Origin: When You And I Were Young, Maggie

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: michaelr
Date: 20 Mar 10 - 11:36 AM

Ably sung by Sandy Paton on the Mudcat "Rose" CD.

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Charley Noble
Date: 20 Mar 10 - 10:14 AM

I had a good friend sing this one at my father's memorial service a few years ago. It was a song he learned while courting my mother while he was teaching in West Virginia.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Jeri
Date: 20 Mar 10 - 10:11 AM

See also the Origin: When You and I were Young Maggie linked to at the top. Although this info was posted in 1998, I didn't see it until now. I'd never even heard the song until I heard it sung (and played fiddle on it) in our Friday night sessions, and then I started hearing it all over.

Beautiful song. Uplifting because of the love expressed, but still sad.

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: GUEST,999
Date: 20 Mar 10 - 09:53 AM

I have encountered some variations in the wording and when I have a computer at home--awaiting the monitor from the west--I'll dig into it more. I have loved the song for years--tears in my eyes love the song. It was a surprise to me that it had a Canadian author.

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 20 Mar 10 - 09:28 AM

According to an uncle (born 1925), in the Scottish Music Halls this song was occasionally performed as if the "Maggie" were a sheepdog, either represented on stage by a real dog or by a puppet. If this be true, then the whole song could not have been given.

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: banjoman
Date: 20 Mar 10 - 08:57 AM

A great song - I had some inkling of its history but thanks for the details. My wife (Maggie) and I often sing this and it has become part of our repetoire on the odd occasion that we are able to get out to venues as age and mobility problems are creeping up on us. Seems poignant somehow.

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 19 Mar 10 - 11:35 PM

Thanks for the info, 999. I never knew the author was Canadian.

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: GUEST,999--this was news to me.
Date: 19 Mar 10 - 09:52 PM

Biography
Schoolteacher and poet George Washington Johnson made his biggest contribution to the world of popular song when he wrote the lyrics to the standard "When You and I Were Young, Maggie" for his new wife, Maggie Clark, who was ailing from tuberculosis. Born in 1839 near Toronto, Canada, Johnson studied to become a schoolteacher, and by 20 years of age he began teaching in Hamilton, Ontario. As a young teacher, he met and fell in love with Maggie Clark, who at that time was one of his students. During one of Clark's harshest struggles with her illness, Johnson composed his now famous poem to her while viewing the local mill from his perch on a nearby hill, and then published it in 1864 in his book of poetry titled Maple Leaves. Johnson and Clark were married in October of that year, but in the spring of 1865, at the young age of 23, Maggie Clark died. A year later, Johnson requested his friend, James Austin Butterfield, to set the poem to music, and the song quickly became a popular worldwide standard. George Washington Johnson married twice more and died in 1917 in Pasadena, CA. ~ Gregory McIntosh, All Music Guide

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Uncle Jaque
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 09:09 PM

This one is usually a pretty good hit with the Senior community - Nursing Homes etc... along with "Silver Threads", "Grandfather's Clock", Old Kentucky Home" etc.. I have "Maggie" in a collection of Minstrel music, of all places!

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: catspaw49
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 09:04 PM

Its an age thing Kendall. But it never hurts to mention Sandy in talking about this song. He has just about the greatest rendition of this I can imagine.

Spaw

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: kendall
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 08:59 PM

Right you are spaw..somehow I overlooked that

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: catspaw49
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 05:14 PM

Thanks Malcolm and Jon.....AND Kendall, if you had read the thread Jon linked to, Sandy had a big part in that one and talking about this song. Sandy's rendition still makes me cry by the way.

And BTW, Jed Marum back up the thread there, does a good job with this one on HIS CD, "Streets of Fall River."

Spaw

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 04:27 PM

Other earlier discussions on the same subject may be found at:

When You and I were Young Maggie
req. recording or music for 'Maggie
When I first said I loved only you, Nora

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Stewart
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 03:52 PM

Here's the answer to my question about "Nora." My copy of Soodlums falsely attributes this to G. W. Johnston. But Prof's Traditional Irish Music Pages has the following history:

There our story might have ended, if it wasn't for John Casey. John Casey was born March 30th 1880 in a rather squalid part of Dublin. Having embraced the Irish republican cause he changed his name to Sean O'Casey and settled down to become a struggling playwright. In the 1920's the Abbey Theatre in Dublin accepted a number of his plays including "The Plough and the Stars" (1926) set around the 1916 Easter uprising. In it the central character sings "verses following to the air of 'When you and I were young Maggie'" and so the song "Nora" was born.

I know it is not uncommon for songs and melodies to be "borrowed", indeed we have featured some in past pages. I also know it not uncommon for a song to become "Irish" (classic example "Believe Me If All Those Endearing Young Charms" which we featured a while back) as indeed "Nora" did, being included in such notable Irish song publications as Soodlums and Ossian. What I do find rather pleasing is that Maggie ultimately seems to have prevailed . As I mentioned in the introduction to this feature, I have come across numerous recordings where, although the artist used O'Casey's lyrics, the name Nora has been changed back to Maggie.

Cheers, S. in Seattle

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: kendall
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 03:03 PM

Sandy Paton does a great job on Maggie on a Folk Legacy CD titled For all the good people- A Golden Ring Reunion. This is just one of many outstanding cuts on that cd.

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: jaze
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 02:24 PM

Foster and Allen (Irish Folky singers) do and incredibly beautiful and sentimental version of this song. I've also heard a version by Irish singers but the song was called "Nora". Neither version has the cemetery verse, however. This remains one of my very favorite songs. Sentimental, I guess.

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: JedMarum
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 12:09 PM

Thanks very much for the great info!

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Stewart
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 12:02 PM

G. W. Johnston also wrote the words to Nora, to the same tune by J. A. Butterfield.

The violets were scenting the woods, Nora...

So, who was Nora?

Cheers, S. in Seattle

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 02:57 AM

Here is a link to a previous thread.

Jon

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: SingsIrish Songs
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 02:22 AM

Prof's Traditional Irish Music site currently has a feature on this song...check it out.

http://www.prof.co.uk/irish/index.htm

Subject: RE: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Lyrical Lady
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 01:46 AM

Thank you, Barry! How I love that song! LL

Subject: When You And I Were Young, Maggie
From: Barry T
Date: 23 Dec 00 - 01:03 AM

I just tripped across an interesting historical site that explains the story behind this great old song. There really was a Maggie.

The main story is here, and pictures of both George Johnson, the author of the lyrics, and Maggie Clark are here.

The music and lyrics, for those who don't immediately recognize the tune, are here.

It's great to know that not only is the song preserved through its popularity but also its history!