BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?

Subject: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: M.Ted
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 05:26 PM

In the thread that questions the lifting of Johnny Cash to icon status, it was mentioned that Catspaw49 is one of the Mudcat icons(oddly enought,it was mentioned by me)--and it got me to thinking about who the other Mudcat icons are--and, because I am nothing if not a dualist, I recognize that negative icons are just as important as the positive ones--maybe more so, because there is nothing like a common enemy to bring a community together--

Some of you are lazy bastards, and will try to get away with posting a laundry list--I won't accept that--when you nominate your icons, explain what they represent, and explain how and why you think that they were elevated by our community into the Pantheon--

This will be tricky, because Mudcat, being a community that includes performers and musicians, has members who are actually icons in the folk/traditional world, as well.

Some people may disagree on the icon status that others put forward--discussion is ok, but let's not be disrespectful to anyone--For starters:

MAX: The creator of our world, and the mostly absent father figure--he very rarely speaks directly to us, but mostly communicates through-

JOE OFFER: His earthly representative--Some see him as benevolent and tolerant, others as a strict and arbitrary-

and of course, there are the demons;

GARGOYLE--who spews both venom and gems of wisdom

MARTIN GIBSON--who some say is the Anti-Christ, and others say is a harmless trickster--

And the Knights Errant: Catspaw49, Bobert, Little Hawk, Katlaughing, WYSIWYG--etc.

You thoughts?

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: The Shambles
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 05:29 PM

I'll stick with Johhny Cash.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 05:51 PM

I think one should include various semi-fictional characters, such as:

Cletus, Paw, and the Reg Boys (*groan*) (but hey, they ARE icons...)

The Little Pissant

Cleigh O'Possum

Now, the above were all created or at least promoted by Spaw...so they are spinoff icons from HIS obvious status as a Mudcate Icon.

The same might be said of a number of characters I have created or promoted, such as...

Chongo Chimp
Blind DRunk in Blind River (Shane McBride)
William Shatner in all his matchless iconic manifestations, which are legion, and probably growing as we speak.

Big Mick is a Mudcat icon, I'd say. When he posts you know that someone is speaking who pulls a lot of weight (no pun intended) on the forum.

The Shambles is a Mudcate icon, having attained unusual notoriety by bringing up certain issues over and over again..

There are certain institutions that have by now become Mudcat icons:

The NYCFTTS (another creation of Spaw's, the Neil Young Center For The Terminally Screwed is a sort of retirement home for folkies who have entered their 2nd or 3rd childhood and for whom there is, frankly, no possibility of restoration to coherence or lucidity.

The MOABS thread. This running joke about a thread which combines all the BS under one title has lived on far beyond the intentions of its originator, Khandu, and now serves as a club for about 8 or 10 people to chatter inanely in on a regular basis.

The WSSBA (William Shatner School of BAAAAAAD Acting) was launched by mois with the intention of attaining iconhood just like the NYCFTTS...but I don't think it ever quite made it. Wasn't for lack of trying... ;-)

Clinton Hammond - Mudcat icon due to his somewhat aggressive approach to human relations...

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 06:15 PM

While he only posted infrequently by the time I joined Mudcat, I knew him before those days. He was a man who had an impact on people, and still does in here.

Rick Fielding

Any questions?

Jerry

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 06:25 PM

Kendall Morse, and McGrath of Harlow, both for speaking sense while others were speaking nonsense.
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Bill D
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 06:29 PM

Jeri, for her growing musical knowlege and taste...interspersed with a keen eye for the point of some of the long-winded debates we get into here. She doesn't usually hang out in the middle of unseemly battles, but when she does comment, it often hits a nerve. I wish I could be as clear and relevant in so few words...(no doubt others wish I could too...☺...I may be an icon of verbosity)

and for just straight, happy, interesting, clear, charming, relevant sharing of ideas and feelings...Ebbie! She has become one of my 2-3 favorite posters....now if I could just get her to say more in person...*grin*. (yes, YOU, Ebbie..)

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 07:02 PM

Anyone who posts under their 'member' name, and unashamedly.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Ebbie
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 07:06 PM

gulp

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 07:06 PM

Amos

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: bobad
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 07:54 PM

Mudcat icon

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Bobert
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 08:45 PM

Well, well, well...

I don't do slam books....














The heck I don't!!!

This ain't hard at all 'cause there's a bunch of folks who fall into the verious tiers of icondom... Of course there are the "old farts icons"... Heck, we all know who they are and we love 'um in spite of theur old fartishness...

Then there's the not-so-ol'-farts who have been 'round Mudville 'bout as long as me an' they nknow who they are... The one's I especially iconerate to icon status are those who either pull my butt out of the messes I create or like fighting with the likes of the folks that ain't on my icon list and them folks know who they are as well...

Then there's this last tier of icons... Well, not ewxcatly icons but icons-in-the-makin' and icon-wantabees and these folks don't have a clue who they are an' I ain't gonna tell 'um 'er they might get big heads and and blow their chances to one day be ol'farts...

Yeah, that's the way I see it...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 09:06 PM

and Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: kendall
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 09:38 PM

And, if elected, there will be a little pot in every chick.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: jimmyt
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 09:43 PM

Leadfingers

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: John Hardly
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 09:53 PM

What a strange thread. And what a equally strange, most unexpected person to have started it.

M.Ted -- was always near the top of my short list of people about whose postings I gave a care. Oddly, because he seemed: 1. full of good information, and 2. only a mild hit-and-run where BS was concerned -- and that mostly well-reasoned (even if I did disagree quite often) thoughts. Definetly NOT "one of the gang", but an MVP in my book.

PeterT -- god how I loved the way that guy could turn a phrase. You could isolate his "best of" posts and they'd be worthy of a forum of their own. Always wished I had that kind of mind. Similarly wish I'd that way with words to express it. Sure there was always a ten foot wall between us -- he was kinda the "anti-Fielding" if you will, where (as Peter once put it) caring for those "with their face pressed to the glass" is concerned. I kinda chalked that up to: 1. Inherent shyness on his part, and 2. Maybe I'd distance myself from me too -- maybe the guy just has taste that matches his wit. :^)

Big Mick -- symbolized the warmth of mudcat to me for a long time. Guy went out of his way (miles and miles) just to meet with me when I know he had to be BEAT from a long business trip. But the mudcat (and folks associated with it) were that important to Mick. Yeah, he's one of the first I think of when I think of the mudcat.

Fielding/Catspaw -- never knew either one of them. They would have been the Ruth & Gehrig, Larry Bird & Magic Johnson (I doubt that catspaw has the magic.....nevermind) to any music-related forum they ever chose to settle into. Enough personality, humor, creativity between the two of them to turn any forum into a community. Hell, catspaw's humor was so great, so unique, that I'd place a sizable wager that his humor posts from 1998 are the initial source for all that goddam forwarded email humor that spams my e-box every day. Thanks for nothing, catspaw! dickhead. :^)

DougR -- unflappable class. Has taken the worst and acted as a gentleman. Probably the closest to his comportment, but from the "other side" would be the equally "mudcat idol"-type -- McGrath of Harlew (or whatever the heck that nom-de-cyber is. I never remember it, idol or not).

I think the last one to come to the forum (chronologically, and before it became a political rather than musical forum) with the same kind of sensibility, humor, care for music and......heck, who I'd actually REALLY enjoy sitting down with and playing music....and the fact that he may not be on other's short list of "idol" candidates is testament to the changes here (and what's now valued), and not his "best-of-mudcat-esque" postings is Bee-dubya-ell.

It seems that Jeri posts nearly as infrequently as I visit. Had mudcat gone more the way of her way of being....my visits wouldn't be as infrequent (maybe not a good thing) and maybe she'd post more frequently (definitely a good thing). Some trades prove to just not be worth it.

That guy that some call "Leej" (is it lonesomeEJ or something?) and JenEllen. Marvelous writers. I DEFINITELY think of them when I think of the best of mudcat.

Mooh -- though less prominent, most every good thread had at least one contribution -- a worthy one -- from Mooh.

If this had remained a music site two of the first mentioned would be Frank Hamilton and Art Theime. Hmmmm.

There are definitely friends from mudcat that I have a greater affinity for -- admire more -- but this is a list of "mudcat idols", right?

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: gnu
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 10:02 PM

Every clone... why? For putting up with us.

Max... why? For putting up with us and with the clones.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: M.Ted
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 10:44 PM

Thank you for the kind words, John Hardly, I've always thought you were one of the good ones, too.
Given that, though, I don't think I am an icon--I mostly try to help people who are wrestling with any of the many things that a musician/performer/lyricist/composer must face daily. As to the "strangeness", well, yes--guilty as charged.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: GUEST,Cluin
Date: 23 Apr 06 - 10:59 PM

Bruce Murdoch, a scary kinda icon... at least to this guy anyway.

To the rest of us, he's a sweetheart.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 12:43 AM

That is a memorable album cover.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 12:54 AM

LEJ and Peter T. are amazing writers...as good as it gets.

Rick Fielding would have to be the greatest Mudcat icon of all. It's hard to believe he's not still here among us. (physically, I mean)

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Ebbie
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:12 AM

There are so many but if I had to choose just one, it would be katlaughing. I think most of us recognize her as a sensitive, caring, heart-wide-open treasure. She is one of those people of whom it can be said, You can share without caring but you cannot care without sharing.

Thanks, kat.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Ernest
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 04:07 AM

hmmm.... in addition to those listed above I would like to add

Jerry Rasmussen - wish I could start threads like he does...

Poppa Gator - the first catter I met in person so far* and also a man of taste. "Thanks" to Katrina he could be our Noah!

Best

Ernest

* = I didn`t count my friend Marty.bye here because I knew him before he joined up.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: The Shambles
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 04:35 AM

Guest.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: ard mhacha
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 05:03 AM

Guest and my favourite is the Guest who blasts Bush on a regular basis, keep them coming.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: GUEST,NODDY
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 09:57 AM

I am to shy to say.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: greg stephens
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 10:01 AM

Greatest humourist John from Hull, who frequently changes his name, and is currently the Rt Hon Sir NoRman from Hull or something like that.
Best politicos: DougR (right), McGrath(left)
Most useful sources of information: Masato Sakurai and Malcolm Douglas.
Sadly miseed: Rick Fielding.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Mooh
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 10:34 AM

Rick, dick, Mick, Alice, Bruce, Spaw, Jerry, John, MTed, and I like to hear from Jeremiah, black walnut, and Aine. Wish I had the time to be a Full Patch Member Of The Mud, but there are other things.

Two days ago I was awakened from Mudslumber by a lovely lady canvassing for the Cancer Society. It's bad enough that I've lost close family and friends to cancer without feeling guilty about doing little about it. I gave more than I can really afford, but I can't afford not to give more...if you get my drift. Turn off the computer and go DO something!

Around Mudcat, those who DO something are the icons.

Thanks for the reminder.

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Alice
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 11:08 AM

Mooh, as a Mudcatter who posted almost daily since 1998 and then had life overtake that obsession a few years ago, thank you for remembering my name!
I've been more active offline since letting go of constant mudcatting. Maybe I'm all talked out on the most of the threads...

Bruce O was one of my favorites for adding interesting info on sources.
Also Philippa and Big Tim.
The rest of my old mudcat buddies know who you are and that I love you all for what you offer.

Alice

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 11:20 AM

Bill D, for good&/interesting computer information. Mark Cohen for medical advice (Have I got that right?)

bbc

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: GUEST,bbc at work
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 11:20 AM

Sorry, that last post was me!

bbc

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 11:28 AM

The people who sybolize what is good about the Mudcat for me are Bill D and Rita, Rick and Heather, Mick, JenEllen, Amos, MMario, Mousetheif, Gnu, LittleHawk and of course the lovely CarolC. I consider none of them Icons but I am proud to call them friends. I was proud to call Max and Joe friends too. But we appear to have had a falling out which I will mention no further on ted's fine thread.

I guess I underestimated DougR. I never cared much for his opinions, seemed to close to Bush talking points for me, but he did tend to stay on topic.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: GUEST,DB
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 12:10 PM

I nominate Malcolm Douglas because he knows about folk music (rather than having fatuous opinions based on guesswork, received wisdom and wishful thinking).

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Once Famous
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 12:18 PM

I'll tell you a bunch who are not.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 12:25 PM

What Martin seems to mean is that very few rise to the level of icon, either positive or negative, and consequently most Mudcatters are not icons. We are indeed blessed to have him to state the obvious for us, in the bluntest possible manner.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: alanabit
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 12:49 PM

He is more often than not my opponent in the debates here. I want to mention Doug R though as a man, who can deliver his opinions clearly, but without malice. You don't have to be spiteful or undignified to express a firm view. Doug R is proof of that.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 12:57 PM

I agree about that Alan.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: gnu
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 01:42 PM

Say.... where is Mousethief anyway? Has he posted lately? I can't recall the last peep I heard out of him.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: M.Ted
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 01:44 PM

In an attempt to swerve out of the way of trouble, here, it suddenly occurs to me that the subject really would include performers and personages that are commonly referenced revered by Mudcatters--beyond William Shatner, that is--

Merle Travis and his guitar style(or a misunderstanding thereof) is often invoked here-- as are The Carter Family and Mother Maybelle's guitar style(or a misunderstaning thereof)-- Nic Jones is revered by some here in a manner usually reserved for the dead, and Martin Carthy is often cited in the manner some might cite the Twelve Tables of the Law--

Comments, Questions, or Observations?

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 01:46 PM

The Ghost of Stan Rogers strolls through here once in a while. That's one thing that attracted me to this site in the first place.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 02:53 PM

Icons are human and, as such, there's an asshole behind every one of 'em.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Amos
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 02:54 PM

Not to mention Earl, Doc, and even Arlo. And, the list cannot be written without putting our own Kytrad at the top.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: GUEST,Seamus Kennedy
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:00 PM

Just one icon - Rick Fielding. Everyone else is an Icon-in-Waiting.

Seamus

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 05:40 PM

Sandy and Caroline Paton; Dick Greenhaus; Art Thieme; my Knights in Shining Armour, you know who you are.

And, Ebbie, YOU are to me!! Thank you, very much, for your kindness, darlin'!

luvyakat

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 05:56 PM

I'm with Seamus on that one.

But I think that Rick personified slightly better Mudcat than we have had since he departed. He smoothed a lot of rough spots and he lead by example. He made me feel like family when Carol introduced him to me. He was a very very good man.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: s&r
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 05:57 PM

John in Kansas who researches engineering problems for everyone.

Stu

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Big Mick
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 06:28 PM

First, thank you for the kind comments made above.

I don't like lists because they are exclusive by their nature, and I believe the magic that is Mudcat was and is its inclusiveness.

But I will say that Rick is the genuine article. Sandy Paton is the genuine article. And, of course, Jean Ritchie (kytrad) is the absolute genuine article.

One that I would immediately include would be Frank McGrath. Many of you won't recognize the name, but he gave us one on the greatest gifts when he brought THIS wonderful recounting of how Robbie McMahon came on the lyrics of Spancil Hill. The story was so compelling that Frank ended up doing an interview with Irish Music Magazine, as a result (I suspect) of another Mudcatter known here as Liam's Brother, but to many of us as Dan Milner.

Dan Milner (Liam's Brother) is absolutely a Mudcat icon for what he has contributed over the years. He is an ethnomusicologist of the first order, one of the great singers, married to one of the finest women I have met (and a Johnson Girl no less), and a wonderful and giving musician.

All the best,

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Amos
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 06:43 PM

Actually, JtS is the paradigm of good-hearted, feisty, funny and informative souls who come to this community. He's the classic Mudcatter. And he is not anti-social.

I don't see that religion has anything to do with anything. Good folks never let their differences stand between them if they can possibly help it.

A

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Alice
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 07:16 PM

For me, the iconic thread of Mudcat was and still is the Where is Spancil Hill thread.
I agree with Mick, I don't like lists. They too often are popularity contests, and people and things get left out.
In the Spancil Hill thread, Frank not only came up with Robbie's story of the original version (when I innocently asked Where is Spancil Hill I had no idea what a wonderful history would turn up) but Frank took that info on to add an article to Irish Music magazine after our thread discussion here.
I started talking to Jean Ritchie by email from finding her web site, and gave her the link to Mudcat, inviting her to join. This was in earlier days where there was more focus on music and fewer people involved in the site. It took some time, but Jean (kytrad) eventually joined, and we are all blessed for that. Rick Fielding, Art Thieme, Sandy and Caroline Paton (I'll never forget Sandy and I discussing Mary O'Hara and both racing to the used book web sites to get her autobiography), Bill Sables (and the road trip adventure with Allan C.), and so many more have made this place a rich community for many years. Thank you all for what you contribute!

Alice

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 07:32 PM

Allen C is another good soul, a very good man and a good friend, but not an icon.

Subject: RE: BS: Who are the Mudcat Icons?
From: Bobert
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 07:45 PM

rEally, wow, folks...

I thought my earlier post might have brought this absolute silliness to and end but...

Are we really that petty that we need to have this "slam book" thread get all this attention??? Haven't we had enough of them past???

Bottom line, if I just stopped in here tonight and read this thread, it would be my last stop here...

I mean, lets get real... Slam books are hurtfull and there are alot of fine folks who haven't even gotten an honorable mention who might just be thinkin', "Hey, why am I wasting my time here with alot of ol' folks who are into worshiping each other???"

That's the way I see it and that is MO...

Bobert

(and last post to this thread....)