Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: John O'L
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 08:31 PM

F*** it, I missed.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: John O'L
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 08:29 PM

Yeah lox, that impressed me too. There's an attitude there that is not at all commensurate with a plea for understanding.

All the f***ing this and f888ing that doesn't help the cause either.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,lox
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 07:52 PM

The main flaw with that video is that in fact,in the west, there is dissent and it is allowed and it is tolerated.

In China, you don't have to be Tibetan. You can be from Beijing and you'll be murdered for protesting peacefully.

That video was slickly produced, the thing that scares me about it is the feverish national pride that it propagates.

If Goebbells had a synth I think he may well have dome something pretty similar.

The anger and aggressive posturing terrify the shit out of me.

And it feels deep down like that's the real intention of the video.


I wish I hadn't seen it now.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,lox
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 07:35 PM

It's like seeing a child at the window of a house where they are being abused, crying out in pain and trying to fight back against an adult 10 times their size and calling for help.

The Adult from time to time, grinning insincerely from under a sweaty brow, waves out the window to reassure us that things are under control and there is nothing to worry about.

The childs grandfather is outside with the crowd and wants to save the child, but like the rest of us is powerless to do so.

The Abusive adult calls out, between strikes, that it's the grandfathers fault cos he's just trying to stir up trouble by interfering in a private matter.

The police won't get involved because the Abusive adult contributes a lot of money for local business, has a seat on the local council and they are afraid of his stash of hand grenades in the upstairs bedroom.

The child can't believe that noone is helping

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: John O'L
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 07:32 PM

"I am surprised the Dalai Lama says he does not support an Olympic boycott."

My understanding of it is that the Dalai Lama thinks you can influence your friend more easily than your enemy.

I stumbled on this last night. As is pointed out in the article Amos linked to, it is mostly bullshit.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 07:05 PM

I told you so.

Maybe Martin McGuinness would like to stop apologising for murderers here and go and form the Tibetan Republican Army.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 02:15 PM

China sends more troops to restive areas

By CHRISTOPHER BODEEN, Associated Press Writer
1 hour, 6 minutes ago



BEIJING - China sent additional troops into restive areas and made more arrests in the Tibetan capital Lhasa in an effort to suppress anti-government protests even as the Dalai Lama offered face-to-face negotiations with Chinese leaders.

Government officials acknowledged for the first time that protests against Chinese rule of Tibet have spread to Tibetan communities in other provinces after sweeping through Lhasa last week. It is one of the broadest challenges to Chinese rule in years.

Hundreds of paramilitary police aboard at least 80 trucks traveled along the main road winding through the mountains into southeastern Tibet. Others set up camp and patrolled in riot gear, helmets and, for a few, rifles in the area above Tiger Leaping Gorge, a tourist attraction that usually sees little unrest.

Such scenes were repeated across far-flung towns and villages in Tibetan areas of adjacent provinces to reassert control as sporadic demonstrations continued to flare. Foreigners were barred from traveling there and tour groups were banned from Tibet, isolating a region about four times the size of France.

The protests started peacefully in Lhasa early last week, but erupted into deadly riots on Friday, drawing a harsh response from Chinese authorities.

China's crackdown has attracted even more scrutiny of its human rights record in the run-up to the Summer Olympics in Beijing.

China says the riots and protests were plotted from abroad by the Dalai Lama, the exiled spiritual leader revered by Tibetans, and his supporters. They have denied Tibetan exile groups' claims that 80 died in the violence and ensuing crackdown.

Authorities say 16 died and 325 were injured.

The official Xinhua News agency reported Thursday that police shot and wounded four protesters "in self defense" over the weekend in western Sichuan province. It is the first time the government has acknowledged shooting any protesters in nearly a week of unrest.

Local Tibetan television in Lhasa aired footage Thursday showing black-clad police arresting 24 men. Handcuffed against a wall, the men, some young, some old, were charged with "endangering national security, beating, smashing, looting and burning," the report said.

State-run television aired a 15-minute program Thursday night, showing Friday's deadly rioting in Lhasa but none of the ensuing crackdown. Footage taken from security cameras showed looted, burned shops, wounded Chinese and a knife-wielding Tibetan standing atop a police car.

Buddhist monks were shown throwing sticks and other debris at riot police in a narrow street in a scuffle on Monday, March 10, in an attempt to portray the protests as having been started by monks.

Speaking from the seat of his government-in-exile in Dharmsala, India, the Dalai Lama offered to meet with Chinese President Hu Jintao and other Chinese leaders, though said he would not travel to Beijing unless there was a "real concrete development." He reiterated he was not seeking independence for Tibet.

"The whole world knows Dalai Lama is not seeking independence, one hundred times, thousand times I have repeated this. It is my mantra — we are not seeking independence," the 72-year-old Dalai Lama told reporters.

"The Tibet problem must be solved between Tibetan people and Chinese people," he said.

Despite China's relentless vilification, the Dalai Lama — winner of the 1989 Nobel Peace Prize — remains widely revered by Tibetans, traveling widely and meeting an array of politicians and celebrities.

China has ignored calls for dialogue, casting recent events as evidence that the Dalai Lama could not be negotiated with.

The Foreign Ministry expressed "grave concern" over a planned meeting between British Prime Minister Gordon Brown and the Dalai Lama, telling Brown not to offer support to the exiled leader.

At a tense news conference, Foreign Ministry spokesman Qin Gang said the government suggested that foreign tourists stay out of western Gansu and Sichuan provinces, the scene of additional clashes earlier this week between Tibetan protesters and security forces.

After a long pause, he added: "But I shall assure you that our government is fully capable of maintaining social stability and ensuring the security of tourists."

The government's attempts to portray the situation as under control, however, contrast with evidence and reports of ongoing tensions.

In Sichuan's Aba county, where a protest Sunday ended in a confrontation, a Tibetan woman reached by phone Thursday said she had heard of numerous arrests of protesters in the area.

"There are many, many troops outside," she said. "I'm afraid to leave the house," said the woman, who refused to give her name for fear of retaliation by authorities.

Xinhua confirmed the Sunday protest, saying protesters attacked "shops and government offices", but made no mention of allegations by pro-Tibet groups abroad that troops fired on protesters, killing several.

Police were checking ID cards at checkpoints and could be heard shouting from loudspeakers for protesters to turn themselves in.

Troops blocked roads also in nearby Serthar, also in Sichuan, confining residents to their homes, said a woman reached there by phone.

The London-based Free Tibet Campaign reported that troops had been sent to the county after local residents blew up a bridge near the village of Gudu.

Protests were reported also in neighboring Qinghai province, which is heavily Tibetan.

Zhang Yusheng, a spokesman for the Gansu provincial government, said a "small number of lawbreakers shouted reactionary slogans, raised the flag of separatism and adopted violent methods."

Shops, schools, homes, vehicles and government offices in Gansu's Gannan prefecture — a predominantly Tibetan area — were attacked, posing an "extremely grave threat" to social order, Zhang was quoted by state media as telling reporters on Wednesday.

Reinforcements were brought in and order was restored, he said. He mentioned no arrests.

Despite those reassurances, a hotel receptionist in the regional center of Luqu said employees and guests had been holed up inside since Tibetan protesters marched through the area on Sunday.

"The streets are now filled with police officers. Our hotel is booked out with tourists, but no one feels safe enough to set foot outside," said the woman, who refused to give her name or that of her hotel for fear of retaliation by authorities.

A police officer in the nearby town of Maqu refused to answer questions about the situation.

The reports confirm previous claims by Tibetan exile groups that the protests had spread. Foreign journalists have been banned from going to Tibet and have found it increasingly difficult to travel to areas in other provinces with Tibetan populations.

The protests have been the biggest challenge in almost two decades to Chinese rule in Tibet, a Himalayan region that the People's Liberation Army occupied in 1950 after several decades of effective independence.

But authorities appeared to be regaining control in Tibet and surrounding provinces where more than half of China's 5.4 million Tibetans live. Moving from town to town, police checked IDs and set up roadblocks to keep Tibetans in and reporters out.

On Thursday morning, an Associated Press photographer was turned away from a flight to Zhongdian in Yunnan province. There were 12 policemen, some with automatic weapons, at the check-in counter. The police said no foreigners were allowed to travel to Tibetan areas due to the protests.

The unrest has prompted discussion of a possible boycott of the Aug. 8 opening ceremony at the Beijing Olympics and calls for China to address Tibetans' grievances and engage in direct talks with the Dalai Lama.

The White House said Thursday that China's crackdown in Tibet is not cause for President Bush to cancel his trip to the Beijing Olympics.

The European Union also opposed a boycott of the Beijing Olympics, saying it would be counterproductive to efforts to improve human rights in China.

Adding to Beijing's worries, activists said Thursday they would demonstrate in Beijing during the Olympics to press China to help end bloodshed in Sudan's Darfur region.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: katlaughing
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 12:29 PM

Good point!

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 11:38 AM

Yes, the fact that the Chinese rulers think they could get away with accusing the Dalai Lama of stirring things struck me as one of the worst examples of bare-faced, downright political lies and ineptitude ever attempted. I wonder would a greater proportion of athletes refuse to go to the Olympics than traditional musicians perform at the White House?

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: katlaughing
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 01:12 AM

I am surprised the Dalai Lama says he does not support an Olympic boycott. Also, it looks as though Great Britain is working towards a direct meeting between China and the Dalai Lama, though China's requirements, that the DL must say he is not in totally automonous Tibet and renounces the violence, may preclude such an historic meeting. Imagine the Chinese gov. and some of its people are calling the DL a terrorist!

Rigin...I am guessing you probably didn't get much out of my book...too much spiritualism and mentions of gawd/great spirit, etc. You can return it for a refund if you'd like.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Goose Gander
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 12:30 AM

Riginslinger, didn't you forget to remind us "four legs good, two legs baaaad!!!" . . . ?

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 20 Mar 08 - 12:17 AM

Yeah, it was damned messy in Cambodia, Rinslinger, when Pol Pot had a go at it. They killed about 1/3 of all the people in the country.

It was damned messy in Stalinist Russia too, and in Maoist China, but hey....y' gotta break some eggs to make an omelet, don't you? (sarcasm) If you'd been there, you could have served in the execution squads and helped rid the world of religion too.

The Tibetans aren't fighting for religion, Rinslinger. They're fighting for their ancient culture and their national sovereignty. I doubt that they have even a sliver of a chance of ever getting it back, because the Chinese system is without pity where its interests are concerned.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 11:10 PM

The news blackout is already in place.

The armies are already on the way in.

It won't be long now.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Riginslinger
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 09:22 PM

The stamping out of religion can be messy at times.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,lox
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 07:45 PM

The youth of Tibet will be looking at the last 30 years or so and thinking - hey this good karma approach isn't working.

They'll be thinking - "dignity? why? so some right on westerner can wear a bloody save tibet badge and feel holy by association?"

China may have to choose between killing them all or pulling out.

Their record does not bode well!

It's a bit like Obama and the race issue - no one talks about it but it's always been there and we can't ignore it forever and hope it will go away.

Well it is true that China has an atrocious human rights record and whats more, if we are to complain about western economic exploitation of the third world, china's approach in Africa makes some of the worst western culprits look pretty clean by comparison.

Our friend and ally is dangerous violent and self serving and while there are some who may say thaat we can't talk, at least there is some accountability here and we can complain without being arrested and when the tim comes we can kick thebastards out - even if we're only replacing them with other bastards.

I was still living in my home town of Hong Kong on june 4th 1989 when the tanks rolled into tienanmen square.

I went to Hong Kong from Dublin at the age of three and lived there till I was 18 before coming to live in the UK and Ireland where I have remained ever since.

My Dad and I watched the news coming in from Beijing about the students being murdered and felt - as Obi Wan said in star wars - a great disturbance - like a milion voices crying out all at once, and in the same instaance being silenced.

That is of course a metaphor that describes how we felt.

Times were very uncertain then.

And they are now too.

China won't like it's precious olympic show to be defaced.

I wonder if the distubances will spread over china - or whether racist attitudes to inferior tibetans will mean that people don't really care.

It will be interesting - and terrifying - to watch it unfold.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,lox
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 07:31 PM

The other governments of the world could ignore protests in their own countries as simple run of the mill typical "nothing to worry about" demonstrations ... don't worry china, there'll always be a few students foaming at the mouth ha ha ... now about that trade agreement ... ".

But they now have a moral imperative to speak out. If there is ganocide and the world says nothing it will be the bigger crime than the murdering.

I think this is the hope of the Tibetan youth.

The world was talking about tibet, but doing it in an academic objective way.

The youth are saying "this isn't a jaw exercise for right on students, this is our home and our life - we are suffering and under occupation and desperately want help.

Please don't brush us under the carpet.

If you do we may as well be dead anyway so bollox to restraint.

what is China going to do?

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 07:20 PM

There will be genocide. Wait and see.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 04:51 PM

O.K. so I had a knee-jerk reaction.

The accounts I am receiving now tell of 17-18 year old Tibetans beating anyone who looked Chinese and of burning shops owned by Muslims or Chinese. It was brutal and the people of Tibet are very fearful of reprisals by the Chinese govt.

I am also wondering about the term 'super citizens' which the Chinese use to describe Tibetans.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 04:26 PM

At least the Tibetans have timed it right. I know that there are many that think the Olympics should be politically neutral but we all know that the Olympics involves alot of political decisions so that is just wishful thinking on the part of the Olympic corporation.

China will be very disappointed when the world boycotts the Olympic and I believe that although govts. may not condemn China, the people will. Who wants to enjoy athletic competition at the expense of the Tibetans?

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 04:25 PM

Yes, Tibet is strategically placed between China and India...much to the misfortune of Tibetans. Afghanistan is also strategically placed...between China, Russia, India, Pakistan, and the Middle East...even a worse fate!

The behaviour of the Chinese government and military in Tibet has been atrocious from the beginning. No surprises there.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: SINSULL
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 04:18 PM

I was in Tibet in 1979. The most striking feature of the people was that I saw only one person between the ages of 8 and late 20s. He was horribly crippled and prostrating himself before a temple. Enforced birth control and forced abortions during the Cultural Revolution almost wiped out the populace.

Tibet was a theocracy and in some ways just as brutal. But this was genocide. The same was true of all the ethnis tribes I saw along the way to tibet.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,dianavan
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 04:02 PM

Tibet is of strategical importance. Its a buffer zone between India and China. Take a look at Tibet's borders.

China's interest in Tibet is similar to the U.S. interest in Israel and now, Iraq.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: beardedbruce
Date: 19 Mar 08 - 03:14 PM

Washington Post:

China's True Face
The Host of the Olympics or the Thug of Tibet?

By Wei Jingsheng
Wednesday, March 19, 2008; Page A15

As what the Dalai Lama has called "cultural genocide" goes on in Tibet, it is wholly unacceptable that Jacques Rogge, the head of the International Olympic Committee, refuses to take a stand against the Beijing government's current crackdown on Tibetan protesters. In fact, this is completely at odds with the "spirit of the Olympics."

Far more than Steven Spielberg, who quit his advisory role for the Summer Games because of China's unwillingness to pressure the Sudanese government on genocide in Darfur, the IOC has a special obligation to act. Since promised improvements in China's human rights were a quid pro quo for awarding the Games to Beijing, how can it proceed as if nothing happened when blood is flowing in the streets of Lhasa?

And if the Dalai Lama resigns from all his public positions in response to the violence, as he said yesterday that he might, the prospect of resolving the Tibet issue peacefully will be even more hopeless. We will feel very sorry if that comes about -- for Tibet and for China.

If the IOC doesn't move to put pressure on Beijing consistent with its obligations, it risks this Olympics being remembered like the 1936 Games in Berlin. Already, the spirit of the Olympics in Beijing has become associated with the word "genocide," thanks to Spielberg and the Dalai Lama. Indeed, if the IOC and the rest of the world do not pressure Beijing to stop the crackdown and improve human rights now, a boycott of the Games will widely be seen as justified.

Tibetans have long chafed under the oppression of the Chinese Communist Party. In 1959, when the Dalai Lama fled to exile in India, Tibetans' protests were harshly suppressed in a massacre that lasted more than a year. Since then, more than a million Tibetans have reportedly lost their lives because of the Chinese government's policies.

In 1989, it was Chinese President Hu Jintao, then a provincial leader, who suppressed yet another revolt in Lhasa by bringing in the military to kill people in the streets. And, of course, the whole world knows what happened in Tiananmen Square that year.

Clearly, without human rights and the rule of law, neither Tibetans nor the majority Han Chinese are safe from persecution at the whim of Communist authorities.

The old lies and propaganda don't work anymore. In the past, many Han Chinese didn't know about the sufferings of Tibetans. Now thanks to travel, tourism, cellphones and the Internet, the majority Han understand that the Tibetan struggle against tyranny is the same as theirs.

Of course, as part of its "peaceful" face, Chinese authorities have expressed their willingness to resolve the Tibetan issue through negotiation. But, as with Darfur, there is no sincerity behind this willingness and there will not be any unless international pressure is brought to bear. If there has been any lesson in all my years as an activist for democracy and human rights in China, it is that only international pressure coupled with internal pressure will yield solid results.

Jacques Rogge's unwillingness to pressure Beijing at this moment is so tragic because these Olympics are the turning point in modern Chinese history. Having invited the world to polite tea, the Communist Party rulers have turned their palace of power into a global glass house. They can no longer show both the smiling face of "a peaceful rise" to the world and the stern face of brutal suppression at home.

The Olympics will force China to show its true face. Only international pressure, by the IOC and others, will make sure it is the face we all want to see.

The writer, a recipient of the Robert F. Kennedy Human Rights Award, lives in exile in Washington. He was first arrested in China in 1979 for his activities with the "Democracy Wall" movement and was released in 1993 nine days before the International Olympic Committee voted on Beijing's bid for the 2000 Games. He was arrested in March 1994 for "plotting against the state" and released in 1997.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 09:26 PM

Well, that too, of course.

It's a complicated crossroads, at any rate. And not for the squeamish Western romantic, either.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Lox
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 08:48 PM

Or quiltless or guideless I'll wager.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 08:43 PM

But...but...but...the Bush administration gave the Chinese a squeaky clean human rights rating so we could all go to Beijing for the Olympics!

Surely, the Bush administration knows!

Yeah...my brother studied in China about 2 decades back...horror stories of him and his Polish wife (then fiance) trying to get out of China together, and the British refusing to let them come out together through Hong Kong. So it was overland, a really incredible life journey that is the stuff of film legends, really.

Out surreptiously overland they went, through Nepal, stranded in Kathmandu for six months, sicker than dogs with all sorts of funky shit, and dodging the Hindu/Buddhist divide and many worthy sons of worthy fathers, trying to 'find their way home' as Steve Winwood sang...

Between Nepal, Tibet & China there are no guiltless or guileless.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,lox
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 08:21 PM

I don't think that it really matters what the religious content of Buddhism Islam or Christianity are, I think they are all equally perceived threats to the Chinese communist machine as they are autonomous organizations whose members are loyal to an authority not accountable to the party.

Hence hamfisted and culturally inept attempts to impose a state appointed Panchen and Dalai Lama.

Hence buddhists and Moslems are equally likely to be on the receiving end as they are both distractions from the greater good of striving for the welfare of the state, instead leaving their followers in a self satisfied stupor.

So that's why it's really important to murder people!

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Amos
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 07:40 PM

Lox:

1. The original expression was "opiate", a general form.

2. Buddhism is very different in this respect from ewither ISlam or Christianity.


I think your "lebesraum" parallel is probably right on. It's despicable in my view.

A

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,lox
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 07:24 PM

You want enlightenment on the Tibet issue eh?...

It is high ground in the Himalayas that strengthens China's position against its southern nuclear Rival India.

China seems to like asserting it's muscle in weak obscure places that have no realistic way of defendng themselves - the north west of China is witness to equally horrible atrocities against Chinese Moslems - the press have no access so there is hardly any information.

Hitler coined what seems to be a suitable term.

Lebensraum -> Living room.

I hope this is one context in which I may deploy that old argumentative lead balloon - comparisoms with Hitler - without it being over the top or offensive but actually pretty accurate.

If religion is the Opium of the Masses then Buddhism and Islam are the Heroin and Crack.

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Jack Campin
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 05:07 PM

Water resources?

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Amos
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 03:00 PM

As can be seen in The HIstory of Tibet entry in Wikipedia, Tibet was sovereign without contest until 1901. The Chinese have asserted sovereignty over it since then, and have enforced it with brute force since the 1950's, in part to a British management policy which lost Tibet as a protected satellite.

Culturally, the Chinese have no real interest I can identify in Tibet -- although it was overrun by Mongols back in the middle ages, it posed no threat to China in the 19th, 20th or 21st centuries. I do not know of any great wealth in natural resources it possesses, or any great strategic interest by reason of its location; so I am at a loss to understand why China elected to simply grab it. I am sure I am being quite ignorant about the larger picture, and would welcome enlightenment as to what the Chinese motive is for grasping and holding Tibet.

A

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: PoppaGator
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 02:57 PM

Is anyone blaming Bjork for this?

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: skarpi
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 02:42 PM

:>) yes you do

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: GUEST,The Mole catcher's Apprentice
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 02:40 PM

The story's been all over the internet all day.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7296837.stm

Charlotte (keeping an eye open)

Subject: RE: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: Wesley S
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 02:27 PM

The CNN Story. Riots in Tibet.

Subject: Something is on in Tibet right now !!!!!
From: skarpi
Date: 14 Mar 08 - 02:17 PM

jabb , something is on in Tibet , CNN told us in news that there
are fires goin .

did not get it all .

ATB skarpi