Tune Req: My Love Is Like a Red Red Rose (R Burns)

Subject: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Hawley Montgomery-Downs
Date: 15 Oct 99 - 11:55 AM

Several of you were very helpful a few months ago when I was searching for a tune to have played/sung at my upcoming wedding. I'm a piper myself so I'm super excited about having Burns' "My Love is Like a Red Red Rose" played on the bagpipe and then sung by my Auntie during the ceremony. Problem: I can't FIND the sheet music for the tune! Can anyone help me?!?! I need to get it to my piper in CA so that he can start to learn it - soon!

Thanks in advance, Hawley

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Ciaran
Date: 15 Oct 99 - 12:40 PM

OK Hawley - go to http://levysheetmusic.mse.jhu.edu/index.html then scroll down to the foot of the page and click on Search The Collection. Then on the ADVANCED SEARCH screen enter red red rose in the Search For window and choose Title in the Within window. Click on Search and you should get six hits - at least two of them are the Robbie Burns versions and they have images of the sheet music. You could download them and print them or e-mail them to your Piper - or just transcribe them yourself? Good luck with the wedding - is it anywhere we know?

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Bruce O.
Date: 15 Oct 99 - 01:41 PM

Have a little caution here. Burns' song is #402 in 'The Scots Musical Museum" with two tunes for it there. The first, "Major Graham" is that generally preferred. It was given earlier in Gow's 1st book of Strathspey Reels, and Vol. 3 of Aird's Airs (now available as ABCs on the internet). However, editors of some early songbook songbooks, including Robert Chambers, got their Grahams confused and cited the tune as "Hughie Graham" for the song. "Hughie Graham" is also in the 'Scots Musical Museum', but its tune is "Driman Duff", (as in DT). [See also the recent Driman Dubh thread.] If American music publishers got their tune from a copy with music, then all should be well, but if they tried to match the tune cited in a songbook it could be the wrong one.

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Bruce O.
Date: 15 Oct 99 - 03:44 PM

For the ABC of "Major Graham" from Aird's Airs go to
www.leeds.ac.uk/music/Info/RRTuneBk/listings.html and scan down to Aird.

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Hawley
Date: 15 Oct 99 - 10:44 PM

Gosh, thank you both so much for writing in!

Ciaran, I found the site you listed and downloaded the sheet music for the tune...if I can't get the actual pipe music then I'll try my hand and altering the piano music, which will be an adventure! Thanks for your help :-)

Bruce O., I've gotcha on the difference between the two tunes, fascinating how these things can happen! SMM is out of print, but I've got amazon.com searching for it and I'm looking on other sites too. In the mean time, just to make sure I'm on the right track...the music I'll find in that book is written for the pipe, yes?

I also found and downloaded the ABC for the tune ("Major Graham") but I haven't got a clue as to what an ABC is...is there a way to translate the text into music?!?! I appreciate your help both of you!

Thanks again, Hawley

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Bruce O.
Date: 15 Oct 99 - 11:18 PM

ABC2WIN will play tunes through your computer's speaker and will display music on yor monitor for free. You have to pay print out the music, however. About $20.00 as I recall. Download it for the ABC hompage. I can't remember the address so click from a paragraph on ABC near the top of my homepage: www.erols.com/olsonw or go to the links at fsgw.org and find the ABC hompage there and click on it. I think you can probably click on it from the Ceolas website in Mudcat's Links.

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Hawley
Date: 15 Oct 99 - 11:32 PM

Ohhhhhhh, I get it now :-) I guess my computer just downloaded a text version instead of playing the tune...thanks for clarifying.

So, do you have the SMM and can you verify for me that it does indeed have the bagpipe version of the sheet music for this tune before I buy it (if I can find it?!)

Thanks thanks thanks, Hawley

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Barry Taylor
Date: 16 Oct 99 - 11:07 AM

IMHO I think that it will be a stretch to adapt My Luv to the limited note range of the pipes. However, there are other Burns tunes that have pipe settings that you might also consider... e.g., My Love She's But A Lassie Yet, A Man's A Man For A' That and Corn Riggs Are Bonnie are all tunes that my band plays in a medley.

Let me know if you want copies of the pipe settings. BTW I've done a midi sequence of My Luv here. Just double click to play it.

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Hawley
Date: 16 Oct 99 - 11:20 AM

Hi Barry -

Your HO is well taken and I'm finally getting the message :( You're right of course, but I could *swear* I've heard the tune on the pipes...probably too much scotch that day! I'm afraid that the Auntie who will be singing is already learning "My Luv" (and in Gaelic!) so it's too late to switch tunes on her. However, we can always have John play a different tune instead. I'll check out your suggestions...mayby we can induce our guests to sing along if it's at the same time as he's playing since no one will hear them then anyway! Yeahhhh, that could work.

Thanks for the MIDI too - I'm trying to decide on a recording to buy for my Auntie, of the 9+ on cdnow.com does anyone recommend any particular one? Doesn't have to be a woman singing, just a nice happy version. The realaudio clips don't give much of an impression.

Thanks to all, I'm having way more fun on this than I am writing my vows! - Hawley

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Barry (again)
Date: 16 Oct 99 - 11:21 AM

A further thought... If you don't mind Thomas Moore making a contribution to the day, you might also consider Believe Me If All Those Endearing Young Charms, which has a message of eternal love that has evoked emotion for a couple of hundred years now. Played as a slow air on the pipes it's a beauty. I have the pipe setting for that as well. Just let me know if you want it.

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Hawley
Date: 16 Oct 99 - 12:07 PM

Hi again Barry,

How WONDERFUL!!! This work is absolutely perfect. The others you recommended (the Burns' poems) are - of course - beautiful, but not really appropriate for the occasion. But we both LOVE this poem by Moore and of course are thrilled to have his contribution :) I think we might even be able to cajole our guests into singing it!

I really would be thrilled if you'd send the pipe setting for this - I have my chanter out and ready to go :) So, how shall we arrange that?? Would it be easier for you to scan it to me, or to send it via regular mail? I don't even know if you're in the US!

Thank you so very, very much for your help on this project, our wedding day will be more wonderful for it.

- Hawley (and Ernie)

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Barry
Date: 16 Oct 99 - 12:22 PM

Ta da! Your tune can be downloaded in pcx format here

Best wishes for your special day!

Barry in Victoria, British Columbia, Canada

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Hawley
Date: 16 Oct 99 - 12:44 PM

Ohhhhhh, this is TOO neat-o Barry!!!!!!!!!!! Thank you so very, very much! Your help has been tremendous :-) And now I'm off to learn to play this tune...and send it to my wedding piper!

Oh, I never did answer Ciaran's question: the wedding will be in Sonoma, California (where I grew up) next July.

Thanks again, Hawley in Mansfield, Connecticut, USA PS - I think Victoria is the most beautiful city in the world, my Dad and I hiked the West Coast Trail in '93!

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From:
Date: 16 Oct 99 - 01:00 PM

Thomas Moore's song "Believe me if all those..." was to the tune of "My lodging is on the cold ground". An ABC of the earliest know copy of the tune, 1775, is B316 in the broadside ballad tunes on my website. (B315 is the 17th century one of the same title)

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Murray on Saltspring
Date: 17 Oct 99 - 02:34 AM

Believe Me if All fits on a bagpipe, since the compass is one octave, and the missing notes (like G#) can safely be ignored. But a tune not composed with the pipes in mind can be a regular bugger to fit! Especially when the compass is far beyond the nine notes of the bagpipe scale. I shudder to think what the result might be... The "Major Graham" in SMM (and hence in the Oxford Poems and Songs, edited by Kinsley, 734) goes from middle C to top G, which the pipes can't handle. The tune mostly used, mind you, these days is "Low Down in the Broom", also in SMM, no. 90.(or an adaptation thereof), which has an even wider compass. I don't see how these can be played on the pipes at all. I'd be interested to hear how this is managed.

Subject: RE: Help: My Love is Like a Red Red Rose???
From: Hawley
Date: 17 Oct 99 - 11:40 AM

Hi Murray - You're right about this, I messed around with my chanter last night seeing what I could do - until my fiancee begged me to stop mutilating such a lovely tune :( So, as Barry suggested and you've now seconded, I'm officially giving up on a pipe setting for "My Luv".

The plan now is for my Auntie to sing "My Luv" a cappella and after that our piper (I'm not playing at my own wedding!) will play "Believe Me" and - we hope - the whole group of guests (100+) will joining us in singing along.

You guys have been so fantastic about helping me out on this, I really really really appreciate it!

- Hawley

Subject: Tune Req: Red Red Rose (R Burns)
From: Genie
Date: 11 Jul 11 - 08:02 PM

I'm trying to figure out which of the various tunes to which Burns's "Red, Red Rose" is sung is which.

Several websites, including the Burns Encyclopedia, say that Burns originally set the poem (which was a song he had heard a country girl sing) to the tune of Niel Gow's "Major Graham," but that when Burns gave the song to Pietro Urbani to publish in his "Scots Songs," Urbani wrote his own tune for it. In 1797, the year after Burns died, the song was published in Johnson's Museum to the "Major Graham" tune. Two years later it appeared in Thomson's Scottish Airs, to William Marshall's tune "Wishaw's Favourite." They also say that the song did not really become very popular until 1821, when Robert Archibald Smith set the lyrics to the tune of the traditional Scots song "Low Down in the Broom."

The thing is, I'm having trouble matching MIDIs and YouTube versions with the scores that I've found, and some versions seem to be using totally different tunes.   When I find a MIDI with the accompanying lyrics, it usually doesn't specify which tune it is. YouTubes and mp3s I find online are generally even more unclear about that.

Can anyone direct me to clear MIDIs or YouTubes of Red, Red Rose being sung to the following tunes?

Major Graham
Wishaw's Favorite
Low Down In The Broom
Urbani's original tune


(One reason the MIDIs don't always help is that they're sometimes overlaid with ornamentation making it hard to hear the basic tune, and sometimes they're played in a style that doesn't seem to fit this song -- e.g., the score says "very slow," but the MIDI is played quite fast.)

Genie

Subject: RE: Tune Req: My Love Is Like a Red Red Rose (R Burns)
From: Jim McLean
Date: 12 Jul 11 - 06:38 AM

Genie, the melody 'Low Down in the Broom' is the popular tune and can be heard here Red red rose

Subject: RE: Tune Req: My Love Is Like a Red Red Rose (R Burns)
From: Jim McLean
Date: 12 Jul 11 - 06:51 AM

The melody Major Graham which is tune used in Johnson's Museum can be heard here: Major Graham
Note that the first strain is repeated in the written melody whereas the song is usually sung "o my love is like ..." then the high part next "As fair art thou .." etcetera.

Subject: RE: Tune Req: My Love Is Like a Red Red Rose (R Burns)
From: Jim McLean
Date: 12 Jul 11 - 07:23 AM

George Thomson printed O My Love ... to marshall's tune Wishaw's Favourite. I have Thomson's book and the melody is a stripped down version of marshall's "Mrs Hamilton of Wishaw" a stratspey which can be ssen here Mrs Hamilton of Wishaw
The reason it is difficult to scan in the words as are normally sung is that Thomson, in the high part, has repeated two words i.e. " So deeep, so deep in love am I"

Subject: RE: Tune Req: My Love Is Like a Red Red Rose (R Burns)
From: Jim McLean
Date: 12 Jul 11 - 07:30 AM

Excuse the typos above. I cannot find Urbani's tune but I wouldn't worry about it!

Subject: RE: Tune Req: My Love Is Like a Red Red Rose (R Burns)
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 12 Jul 11 - 10:35 AM

Thank you for the links, jim. It's interesting to compare the different tunes.