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BS: 'Toning it down'...
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 15 Jan 11 - 03:35 AM Donuel, Your point is well understood, and so are your feelings..but I'm telling you, and anyone else who has the ears to hear, if we jump on board the 'anger and retribution train' we have disarmed ourselves of the very thing we have to fight back..and that is speaking to the hearts, and emotions of peace, that lies in most all humans...SOMEWHERE. Being as we are musicians..and some of us even virtuosic, the choice has been entrusted with us, to KNOW what we are supposed to be doing, especially in these times of unrest. It is not to participate in either of the sides, but rather PLAY, with everything that lays within you. Practice, Practice, Practice... till your muscle memory, is locked in..the rest is up to being in touch with the very inner connection, that delivers the images and emotions, that bring peace, to your audience, or listener. If you lock it in, REALLY tight, paying attention to every nano-second of timber, phrasing, and expression..you can speak more effective words, than you'd ever be able to express, in a mere opinion..or anger, indignation, fear, even with a 'righteous' cause. its not just 'chops' but the ability to communicate directly to the central nervous system, of your listeners. The ears are the most direct way into the central nervous system...and what people listen to, directly affects their moods, and thoughts. I know it is a narrow path, to walk with iron discipline,..but, that is the way it came down to some of us..as a gift...use it, to point the way...Not to 'enlisting' in one side or the other,(they both have screws loose!), but rather lift people OUT of the fray, to give them the space to see and think clearly. The rest will come to them...but give them a shot, when they hear your stuff. Give them rest, from all the crap that is inundating everyone! I've said this in total support of your musical calling...and am only sharing with you what works, as you may know, and in no way, am I speaking condescendingly...and I have an idea, that you know what I've said to be true, inside you, as well. Imploring You Passionately,(..'and may the force be with you'!) GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 15 Jan 11 - 03:50 AM OOOOOOPs a typo of omission: What I said was: "The ears are the most direct way into the central nervous system...and what people listen to, directly affects their moods, and thoughts" and it should have read: "The ears are the most direct way into the central nervous system...and what people listen to, directly affects their moods, thoughts and BEHAVIOR" Sorry.... GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Bobert on NC Date: 15 Jan 11 - 07:47 AM There is a world between "retribution" and... ...one's civic responsibility to get angry and to turn that anger into real policy changes that makes us more civilized... It's called *agents for change* and that is what Donuel has been all about going back as long as I have known him... I mean, the guy has an immense talent and to not use it in a manner that pushes for needed policy changes would be a waste... Maybe a little more of that is needed from everyone 'cause 30,000 deaths from handguns every year, the assassinations of elected leaders and/or the support of folks who pretend to have the country' best interests at heart when all they really want it to have their egos stroked is not only lazy but down-right selfish... Keep in truckin', Donuel!!! Gotta go... Long drive home today... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 15 Jan 11 - 02:03 PM So, Bobert, would you rather be Lee or Grant?....or Beethoven or Bach?....or maybe,....yourself?????? GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Bobert Date: 15 Jan 11 - 06:15 PM Of the list of folks I'd take "me"... Why??? |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Dorothy Parshall Date: 15 Jan 11 - 09:09 PM This has been a disturbing and thought-provoking thread. Disturbing because it is full of the vituperative rhetoric that is the cause IMO of much that is wrong in the USA and the world today - and probably for centuries. Thought-provoking because I am currently working on trying to define for my Quaker community the reason why I am distressed by the recurrent and very new use of the word "discussion" as a replacement for the traditional term "consideration". In this thread, I am seeing an even more difficult word - debate, another step beyond discussion although closely akin to it and, too often IMO, where "discussion" leads. If we are truly concerned about the negative rhetoric being used in the world, do we not need to be looking at how we, ourselves, conduct our threads, and other interactions? If so, how can we accomplish that? The reason I am concerned that the traditional term is used is because words do affect the way we perceive the process. Consideration has the denotation of thoughtfulness (amongst other synonyms). Discussion, debate, argument - the downhill slope is not necessary but too often occurs. And certainly has in this thread, as it does in many. Some of us are looking for a non-violent approach to life, others choose to be violent in their written word. As we learn more and more about our interconnections as human beings and considerably more about how the brain and its DNA are affected by traumas of various sorts, I look at people with so-called mental illness in a very different way. In the midst of the violent rhetoric and feelings flying around in the air, the ether, the sound waves, and in peoples very beings, it seems to me not only possible but probable that someone who in open to those "vibes" ( I use that as a catchall for what I am trying to say, knowing full well someone out there in mudville will take umbrage) can be affected without hearing the verbiage, without being aware they are hearing it, with very little actual awareness of what is going on, they can be negatively affected by all this negativity flying around them. (Wow, what a run on sentence! REad it again if you need to do so.) I do not believe this poor guy who shot those folks was unaffected by the environment in which he has been living. The rhetoric which needs to be "toned down" out there is affecting every one of us. So does the rhetoric here on mudcat. When I "sent a letter to Sarah Palin" through one of my on line orgs, this is what I sent: If there is to be peace in the world, There must be peace in the nations. If there is to be peace in the nations, There must be peace in the cities. If there is to be peace in the cities, There must be peace between neighbors. If there is to be peace between neighbors, There must be peace in the home. If there is to be peace in the home, There must be peace in the heart. Lao Tzu And it needs to start here. And I am prepared for whatever, whoever, throws my way as a result of this post. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 16 Jan 11 - 01:04 AM Dorothy Parshall: "If there is to be peace in the world, There must be peace in the nations. If there is to be peace in the nations, There must be peace in the cities. If there is to be peace in the cities, There must be peace between neighbors. If there is to be peace between neighbors, There must be peace in the home. If there is to be peace in the home, There must be peace in the heart. Lao Tzu And it needs to start here. And I am prepared for whatever, whoever, throws my way as a result of this post." Are you ready for....>>>>>>.......................>>>>>>>>............ .........>>>>>>>>.......................>>>>>>>>>..................>>> ....................>>>>>>>>>>>.......................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.. ...>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ..................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>...................>>>>>> >>>>>.................................>>>>>>>>>>>>>................... ...................................................................... .......>>V V V YOU ARE WONDERFUL!!!! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Donuel Date: 16 Jan 11 - 05:17 PM I have learned today that a gruntle is a truthful gentle sincere stroke of one's ego. It is an easy thing to give. Without it people are disgruntled and can go crazy from the outside in. Knowledge, music and the pursuit of peace makes people go sane from the inside out. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Taconicus Date: 16 Jan 11 - 05:37 PM Is there a way to block a particular thread so I don't have to even think about its existance? So many posts here are full of such demonstrably false statements, and of outright partisan hatemongering, that I want to shout that's not so and then say why... but then I'd become part of the problem. Why can't we just talk about music, and leave the hatemongering and yelling to the politicians and political head-bangers? |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Richard Bridge Date: 16 Jan 11 - 06:03 PM Because then nothing stops them |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Ebbie Date: 16 Jan 11 - 06:53 PM "Why can't we just talk about music, and leave the hatemongering and yelling to the politicians and political head-bangers?" Taconicus My answer would be three-fold: You Another. harder, answer is that even musicians are not one-dimensional; we all live in a larger world. Thirdly, on occasion the "politicians and political head=bangers" are us. See Answer Two. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Ed T Date: 16 Jan 11 - 06:57 PM Well, this guy tried toning down with some fake drugs. And, what did he get? A year in jail for not selling drugs and preying on desperate addicts. Go figure that one? Toning it down |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Bobert Date: 16 Jan 11 - 08:34 PM BTW, as a by-product of the Tuscon shootings it would appear that one heck of a lot of folks are "tonin' it down"... The op-ed in this morning's Washington Post by John McCain certainly had all the right words to heal the rift between him and Obama... Senator Udall has started quite a stir with his announcement that he would sit with the Repubs at the State of the Union Address which, in turn, has gotten 20 or so other representatives and senators to the same... I see a lot of progress here... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 16 Jan 11 - 11:19 PM Taconicus, I know what you mean..I've gotten sucked into a few myself. What is somewhat interesting though, is seeing some of these 'musician's' points of view; is really eye opening to how shallow some of them are! Their music, or at least the lyrics that some of them may be writing, is more than likely just as 'depthy'(?)...At least it gives you a clue, about their insights, and more than likely, their musical insights, as well. On the other hand, some might have something interesting to say...I hope it might come out in the music, more than in here!! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Bobert Date: 17 Jan 11 - 10:15 AM How about posting some of yer music, GfinS??? |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: John P Date: 17 Jan 11 - 10:31 AM GfS, Here you are, trying to say something positive, and you still can't manage to avoid flinging insults around like fish. Should we make judgments about the quality of your music (and lyrics!) based on your grasp of the English language and it's syntax and punctuation? And speaking of judging musicians' artistic abilities by reading what they have to say about current events, have you ever heard the old saw and the pot and the black kettle? Just out of curiosity, what conclusions would you draw about the music of someone who insults others at every opportunity and who doesn't believe that everyone should enjoy the same civil rights as himself? |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: John P Date: 17 Jan 11 - 10:32 AM oops. "old saw about the pot and the black kettle" |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Donuel Date: 17 Jan 11 - 01:09 PM In a way it was wonderful that the nation reacted with such shock and outrage. Imagine how awful it would be if the country was so numb as to dismiss the "rampage" in 48 hours like usual. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Dorothy Parshall Date: 19 Jan 11 - 05:02 PM It is good that we humans are not so jaded as to be numb to the worlds ills. Few of us are, however, one-dimensional. We have good days and not so good ones. There are things which push our nasty buttons, things which hurt us, times when we can cope .... I sincerely believe that we each do the best we can at any given moment. The same person may write beautiful music, meaningful lyrics and then stuff we perceive as dreadful. And what one of us loves another may detest. Tolstoy said it very well (please excuse Tolstoy as he predates PC language!) : "One of the most widespread superstitions is that every man has his own special, definite qualities; that a man is kind, cruel, wise, stupid, energetic, apathetic, etc. Men are not like that . . . Men are like rivers; the water is the same in each, and alike in all; but every river is narrow here, is more rapid there, here slower, there broader, now clear, now cold, now dull, now warm. It is the same with men. Every man carries in himself the germs of every human quality and sometimes one manifests itself, sometimes another, and the man often becomes unlike himself—while still remaining the same man." — Leo Tolstoy May we allow and respect ourselves and each of us in our human-ness. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Bobert Date: 19 Jan 11 - 07:33 PM Thanks for the Tolstoy, Dorothy P... I love him... He got alot very much correct... And yeah, we do all have our good days and our bad days... I'd like to think that most of mine are good 'uns but, hey, that's the way I try to look at like in general... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Donuel Date: 20 Jan 11 - 05:08 PM Posts are becoming so high brow and close to the heart of truth its embarrasing to make additions. Yes the power of ideas is immense. The peace we want in the world starts inside. Responding with no response however does very little. Take a look at Speak John Boehner. He has refused to eat with Obama and has been a no show for 3 State Dinners. He would not go to the memorial in AZ. When Ms. Giffords complained directly to Boehner for the verbal and graphic threats being made against her along with the vandalizing of her office with bricks and stones, he made no comment or offer to help her. YOU SEE http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/matt-taibbi-the-crying-shame-of-john-boehner-20110105?page=3 John Boehner's last election made sure his opponent would not be able to show his face on the street. Because thats what he told his supporters to do! His campaign posted threats and verbal appeals for Republicans to stick by their guns. He posted his opponents home address and pictures of his wife and two small boys -Don't let show his face- was the Boehner campaign slogan. Boehner was to told his face to stop the bullshit I have two little boys in that house... Well it doesn't matter now does it? Yes Gavrielle Giffords also coplained to Boehner and do you know what he did???? He made sure that she would be the one to read the first ammendment pof the constitution out loud, to drive in the point that he or she can't do a damn thing about speech. If there is a polar opposite person from me in this world, it is John Boehner. PS He served less than two weeks in the Army, oops we are not suppose to say it out loud. The new civility has more or less evaporated in the house Congress already. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Dorothy Parshall Date: 20 Jan 11 - 05:44 PM How appropriate that Giffords got to read the 1st amendment! Too bad more people do not realize: It is better to be silent and thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt of it! (source unknown) or more colloquial: Engage brain before putting tongue in gear. I was raised on many mottoes: "your freedom ends at my nose" does not cover freedom of speech but "I don't agree with a word you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it." does. We are each responsible for what we say. We are also responsible for how we react to what others say. We are responsible for our own feelings and our own actions. We cannot blame others for how they "make" us feel. Unfortunately, there are people who do not understand the above, and people who could not adhere to it even if they did understand. Each individual needs to determine for them self how they wish to affect others - by both word and deed. When we throw our words out there into the pond of life, do they make positive ripples or negative ripples. Boehner may never realize the negativity he projects. Giffords is certainly aware of the positive effect her words and actions have. Yet they were each elected to office. That is a puzzlement. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Bobert Date: 20 Jan 11 - 06:22 PM "Boehner may never realize the negativity he projects" Hell, no, he wont!!! Actually the entire Republican Party has used negativity for the last 2 years as a means of whipping up the looniest among US and it looks as if that this continues to be their plan... Too bad that the left no longer has any real access to the microphone to offer an alternative but the left are the folks who work in Boss Hog's factories, and teach Boss Hogs kids and fix Boss Hog's cars and paint his house and those kinds of jobs just don't pay the kinda money where there is much left to contribute to the advertising that is required to just "break even"... No, what we know is that in over 90% of all campaign the candidate who spends the most wins... The corporations and the Chamber of Commerce will be sure to it that democracy will never again raise its ugly head... They saw what could happen in the 60s and they have sho nuff put the patches in place to be damned sure that that never happens again... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Dorothy Parshall Date: 20 Jan 11 - 06:54 PM Well, Bobert, things seem to be pretty grim right now. The right is in ascendance and we feel almost disenfranchised in a way, don't we? The house has voted to repeal the health care bill and .... Do we have the option of giving up? NO! I belong to moveon.org which keeps on keeping on and there are other groups keeping the faith. I see and share things on FB and do not waste my energy on the far right or on worrying about it. Letters to the editor, blogs on the computer, comments on newspaper articles, talking with people reasonably - all these have an effect. No other options that I see at the moment. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Donuel Date: 21 Jan 11 - 12:57 AM Nicely said, what?...Ohh, its Dorthy Parshall, I thought someone was channeling Dorthy Parsons. anyway If we could do a remake of Its a Wonderful Life, Lord Boehner would make a believable Mr. Potter. On the other hand he could do a convincing Uncle Charlie after a few bourbons. Ever notice how weepy Uncle Charlie gets after he's had a few? Who would be George? It would be hard watching Barak go through a break down though. All that hope and yes we can crap diving into an icy river? Brr, Its sad to even think about it. I do love the ending. "Listen daddy, its Art Bell, everytime Art Bell rings, Sharon Angle gets right wing nuts to excersize their 2nd ammendment rights. (fade to black with gun shots and screams) Thats a wrap folks Its time for the George Noory Show. He is sort of a combination of a human Ambien and Pat Robertson. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: J-boy Date: 21 Jan 11 - 01:22 AM George Noory? He puts me to sleep every ni... zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Stringsinger Date: 21 Jan 11 - 02:57 PM "ideology" is different from people. To get angry at another person for their beliefs is not the same as getting annoyed at the beliefs themselves. "Toning it down" doesn't mean compromising basic ideas about the negative effects of ideologies. Violence solves nothing! But being silent in the face of injustice is not useful if it is called "toning it down". Ideologies carried to extremes, what is being done in the current American House of Representatives, does set an atmosphere for violence and "toning it down" will not stop the reprehensible actions of the White Ring. "Toning it down" is a simplistic device used by those who are in denial about the injustices being served to the American people in the name of jingoistic and propagandistic jargon. There may be perfectly nice people in the Greedy Old Party and as human- being-people, they need to be treated with respect however as G.O.P. reps they need to be disagreed with and told just how little concern for humanity that they really have. As Olbermann says, "Hey Boehner, where are the jobs?" This is an issue of ideology not of the Speaker himself. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Dorothy Parshall Date: 21 Jan 11 - 04:10 PM I have trouble imagining anyone on mudcat being silent in the face of injustice! Righteous indignation seems to be the moving force and it can do much when carried out with determination. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 21 Jan 11 - 10:02 PM Leo Tolstoy..a man after my own heart.............. "The truth is that the State is a conspiracy designed not only to exploit, but above all to corrupt its citizens ... Henceforth, I shall never serve any government anywhere."--Leo Tolstoy Sound familiar???????????????????????? GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Bobert Date: 21 Jan 11 - 10:36 PM Gotta love the guy, GfinS... I mean, part of being a contributing member of yer community involves being creative... All stuff ain't about government and that's what Tolstoy was all about... He said that government is the caboose... The rest of the train already gone by... Hey, we all understand that concept... Government is always late... No matter whoes government... Don't much matter... Ours is certainly late... Tolstoy... Gotta love him... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 21 Jan 11 - 11:08 PM Been a Leo Tolstoy fan for over 40 years!!..and BTW, he would be telling you EXACTLY what I've been saying on here for about two years, as well!..Oh, and BTW, he was also a Christian. He hated both sides of the corruption, just as I've been saying..and he would NOT supported the 'right' or the 'left'...but concentrated on his art, and the spiritual side of things..AND manifested it through and IN his art!! Jeez, I'm glad he came up, again..I've quoted him, as well, on here..but to no avail....people are just so fucking hung up in phony political posturing..and more often than not, don't know what the hell they're talking about!..I'm telling you,(once again) its ALL a charade!~!!..and the 'two parties' serve the same master!....ask Leo! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 22 Jan 11 - 12:21 AM Oh...and while you're wiling away a little time, here, "getcha self a little cultcha" Take the time to read a little Tolstoy!!! See if you can 'get it'..from this guy who wrote during the Russian Revolution! (Gosh, ya' think it might be applicable?) GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: TIA Date: 25 Feb 11 - 11:34 AM Here's some good "Toning Down" of the violent rhetoric. From....guess which side.... Indiana deputy attorney general out of job after live ammo tweet Man Asks GOP Congressman "Who Is Going To Shoot Obama" In the second linked article, pay very close attention to the GOP Congressman's reply. I would classify it as sympathetic. Certainly not a denunciation in any fashion. |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Bobert Date: 25 Feb 11 - 11:51 AM Thanks, TIA... Yes, we certainly are in the midst of Republican brown shirt/redneck movement and I sincerely hope that the left will get enough microphone time to show the "moderates" just what is going on... Yes, we know but most "moderates" are clueless because this won't make the news mainstream news cycles... I guess, when some moron actually shoots or shoots at Obama the mainstream media will pay attention... I'd love to have the $$$ the Kock brothers are spending every day to do to them what they are doing to our country... I'd put together a media buy and some ads that would do what the media is supposed to be doing: telling the American people the truth... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: GUEST,TIA Date: 28 Feb 11 - 10:03 AM Apparently a 78 year old woman who weighs about 80 pounds is responsible for the USA's economic collapse. At least that's what Glenn Beck's chalk board says. And now she gets so many death threats, she has had to call the FBI. Gotta listen to this to believe it: http://www.npr.org/player/v2/mediaPlayer.html?action=1&t=1&islist=false&id=13410 |
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Subject: RE: BS: 'Toning it down'... From: Greg F. Date: 28 Feb 11 - 10:29 AM Its way past time that Beck was institiutionalized- along with those idiotic enough to believe the shit he comes out with. I'm surprised that they remember to eat. |
