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BS: Libraries under siege
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Subject: BS: Libraries under siege From: Stilly River Sage Date: 13 Jul 04 - 04:50 PM Heaven forbid that teenagers in this day and age should be exposed to information regarding healthy sex and birth control information! [sigh] this kind of wrong-headed thinking doesn't prevent a single teen from partaking, but it might block access to information they need to at least be careful in what they're doing.
July 13, 2004 02:47 PM EDT SIOUX FALLS, S.D. - The governor shut down the teen section of the South Dakota State Library's Web site, saying it included links to material he doesn't believe young people should see. Gov. Mike Rounds' move to shut down the entire teen section Monday followed a decision last week by the State Library Board to remove a link to a Planned Parenthood Web site. While the state board rejected a request to remove the link in April, it reversed itself Friday at the urging of the governor. Rounds opposes abortion; Planned Parenthood lobbies to keep abortion legal. "As a parent, I would be very disturbed to have my children connecting to any of these Web sites that are found through the state Web site at this time," the Republican governor said Monday afternoon as links on the library's Teen Center page began disappearing. Rounds said he will assemble a committee to review the links and see if any can be restored. In Rapid City, the state's second largest city, about 20 teens rallied at their city's public library Monday, protesting the Planned Parenthood decision. "It seems as though our governor is censoring one particular group without really regards to the content," said one protester, Loy Maierhauser. "It's kind of like pulling a book off the library shelf just because of the author." However, Rounds said the removal of the Web links does not amount to censorship because Internet users still can go directly to those organizations' sites. State government sites should not feature links to advocacy groups that are politically active, he said. A quick scan of the Teen Center site before the plug was pulled revealed mostly links to information about popular culture. Some general categories, included "Words to Chill By," "Homework," "Life After High School," "That's Life" and "Teen 'Zines." One link was to Columbia University's Go Ask Alice!, which provided answers to health concerns and some explicit sexual questions. Another was to It's Your (Sex) Life, which includes information on pregnancy, birth control and sexually transmitted diseases. Rounds said he made a judgment call, and that's one reason he was elected. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Sorcha Date: 13 Jul 04 - 05:04 PM My librarian would we reading somebody the Riot Act in spades! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Amos Date: 13 Jul 04 - 05:48 PM Bloody meddling fascists. A |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: GUEST,Barry on another's pc Date: 13 Jul 04 - 06:17 PM If it's not one brainless authority figure who has the world's answer to one or all of the evils, it's some other idiot with power telling the population what's best for us all, in their VERY humble opinion. The Catholic Church is now alining itself or competing with the Christian Right in a political power play for the souls of us all & for it's god given right to rule the nation. The more info children, teens & adults have on any subject the better able to make an educated decision never mind the fact that denying people the access to any form of media proctected as a form of free speach. Book burning is looking to rear it's ugly head, banning undemocratic forms of music has already shown it's evil face in public, disagreement with the powers that be weither it's the government, the church is enough cause to be looked on as an enemy combatment of this country, the religious inquisition is on the move again, no news is good news no longer holds water it only means we're drowning in a sea of mis/dis information. Pretty soon us Americans are gonna be searching for a new home somewhere in a mystical land of the free. Barry |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: TheBigPinkLad Date: 13 Jul 04 - 06:25 PM Great idea. Shut down the teenager web pages at the library ... that'll keep the teenagers of South Dakota safe from all that rude stuff on the Internet. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Bill Hahn//\\ Date: 13 Jul 04 - 06:46 PM I am president of my local library board. The frightening thing is that the Feds now have authority to come in and ask for the reading habits of patrons if they chose to do that. Patriot Act. Great acronym for something it is not. The policy of the ALA, and ours, is to ask for a supboena. In addition, our computers (ah what happened to the kindly ladies with the pencils that had a stamp at the other end to tell you when the book was due)are programmed not to store any patron's use in memory. Only overdue books are stored there. As to the thoughts above about the teen-ager's situation vis a vis birth control and such subjects. What a sad state of affairs when we limit our youth in garnering information to, perhaps, help them in making safe and sane decisions regarding their lives and sexual habits. The prurient always seem to feel they have to instill their values on the masses and the self serving politicos go along for some votes. W being no exception---though he may really believe this (expletive deleted). What do we get---AIDS. Among other things. Bill Hahn |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: LadyJean Date: 14 Jul 04 - 12:40 AM And yet Dick Cheney uses the F word on the Senate floor. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Don Firth Date: 14 Jul 04 - 04:34 PM The people who want to censor the libraries are the same people who regard the Taliban as the personification of Evil, having no notion, of course, that they have the same mind-set. Regarding the Patriot Act (now there's a misnomer if there ever was one!!), this is the response of the Seattle Public Library: The Seattle Public Library Confidentiality Policy"Resistence is futile!!" Oh, yeah? Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Wesley S Date: 14 Jul 04 - 04:58 PM Shut down an entire section because of one link ?? This almost guarantees that teenagers of South Dakota will now check out the Planned Parenthood website even if they had never heard of it before. I am so looking forward to retirement so I can go to every single PTA meeting and be the liberal thorn in their side. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: GUEST,John O'Lennaine Date: 14 Jul 04 - 07:52 PM Yet again the iron fist of repression-morality proves its true worth. Drive the kids underground where they can pick up inaccurate, or perhaps truly malicious information. A small price to pay if it means keeping a respectable library unsullied. "LIBRARY"? Isn't this exactly what they're for? Finding reliable information? ...and then they feign concern because kids aren't using them any more. John |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Sorcha Date: 14 Jul 04 - 08:01 PM Wonder what Rapaire the Librarinan will say here....and the other librarians as well. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Bill Hahn//\\ Date: 14 Jul 04 - 08:16 PM I can only re-iterate what I had said earlier. We make sure that our computers retain no memory, our computers only keep lists of overdues. That said, we have, so far, have had no problems with queries from any gov. agency. Will we? Who knows. I, like everyone else, wants the terrorist attacks to cease. Yet, we do not want to change what our nation and our life-style is all about. As an author said recently---re: VietNam---we did not lose we just could not win because it would have changed our values of human life. His meaning was that we would have to use the most horrible weapons and wipe out all life in N. Vietnam. Let us hope that our values can stay intact, our rights remain constant and secure, and we can prevail in a strange new world with these things still whole. Politically--I doubt very much that this administration can do that---given their morality, self interests, and dogmatic behaviour. Bill Hahn |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under deluge From: Stilly River Sage Date: 21 Jul 04 - 04:10 PM Perhaps this needs a thread subtitle of "Libraries under deluge." It looks like this bogus "settlement" has allowed all of these record companies to dump their unwanted overstocked CDs, free up warehouse space, and consider the unloading of this junk of libraries around the nation as some sort of payment. Give me a break! I heard an interview with someone in the Seattle or King County Public Library (Washington State) saying they were simply putting these things out for the public so anyone who wanted could buy any of this oddball collection. So the record industry went from consipiring to set minimum prices to unloading unwanted goods on the unsuspecting public and marking their accounts "paid." Looks like the record industry is still calling the shots. What a crock. Libraries getting CDs, but contents a mystery By Paul Bourgeois, Star-Telegram Staff Writer Public libraries, schools and other agencies statewide will soon receive 409,000 compact discs in a lawsuit settlement against record companies. But it's anyone's guess what kind of music will be on the CDs. Kansas, for example, received 51,000 CDs, but the stash included 600 copies of a CD with one song -- Whitney Houston's rendition of The Star-Spangled Banner. "We don't know what we're going to get, but we have seen reports about some libraries getting a zillion copies of the same CD," said Deborah Littrell, state director of library development. Texas is expected to receive a list of its CDs in a few days, and distribution could begin within a month, said Tom Kelly, a spokesman for Attorney General Greg Abbott. Of the state's allocation, 74 percent will be turned over to the Texas Education Agency to be distributed among schools, and 22.6 percent will go to the Texas Library Board to be dispersed among libraries. The remainder will be sent to agencies such as Boys and Girls Clubs. The settlement came out of an antitrust lawsuit that accused major record companies and large music retailers of conspiring to set minimum music prices. SRS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Ebbie Date: 21 Jul 04 - 04:38 PM Bill Hahn: That said, we have, so far, have had no problems with queries from any gov. agency. Will we? Who knows Ah hah! How would we know?! That self-same Patriot Act forbids a library from telling patrons that their reading habits have been checked. So, Bill H, is your denial some kind of code? *g* |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Rapparee Date: 21 Jul 04 - 04:47 PM And now -- the Word from the Idaho State Journal, Pocatello's finest (and only) daily newspaper, for Friday, July 16, 2004: Libraries see many duplicate CDs from settlement By Emily Jones - Journal Writer POCATELLO - Marshall Public Library Director Mike Doellman doesn't have anything against Ricky Martin or Whitney Houston. He just doesn't expect the library users to check out 11 copies of Whitney singing "The Star- Spangled Banner," or 15 copies of Ricky crooning "She Bangs." Along with Houston and Martin, Doellman came back from a business trip Thursday to find 1,074 CDs waiting to be sorted and catalogued. The CDs were sent to Marshall and more than 90 other libraries across Idaho. The music was sent as part of an anti-trust settlement between music companies and 40 states. The state attorneys general alleged five music distributors and three large CD retailers conspired to raise the price of CDs. In addition to paying fines and restitution, the companies agreed to donate CDs to non-profit organizations. Many libraries, like Marshall, have seen lots of duplicates. One library in Washington state received more than 70 copies of Houston's "Star-Spangled Banner," Doellman said. The library staff is slowly going through the CDs, deciding what to keep and what to get rid of. The multiples (such as "Timeless: Honoring the Music of Hank Williams" - 15 copies), will be given to Friends of the Marshall Public Library for sale. Money from the sale is legally required to be spent on something music-related, and must supplement the already-existing budget, Doellman said. "If you like Ricky Martin, I've got a deal I think you're going to like," he said. In smaller communities, such as Grace, the CDs were a welcome gift. Grace Public Library received 78 CDs, and only a few were duplicated. Before receiving the CDs Thursday, Grace had no collection at all. "It's going to be really nice for us," said Grace Library Director Linda Rasmussen. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Rapparee Date: 21 Jul 04 - 04:51 PM As for the Governor of Whichever Dakota It Was: PHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBPTTT! Waddayaknow? He's a politician! And I wonder if he's up for re-election this year. Just keep them kids butt-naked iggerant. 'Sides, they kin learn that stuff at the street corner, jist like their daddies did. An' they kin marry them girls they git knocked up, jist like their daddies did. And they kin knock their old ladies around and beat their kids, jist like their daddies did. But by then the Gov. will be retired and it won't bother him any. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Bill Hahn//\\ Date: 21 Jul 04 - 04:52 PM Code---not at all. As said---read earlier post--re: computer lack of memory of checkouts, supboena requirements for any info at all. Again---no inquiries by anyone ----=yet. Our library serves a large mix of ethnicities. Bill Hahn |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Rapparee Date: 21 Jul 04 - 05:04 PM Thing about the PA is that they didn't ask libraries if some of this stuff could actually be done, like keeping records of the names of everyone who ever checked out a particular book. It can't. Sure, I could tell 'em what you have out right now, how many you have overdue, what fines you might owe, stuff that's current. If you brought a book to me and asked me to see who last had it out, I might be able to do so, IF it had been returned in the last week or so, maybe. Beyond that, it's gone. They shoulda oughta asked. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Rapparee Date: 21 Jul 04 - 05:09 PM But let me pose this to you all. It's a actual, real, happening. And it happened here. Last Saturday, a young boy and an older boy were using one of the children's computers. No big thing, older and younger siblings use these all the time. But this time there was a twist, because the younger boy went upstairs and told he mother that the older boy had "felt his chest and all over, even lower down." Obviously, the mother was disturbed, but when she came downstairs the old boy was gone. The older boy was identified, and the police called. A staff member looked up the older kid's address from his library registration record and gave it to the police officer. The police went to the older boy's home, where the kid admitted the offense. He was arrested and placed in the Juvenile Detention facility. Older boy is 14, younger kid is 5. Your comments??? |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Ebbie Date: 21 Jul 04 - 05:19 PM Bill H, I was being facetious. Sorry. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Bill Hahn//\\ Date: 21 Jul 04 - 05:30 PM Rapaire: I really do not understand the story you relate as it is written. But, I hasten to add that the mother called the police and was looking for her child. Sort of like a missing persons alert---not reading / computer habits. More like an AMber alert type of thing and all they rcvd was the address. Your story is not clear as to how the mother was involved with the police, why they took him, and such. Sounds like there was a lot more to the story---nothing to do with reading habits. Bill Hahn |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Rapparee Date: 21 Jul 04 - 07:03 PM Call the young boy Able and the older boy Baker. Able was using a children's computer to play a game and Baker sat down with him. While Able was on the computer, Baker fondled Able. Able left the computer and went upstairs to his mother, who was using a public Internet computer, and told his mother what had happened. Baker had left the library by the time Able and Mom came back downstairs. Mom called the cops from the library. The police came, talked the Able and Mom and the librayr staff. One of the staff gave Baker's address to the police, an address retrieved from the library's patron records. The police went to Baker's house, and he confessed. He was taken to the Juvenile Detention Center. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: DougR Date: 21 Jul 04 - 07:16 PM Bill H: I can see why you are so concerned. It must keep all of your librarians busy as hell looking up things the government has asked for. Oops, sorry. You said so far you have had no inquiries from the government. I guess I missread. DougR |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Bill Hahn//\\ Date: 21 Jul 04 - 07:42 PM Rapaire: I am curious---why did the mother not give her address to the police? Seems that would have been the first thing asked for. I am sure there is more to this story. Doug R: Either you are humorous or confrontational. I know not which---if humor--it eludes me. If confrontational---why? A simple statement of fact----no inquiries. Would you like that there were inquiries? Bill H |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Deckman Date: 21 Jul 04 - 07:54 PM Rapaire ... "GOOD JOB" I say. Bob |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Bill Hahn//\\ Date: 21 Jul 04 - 08:05 PM I restate my question----you said that they were siblings. If that is the case then why did Mom not tell the cops the whole story? SUrely---as said there is more to this than is being stated and perhaps misinterpreted. Bill H |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Rapparee Date: 21 Jul 04 - 08:40 PM 1. Able and Baker were NOT siblings. They are not even related. 2. The address retrieved from the records was that of Baker, not Able. 3. Siblings often share the computers that Able was using; the staff assumed that this was the case this time as well. Therefore, suspicions were not aroused. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Bill Hahn//\\ Date: 21 Jul 04 - 08:53 PM Rapaire: I re-read your earlier post. From the way you wrote it the scenario seemed like the siblings were there. Problem, I suppose, with written communication. That said---and if the story is correct in its entirety---boy fondled by stranger (also boy) --mother alerts police---police want his address. All proper---this is not a Patriot Act thing---as said earlier--an Amber Alert type of thing (though a bit different). WIth a supboena this could also have been accomplished with delay. Still no Patriot Act type of thing was involved---no records of computer use, no reading habits, etc; Rather a more serious and thing of the moment was uncovered---like pulling a driver over for erratic driving and finding drugs in his car and he is driving under the influence of something. Bill Hahn |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Rapparee Date: 21 Jul 04 - 09:33 PM Idaho, like many other states, has a law that says library records are to be held confidential. You cannot provide any information that would in itself, or if used with other public records, provide information about what a patron has checked out, requested, or services used by that patron. (Without a supeona or court order, of course.) In this case, it was legal. Only the Baker's address was given, and from the address you can't deduce his library use. And we wouldn't give even that information to just anyone ("Miss, (drool, slobber) kin I have the phone number of that cute little girl over there?") -- you'd better be a copy, an EMT, or have a VERY cogent reason for the information. Otherwise, we'll had you a phone book. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Rapparee Date: 22 Jul 04 - 08:27 AM Well, no, you'd better be a COP, not a copy. Not even a copy of a cop. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: Bill Hahn//\\ Date: 22 Jul 04 - 03:41 PM That is pretty much what I was saying---so I do not see the relevance of your anecdote to the Patriot Act and the issues involved therein. Bill H |
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Subject: RE: BS: Libraries under siege From: GUEST,Loy Maierhauser Date: 09 Feb 05 - 01:35 AM Hey Everyone. I know it's been awhile since this has been in the news, but I wanted to thank you all for your support. You encouragement keeps up fighting! |
