BS: The Dark Knight Rises

Subject: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 02:33 PM

Just seen this 164 minute film, and would warn anyone who plans to do likewise, that the music soundtrack is so loud that it is often difficult to understand the dialogue - mixed by arseholes.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: gnu
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 03:06 PM

I haven't been to a movie theatre in about 15 years because of the sound volume. I stayed 30 minutes, got my money back and that was that. Never again.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 04:14 PM

I try to watch films in theatres with less intrusive sound systems nowadays, or wait till it comes out on DVD.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 04:44 PM

I'm just the same, can't stand the loud volume in cinemas, it makes me cringe. Why do they have it so loud? Have people got hearing damage from going to loud nightclubs etc? They must be a bit deaf to be able to stand it!

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Don Firth
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 05:01 PM

I haven't been to a movie theater in years. I think the last movie I saw in a theater was "Jurrasic Park."

A friend bought my wife and me an on-going subscription to NetFlix a couple of years ago, and we go through the offerings and pick the DVDs we want to watch. We recently acquired a 26" wide-screen flat-panel television. Or we can watch a movie on the 17" screen of my laptop while sitting on the bed.

No hassles. Lots less expensive, no parking problems, and no kid behind you kicking the back of your seat.

Don Firth

P. S. I started following Batman in Detective Comics way back in medieval times, when it first came out. I don't really like what some recent meddlers have done with "the Batman Legend" lately. 'Tain't the Batman I grew up with.

The first Batman movie with Michael Keaton was good. Followed the basic genesis of Batman pretty faithfully. Subsequent movies have been getting weirder and weirder. I think Bob Kane, who created the character in the first place, wouldn't be too happy with what's being done.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 06:30 PM

Even my local newspaper panned the film, and THAT takes some sort of bad film.

Last time I was in a movie theater I saw the second Harry Potter film.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 06:31 PM

And Don is right -- that ain't the Batman I grew up with...or Superman...or Green Lantern...or Green Arrow....

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Janie
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 06:37 PM

The world moves on and us old farts todder along in spite of it. Good on us, and good on the world.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 08:59 PM

...or Captain America or Sergeant Rock of Easy Company or Aquaman or Mighty Mouse or....

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 09:06 PM

No, thanks...

If I'm going to see a movie I don't want to come out of the theater with my ears ringing for days...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 09:29 PM

Ya know, there's a good reason I like acoustic music.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Don Firth
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 10:38 PM

What I liked about Batman in the first place was that he was NOT a superhero—as the current promos keep claiming.

Superheroes have super powers. Superman, for example, came from a planet with a much stronger gravity that earth's, so his body is denser, which is why bullets bounce off his chest, and a little hop on Krypton transfers into his being able to "leap tall buildings in a single bound!"

Billy Batson, the little crippled newsboy, can shout "Shazaam!" and he is suddenly endowed with the powers of a whole pantheon of Greek gods. The strength of Hercules, the speed of Mercury, etc., etc.

Peter Parker gets bitten by a radioactive spider and gains all kinds of kookie abilities like being able to crawl up vertical surfaces, crawl around ceilings, and swinging on webs.

[Red Green to his nerdy nephew Harold: "Harold, being able to get a date with a girl is not a superpower!"]

Bruce Wayne was a normal human being. Or as normal as one can be if, at the age of ten or so, you see your parents shot down in cold blood by a derange robber, and are subsequently raised by Alfred Pennyworth, your father's dedicated and loyal English butler, who honestly manages your father's millions which you have inherited, and sees to it that you get the best schooling.

All the time you are growing up, the murder of your parents haunts you. The idea that criminals can walk the streets and skulk through the shadows and do the kind of things that one did to your parents has become something of an obsession, and you feel that you are called to do something about it.

In your childhood, you discover that there is a large cave under your home, Stately Wayne Manor. It's full of bats. At first they scare the hell out of you. Then, the idea strikes you that a huge bat, roaming the shadows and preying on the criminals, would really strike fear into their hearts.

You get training in hand-to-hand combat techniques, gymnastics, other skills you feel you might be called upon to use, and become very athletic in general.

Then, you design a mask and costume. And you begin skulking through the streets, darting from shadow to shadow, preying on thugs, footpads, and criminals.

Not a superhero. Just very acrobatic and very good at what you do.

That appealed to me much more than the idea of someone endowed with superhuman abilities.

Early on, interest began to flag in Superman because the comic books began to lack a certain element of suspense. The Man of Steel could rescue people from danger, but he, himself, was never in danger! He was essentially invulnerable. So Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster had to invent "Kryptonite," the presence of which could render him weak and powerless.

Even a superhero needs to be vulnerable to something, otherwise his adventures lack a necessary level of suspense. At least once in his career, as I recall, Batman was shot and seriously injured. He was vulnerable, and hence that element of suspense existed. If the "baterang" came loose from the cornice of the building while he was in mid-swing, he could fall to his death in the street ten stories below.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Don Firth
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 10:42 PM

By the way, for those not familiar with the character, when Billy Batson, the little crippled newsboy, saw a crime in progress, he could shout "Shazaam!" and not only did he gain the powers of the Gods of Mount Olympus, he gained a commission as well.

He became Captain Marvel!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 11:23 PM

I rarely go to movies. Even science documentaries are so loud I can hardly stand it.

Sometimes we watch movies on a DVD. I like to take a break about halfway through, and sometimes I just can't stand to watch the whole thing. I hold my breath for long periods of time, even for quite innocuous movies.

I think it would be a good medical experiment to have people watch movies while machines monitored basic things such as breathing, heart rate, blood pressure and brain waves. It might be very informative.

It'a amazing to me that millions of dollars are invested in movies, but nobody asks, "How can me ensure that people will want to come and see our movies?"

I won't be seeing The Dark Knight.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Rapparee
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 11:28 PM

S         for the wisdom of Solomon         As Captain Marvel, Billy has instant access to a vast amount of scholarly knowledge, including most known languages and sciences. He has exceptional photographic recall and mental acuity allowing him to read and decipher hieroglyphics, recall everything he has ever learned and solve long mathematical equations. He also has a great understanding of divine phenomena in the mortal world. The wisdom of Solomon also provides him with counsel and advice in times of need. In early Captain Marvel stories, Solomon's power also gave Marvel the ability to hypnotize people. (Solomon is the only figure in the list not taken from Greco-Roman mythology.)

H         for the strength of Hercules         Hercules' power grants Captain Marvel immense superhuman strength, making him one of DC Comics' strongest characters; he is able to easily bend steel, punch through walls, and lift massive objects, (including whole continents like South America). In the comics, this strength has evolved in parallel to that of Superman.

A         for the stamina of Atlas         Using Atlas' stamina, Captain Marvel can withstand and survive most types of extreme physical assaults, and heal from them. Additionally, he does not need to eat, sleep, or breathe and can survive unaided in space when in Captain Marvel form. Pre-Crisis, it was implied in some stories to give him invulnerability.

Z         for the power of Zeus         Zeus' power, besides fueling the magic thunderbolt that transforms Captain Marvel, also enhances Marvel's other physical and mental abilities, and grants him resistance against all magic spells and attacks. Marvel can use the lightning bolt as a weapon by dodging it and allowing it to strike an opponent or target. The magic lightning has several uses, such as creating apparatus, restoring damage done to Marvel, and acting as fuel for magic spells. If Billy is poisoned, for example, transforming will enable him to survive. Pre-Crisis, it was claimed in some stories to give him invulnerabilty. It can also turn other Marvels back by striking them. It aids interdimensional travel at the Rock of Eternity.

A         for the courage of Achilles         This aspect gives Captain Marvel the courage of Achilles, giving him bravery and in one story it is claimed to give him fighting skills. In the Trials of Shazam! mini-series, this was changed to Achilles' near invulnerability. It also aids Captain Marvel's mental fortitude against most mental attacks.

M         for the speed of Mercury         By channeling Mercury's speed, Captain Marvel can move at superhuman speeds and fly, although in older comics he could only leap great distances. This also gives Marvel the ability to fly to the Rock of Eternity by flying faster than the speed of light.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Beer
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 11:32 PM

Isn't anyone listening to our complaints. I also don't go because of the sound which must be about 125 decibels.
Adrien

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: frogprince
Date: 22 Jul 12 - 11:58 PM

I hadn't seen any of the Batman flicks since Michael Keaton. Then, just a couple of nights ago, I caught the last few minutes of one of the newer ones on tv. So I don't know about the theater sound, but between the grizzliness of the thing and the take on Batman, I was a lot more creeped out than entertained.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Don Firth
Date: 23 Jul 12 - 12:14 AM

Beer, that's one of the many reasons that Barbara and I prefer to watch movies at home. We may not be able to catch new movies when they are first doing the rounds of the theaters, but they do appear in DVD form fairly soon after that.

And Barbara and I are patient.

And--no problem adjusting the volume to suit.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Jul 12 - 02:47 AM

If you can't feel the rumble in your gut in the action scenes, the theater has a crappy sound system. THX baby!! Dolby digital!! if you don't have it might as well stay home!

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 23 Jul 12 - 03:00 AM

Not logical, Jack. I have experienced certain organ notes which actually set the floor to rumbling, yet they are not overly loud.

There's a difference between powerful and painful.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 23 Jul 12 - 03:07 AM

"Isn't anyone listening to our complaints?"

No, I don't think so, Adrien. I've been baffled at the way investors seem to cheerfully sink millions into movies which promptly tank. My husband has an interesting theory. He says they are gamblers. They are hoping that THEIR tiresomely repetitive, violent movie will be the one that catches the public's fancy and makes a jillion bucks.

Science and logic just aren't going to work with a mentality like that.

Movies, like slot machines, seldom pay off, but the gamblers just keep gambling, I guess.

Either that or somebody's cooking the books.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 23 Jul 12 - 04:37 AM

Leeneia, the Studios are making very very good money over all. The big budget films are more likely to make a profit than the smaller, arty films.

I don't go to movies a lot. But when I do I go to see the big, loud spectacles. They never hurt my ears.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Little Hawk
Date: 24 Jul 12 - 12:23 AM

It's a matter of personal taste. I also think the sound volume in theatres now is unnecessarily loud...way too loud, in fact...but if the movie itself is one I really like then I can put up with it, although I'd prefer it down a notch or two.

Another thing I don't like about a lot of movies now is the constant rapid cuts from one angle to another to another in action scenes....such that you can't really see what's going on in a fight scene, because you're only seeing split second fragments of it, rather than seeing some visual flow of continuity such as you would have seen in movies a few decades ago.

Again, a matter of personal taste.

I would prefer not to be subjected to at least 20 minutes of earsplitting trailers for future movies and assorted advertising before I finally get to see the movie I just paid good money to see. One way to deal with that is to deliberately enter the theater about 19 minutes after the official start time. This will get you in just before the feature film starts...and that is what I paid for. I did not pay for the 20 minutes of commercials that precede it.

Again, a matter of personal taste.

(I don't particularly mind if my taste differs from yours or if yours differs from the next guy. Like me, I expect you know what you like, and that's just fine.)

In the really old days you got to see a cartoon before the feature. That was fun. (but it didn't sell anything...) GOSH! I wonder why they now have 20 minutes of ads first...and I wonder when it will expand to 30 minutes of ads first, and a pause for more ads halfway through the feature, and more ads blaring in your face as you finally exit the theatre? Greed never stops, it just keeps encroaching on the available space like developers building on available green space, and that's what you see happening everywhere in this society, because there's only one sacred thing left here. Money. Money is God here in modern North America.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 24 Jul 12 - 11:55 AM

We are currently re-watching Brief Encounter which was brilliantly made 67 years ago!

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Jul 12 - 12:30 PM

There are other reasons many of us are likely to avoid going to see "The Dark Knight Rises".

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 24 Jul 12 - 12:43 PM

I'm with you, Little Hawk. I hate the loudness and the flashing. I've learned never to watch the trailers. I stay in the lobby till the feature begins.

Meanwhile, here's this from Wikipedia on the risks studios are taking:

"Studios pushed into financial ruin:

In extreme cases, a single film's poor performance can push a studio into bankruptcy or equivalent financial ruin, as happened with:

RKO (The Conqueror),
United Artists (Heaven's Gate),

Carolco Pictures (Cutthroat Island, once listed in the Guinness Book of World Records as the biggest box office flop of all time[7]),

Fox Animation Studios (Titan A.E.),
The Ladd Company (Twice Upon a Time and The Right Stuff),
Fleischer Studios (Mr. Bug Goes to Town),
ITC Entertainment (Raise the Titanic).

The Golden Compass was seen as a significant factor in influencing Warner Bros.' decision to take direct control of New Line Cinema.[8]"
=========
It would seem logical to figure out what are the elements of movies that keep people away, then eliminate them. Perhaps by making movies 10% less incoherant, they could double audience size.

By the way, I have no trouble watching YouTube, because YouTube is natural in its pacing, and I control the volume.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 24 Jul 12 - 02:28 PM

I too find the constant sweeping camera moves disorientating, and they can trigger vertigo, making me vomit. Not pretty! But this terribly loud volume... anyone who says they aren't troubled by it just must have desensitised ears, ie damage, and they are literally a bit deaf. I can hear a pin drop, my ears are very good, so that's why I suffer in these cinemas and theatres. I sat through Miss Saigon at our theatre with my fingers stuffed in my ears. Even our TV is set at the lowest volume before it's silent altogether!

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Jul 12 - 04:29 PM

The overload music and oter sounds tend to be accompanied by dialogue that is inaudible.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: frogprince
Date: 24 Jul 12 - 05:20 PM

My impression has been that the rapid splattering of images originated with rock music videos.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Beer
Date: 24 Jul 12 - 11:11 PM

I just finished watching a movie on Netflix and adjusted the sound to my liking. My wife and grand son went to the movies this afternoon. I said no thanks.
ad.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 25 Jul 12 - 04:09 AM

(More geriatric moaning...) I also don't like the enormous screen. I feel dwarfed and intimidated. I actually like the little tiny portable DVD player my husband has. You select a nice gentle film (eg Sound of Music) get the volume down to a whisper, sit up in bed and watch it. No cringe-making ear-shattering decibels, no whizzing-about camera shots, no violence or horrifying scenes. You doze off deliciously content. That's my idea of perfect film-viewing.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 25 Jul 12 - 05:32 AM

Leeneia mentioned 'Twice upon a Time'. I presume she means the 80s cartoon rather than the 50s British film which was the original English language version of 'The Parent Trap'.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Elmore
Date: 25 Jul 12 - 07:23 AM

By the time we get around to seeing a movie it's usually on tv. At the movie theater the previews are endless and loud, the movie not so bad.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 25 Jul 12 - 10:19 AM

I used to have good hearing. Now I have very sensitive hearing from the damage caused by fools blasting me with sound. (feedback, mostly)

I carry hearing protection with me at all times. I like the Mack brand of earplugs, waxy balls which cover the opening in the ear. I always have them at the movies (though I only go rarely). I also use them on airplanes.

Loud noise, even of sounds which we enjoy, raises the blood pressure and makes us tired. I'm convinced the reason so many people grouse about air travel is that they are worn out from the noise of the engines.

Back to movies - I once went to a documentary on Anarctica but forgot my hearing protection. Walking to a restaurant afterward, I felt like somebody had hit me. You know that hollow sensation you get in your chest when recovering from a blow or a bad fall? I was feeling that. I think it's a symptom of shock.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 25 Jul 12 - 12:37 PM

I'm sure it IS shock, leeneia. I'm always trembling and ill after very loud noises. I stick my fingers in my ears if necessary. Don't care if people stare, I won't damage my health if I can help it. What amazes me is the other people present - they don't seem at all to mind the decibels, which is why I think they're partially deaf already from noise.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 25 Jul 12 - 05:46 PM

Brief Encounter - Hey, much watch it again - I was on Carnforth Station about 2 weeks ago and though the same. Now, if only my memory was not quite as brief :-)

Anyroads - Back to the plot. I am a big fan of Superhero films and the Dark Knight is fast becoming a favourite. Not seen this one yet but must do soon. The sound does enhance it fo me - and I did suffer some hearing damage as a kid but it did not seem to have a lasting effect.

I do know how bad it can be though - My wife can no longer go to the flicks or any amplified concert without a pair of sound-deadening ear plugs. Try it yourself - It really works for her. But don't tell anyone on here :-( I did once and got piss taken out of me by someone who did not believe me and insisted that my wife was just being rude to the artists! C'est la Vie as they say in Huddersfield...

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 25 Jul 12 - 05:52 PM

Oh - BTW - Make sur the plugs you get are for sund protection - The aeroplane pressure ones or the water blockers don't work as well. Soft foamy ones that you squash between your fingers to put in and then they expand to fill up yer lugole seem to work best for 'er indoors.

D.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Beer
Date: 25 Jul 12 - 10:10 PM

So, who decides that the sound should be turned up so loud? Anyone know what the decibels reading are? I think that there is a law in Canada that it should not be higher than 80 decibels according to Workman Compensation. I could be wrong.
ad.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 26 Jul 12 - 04:13 AM

Exactly, Beer. I'm sure there is a legal limit. But people (especially the younger ones) seem to demand ever louder noise, not just at the cinema but also at Festivals. I think they've been clubbing for years and their hearing is impaired. Their reactions are also blunted by over-stimulation from so many sources that they need ever more startling and excessively violent and horrific films to get any response at all from their brains. And cinemas get their revenue chiefly from the young these days. That's my theory anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,Shimrod
Date: 26 Jul 12 - 06:39 AM

I've never understood the American obsession with superheroes. From this side of the Atlantic it all seems a bit odd.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 26 Jul 12 - 09:06 AM

"obsession" ? It's merely a trend in the entertainment industry.
=========
Dave, I salute your wife for using hearing protection. More people need to take a stand, as if to day "You don't have the right to hurt me."

Somebody spoke about decibels. Decibels are part of what makes a sound painfully loud, but there are other factors. The higher the pitch, the worse it is. The longer it goes on, the worse it is, and the closer the source is to one's head, the worse it is.

One of the worst noise sources in the home is an exhaust fan over the range, or so I have read.

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Beer
Date: 26 Jul 12 - 10:34 AM

I found this site interesting and have written to them asking if they ever have conducted a decibel check ion a movie theater.

http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/loudness.html

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Don Firth
Date: 26 Jul 12 - 01:36 PM

A friend of mine and I went down to a firing range to do some target shooting. Part of the gear we normally took with us included a set of "Lee-Sonic ear valves." These are ear plugs that don't block normal sound, but any sudden sound wave—like a gun shot close by—closes the valve, protecting the wearer's ears.

One day I forgot to put mine in. Loren, standing about eight feet to my right, fired his first shot at the target. He was firing a 9 milllimeter Smith & Wesson automatic. VERY loud!!

My right ear rang for three days! Needless to say, I never forgot to put in my Lee-Sonics again.

On another occasion, a lady-friend and I went downtown to a place that used to be a coffee house that featured a resident folk singer. When we got there, we discovered that it had morphed into a rock club. There was a four piece band there, complete with amplified guitars and electric basses. mic stands and amplifiers all over the small stage, and big speakers everywhere. All turned up to top volume.

Tedi and I stayed for less than fifteen minutes. Finally we signaled each other (conversation even at close range was impossible), and beat a hurried retreat.

Her ears as well as mine rang, again, for three days afterward.

My hearing is precious to me. I don't hang around when volume levels are that high.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: The Dark Knight Rises
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 26 Jul 12 - 05:48 PM

Thanks Leeneia - That really is much appreciated after the ribbing I got last time I mentioned it!

Shimrod - If by 'this side' you mean the UK then I must point out that I am here too. And love superheroes! Maybe it was growing up in the 50s thing?

Cheers

DtG