Rap and Talking Blues

Subject: Rap and Talking Blues
From: Rapparee
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 02:49 PM

Did Rap and Hip-Hop evolve from the Talking Blues?

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: Bettynh
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 03:03 PM

I've often thought so. The beat poets talked over music. There's a southern tradition of storytelling over music, too. Gamble Rogers and David Holt come to mind.

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: Wesley S
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 03:20 PM

Yes. Next question.

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 03:39 PM

The History of Hip-Hop BBC documentary - Youtube


Few parts on there..

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: Bert
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 03:46 PM

I always thought that Rap was invented by Billy Cotton.

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: gnu
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 03:51 PM

The "nuance and beat" certainly seem Celtic to me, but I am not versed in world music and thereby biased in my opinion.

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: Lox
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 03:56 PM

Rap is part of the continuing african tradition of improvised vocal expression over relentless rhythms.


In short, yes!


You can easilty trace this process by looking at videos on youtube, of west african music, early american worksongs, blues as it was first preformed ie without instruments, and so on.

Your first port of call to find the missing link should be "the last poets".

There are plenty of clips of them on youtube.

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: GUEST,Hootenanny
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 05:16 PM

So does that mean that we have Chris Bouchillon to blame for all that nonsense.

Hoot

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: gnu
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 06:00 PM

Lox... can you link some of those west african music videos?

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: TinDor
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 06:23 PM

West African griots is the ancient link.

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: TinDor
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 06:33 PM

In modern times. The "jive talkers" of the 1930's-1950's (check Louis Jordan, Cab Calloway, Black radio Dj's etc..) and those groups/artists like Gill Scott Heron, Watts Prophets and The Last Poets.

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 06:36 PM

I always felt that the answer is yes, but the route is so circuitous and the influences so diverse that maybe it doesn't matter. I don't think any contemporary rapper would see the connection to talking blues (except maybe when Frank Stokes was really smoking).

In any case, Yazoo Records thinks there is a connection. They have an excellent CD for fans of talking blues:

The Roots of Rap

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: RWilhelm
Date: 06 Mar 10 - 06:38 PM

btw, GUEST is me. I didnt know my cookie wasnt set.

RW

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: Goose Gander
Date: 09 Mar 10 - 03:56 PM

I've suspected an evolutionary link for some time, but it's very difficult to prove a direct connection. One thing - Dylan had a definate talking blues influence in some of his early recordings, and a friend of mine once referred to 'Subterranean Homesick Blues' as "that song where he tries to rap."

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Mar 10 - 04:03 PM

All African American folk music...

Subject: RE: Rap and Talking Blues
From: TinDor
Date: 09 Mar 10 - 08:03 PM

Louis Jordan - Beware

Lightnin' Hopkins - The Dirty Dozens