BS: a word to the wise

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Peace
Date: 21 Mar 06 - 06:20 PM

"FDA investigators say Tamiflu is safe
November 18, 2005

FDA investigators say Tamiflu is safe
The antiflu drug Tamiflu is safe, federal health advisers said Friday, after finding no direct link between the drug and the deaths of 12 Japanese children who had taken it."

from here. Notice the Roche logo at the top.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Peace
Date: 22 Mar 06 - 04:44 PM

Neat site with questions and answers that may help some folks put this Bird Flu thing in perspective.

http://www.abc.net.au/science/expert/

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Becca72
Date: 22 Mar 06 - 04:58 PM

wasn't this same little fright tactic called "Sars" awhile back?

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Peace
Date: 22 Mar 06 - 05:03 PM

I see it this way. Ya want to take over a country. So, create a reason to restrict travel. Create a reason that will make seeing troops in the streets commonplace. Get yer potential troublemakers and put them in camps. Then make them disappear. Announce that the New World Order (which has been talked about for over 100 years now) is in place and if ya don't like it talk to the guy/gal with the tank or APC.

"Good morning, America, how are ya . . .".

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Jeri
Date: 22 Mar 06 - 09:13 PM

In addition to what Rapaire said, the influenza vaccine contains inactivated strains of virus. If it were possible for anything to get into the culture when the vaccine was growing in the egg medium, it would be inactivated by the same process.

I think the chance of a pandemic is quite slim.
I also think the chance of the mother of all hurricaines causing the damage it did in New Orleans, I think the chance of the unjustifiable death and suffering due to lack of government action is slim. I think 20 - 100 MILLION of the world's citizens dying from flu in one single outbreak are slim. All of these things happened.

When I worked in public health, sometimes what we did was try to head off panic and sometimes it was simply trying to get folks to take threats seriously. People get hysterical, or they resent having to think about possible disasters and ridicule anybody who does, whether the people they're making fun of are over-reacting or just making sure they have batteries and a full pantry. I think the smartest thing to do is just develop an appropriate plan, get prepared, and then go on with life as usual.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Mar 06 - 09:25 PM

Jeri, that's exactly what I think. Panic buying of Tamiflu isn't going to help a bit -- that's a "I got mine, screw you!" mindset. When your neighbor comes knocking, asking for some bit of food for his sick kid, what are you going to do -- shoot him? Isolating yourself in your house is ridiculous.

I've been through this before...with Y2K; with the Cuban Missile Crisis, with the Hungarian Revolution of 1956; with saber-rattling by the Chinese over Quemoy, Matsu, Formosa; with the sinking of Pueblo; with the shooting down of the EC-121 plane; with the Asian Flu; with the Hong Kong Flu; with the North Koreans jumping on South Korea; with Hantavirus; with Lyme disease....

I remember when I was very young laying in bed listening to airplane propellors overhead, remembering a film I'd seen somewhere about the bombing of Pearl Harbor, wondering if this was the plane that would End My World.

My "disaster/panic/fallout shelter" circuits overloaded long ago, as did my wife's.

Plan, prepare, and get on with life. Sheesh.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Mar 06 - 09:45 PM

Rap, I miss the significance of the 1956 Hungarian Revolt in connection with alarm in this country. The main problem there is that our government did NOT help.

The reason I mentioned that Alaska doesn't have a poultry industry is that I figure that wild fowl won't have as much chance at infecting chickens where there are fewer chickens.

I agree that hysteria-mongering is counter productive. But Jeri makes a good point in what has happened in the past in this country.

I'm of the opinion and mindset that when a flu - any flu - sets in a community anyone coming down with something should

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Ebbie
Date: 22 Mar 06 - 09:55 PM

A finger flick sent my post skittering away- I want to finish my thought.

When anyone is coming down with something, I think that person should STAY HOME. DON'T go to the office or to school. All of us have seen a bug sweep the entire office. Just STAY HOME; when you are no longer contagious come back. If each does that, not only will fewer of the personnel get the bug but the office will keep functioning.

Not everyone agrees with that. I have a friend who is of the opinion that we all get stronger when we are exposed to whatever comes along each time it comes along.

When and if a super flu comes along I plan to behave just as I've done in the past. If I'm coming down with it, I won't go anywhere. If someone else is coming down with it I'll stay away. I once sent a musician home because she was so sick she could hardly see straight- she had come to music night because she "didn't want to stay home by herself"; there was no way I wanted her sitting in our group and as tactfully as I could, I told her so.

The main thing that keeps me from being too alarmed about this avian flu is remembering the many times we've gone through this before. Anyone remember the 'swine flu'?

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: katlaughing
Date: 22 Mar 06 - 11:42 PM

I totally agree with you on that, Ebbie.

The latest on this, though, says it is not easily passed from human to human:

Why bird flu is harder to catch than a cold
By Roger Highfield, Science Editor
(Filed: 23/03/2006)

The reason the deadly H5N1 bird influenza virus is hard for people to catch and spread has been found.

Although more than 100 people have been killed by the avian influenza virus, the fact that it does not spread easily to other humans has been a biomedical puzzle. Now, a study of cells in the human respiratory tract reveals a simple anatomical difference in the cells of the system that makes it difficult for the virus to jump from human to human.
        
Bird flu factfile

The finding, reported today in the journal Nature, is important because it demonstrates a requisite characteristic for the virus to equip itself to easily infect humans, the key development for the virus to become a pandemic.

A group led by University of Wisconsin-Madison virologist Prof Yoshihiro Kawaoka, showed that only cells deep within the respiratory system, rather than the nose or throat, have the surface molecule or receptor that is the key that permits the avian flu virus to enter a cell.

"Our findings provide a rational explanation for why H5N1 viruses rarely infect and spread from human to human," the authors report.

The upshot of the finding is that existing strains of bird flu must undergo key genetic changes to trigger a pandemic.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: jacqui.c
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 07:32 AM

Rapaire - you hit the nail on the head for me.

I was about 14 when the Cuban missile crisis arose and had, a few weeks previously, read Neville Shute's 'On The Beach'. Bad combination, particularly since my parents were not the sort of people that I could go to to unload worries or even just discuss what was going on. I don't think I slept a full night for quite a while and had fears of nuclear war up into my twenties, particularly once I had my children.

One day I started thinking about where I was going with this and worked out that this was one of the things that I could not do anything about and so should stop making myself ill over it. Took a lot of training to not keep thinking about it, especially in that time between wakefulness and sleeping, but it worked in the end.

Now I look at what happens and, if I can do something to change it I will. If not - ce la vie - I'll just get closer to coming back as a wolf!

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: kendall
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 07:35 AM

I woke up this morning with a hankering for sunflower seeds, and a strong desire to shit on someone's car. Should I worry?

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: SINSULL
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 09:26 AM

If you shit on my car - WORRY!

Isn't it odd that every time something new comes out about Katrina or Iraq or Iran, up pops Bird Flu? Think he wants to distract us?

I keep a few weeks supply of cat food in my basement along with some bottled water. If I am house bound, I don't want to be murdered by my cats.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: SINSULL
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 09:32 AM

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Peace
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 10:18 AM

"and a strong desire to shit on someone's car"

Thanks a bunch.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Donuel
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 02:51 PM

Questions to be answered

When the bird flu hits, as it enevitably will, what will you do about your pets who pick up dead birds?

about dead birds in the pool

about your kids with flu like symptoms

about...



This issue has not been properly thought out by a long shot.


for a laugh however try... http://www.thefrown.com/frowners/becomerepublican.swf

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 03:09 PM

Donuel, thanks for the link!! Scathing, hilarious, and too true!

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Rapparee
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 03:40 PM

When the bird flu hits, as it enevitably will,

It already has.

what will you do about your pets who pick up dead birds?

Don't have any pets.

about dead birds in the pool

Don't have any pool.

about your kids with flu like symptoms

Don't have kids, either.

But if I had any of the above I can't see running around screaming about it. You assume that ALL dead birds will be dead of H5N1, which will no more be the case in the event of a pandemic than it is now. If a pandemic did hit, the city would close the aquatic complex -- not because of dead birds, but because of the danger inherent in groups. READ ABOUT THE 1918 PANDEMIC!! LEARN FROM HISTORY!!! Gatherings, even church gatherings, were banned (or in some cases held outdoors). Many people wore surgical masks, not to stop the "germs" but to prevent coughed-up droplets from infecting others. Most cities had "no spitting" ordinances on the books and enforced them. But the trains and buses and streetcars still ran, food was still available, and life went on.

But the ONE THING that any reading of the history of the 1918 pandemic shows is that national and big-city governments were not prepared and in fact were in a state of denial. New York city, for instance. The Surgeon General of the US. The US War Department, which wouldn't stop transfering troops around the country and thereby spreading the disease.... And by the way, the 1918 pandemic apparently started in a rural county in Kansas -- it did not start in Spain.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Peace
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 03:45 PM

"And by the way, the 1918 pandemic apparently started in a rural county in Kansas -- it did not start in Spain."

There's the answer then: Kansas has to go . . . (with Dorothy I suppose).

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 03:47 PM

Wesley - the British Government releasing a virus!
Not much worry there.
Blair and his incompetents couldn't organise a piss-up in a brewery.

There was a case of bird flu identified near France. The French government innoculated all their domestic chickens within the week. France is 23 miles across the English Channel. Our government's statement was something to the effect of - "there's nothing to worry about - it's in a different country - we will start to think about doing something if it gets over here!" In the meantime they are sacking thousands of doctors and nurses from hospitals because the accountants are paid too much and there isn't any money left to actually treat patients.

If he USA is worried about catching bird flu from person to person contact - does that mean Blair will have to stop licking Bush's arse?

And isn't Tammy Flu in the Country music Hall of Fame?

Quack!
Geoff.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: Rustic Rebel
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 10:43 PM

I just found a dead, great horned owl in my yard the other day. I didn't even consider it to have the bird flu, but rather thought about West Nile disease. My dogs were strange around the bird, they walked around it. I turned the bird into the local DNR office and they told me they probably won't even test it to see why it died because of expense! They said they would send it up to a different office in case someone wanted to stuff it. Odds are they threw it in the woods out back as soon as I left.

Subject: RE: BS: a word to the wise
From: SINSULL
Date: 23 Mar 06 - 10:48 PM

DNR? Do Not Resuscitate?

Here in Maine, they were testing dead birds for West Nile. The ones my cat brings in definitely did not die from a virus. I handle them with care, scrub my hands with disinfecting soap, and have ANOTHER talk with the cat. He just doesn't get it.