Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: van lingle
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 08:03 AM

"GS (and others) admitted quite blatantly to ogling women rather than keeping his eyes and mind on the performance."

This problem could be easily solved in a Shaker-like fashion by providing seperate entries for the two sexes and the erection
(pardon the use of this term) of a "chastity wall" in performance venues to prevent predation which in turn would prevent fraternization which in turn would prevent the propagation of future folksingers...o.k. I haven't worked out all the details yet.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 08:07 AM

Talking of ones mind drifting during performances reminds me of an incident. I was gigging this pub - somewhere in the depth of Warwickshire, waiting for my turn to go on, and my concentration started to wander and i was checking out the room's decor. there were plates hung on the wall.

When I got 'onstage', the first thing I said was, look those plates with red indian prints on that they sell in the Radio times! somebody actually buys that shit!

The Landlady was convulsed with laughing and the Landlord shouted, That was MY choice, smartarse!

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 08:55 AM

Yes, it's amazing the amount of shit some people will fall for when the wrong sort of misinformation is heaped upon them. Buy this, you know you want it. No you don't.

Like when sitting along a sea wall somewhere playing English tunes and this person with a gaggle of kids announced to them: 'That's Irish music'. 'No, it bloody well isn't', I told them, complete with demonstration of what is dotted and what is not.

And it's even worse to try and con people into thinking MOR mainstream shit is English music too, or that women must comply with male oppression or the world will come to an end. You belong to me so do what I bloody well say. What bollocks. Some men should just take a look at themselves once in a while.

Imposing what they imagine to be their god-given will and lack of taste on the status of women as well as on music is going to end in tears. Theirs.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 09:46 AM

Another convert gained for folk music...?

fee like that scouser in the Harry Enfield Show, Calm down...!

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Fudged
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 10:05 AM

I suppose most of Diane's foul mouthing in this thread is based on the idea that ..

"You belong to me so do what I bloody well say. What bollocks. Some men should just take a look at themselves once in a while."

Bad news for you Diane - You Belong To Me was written by a woman (Chilton Price) a professional musician and student of music appreciation.
I think most versions of the song have been performed by women too, including of course, the one you're bumping your gums about here.
How's that for a dose of "dispassionate accuracy"?
So there we have it 'nice' little Kate Rusby is not only the anti-christ of English folk music, she's also a rampant opressor of men-folk (no wonder John McCusker's hair stands on end!) singing in an accent that doesn't really exist.
I never realised she was so complex!

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 10:09 AM

what is puzzling Diane - is how do you manage? I don't suppose musicians are really any more libidinous than traffic wardens, or teachers, anybody - but the presence of alcohol in venues and the night and the music does tend to weave its none to subtle spell.

I should have though GS's ogle 4O years ago, when he was young and the sap was rising, could be thrust into the background of your relationship. Time to let go...sort of thing.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 10:41 AM

As a matter of fact I am perfectly well aware of the origins of the crap song in question and who wrote it.

My objections are twofold:

(1) against ANYONE of whichever gender who claims collar & lead stylee ownership over another person.

(2) specifically here (as it pans out that way) against those men who impose their imagined 'superiority' (whether of knowledge or predatory behaviour) on those who neither need or want it.

Isn't it extraordinary (no perhaps it isn't) that some remain quite incapable of examining the horrific nature of their behaviour and, additionally, find it equally impossible to assimilate my objection to the sycophantic adulation of these vile piece of pap as an example of 'English music'.

I don't actually give a stuff what the kRusby does and I deplore entirely references to her personal life. How dare you bring that into it? She's a singer of mostly pop songs that do not interest me. What does concern me is the status of English music. And she has not a lot to do with it.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 10:49 AM

Written by the all-knowing Diane Easby yet again   >>>>>>>>>>>>>As it happens I have been involved in music journalism and research since before GS embarked upon his intimidatory pursuit of women. I have not, however, done a paid gig for 30 years (and never in Lincolnshire) and so people can draw their own conclusions about the very odd lies which fly about surprisingly often from those who claim to have seen and heard me where I was not.

GS (and others) admitted quite blatantly to ogling women rather than keeping his eyes and mind on the performance. My concern is to ensure that music venues are safe for women to be. At the time many women contacted me offlist about how intimidated they had felt when on the wrong end of predatory behaviour at venues but were too scared to speak out. I'm not.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

My pursuit of women has never been intimidatory, predatory, or even offensive as any decent women I have made acquaintance with will tell you.
I have never admitted to quite blatantly ogling women rather than keeping eyes or mind on performance! Nor have any others on mudcat that I am aware of. I have a healthy regard for women and for pesonal space as anyone who knows me will verify and some have tried although Diane you are too thick skinned to want to see the truth.
The 'blatantly ogling women' statement came from none other than yourself and your imagination...as the other threads you 'contributed to will bear out on close scrutiny. You labelled me a pervert...you labelled Lincolnshire men "Backwoodsmen"......You are wrong on both counts...
You are now just some sad person who has lost track of reality and everyone seems to have picked up on that.
Please Diane...get real and get a life! Then perhaps we can have a few decent debates on sensible issues rather than the childish playground behaviour and language we witness from you.

Ted, thanks also for your posts....hope to meet up again soon...has been too long mate.
Best wishes, Mike.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 11:03 AM

Who the hell's Ted?
Yet another 'all boys together out on the pulling rampage'?
The silver teapot puts up a post about a particularly shit song with dodgy connotations in the sexual politics field by a mainstream, slightly f*lk-tinged semi-popstar and uses it not only to attempt, lamely, to justify his frankly appalling attitude to women but also to blame me for not succumbing to his dubious protestations.

Well, I don't actually give a stuff what you do in the wilds of Lincolnshire (apart from fearing for the women who live there).

You want a fucking debate? Drop the 'good enough for f*lk' crap, discover what English music actually is, resolve not to shout down those who actually know already . . . and there is a vague possibility.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Willie-O
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 11:30 AM

Wow...what an asshole. Diane, you don't just take the cake, you ARE the cake!

I sure like everything I've heard Kate Rusby do. She is an exceptionally talented English singer who clearly believes in every song she sings. Thanks for the link which leads one to an abundance of other songs performed by Kate.

Whoops, did I say something wrong?

W-O

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Jeri
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 11:37 AM

Welcome to the Diane Easby Show.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: harpmolly
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 11:41 AM

Amazing...truly amazing. It just proves my theory that for some bizarre reason, the Mudcat is utterly incapable of hosting a Kate Rusby-related thread that doesn't descend into verbal assault and name-calling.

Pretty impressive, given the subject is a lovely young Yorkshire lass with a sweet voice and a propensity for folk ballads. I mean, clearly, she is deserving of all the scorn heaped upon her and more. *rolls eyes*.

I don't get it.

Molly

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 11:41 AM

This thread started Diane, as an expression of my appreciation for one girls voice singing a particular song..nothing more-nothing less.
Once again you have taken your personal route away from that to try to show your dubious 'expertise' in everything from Folk music to 'men' and their behaviour. Once again I will desist from posting further on this thread because of your larger than life presence which is at least unwelcome and at most pathetic.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 11:45 AM

Incidentally, in reply to your who is Ted?....Ted is a rampant transvestite who came from Upper Ramsbottom...and has a penchant for has-been female journalists.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: GUEST,Crazy Man Michael
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 11:47 AM

the dialect is what is spoken, the accent is what it is spoken with.
The song You Belong To Me wasn't a particularly good song, as the standards went, to begin with.Depending on what Kate Rusby sings I either like what she's doing or I don't.In conclusion let me say that Diane Easby has once more succeeded in riling up the crowd which is some she IS truly good at, this based on an exhaustive reading of many of the threads here at Mudcat(shows you what little life I have *LOL*).

*and now back to The Diane Easby Show, brought to you in part by Celtic Music* ;-)

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 11:56 AM

kR sings in an accent that doesn't really exist

intoned some git who also made intrusive comments about her former marriage.
Yes the accent exists, but it's not a dialect. Go figure the difference.

A bold and certainly coarse fisherman who has delusions that he saw me sing (who is this person who keeps on being mistaken for me?) is the latest to be tripped up by total ignorance of Child 68. My former name was a shitproof umbrella to come on here four years ago when the usual suspects were administering a kicking to a young performer the moment he left on an overseas tour.

Same 'suspects' of limited comprehension are trying to make out that I 'don't like' kR. I've said twice in the thread that she's 'very nice' (which is what I always say) but that I know her not at all well. What she does, however, has altered not one iota in the past 12 years so I don't need to follow her career too closely.

I object to her being set up as a representative of 'English music'. She's no such thing. She's a bloody pop singer with the sole aim of getting onto MOR playlists. And the particular song that was put up in this thread is shit, for all the reasons I have fully explained for the slow to comprehend.

She's doing perfectly well, thenking you, and will lose no sleep, nor even mind, that I don't like what she does. But it's misleading to say she represents English music. She doesn't.

The thread is obviously about what constitutes English music and, more importantly, what doesn't. You Belong To Me doesn't. It's shit and that needs to be said. And it's about behaviour, as I said. Those who don't know how to.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:05 PM

Actually, CMM, I don't 'rile up' anybody.
I deal in facts,
It's just beyond a lot of people to read and assimilate so they make up what they think they see.
That's why I did a brief résumé up there of just a few things I actually said.
Don't why I bother really as this thread has managed to round up all the English-loathing, 'good-enough-for-f*lk', sexist, cloth-eared gits on Mudcat,

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: van lingle
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:06 PM

diane your shadow boxing. i didn't see anyone here try to pass this off as english folk music. to me it's just a charming little ditty being sung by a fine singer. i don't care if she's from bf egypt.vl

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: KB in Iowa
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:07 PM

"The thread is obviously about what constitutes English music and, more importantly, what doesn't."

Actually GS only said he liked KR's version of a particular song. No mention was made about whether or not it 'constitutes English music.'

As a side note, I have never thought this particular song meant 'I own you,' I always heard it as more along the lines of 'please come back.'

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Willie-O
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:07 PM

"The thread is obviously about what constitutes English music and, more importantly, what doesn't."

Hello? I have this quaint idea that whoever starts a thread defines what it is "obviously about". If the quote below means the same thing as the quote above, either I am semantically challenged, or someone else is.

Said Georgiansilver:
"Only recently discovered Kate Rusby personally and so enjoy this cover of "You belong to me", complete with the accent, that I thought I might share it with you...What a voice      
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LP6us-ZeiSk
Best wishes, Mike."

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Cluin
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:09 PM

This thread is surreal.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: GUEST,Crazy Man Michael
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:13 PM

"what constitutes English music and, more importantly, what doesn't. You Belong To Me doesn't."

I don't think anyone ever said it did...and it states quite clearly on Kate Rusby's album who wrote it, and it isn't Trad. Arr. Heck if The Bunch (Sandy Denny, Richard and Linda Thompson, Pat Donaldson, Ashley Hutchings, Gerry Conway, Dave Mattacks and Trevor Lucas and Co.)can perform and record some of their favourite rock 'n' roll, and The Ashley Hutchings Big Beat Combo do the same thing ; why can't Kate Rusby record a standard? Though admitedly it was something of a mistake, but that's a personal opinion.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:13 PM

The thread is obviously about what constitutes English music and, more importantly, what doesn't

Indeed. What doesn't.
This song (and rendition) has absolutely fuck all to do with what constitutes English music.
I'm in business to clarify what does and not let the mainstream musbiz hijack the term (again) and con people into thinking any old shit (such as this) has anything whatsoever to do with our national cultural heritage.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Willie-O
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:14 PM

D'ya think, Cluin? Well, it's too hot out to do real work.

W-O

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Willie-O
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:17 PM

Hello? Diane? It's not anyone trying to con anyone else into thinking anything...at least the recording in question isn't. It's a girl singing a song. They do that, y'know.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:18 PM

What about that Bob Dylan bloke; he wrote "She Belongs to Me"?

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Cluin
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:20 PM

"I'm in business to clarify what does and not let the mainstream musbiz hijack the term (again) and con people into thinking any old shit (such as this) has anything whatsoever to do with our national cultural heritage."

Oh, she's a folk nazi. Making music must only further the cause. You're on notice, world... anybody who steps out of line, beware.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Big Mick
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:24 PM

Nope, just another attempt by someone to hijack for their personal crusade. I believe the title and the first post defines what this is about. It was Easby's post of 08 Aug 07 - 03:46 AM that introduced the trad piece although the thread had been hijacked by herself and her detractors much earlier, like in about the fourth post.

Folks, Diane isn't the subject here. If you don't like her style (I have come to find it amusing btw),just ignore the style and address the substance. Or ignore altogether, but don't hijack the thread. We have all been far too guilty of that of late.

I love Rusby's voice, don't much care for the subject or arrangement of this one though

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:26 PM

Actually, I'm equally in business to ensure that the neo-nazis as well as the musbiz are not allowed to hijack English music. But imagine that's far too complex for you to grasp.
Especially as you have not a clue what the cultural heritage constitutes and how conventions can be broken as long as it is respected.

Oh, no. Far too difficult . . .

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Cluin
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:28 PM

You are a riot, Diane. Never change.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: GUEST,Crazy Man Michael
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:32 PM

"What about that Bob Dylan bloke; he wrote "She Belongs to Me"? "

I do blieve we're referring to the standard You Belong to Me, written by Chilton Price (though also credited to Redd Stewart and Pee Wee King)The Kate Rusby version is to be found on her 2005 album The Girl Who Couldn't Fly
some information on Chilton Price

Chilton Price

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:32 PM

Well, quite Mick.

It's not about me.
It's just that people too dim to follow the concept of the public perception of English music resort to the ridiculous tactic of 'don't understand so we'll kick the messenger'.

Try reading the sodding message.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Willie-O
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:32 PM

I don't think there's much danger of that, Cluin.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:36 PM

Change?
No, as long as big girl's blouses like the teapot post up shit I'll be here to knock it down.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Willie-O
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:45 PM

I take it that means anytime someone posts a link to a Kate Rusby recording, or any other artist of whom you disapprove, you will take that as an invitation to belittle other peoples' tastes, intelligence, and knowledge under the pretext of "it's hijacking English music".

What a beacon of light you are indeed. We are not worthy. Thanks again.

W-O

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:53 PM

Sigh.
And I know perfectly well that this crap song is a composed . . . er thrown together . . . piece.
I've already said so.
I never said anyone was claiming it as Trad/arr.
Point is that a kazillion English musicians are doing composed/standard/former hits (call them what you will) in a particular English style mainly for dancing.
This is what has always happened and many found their way into the tradition, though this will happen no longer, as a result of the digital revolution.
This insertion of You Belong To Me (yuk) onto a kR album is in exactly the same vein as, say, Till There Was You stuck onto a Beatles album 40+ years ago.
It was de rigeur then but ever so boring and now it is more so.
English dance music does things in a completely new and fresh way.
And now I'm going out. This is too tedious.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 12:58 PM

I used to like Fletch singing it in Porridge.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Crazy_Man_Michael (inactive)
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:01 PM

"What about that Bob Dylan bloke; he wrote "She Belongs to Me"? "

A little research reveals that Dylan infact recorded Chilton Price's song

Chilton Price on hearing Dylan's version of her song

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Crazy_Man_Michael (inactive)
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:06 PM

"Point is that a kazillion English musicians are doing composed/standard/former hits (call them what you will) in a particular English style mainly for dancing."

Now that's hilarious, because the arrangement of When Will I Be Loved on The Bunch Rock On, sung by Sandy Denny and Linda Peters, is, infact, The Everly Brothers original arrangement, unlike the Linda Ronstadt version which isn't. *LOL*

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: GUEST,jOhn
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:18 PM

Diane Easby-you are rubbish person and a big trubble maker, and i bet you dont even like folk music, you just like to make trubble.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:33 PM

What really pisses me off about Mudcat are the vast numbers of myopic pigeons who home in to a busy thread, don't bother to read the subject line, never mind the posts and . . . SPLATT (as pigeons do).

No matter how carefully you may have composed your responses, writing carefully to topic with elucidating facts, references and explanations . . . splatt, splatt, splatt. Never mind the issues, just make a mess and flutter off.

I recommend a visit to the optician, ultra-strong reading glasses and a recharged power pack for the brain.

Brain? Oh dear no. Far too much to ask.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Cluin
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:38 PM

Thank you! Thank you!

That was Diane Ego, folks! Let's give `er a big hand!

*clap*

*clap*

*clap*

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Willie-O
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:41 PM

Let me see...it seems Ms Easby objects to English artists including covers of popular songs on their albums. Because English dance music is "fresh and new"...and also "This is what has always happened and many found their way into the tradition, though this will happen no longer, as a result of the digital revolution."

Not that I care, but if the departed Ms Easby were to acquaint herself with the concept of the "unclear antecedent", as explemplified by excessive use of "this" and "that", and edit her posts accordingly, then we could perhaps get a little closer to comprehending her declamations.

I am, however, in awe of her psychic ability to know what "will happen no longer", whatever she may mean. (See "unclear antecedent")

Personally I find it hard to believe that the "digital revolution" has stopped well-known artists from re-popularizing songs they perform and record. If that's what Diane meant.

Anyway, enough of this.
I remain, your humble servant
Willie-O

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:50 PM

Interesting information CMM; actually I just chucked that line in as a bit of levity since the original title was deemed to be sexist then surely Dylan's must be too! To stay on topic I thought that "You Belong To Me" was a rather ordinary track on what was a disappointing album. In the context of Kate's progression that is.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:52 PM

I do not object to English artists doing covers. Where did I say that? Nowhere.
Though if they're shit I do. Because they are.

Composed tunes incorporated today into dance music will not become 'traditional' because it is no longer possible to forget who wrote them.
This is surely bleedin' obvious.

Your final paragraph is complete nonsense. The digital revolution means that attribution is simpler than ever. Obvious to non-tossers.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: GUEST,Crazy Man Michael
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 01:59 PM

*LOL* Now that's a great name for a band, Diane Easby's Ego...and their first album F*lk That

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 02:12 PM

F*lk That

Been done.
Do keep up.
And I've had far better band names than that.
NOT incorporating my name.
Because it's not and never has been about me.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 02:13 PM

And [100], READ THE THREAD.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 02:52 PM

'Composed tunes incorporated today into dance music will not become 'traditional' because it is no longer possible to forget who wrote them.
This is surely bleedin' obvious.'

The songs that have captured the public imagination in the last 100 or so years have been composed (and I suppose someone had to compose even the ones that are anon.)

I feel that my great grandparents, grandparents, parents and me should be accorded some place in this glorious tradition. Why has folk music got to be the stuff that relates to some forgotten rural idyll? Why can't it be the stuff that relates to the actual 'folk' - however impure and racially sullied you feel ourse;ves and our tastes to be.

'no longer possible to forget who wrote them.....'

Chilton Price... I'd forgotten her, if I ever actually knew.

Subject: RE: Kate Rusby, 'You belong to me'
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Aug 07 - 02:53 PM

And the PRS do a pretty good job of forgetting me, come to that.