BS: Chilean trapped miners - All Out & Safe!

Subject: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Bettynh
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 11:44 AM

Has anyone else been following this story ? I try to imagine being trapped with 32 others for more than 2 weeks, and then finding out we're there till Christmas. Even with food, air, water, and internet, it's gonna be a long wait. There's potential for an epic ballad, as well.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: greg stephens
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 12:02 PM

I would want the complete works of Patrick O'Brian lowered down. And some looroll. And some beer. Well, quite a lot of stuff actually. Good luck to the poor lads, sounds as if they are going to need it.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Alice
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 02:00 PM

Yes, I just watched the news update. The rescuers have contacted NASA to see what help for surviving in enclosed spaces can be provided from the space program, and also submarine technology that can help.
They will begin by sending liquid food down today.

A.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: mauvepink
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 02:16 PM

I just saw the news item too. How terrible for them. I, too, find it hard to imagine without quickly falling into some nightmare scenario. I hope their time goes quick and that they survive this but I would not change places for all the gold there is.

Makes you appreciate your freedom

mp

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: gnu
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 03:22 PM

Words escape me.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: fat B****rd
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 03:30 PM

On the BBC news tonight the trapped miners were heard singing.
Remarkable ! I can only admire them and wish them well.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: GUEST,999
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 05:06 PM

My grandfather was a coal miner way back--1898. He told me about the mines, the horses and the life. I cried when I heard they found some of the boys alive. It`ll be tough, but hey, they were tough in the first place. I don`t believe in God, but if there IS some sort of helping force out there, I hope it considers these men.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Maryrrf
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 07:50 PM

They know they're facing a difficult time, but it sounds like the relief at being alive with rescue coming (even if it will take awhile) will keep them going. I wonder if they'll go into the mines again after this?

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Ebbie
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 10:37 PM

Presumably they will be given a source of lighting so maybe what I have read won't pertain, but I have heard that with no way of telling time of day or date, time has little meaning. In other words a month may be much less onerous for them than it will be for the watchers and rescuers.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 Aug 10 - 11:23 PM

Me, too, gnu.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 09:46 AM

The poor men and their families - although I complain about my job from time to time I realise that I am lucky to have a 'safe' job.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 01:07 PM

This the saddest, most tragic story I've ever read. It is hard to imagine that any survivors who come out (and I'm pessimistic any will) will ever be able to lead a normal life after being trapped in that small, dark, hell for 3-4 months.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: katlaughing
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 01:59 PM

They do seem to have had some preparedness training and supplies, as well as strong leadership, though, by the reports, the company reopened before they should have. I was relieved to see one USA expert say it might be only a matter of weeks. I hope he is right.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 02:06 PM

"It is hard to imagine that any survivors who come out (and I'm pessimistic any will) will ever be able to lead a normal life after being trapped in that small, dark, hell for 3-4 months."

I believe they will. They have each other, and they know the world is with them supporting them and working at getting them out of there. All things that make a very challenging experience, psychologically endurable.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 02:16 PM

Kat and Crow Sister, I'd rather you are right and I'm wrong. What I've heard, howver, from several news sources is that the digging goes so slowly that they may not be out until Nov. or Dec., hence my pessimism.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 02:41 PM

Here are pictures and names of all of miners. Good faces.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 05:01 PM

I would bet on them too. Every miner has to work daily in cramped, unsafe quarters. I believe they have gotten some telecommunications down to them...next could be small entertainment devices, food and water of course, soap..they have asked for toothbrushes...clean clothes...maybe kindles? Ear plugs so they don't have to listen to each other snore..

And a way of getting sewage up the shaft although they say there are tunnels they have been able to use...

I think most will be OK..although there is concern over a couple of heavier ones that might not get throught the planned hole. They are hoping they will lose weight in the meantime. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 06:41 PM

They've asked to have some beer as well. And they are getting letters:

"Can you imagine? After 30 years of marriage we will start sending each other love letters again," said Lilianett Ramírez, whose 63-year-old husband, Mario Gómez, is among those trapped. She was first to send a letter down to her husband yesterday. "I told him to be very patient, that we're all camped out here, following his every heartbeat. That he shouldn't become desperate, and that he try to be extremely tranquil," she said. (From here) Mario Gomez is number ten in that link I gave to the faces and names.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Bobert
Date: 25 Aug 10 - 10:18 PM

What I want to know is why it takes 4 months to drill a 2000 foot, 2 foot wide shaft large enough to get these guys out... Seems something is wrong here... Seems that with the right eqipement they shoould be able to do at least 100 fett a day... That's not much... Heck, a 300 foot deep well can be drilled in lass than 2 days and that's thru stone???

Maybe I am missing something here???

No matter, I hope they all get out alive and can figure out how to find some peace in their lives after such an experience...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: I don't know
Date: 26 Aug 10 - 03:51 AM

This mornings report said they have sent lights, phones, cards, books & food & water. Lets hope the drilling is completed quicker than expected & for the families sake everyone survives this horrendous ordeal

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Aug 10 - 10:07 AM

Maybe it won't take as long as they have been saying.

From that Guardian story I linked to: Andres Sougarret, leading the rescue effort, estimated that it would take three to four months to pull the men out. But Davitt McAteer, a former assistant secretary of the US Mine Safety and Health Administration, called that "perhaps the most conservative model"."

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: katlaughing
Date: 26 Aug 10 - 11:59 AM

It does seem as though it will take a good while. There is a good explanation of what has to happen, with photos of the rescue equipment, HERE.

May they all keep their spirits up and may the rescuers be well guided and swiftly, safely bring them all to the surface.

kat

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Ebbie
Date: 27 Aug 10 - 01:57 AM

My guess is that the miners are well aware of the factors involved in getting them out. I would bet that the old timers among them have already gone down the list of what must be done and what could go wrong.

The best thing that the rescuers and loved ones can do is to say frankly that they don't know how long it will take and to be assured that it won't take one moment longer than needs be.

Nobody needs to spell it out.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Aug 10 - 07:11 AM

It would appear they aren't going to be sitting down there brooding - there's going to be sustained hard work involved removing the rubble as the escape shaft is drilled.

From this clip they look a pretty impressive bunch.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler
Date: 27 Aug 10 - 07:37 AM

From what I hear on BBC Radio4 the reason that it will take so long is that they have to drill though granite most of the way. This is not a coal mine, most of which are in relatively soft rock.

I would have thought that NASA woild be interested in the situation as some of the problems involved here are the same as on a Mars mission with a group of people stuck in close proximity for such a long period in a rather dangerous predicament. There certainly should be some lessons to be learned by the end of their time underground.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 27 Aug 10 - 12:52 PM

I think they are going to at least think about certain items to have on hand in case someone snaps...tranquilizers, handcuffs etc. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 27 Aug 10 - 02:17 PM

I'm keeping them all in my heart, every day. I feel so much for the men and their families. It must be devastating to know they're alive, and yet to not know if you'll ever see them again. This kind of tragedy unites us all as a Species.

I hope the men who own the mine, and who refused to make it safe, refused to install ladders etc...despite the miners telling them things were looking very unstable, are spending each and every moment, of each and every day swamped with guilt over their actions..or lack of action.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Aug 10 - 04:56 PM

I assume that there are mining engineers who are exploring any other possibilities for opening up a rescue route.

Here's a piece by Ken Capstick of the NUM about the life of being a miner:

...Miners depend on each other for their own safety, which creates an unbreakable bond of camaraderie. Some might find it strange that a coalmine echoes to the sound of laughter. If I miss anything, it is the humour.

A miner is a miner wherever he works. Sometimes I spent 18 hours at a stretch in a coalmine, but can only imagine what it must be like for those fellow miners trapped in the unimaginable darkness of the San José gold and copper mine.

Leadership will be a vital element, someone experienced who they trust and respect, with the authority and mental strength to maintain his own morale as well as that of the others. I have met many men of that calibre. And in San José, 670 metres underground, it seems a natural leader has emerged – 54-year-old shift foreman Luis Urzúa.

If you have ever called a miner greedy, say a prayer with me tonight for those in Chile who, if reports are accurate, look like being there until Christmas.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Joe_F
Date: 27 Aug 10 - 06:24 PM

"Ballad of Springhill"
_Ace in the Hole_

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Beer
Date: 28 Aug 10 - 12:18 AM

Late arriving here.
Saw the video on the T.V. tonight and all i have to say is that as long as messages can be sent and heard by those men/women? than it is a great blessing to their families and their survival.
Ad.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: open mike
Date: 28 Aug 10 - 04:09 AM

what are/were they mining? I recall some grusome scenes of mines in south america...tin mines, perhaps...in one of the movies Koyanaquatsi
or powasquatsi...there were 3 movies in that series....with music by phillip glass. they were in the style of montage...almost like slide shows with image after image.....the mines in the movie were open pit maines with workers crawling up out of a pit with bags of ore on their heads and backs...oh see it is a copper mine.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Aug 10 - 05:23 AM

"...the San José gold and copper mine."

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Seaking
Date: 28 Aug 10 - 05:49 AM

I imagine that there will be some fairly major technical issues to overcome, hence the seemingly long time period to complete the rescue bore. The drill cuttings have to be removed to surface (that's a large volume from a 2 ft hole over 2000 ft)and the rotating bit will need to be cooled and lubricated, similar to the principals involved in oil and gas well driling. That involves setting up a lot of heavy duty equipment. I doubt the drill bits will be 'off the shelf' so may have to be produced. Drilling through granite won't be quick and the drill string will probably need to be pulled regularly to replace the bit. The deeper you go the longer this takes each time it's done.

I wish the guys the very best of luck and look forward to them being rescued as soon as possible, it would seem that every available resource is being thrown at this. One of the most important factors in maintaining their mental wellbeing will be providing them regular information on the drilling progress.

Chris

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Aug 10 - 06:26 AM

The drill cuttings have to be removed to surface As I understand it, a lot of the cuttings will be falling down into the mine, and the miners are going to be having to work long shifts to clear it away into the tunnels.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 28 Aug 10 - 06:56 AM

"the miners are going to be having to work long shifts to clear it away into the tunnels."

Somehow I imagine being physically engaged in essential work towards establishing their own freedom, would suit these men better that sitting around passively waiting for rescue. There's less helplessness in that, and it will help to productively eat up the long, long hours down there in the dark.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Beer
Date: 28 Aug 10 - 11:18 PM

refresh

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Ebbie
Date: 28 Aug 10 - 11:44 PM

Today they reported that five of the 33 men are showing signs of reacting with depression to the stress, and that they will be addressing that with a therapist and medication.

I just hope the time goes swiftly for them and that there will be a happy day when the last man is pulled out alive and well.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Newport Boy
Date: 29 Aug 10 - 10:56 AM

Some might find it strange that a coalmine echoes to the sound of laughter. If I miss anything, it is the humour.

Confirmed by Max Boyce (Duw, it's hard): "And I'll not forget the times we had, laughing midst the fear."

The drill cuttings have to be removed to surface
As I understand it, a lot of the cuttings will be falling down into the mine, and the miners are going to be having to work long shifts to clear it away into the tunnels.

The initial pilot hole will need removal to the surface, but the reaming out will let the cuttings fall, and that's about 3/4 of the total.

I think one of the worst parts of the rescue will be being hauled up inside the capsule. It's a very long way in a very small hole, and it wouldn't take much in the way of a minor fall to block progress.

I speak from (very limited) experience. I was lowered down a series of 600mm clay bores in a similar capsule to inspect the bottom. Only 12m deep, not 700m. The capsule had a mesh panel in the top, so I was able to see the sky - this won't be possible in the deep bore. I found the experience very claustrophobic - not something I suffer from normally.

Phil

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Ebbie
Date: 29 Aug 10 - 01:44 PM

Phil, that reminds me of what they tell you in Virginia's Luray Caverns when they turn off the lights to let you experience total darkness: If it scares you, close your eyes.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: katlaughing
Date: 29 Aug 10 - 03:30 PM

I couldn't do it, Phil, unless they drugged me with tranqs or something. I'd go crazy trying to get out...too claustrophobic! I guess that must be somewhat of a familiar thing to a miner, though? Not something as small as the wire basket, but tight quarters at least.

I almost couldn't finish a Nevada Barr novel once, Blind Descent. It took place in Carlsbad Caverns and the descriptions of the tight, tight, small cracks the main character had to go through just about had me going through the roof.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Newport Boy
Date: 29 Aug 10 - 04:21 PM

I'm sure miners do get used to the confined space. I've only spent one shift below ground, and the initial horror gave way to some sense of normality.

I supervised a pipejack under a railway line - the 3ft diameter pipe was about 10ft below ground and was gradually pushed under the line with hydraulic jacks. To make this work, someone has to dig out the ground in front of the pipe. We had an ex-miner do the job. He went in at 8am and came out at 4pm each day. He ate his lunch where he was working, and wouldn't come out. The maximum distance was 25 yards!

Phil

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Ebbie
Date: 12 Sep 10 - 07:53 PM

A glitch but on target... How hard it is.

Plans continue

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 12 Sep 10 - 11:35 PM

Since they have been down for a month, why are they now getting cigarettes? A golden chance to give up, surely.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: open mike
Date: 13 Sep 10 - 01:39 AM

any news on this situation? I played some mining songs on my radio show by way of sending good thoughts for a positive outcome for these miners

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Gurney
Date: 13 Sep 10 - 01:48 AM

One of the men must be especially worried, according to my lady. She heard on the news that both his wife and his girlfriend turned up at the pithead.   And got talking.....

Mary put her finger on the point that occured to me. I hope the place is big enough to get away from the waste-products.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: open mike
Date: 13 Sep 10 - 03:01 AM

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iWbdQnTuWBzuFDy7O-UjlSjeuMOg

they are being shown exercise videos and are working out one hour a day

http://ap.juneauempire.com/pstories/20100912/707006659.shtml

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 13 Sep 10 - 07:32 AM

>One of the men must be especially worried, according to my lady. She heard on the news that both his wife and his girlfriend turned up at the pithead.   And got talking<

I really feel for the men down the mine and hope they emerge safe and unharmed, but I would love to be a fly on the wall when they all meet up again with their loved ones!

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: I don't know
Date: 15 Sep 10 - 03:42 AM

Just read one of the miners wife has had her baby (Girl). Best wishes to the family & lets hope they soon get all the miners out.

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 15 Sep 10 - 04:17 AM

That's right and they have named her Esperanza (Hope). Here's hoping he gets to meet her very soon!

Subject: RE: BS: Chilean trapped miners
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 15 Sep 10 - 04:53 AM

Yes I hope so to, it is sad that the wife had to be without her husband at the birth but it will give him the determination to keep going until he meets his beautiful baby girl.