree.

Just a thought.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: GUEST,Bloke in Groucho mask
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 04:32 AM

Capos serve two very good purposes; allowing easier playing alongside other instruments and finding a comfortable range for your voice.

When I was a teenager with a very cheap acoustic guitar and no knowledge of setting a guitar up, let alone realise they could be, a capo also came in handy to lower the action and make the *^%!! thing playable.

Interestingly, and with a large guitar collection to play around with, I notice the drop off in good intonation as you get further up the neck more with some than others. One of my favourite guitars isn't really good with the capo beyond the 4th whilst another is still holding good tone and resonance way beyond a practical fret.

Lately, and with my "changing" voice in mind, I play a baritone guitar all the more. The principle, as a friend advised me at the time of purchase, is a backward capo..,,

I also tune a Rainsong I have to D to D. The carbon fibre neck keeps it in check.

One bit of advice from experience; Always have them just slightly tighter than buzzing.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 04:36 AM

Thank you fellas.

The Paige (screw fitting not click fitting) cannot be cut down to make a partial capo - but it might work as a general 12-string capo. I'll try one! The Tak is a VERY slim (front to back) and narrow neck though so there may be other problems.

John Barden used to use a glider on his Fylde. It DID affect tuning (but he was an approximate tuner at the best of times - his magnificent voice was his greatest strength).

The Thalia is very pretty but it appears to combine ALL the design defects I've been on about, other than the centering back bar, in one overpriced showoff package. Camber - non-adjustable. Gape - limited. Spring tensioned (as far as I can see) and flat fronted pads so very likely to bugger up tuning. When used as a partial capo - no access to the un-fretted strings.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: GUEST,Bloke in Groucho mask
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 04:46 AM

Interesting M'Unlearned friend.

Good luck with trying. Regarding partial capos, I've always been lucky with a shubb, hacksaw, small blowtorch, hammer and sundry anglo Saxon till it worked. (Thinking on, over half my "set" is five string second fret.

Mind you, my mate Brian gave me a factory issue three string shubb capo and I love some of the fun you can have with buggering about with it.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: GUEST, DTM
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 05:10 AM

My favourite capo is the shubb.
I don't like the G7 - expensive & dodgy in my experience although many top guys use one.
Beware - once I bought a cheaper copy of a shubb and it was a total waste of money.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 05:16 AM

I'm also enamoured of the Shubb 5-string and 3-string partial-capos. And I like their 'FineTune' stirrup-type capo too, even more than my Elliott-McKinney (which, being hand-built, cost twice as much). I've got the F1 (standard) FineTune, and I've just ordered the new F3 (wider) FineTune) which will suit my 1-3/4" nut-width necks better.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 05:20 AM

Thank you Primitive Tribesman! I'll get two of those and assault one like the man formerly known as Mither. I have successfully truncated Kyser copies before but getting clearance for the bottom E string on a modified shubb may be tricky - although if it's a big enough gape I might be able to pad the rubber as well as removing part of it.

I can stick to one Kyser pro-am and a modified pro-am for the D-neck profile Hagstroms.

Is this the Mudcat coming up trumps again? Maybe I will start coming here again.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 05:46 AM

I was talking about the SV3. The F3 appears to be an astronomical price and only available from the USA (not from Thomann or Amazon).

Off to check the prices of the Paige now.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: gillymor
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 05:47 AM

I used to use a Third Hand Capo which Harvey Reid apparently quit making last year. It worked pretty well but was a bit fussy. Now he's selling other
partial capos.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: GUEST,Gilly
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 05:59 AM

Can't use a capo on 7th fret ?
Only for cheaters ?
Little known amateur guitarist G.Harrison? Part of a popular combo in the last century ? 'Here comes the Sun '?
And he was a barre chord wizard to boot...

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Will Fly
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 06:06 AM

I use a small Shubb capo on my tenor, and occasionally on a 6-string to allow the bass E to float. I use a G7 for all other guitars. The G7 I've found to be easy and reliable - wouldn't swap it for anything else - just my personal experience.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 06:45 AM

I preferred the Scott tuning capo to the Third Hand but it needed you to add your own rubbers and could have done with a greater range of camber adjustment and an indicator to show how much had been applied.

Those "flip" capos (Gillymor's link) look interesting. But since my ebay shopping basket (including a Paige 12-string special) now stands at over £100 I'd better slow down.

The banjo size Shubb digs the nose of its back bar into middle of the back of a guitar neck and so is unstable.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 08:46 AM

Guess what?   Ordered many tings on ebay. Then found the missing tin of capos in a Volvo!

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 11:55 AM

They're probably worth more than the Volvo. 😜😄

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: GUEST,Bloke in Groucho mask
Date: 13 Oct 16 - 03:47 PM

Put a capo on the Volvo. You never know, the change in pitch may be a couple of cylinders firing for the first time in years. 🚗💨

The five string Shubb seems to be more expensive than a normal shubb and five mins with a hacksaw does the same job. Although on a serious note, the more expensive roller ones snap whilst the rubber tip end ones saw evenly.

Mind you, I went for years winging it with a normal shubb perched on the edge of the neck. Only flew off a few times and only once landed in someone's beer.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Oct 16 - 09:12 AM

Paige capo P12E assessment

Clearly some thought has been given to the needs of the 12-string player, but the execution could be better.

1.        The latch for the bar is both tight and fiddly. The groove on the old Hamilton Quick Action works better.
2.        The screw does not withdraw far enough. There are many old C-neck 12-strings still in use. The back bar appears to have been specifically shaped for V-necks which further reduces clearance for C-necks. On my Mugen THE 78-12 and THE80W twin-neck the P12E can be forced on at the first fret and then slid up the neck to the fourth fret – but it then pulls the guitar badly out of tune.
3.        The rubber is too thin – so one cannot file grooves into it for the fat strings to ease fit and get round the inadequate sleeves (see below).
4.        The sleeves to reduce the risk of string rattle on the thin E A D and G courses are a good idea in principle but:
a.        The pack that came to me said it contained transparent sleeves. They were black – this may simply indicate a lack of oversight but it looks like amateurishness.
b.        They were a VERY tight fit over the bar – needing washing-up liquid and a lot of force to get them on –and the tightness also made it very hard accurately to locate them.
c.        They were sloppily cut. It looked as if somebody had cut them off a bit of tube with a craft knife.   
d.        They were too wide – making it very hard indeed to avoid interfering with the thicker strings on each course.   



Suggestions.

1.         Make the frame deeper so that large-neck 12s could be catered for. I deal below with catering for slimmer necks without making a further design.
2.        Use a flat bar, not a round bar (again, like the Hamilton Quick-Action) with a slot for the bar in the rubber (like the cheap and nasty Chinese Shubb copies that have not really worked out how the Shubb over-centre lever works)         
3.         The rubber can then be eccentric, with more rubber on one side than the other (just like the worst Shubb copies) and a rounded profile to face the frets. If the rubber were slid off and returned with the thicker side towards the frets this would reduce the need to screw the screw tight in (which might lead to poor stability) for slimmer necks.
4.         Make the slide-on pieces to hold the thin strings narrower with a groove round the circumference. This would ease centring those pieces on the slimmer strings.
5.         Have another wide thin slide on piece for the B and to E courses so that the bar sits flat to the neck.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Oct 16 - 09:59 AM

Or learn how to play up the dusty end....

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Oct 16 - 02:14 PM

i don't see why you should be offended by someone like James Blunt using a capo in a certain way. Don't be offended....

'you're beautiful...'

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Oct 16 - 03:13 PM

Oh dear, capo snobbery again. The stuff I do with partial capos cannot be done with different fingerings.

Colonel Blount, on the other hand, indeed offends every time he squeaks.

Subject: RE: Yet another capo thread
From: Andy7
Date: 14 Oct 16 - 05:07 PM

I'm still waiting for someone to invent a 'backward' capo, which you can put on the guitar to LOWER the pitch! :-)