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Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile of BBC [2011]
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 08 Oct 12 - 09:14 AM The story has moved on. He is now seen to be just among the worst of many. There was (is?) a culture in the entertainment industry where successful male performers regarded all females as available. Only a minority succumbed to this cultural pressure, but a significant minority did. Those who should have protected the victims failed to act or even investigate complaints, because of who the offenders were. No wonder it was twice likened to the Northern trafficking cases by "radical socialist" Mark Sawatka on the last R4 Any Questions. http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01n1vwk 29 minutes in. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST Date: 08 Oct 12 - 08:11 AM RIP Rest in Purgatory ? hmmm.. notice the last 2 syllables of 'Purgatory'.. that's interesting... |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Jack Campin Date: 08 Oct 12 - 05:04 AM Changing just one letter in the thread title would do it. Odd that "Rot In Hell" never gets an acronym. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Eliza Date: 08 Oct 12 - 04:10 AM It isn't the 'Obit' part of the thread title which doen't seem to fit, it's the RIP! |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,CS Date: 08 Oct 12 - 04:08 AM The Beeb has caved and finally agreed - under mounting pressure, including from Cameron - to hold an internal inquiry. I wonder if this will be in any way useful, or as they previously stated, will it merely serve as a hinderance to the police investigation? |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Musket Date: 08 Oct 12 - 03:58 AM Generally speaking, and many newspaper editors would agree; one of the advantages of an obituary being after someone has died is that it lowers the risk of being sued for what you say. An obituary is not an eulogy but, as CS says, information about their life. Nobody ever said any obituary had to be balanced, sound in evidence or positive. At this stage, there are serious allegations and if he were alive, our judicial system of prefacing everything with "alleged" would hold true. As he cannot be taken to court, it will be difficult to get a fact "beyond all possible doubt" but in any event, the account of many people cannot be ignored. There are however, many others still alive whom he shared his time with, and perhaps waiting for the sword of Damocles to fall their way. Anyway, it's been a while since Gary Glitter was in prison last... |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,CS Date: 08 Oct 12 - 03:31 AM "Well this one is rather long - and having as an Obit doesn't seem particularly appropriate." Obituaries are for information about the deceased's life, as such this aspect of Savile's life is as 'appropriate' for discussion here as any of the other things he was previously famous for. Joe has also stated earlier on this thread that he is OK with Obit's on MC carrying discussions about the more unsavoury aspects of the deceased's life also. I'm sure he would have - and still could - separated the thread if he felt it were required. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 08 Oct 12 - 02:57 AM Sage, I could not say if he sympathises or not, but he said that he had expressed that sympathy, and I said that he had not. He had said that Savile's abuse of young girls should be kept quiet until he was convicted, i.e. never, and he had expressed sympathy for Savile's family, but for the victims, nothing. (just like last time) |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 07 Oct 12 - 04:32 PM Well this one is rather long - and having as an Obit doesn't seem particularly appropriate. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: theleveller Date: 07 Oct 12 - 04:17 PM "It might have been better to describe the allegations against him in a separate thread," Why? |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Stilly River Sage Date: 07 Oct 12 - 02:04 PM
Keith, if someone says they sympathize, then for you to come back and say they don't is not only silly, it is pointlessly argumentative. You keep so many arguments going because you won't listen to what people tell you. This guy sounds like a creep. But he's a dead creep. It might have been better to describe the allegations against him in a separate thread, but that didn't happen. Give it a rest. SRS |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Eliza Date: 07 Oct 12 - 12:43 PM And what about the flamboyant and effusive monument to the man where, I believe, he is buried? I heard it has already been vandalised. Do people think it should be removed or replaced with something more low-key? Difficult to know what to do with it. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,CS Date: 07 Oct 12 - 09:13 AM Charities associated to Savile are speaking of making donations to organisations that work with and support child abuse victims. I'm heartened to see this response. I also suspect that the high profile nature of this story will encourage many more (not just those assaulted by Savile) to seek the help of such organisations. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Big Al Whittle Date: 07 Oct 12 - 09:08 AM Yes I see a gain , Don. Its like those museums to the holocaust. We see the depths humanity will sink to. We are on the lookout, and suspect the motives of the next baddie that comes along. Its a negative sort of thing, but its a gain - of a sort. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,CS Date: 07 Oct 12 - 05:18 AM Those coming forward claiming to have been abused by Savile, now verging on one hundred. A further witness reported Savile to police in 2004, accusing him of taking child sex holidays in Goa. Again, this was reported at the time, and yet again there was supposedly "not enough evidence" to proceed. "Many were aged nine and 10 when they claim the TV favourite molested them at the height of his fame. Savile, who died last year at 84, is even alleged to have abused girls into his 70s. We can reveal a British man told Scotland Yard in 2004 he was making trips to Goa in India to have sex with children. The witnesss said Savile went to villages to pick up girls. But police said they needed more evidence." http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/jimmy-savile-almost-100-victims-make-1365264 |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: theleveller Date: 07 Oct 12 - 04:37 AM You really don't get it do you, Don? The victims were often embarrassed and ashamed and also afraid that they wouldn't be believed becasue Savile was such a pillar of the community. Seems pretty obvious to me - and probably to anyone with an iota of imagination who isn't just being stubborn to prove a point. Mother-in-law was talking yesterday about the time he abused her and was wondering, after over 60 years, whether she ought to say something so that people would realise he was a predator right back in the late forties, early fifties. Why didn't she speak out at the time? Well, she was very naive and innocnet, her father had died and she didn't get on with her mother, so it wasn't until a couple of years later that she confided in my father-in-law. She has lived with this for over 6 decades but now says that she feels his exposure has had a cathartic effect. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Eliza Date: 07 Oct 12 - 03:17 AM '...shouted his disgrace from the rooftops...' . My unpleasant experience left me for some reason ashamed and as if I myself were to blame. The very last thing I'd have done would have been to tell anyone. The man was a GP, and always welcomed us to my cousin's house congenially. My parents liked him a lot and were proud their niece had married a doctor. It would have been dreadful if I'd maintained he'd touched me in that way. I'd have probably been punished severely for 'imagining' such a thing. It would have been catastrophic, I was only twelve. Now of course. if anyone took liberties, I'd break their neck. (I weigh quite a bit.) |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Oct 12 - 07:18 PM Of course I sympathise with the victims and have said so. You have not Don. Not once. Heart of stone. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Oct 12 - 07:07 PM Innocent members of his family are innocent. The shame is all his. Did you read his nephew's account of his experiences as a child at parties for children and men? Did you know that at least one poor kid, a 15 year old, topped herself because of what he did to her? It was all found in her diary. If only she had been strong like you, she would have shouted her disgrace from the rooftops, but she was just a frightened kid. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Jack Campin Date: 06 Oct 12 - 06:56 PM Liz Kershaw is reported at more length in another story: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-19856081 Ms Kershaw, 54, who joined Radio 1 in 1987, said the station had changed out of all recognition since the 1980s. [...] The main jokes were about his adventures on the Radio 1 Roadshow. It was massive then. "It was rather like the X Factor going round the country then. Can you imagine the X Factor judges rounding up the contestants and asking for sexual favours after the show? I don't think so," she added. You know what? I do think so. Shows like The X Factor are not one bit less sleazy and riddled with institutional creeps playing power games than TV was in Savile's day. Of course some of them are abusing their position. 15 years is nowhere near long enough for the sort of cultural change Kershaw says has happened - not without a couple of layers of management being taken out and shot, anyway. She's talking like a Catholic church bureaucrat on a damage limitation exercise. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 06 Oct 12 - 06:14 PM Of course I sympathise with the victims and have said so. Do YOU understand what I said about the effect on innocent members of his family? NO! Heart of stone Keith? Or do you see a gain from this in terms of punishing a man who is too dead to give a shit? Don T. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Oct 12 - 06:08 PM Neither on this nor the previous thread have you shown any empathy or expressed any sympathy for the abused kids. Just protected their abusers. Heart of stone Don. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 06 Oct 12 - 06:03 PM ""If I were a victim of serious abuse You are not a frightened young girl who has been forcibly abused and humiliated by a physically and socially powerful man who everyone else regards as a saint."" Neither are you! So hows about taking the WHOLE of my post and considering what it actually says in context. Try something new, why don't you? Don T. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Oct 12 - 04:46 PM If I were a victim of serious abuse You are not a frightened young girl who has been forcibly abused and humiliated by a physically and socially powerful man who everyone else regards as a saint. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 06 Oct 12 - 01:38 PM As has been pointed out, he will never be convicted and is beyond punishment. If I were a victim of serious abuse, I would be shouting it from the rooftops immediately, not waiting until the only possible revenge fell, not upon the criminal, but on the other, innocent, members of his family. I just hope that this sudden rush of accusers will be made VERY aware that the only people they are affecting never did them any harm at all. I hope they get some satisfaction out of that. Dealing with those who knew and did nothing is a separate issue and I earnestly hope that THEY will pay the price. Don T. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Martin Date: 06 Oct 12 - 06:03 AM The reason he got away with it so long was because his very survival depended on being shrewd. For example, once the police became involved, he became guarded, possibly employing a different approach. Not saying or doing anything that could be later used against him in the event of surveillance or even possibly a cunning "honey trap" being employed to get him to say or do something that would play into the hands of those out to ensnare him, example, "lifting the block". Working together as a group, gathering what some may consider as factual evidence isn't always enough to secure a prosecution. Possibly the visit from the police was an attempt to "put the wind up him". The question remains, did it ? There will never a prosecution, unless someone brings a civil case, which as we all know is outside the financial means of most. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Eliza Date: 06 Oct 12 - 05:41 AM Fortunately, regarding sexual harassment in the workplace, there is much more scope for complaint and bringing perpetrators to book than there was thirty years ago. And workers are (I believe) more ready to defend themselves forcefully against inappropriate sexual behaviour. But I wonder if a child or young teenager bringing allegations of sexual attack against a popular celebrity would be listened to more readily today? Especially perhaps a wayward teenager who had for example already been in trouble with the law? I have my doubts, sadly. (By the way, the man who did that to me all those years ago, my cousin's husband, was a family doctor! I've often wondered if he did those things to his patients?) |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,CS Date: 06 Oct 12 - 05:35 AM Scanning through yet more allegations this morning. My guess is there will indeed be a number of 'celebrities' still living, who may be forced out of the shadows. This morning a close family member corroborates victims and witnesses allegations: Savile's nephew speaks of being taken to uncle Jimmy's parties at age thirteen: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2213636/Uncle-Jimmy-took-sick-parties-Nephew-tells-childhood-stolen-13.html "Other members of Savile's family spoke out last week to condemn a TV programme alleging the DJ sexually abused teenage girls, but the nephew said many relatives were aware of his sordid past. ... 'At night you would get about 15 or 20 people turning up [at the house where the parties were held}. There would be music and tables full of food, we couldn't believe it. There was everything we needed and we just hung around. 'At first we automatically assumed the children lived there, but we soon realised they didn't. They would be brought there, sometimes by Uncle Jimmy, and would stay for six or seven hours until 3 or 4am. They were just little kids, boys and girls. 'Two or three would go off and come back later. The really strange thing was that they didn't come out the bedrooms kicking and screaming. None of them seemed to be in any distress, but there is no doubt at all in my mind what they were being used for. [...] Guy said he believed he and his friends were there to 'keep the kids happy'. He said: 'I didn't think anything about it at the time, maybe because there was no such thing as paedophiles back then. I never saw Jimmy Savile sexually abuse any of the children, but as far as I am concerned he was part of a paedophile ring at those parties.' [...] 'Although I was not sexually abused I do feel like a victim myself. I think I should have reported him years ago but I was too scared to do it. 'Now I am really pleased everyone knows the truth.' |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,CS Date: 06 Oct 12 - 05:15 AM Liz Kershaw describes how Savile's predilection for young girls was "an open secret at the BBC" and also of how her own complaints about being groped by a (unnamed) coworker, were dismissed. Evidence is beginning to stack up against the BBC that the corporation knew full well what was going on in alcoves in dressing rooms: http://www.itv.com/news/update/2012-10-06/liz-kershaw-savile-claims-were-open-secret-and-another-dj-groped-me/ "Ms Kershaw, who now works for Radio 6 Music, said that when she joined Radio 1 in 1987 - the year Sir Jimmy left - his behaviour was an "open secret" at the station. "The rumours were there, the jokes were there. It was an open secret," she told the BBC Radio 4 Today programme. "Round Radio 1 everyone joked about Jimmy Savile and young girls. The main jokes were about his adventures on the Radio 1 Roadshow. It was massive then. "There was one presenter who routinely groped me. I would be sitting in the studio with my headphones on, my back to the studio door, live on air, and couldn't hear a thing except what was in my headphones, and then I'd find these wandering hands up my jumper fondling my breasts," she said. "I couldn't say anything, I couldn't even explain because I was broadcasting to the nation. When I complained to somebody they were incredulous and said 'Don't you like it, are you a lesbian?"' |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Martin Date: 06 Oct 12 - 04:57 AM Alan, when I refreshed this thread on the 1st October a few leaped on me in Savile's defence, that seems to have abated. Strange that none of those who blew smoke up his arse prior to my post of 1st October returned to comment. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Alan Whittle Date: 06 Oct 12 - 04:43 AM Its a strange business - as I find myself keep repeating. Don raises an interesting point. Why didn't the press latch on to these complaints. They certainly did with Benny Hill's casting couch antics - must have been round about the same time. Why is it only now? Nobody's defending the guy....but why now? |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Martin Date: 06 Oct 12 - 04:39 AM Jimmy Savile was a strong supporter and personal friend of Margaret Thatcher. Jimmy Saville actually stayed at Chequers with Thatcher for ELEVEN successive NEW YEARS EVES. Their friendship is well documented. It would appear they have much in common. They both shafted minors in the 1980's. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Musket sans cookie Date: 06 Oct 12 - 03:56 AM Amazing how discussing whether one person was a monster leads to discussin whether another person still is. The difference I suppose is both used public acceptance of one side of their nature to disguise their aims in other aspects. A difference between buggering kids and buggering their chances. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 06 Oct 12 - 01:42 AM All parties including Labour now agree that immigration has been at too high a level. I think that Labour is also now in favour of a higher priority for housing be given to those who have been waiting for years. Not sure why Fatcher is essential to every thread. What was your point Jim? |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: The Sandman Date: 05 Oct 12 - 08:50 PM More Evidence That Margaret Thatcher Was Racist, Everyone Fairly Unsurprised 3:11 pm - 12/30/2009 Margaret Thatcher complained about Asian immigration to Britain Margaret Thatcher thought it was "quite wrong" for immigrants to get council houses ahead of "white citizens", previously unpublished government papers show. Files released to the National Archives show that soon after becoming prime minister, Lady Thatcher privately complained that too many Asian immigrants were being allowed into Britain. The documents, which are published today under the "30 year rule", shed further light on Lady Thatcher's attitudes on race and immigration, political issues that have remained controversial ever since. They show that in July 1979, Lady Thatcher met Lord Carrington, her foreign secretary, and William Whitelaw, then home secretary, to discuss the plight of hundreds of thousands of "boat people" fleeing persecution in communist Vietnam. The prime minister, who had publicly said that she sympathised with fears that Britain was being "swamped" by immigrant cultures, reacted sharply to the ministers' suggestions that thousands of the Vietnamese refugees should be welcomed. Lord Carrington, who had visited refugee camps in Hong Kong where some of the boat people were being held, gave a "vivid account" of the conditions there, the minutes show. He suggested that Britain take 10,000 of them over two years. Failure to take a significant number would lead to a "damaging reaction" at home and abroad, he said, and anything less than 10,000 would be "difficult to sustain" on the world stage. But Lady Thatcher said that there were already too many people coming into Britain, according to the minutes. She said that "with some exceptions there had been no humanitarian case for accepting 1.5 million immigrants from south Asia and elsewhere. It was essential to draw a line somewhere". Mr Whitelaw entered the debate, suggesting to the prime minister that refugees were a different matter to immigrants in general. He said that according to letters he had received, opinion favoured the accepting of more of the Vietnamese refugees. Lady Thatcher responded that "in her view all those who wrote letters in this sense should be invited to accept one into their homes," the minutes disclose. "She thought it quite wrong that immigrants should be given council housing whereas white citizens were not." Lady Thatcher asked what the implications of such a move could be given that an exodus of the white population from Rhodesia – now Zimbabwe – was expected once majority rule was established. She made clear, however, that she had "less objection to refugees such as Rhodesians, Poles and Hungarians, since they could more easily be assimilated into British society". The meeting was held about 18 months after Lady Thatcher made comments in a television interview that came to be seen as a watershed in mainstream politicians' handling of race and immigration. "People are really rather afraid that this country might be rather swamped by people with a different culture," she told World In Action. "If we do not want people to go to extremes we ourselves must talk about this problem and we must show that we are prepared to deal with it," she added. "We are not in politics to ignore people's worries. We are in politics to deal with them." The comments were held responsible for a collapse in support for the National Front, which had been gathering momentum in working class communities. Read more at ONTD Political: http://ontd-political.livejournal.com/4945894.html#ixzz28TYDzLjC |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: MGM·Lion Date: 05 Oct 12 - 06:36 PM And we haven't even started to discuss their willingness to be used as a private army by Lady T... Anybody attempting to make racist capital out of child abuse is a sicko... Jim Carroll .,,. How about trying to make anti-Thatcherite capital out of it, hey Jim? ~M~ |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Dave the Gnome Date: 05 Oct 12 - 03:07 PM I don't believe anyone can be found guilty of a crime if they cannot defend themselves can they? Anyway - Saville will never have to face court but he does appear to be guilty of the crimes if we believe what we are told. Trouble is - Does anyone benefit from this apart from the press and media? The same kind of who gave him the opportunity to do these things are now making another fortune out of it. Sad really. Surely the only good that can come of it is that the victims can now relieve themselves of the burdens that he placed on them and that would be best done in private and with dignity. Don't give the Sun and Telegraph and the BBC and Rupert Murdoch the benefit of making another penny out of him. Consign all their rubbish to the bin and let the victims recover in peace. Cheers DtG |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Eliza Date: 05 Oct 12 - 02:02 PM I'm afraid, for me, all the good he has done etc is totally wiped out by his predatory way of life as a paedophile. I suspect his charity work was cunningly planned solely to give him access to possible victims and to boost his self-image. He loved the limelight and it gave him a kind of immunity. 'Leaves a rather nasty taste in the mouth...' well, sticking his tongue in young girls' mouths (and worse) leaves a VERY nasty taste in mine!! A monster who does 'good works' is still a monster. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 05 Oct 12 - 01:33 PM ""I'm also glad to see apologists leave this thread."" That is an insult which I don't deserve C.S. I have nothing but loathing for child molesters, and I want to see every individual who had definite knowledge of this and concealed it taken to court, convicted and punished. This does not in any way conflict with my distaste for the unholy glee with which the Media (and some Mudcatters) have chosen to destroy not only the man for the evil he has done, but also everything good which was also achieved through his actions (see the comments re charity work in this thread). It leaves a rather nasty taste in the mouth, and one can't help wondering why almost all of the victims waited so many years to come forward. Don T. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Rob Naylor Date: 05 Oct 12 - 01:08 PM And by contrast, from Savile's own autobiography (written in 1974) we have him writing about an incident at the Mecca Locarno ballroom in Leeds, where he worked as a DJ, when a female police officer came in with a photograph of "an attractive girl who had run away from a remand home". Savile wrote: "'Ah,' says I all serious, 'if she comes in I'll bring her back tomorrow but I'll keep her all night first as my reward'." He then wrote that the girl did go into the club and: "agreed that I hand her over if she could stay at the dance, and come home with me". He wrote that he did then hand her over to the: "lady of the law, who was dissuaded from bringing charges against me by her colleagues, for it was well known that were I to go down I would probably take half the station with me". Not convicting him without a trial or anything, but it's telling that back in 1974 he felt so secure that he didn't even bother to hide his liking for "young girls". |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Brian May Date: 05 Oct 12 - 12:16 PM I wrote this last October . . . wow was I fooled. Just seems you don't know do you? Subject: RE: Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK From: Brian May - PM Date: 30 Oct 11 - 05:29 PM My wife knew Jimmy when he was at the height of his fame. He used to go to the club she was managing in York., he was wonderful with all the staff, generous, considerate and down to earth. She says he was an absolute gentleman at all times, even running her home in the early hours to York and having tea and biscuits with her mum and her before driving on to Scarborough to see 'the Duchess'. The world is a dimmer place without him in it. RIP Sir Jimmy, I wish I'd a memory like that too. Never heard anything bad about him - I'm glad about that. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: The Sandman Date: 05 Oct 12 - 11:45 AM Was it because the problem was endemic when the facts were commented on?. i think you are right |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,your willie Date: 05 Oct 12 - 08:58 AM My quote of 6.59 A.M. 3/10/12 shows that some at least were aware and critical of the issue even though at that time the age of consent was twelve. L.C. and the sheep who agreed with her should at the very least give a thought as to why the subject was being aired. Was it because the problem was endemic when the facts were commented on?. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Musket Date: 05 Oct 12 - 08:34 AM Saville could gag the press by threatening the risk of charitable giving through his aura. Freddie Starr.. What the hell could he threaten? "Expose me and nobody will be able to laugh at my Hitler impression?" "The S*n wont be able to get a story over my hamster culinary arts? " Sadly, power corrupts and I am not surprised to hear how you feel invincible when all around tell you what a superstar you are. You end up believing it. Base instinct kicking in can be such a small simple step... Allegations need to be looked into. With Saville, that is not easy as there is no criminal case that can be answered, so we will not get the impartial forensic examination that a court of law could give it. Sadly, sensationalism and innuendo will be mixed with the facts, so we may not know the true story. If, as many have pointed out on this thread, such exposures are a deterrent to others, then it can serve a purpose. One positive, if there can be a positive, is that most of this was a long time ago. With increasing public awareness, safeguarding training in public bodies including hospitals and The BBC, such occurrences would be far more difficult now than at the time of most of the allegations. Although those in charge of some Rochdale and Rotherham child care homes may wish to wonder why they bothered with safeguarding awareness training if they didn't do anything about it... |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Doc John Date: 05 Oct 12 - 07:53 AM 'Malicious allegations are rare'...Rare maybe but not that rare as to be discounted: ask some teachers who have been wrongly accused of child abuse by a vindictive child. Even when found quite innocent, the cloud hangs over the teacher forever. Threats of being reported to Childline for no good reason are not unheard of. Then we must consider false memory syndrome: patients under therapy 'remembering' incidences of abuse as a child which certainly did not occur but were planted, perhaps unwittingly, in the patients' mind by the therapist. Then there's jumping on the bandwagon to make a fast buck. By all means listen to the child but with a critical ear. Children are not always sweet innocents: they can be vindictive liars too. Not that the above is relevant to the current case. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,CS Date: 05 Oct 12 - 07:02 AM "there have been at least three other 'media stars' who, it has been suggested, were involved in these claimed events " At least two that I'm aware of at present. "Gary Glitter" and Freddie Starr. Starr initially sought and won a press silencing gag, but that has since been overturned and he has now been named as the "third star" alleged to have participated in a group assault upon underage girls from the Duncroft home for (quote) "emotionally disturbed" girls. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,Felix Titling-Blandiver Date: 05 Oct 12 - 07:01 AM Spot on, CS. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Keith A of Hertford Date: 05 Oct 12 - 06:56 AM Don, we are not in court. As a general rule, when child sex abuse is reported by the victim, they should always be listened to and believed if there is no reason not to. Malicious allegations are rare, and the motive usually obvious. Here we have numerous and disparate victims telling the stories that still haunt them decades later. I believe them, as I did on the last occasion this came up. |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: Jim Carroll Date: 05 Oct 12 - 06:52 AM "Do YOU believe it is right to ignore the most basic tenet of English Law" I go along %100 with this, but I do believe that there comes a point in the disclosures where the probability of it having happened becomes obvious and I think we might have reached that point. It is immaterial whether the suggested culprit is alive or dead; if it is true that the BBC was aware of the possiblity that it was happening and they allowed Savile to go on working with children, they have a serious case to answer. I think I am right in remembering that there have been at least three other 'media stars' who, it has been suggested, were involved in these claimed events - do we ignore the possibility that they are still out there and allow them to go uninvestigated, and maybe even to continue to practice their 'little weakness' in order to keep the memory of 'Sunny Jim' untarnished. Jim Carroll |
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Subject: RE: 2011 Obit: RIP Sir Jimmy Savile UK disc jockey From: GUEST,CS Date: 05 Oct 12 - 06:33 AM "The relish with which some of you have picked this man apart is slightly sickening." I am extremely glad that these allegations are coming to light. Indeed I am always glad when allegations of this sort are exposed rather than remaining dirty secrets. Very glad indeed that these crimes are no longer being concealed either by the victims OR by those who suspected by chose to do nothing, either for the realistic fear of being disbelieved, or for the fear of harm being done to careers. The more such crimes are revealed, the less easy it is for the systematic abuse of children by powerful people or within powerful organisations, to occur in the future. As someone who was abused, I have a deep and personal interest in such stories. I'm not ashamed of that. I'm also glad to see apologists leave this thread. |
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