BS: Cultural genocide

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,HiLon
Date: 01 Jun 15 - 04:01 AM

"cringing behind six million dead" I can't believe you actually said that.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 01 Jun 15 - 03:42 AM

None of these quote over what happened last year deal with the mass murder of civilians by the Israeli forces, where hospitals, schools health centres and old people's homes were deliberately targeted using sophisticated and sometimes illegal weaponry.
An early act following the war wasfor Israel to enlist the support of the U.S. to oppose an enquiry into what happened.
BAN THE INTERNATIONAL WAR CRIMES COURT
Equivalent to a suspected criminal demanding that the court be abolished.
Bruce the Beirdie isn't the only one cringing behind six million dead to defend war crimes and atrocities.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 01 Jun 15 - 03:15 AM

Guest of all people?

Guest is the name of the contributor who, to date, seems to have supported terrorism, questioned whether getting a stiffy for young girls is wrong, questioned whether black people are capable of strategic thinking and reckons Muslims are all rapists.

Nobody is interested in your actual name, after all, most decent people would cross the street to avoid weirdos, but if you can't have courage if a consistent moniker, you have nothing to add, and from your partisan bullshit, even less to add anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 15 - 09:57 PM

Got anything other than childish insults

Got to hand it to you for chutzpah.

You, of all people.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 31 May 15 - 08:10 PM

Got anything other than childish insults, guest? Like facts, perhaps?

Still waiting for the excerpts from the same Board of Inquiry report on Israeli activities.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 15 - 07:13 PM

highly likely - might have - could have - likely

Translation: no evidence.

I'm sure the terrorist group Hamas was very cooperative with the UN investigators.

Use your head,fool.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 15 - 07:09 PM

The text is from the the UN board of inquiry.

Nice try at the attempt to smear though.

Despicable.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 31 May 15 - 06:56 PM

highly likely - might have - could have - likely

Translation: no evidence.

Now, how about some report extracts on Israel's doings dduring the same period.

NOTE:

"UN Watch" is a Geneva-based organization closely associated with rightist sectors in the United States and Israel that claims to monitor compliance of the United Nations with its charter. According to its website, UN Watch "serves as the central forum for discussing international economic and social issues, and for formulating policy recommendations addressed to Member States and the United Nations system."[1]

Despite efforts to paint itself as an independent watchdog group, UN Watch has repeatedly been accused of having a staunchly "pro-Israel" bias and on outlook on Middle East peace that is closely in line with that of Israel's right-wing Likud Party. For many years, the group was funded by the American Jewish Committee (AJC)—publisher of the neoconservative flagship journal Commentary, whose editors have included Norman Podhoretz and Irving Kristol—which has made use of its offices in Geneva, as well as those of other affiliated groups, including the Transatlantic Institute in Brussels.[2]
- See more at: http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/UN_Watch#sthash.RFbQHPQi.dpuf

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 15 - 06:30 PM

Extracts from the summary by the Secretary-General of the report of the United Nations Headquarters Board of Inquiry into certain incidents that occurred in the Gaza Strip between 8 July 2014 and 26 August 2014:


    Hamas and/or Islamic Jihad stored rockets in UNRWA schools. The board found, in the case of the UNRWA Jabalia Elementary "C" and Ayyobiya Boys School, referring to the discovery of weapons there on 22 July 2014, that "it was highly likely that a Palestinian armed group might have used the premises to hide weapons."

    Hamas and/or Islamic Jihad stored rockets in schools that were in active use by children. During the war, former PLO lawyer Diana Buttu famously said on Al Jazeera that "the rockets that were found in the schools in UNRWA were schools that are not being used by anybody—school is out, I'll have you know." However, in the UNRWA Gaza Beach Elementary Co-educational "B" School, on 16 July 2014, the UN Board of Inquiry notes that the school gate was unlocked during the period leading up to the incident "in order to allow children access to the schoolyard." School was out, but UNRWA was inviting the children back in to play.

    Hamas and/or Islamic Jihad fired rockets from UNRWA schools. In the Jabalia school listed above, the board found that "it was highly likely that an unidentified Palestinian armed group could have used the school premises to launch attacks on or around 14 July." Similarly, concerning weaponry stored at the UNRWA Nuseirat Preparatory Co- educational "B" School, the UN inquiry found that "the premises could have been used for an unknown period of time by members of a Palestinian armed group" — and that "it was likely that such a group may have fired the mortar from within the premises of the school."


Full Text: UN Board of Inquiry on Gaza

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 31 May 15 - 06:14 PM

What has that to do with anything Keith? Hamas have some evil fuckers fighting alongside them, just like Israel.

Does the action of one terrorist organisation make the state terrorism of Israel ok then? Your assertion that condemning one set of twats makes you a supporter of another set says more about you and your agenda than it does the point you are trying to make to the debate.

Amnesty eh? I think their reporting of Israelis bombing schools and hospitals forgot to use the term "legitimate targets" unlike your own comments at the time, as I recall.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 31 May 15 - 04:10 PM

Amnesty on Hamas, reported in Guardian,

"As well as the unlawful killings, others abducted by Hamas were subjected to torture, including severe beatings with truncheons, gun butts, hoses and wire, or held in stress positions. Some were interrogated and tortured or otherwise ill-treated in a disused outpatients' clinic within the grounds of Gaza City's main al-Shifa hospital. At least three people arrested during the conflict and accused of collaboration died in custody."
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/may/27/hamas-executed-palestinians-under-cover-gaza-conflict-amnesty

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 31 May 15 - 02:34 PM

It seems , if yo're Gay in Israel, you're O.K. (sort of) but being the wrong colour or religion - different matter altogether.
They may have been welcomed into the 21st century as far as same sex partnerships are concerned, but, race - still runnin neck and neck with 1960s Mississippi.
ISRAELI RACISM
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 31 May 15 - 02:14 PM

The guest hadn't used the word irony, which is interesting.

I know quite a few Israeli people and was in Tel Aviv only last year visiting old friends who set up an agency for my business in those parts.

Don't confuse my detestation for the military objectives of a right wing criminal government with any social views of individuals.

Oh, by the way. We went to a BBQ held by his son and partner. They hope to marry one day.

Fucking troll.

Hey! If people love to confuse religion with state sponsored terrorism and say normal people are being anti Semitic, crack a load of how the bastards treated the Ethiopian Jews who sought sanctuary in Israel. It'll make your beard curl.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 31 May 15 - 01:27 PM

Didn't say Israel haven't made advances - just that it wa a hard stuggle to get there and they still have a way to go.
None of which makes an iota of difference to the fact that Israel is an extremist terrorist state.
One again, the Israeli Government has been forced to abandon plans to introduce a test period od segregated public transport
Sounds like post South Africa to me
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 15 - 01:17 PM

Lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender (LGBT) rights in Israel have generally been seen as one of the most advanced in the Middle East and Asia.[1] Same-sex sexual activity was legalized in 1988, although the former law against buggery had not been enforced since a court decision of 1963.[2] Israel became the first in Asia to recognize unregistered cohabitation between same-sex couples, making it the only country in Asia to recognize any same-sex union thus far. Although same-sex marriages are not performed in the country, Israel recognizes same-sex marriages performed elsewhere, making it the first and only country in Asia to do so. Discrimination on the grounds of sexual orientation was prohibited in 1992. Same-sex couples are allowed to jointly adopt after a court decision in 2008, while previously allowing stepchild adoptions and limited co-guardianship rights for non-biological parents. Gays and lesbians are also allowed to serve openly in the military.


Recent polls have indicated that a majority of Israelis support same-sex marriage, despite some social conservatism.[3] Tel Aviv has frequently been referred to by publishers as one of the most gay friendly cities in the world,[4] famous for its annual Pride Parade and gay beach,[5] earning it the nickname "the gay capital of the Middle East" by Out magazine.[6] According to LGBT travelers, it was ranked as the best gay city in 2011,[7] despite reports of some LGBT violence during the 2000s,[8] which were criticized by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and President Shimon Peres. A monument dedicated to the gay victims of the Holocaust was erected in Tel Aviv in 2014.[9]


Wikipedia

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 31 May 15 - 12:39 PM

"Oh and your link has absolutely nothing to do with Israel's LGBT policies,"
No it hasn't, but as you keep accusing critics of Israel of Antisemitism, I thought it might interest you.
Israel's fight for equal rights for gays has been a long and difficult one - Zionist opposition featuring largely, Gay-bashing, even a stabbing on a Gay Pride march.
Your smugness in comparing what happens in impoverished Arab countries, to the situation in a wealthy, powerful and supposed civilised State like Israel is irrelevant, and in no way excuses terrorism by the Israeli regime.
Jim Carroll

"Azar's prominence in popular culture within a society where homophobic attitudes remain deeply embedded in certain sectors is but one example of the triumphs and tensions that come with being gay in Israel today. Many of the basic rights for LGBT people have already been won, but formal legal equality, especially on the issue of marriage, remains elusive. Tel Aviv is today one of the most gay-friendly cities in the world, but in Jerusalem—just one hour down the road—it is almost impossible to be gay and live openly.
Being gay in Israel, then, is to be witness to a series of contradictions, paradoxes which show that Israel is in many ways a multicultural society within which LGBT people—not only celebrities—have been able to find a place for themselves."

"LGBT Rights
Although in recent years there has been a growing recognition of gay and lesbian rights in the public and legal arenas in Israel, the LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgendered) community still faces various forms of discrimination by government authorities and in the private sector. LGBT men and women, and particularly transgendered persons, also experience discrimination in employment and health services, and are often the target of verbal and physical violence.
ACRI has achieved many significant victories in the struggle for LGBT rights, in particular concerning the rights of same-sex couples, including with regards to marriage registration for marriages conducted outside of Israel, spousal and medical benefits for same-sex partners, protecting inheritance rights, recognition of same-sex partners by the Israeli Military, recognition of adoption by same-sex couples, prohibiting discrimination based on sexual orientation, and ensuring equal access to medical treatment, housing and mortgage assistance, pensions, and life insurance."

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 15 - 11:24 AM

Oh and your link has absolutely nothing to do with Israel's LGBT policies, you're just trolling for anything that supports your contempt for Jews.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 15 - 11:18 AM

MUCH BETTER THAN THIS THOUGH

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 31 May 15 - 11:04 AM

BIT BETTER THAN THIS I SUPPOSE - JUST AS AMAZING THOUGH!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 31 May 15 - 10:26 AM

I'm still savouring the delicious irony of Musket indulging his obsession with Israel in a thread about tolerance and acceptance of same sex unions. Take a look at Israel's policies toward LGBT rights and compare it with her neighbours'....you will be amazed.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 31 May 15 - 07:30 AM

"Following but not mentioning."
Their refugee crisis has only been reported here over the last couple of weeks, and there ar
Like the Gay Cake thread yesterday,e other refugee boat crises ongoing.
Their plight was referred to and briefly discussed in the Christian Persecution thread that I started, but had to be closed because of all the nastiness.

Like the Gay Cake and the All Changed threads yesterday.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Joe Offer
Date: 31 May 15 - 06:59 AM

Yeah, and this is the 100th anniversary of the genocide of Armenians by the Turks. The term genocide was coined to describe what happened there in Turkey in 1915. Several Armenian women in one village were crucified naked to mock their religious beliefs. Well over a million Armenians lost their lives.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 31 May 15 - 03:36 AM

Following but not mentioning..

Hey #! Bruce baby. The problem is, keeping the thread about Canada is a wee bit limiting to say the least. I know a bit about a few ski resorts and have a bit of a soft spot for Vancouver, but I'm not sure many on here could fill a whole thread about any of colonies, let alone one that tries speaking to you in French now and then.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 May 15 - 02:30 PM

Yes, I have been following their story too.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 30 May 15 - 01:29 PM

Jim, good point--the Belgian atrocities in the Congo were forgotten for a long time, but now have been recognized as the first genocide/democide of the 20th Century. However, we all seem to have forgotten that conflicts and atrocities have been going on there since 1996 that have resulted it what may be as many as 5.4 million deaths.http://worldwithoutgenocide.org/genocides-and-conflicts/congo


Keith, I see your question about Christians as the expression of a real and justified concern about the welfare of minority populations in areas of political upheaval. No question that they are at risk.

I would add that minority Muslim populations have the same vulnerability, as we can see from the current boat exodus from Myanmar, which   involves large numbers of Muslim Rohingya who are fleeing persecution by the Buddhist majority.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 30 May 15 - 12:37 PM

There are some really ugly comments here, some people have so sense of their own stupidity nor do they have any sense of how nasty they seem in the yes of others. How many times do some dogs have to run in circles before they realize that the tail is attached to them.
   It wasn't a joke gone wrong..it was pure nastiness and I, for one, am sick to death of it.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 30 May 15 - 12:11 PM

No. It never was.

See: he can't read. Full stop.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,#
Date: 30 May 15 - 12:09 PM

If you're not going to restrict posts on this thread to cultural genocide in Canada then kindly go away. You people have become good exemplars of why some mammals eat their young.

I know it's your thread, Ed T, so if I've overstepped protocol please excuse me.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 May 15 - 12:04 PM

More nasty, personal attack.
I hope it can just be deleted and not the whole thread.

Why not try to follow it with a reasoned post on the issue of the thread Musket?

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Musket
Date: 30 May 15 - 11:48 AM

If superstition makes you anything like Keith in your outlook, perhaps it should wither and die out. He seems the sort able to tie his own boot laces, so without superstitious nonsense clouding his vision, he may even begin enjoying life.

In the meantime, if it is Christians being persecuted he wants action. If it is Christians persecuting, he calls you a liar for mentioning it.

Sick fuck.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 May 15 - 11:39 AM

it was a poor taste joke

Yes it was.

and identified as such by the joker.

No. It never was.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,#
Date: 30 May 15 - 11:39 AM

Current estimates are that 6000 people were systematically murdered or otherwise disposed of by residential schools. The last two closed in the mid 1990s. That estimate was arrived at by the Truth and Reconciliation Commission of Canada headed by Justice Murray Sinclair. The final report will be released in July. Six volumes. Justice Sinclair seems to think there are more deaths unaccounted for. I fully expect our present government in Ottawa will whitewash it.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 30 May 15 - 11:24 AM

"Many here will remember it."
I remember it as being a joke, if that's what you mean, but when in a corner, grab anything that comes to hand, as tey say
Leave it Keith (unless you intend to close this thread) -it was a poor taste joke and identified as such by the joker.
The real problem with many of these threads is people who actually mean what they say.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 30 May 15 - 11:18 AM

G'way kid, ya bother me!

W.C. Fields

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 May 15 - 10:53 AM

Greg, do you deny saying they deserved death and persecution, later claiming it to be a joke?
Many here will remember it.
I could easily find it if you need reminding.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,HiLo
Date: 30 May 15 - 10:26 AM

What absolute nastiness...

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 30 May 15 - 10:09 AM

Not so, Keith- YOU deserve to be persecuted. Killed? I'm not sure.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 May 15 - 09:45 AM

I referenced persecution of Yazidis and Shia Muslim before mentioning Christians.
It is you who have a bugaboo Greg, against Christians.
You even joked that they deserve to be persecuted and killed.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Greg F.
Date: 30 May 15 - 09:32 AM

Here we go again with Keith's bugaboo of "Christian Persecution".

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 30 May 15 - 08:29 AM

So, not actual genocide.

The expunging of Christian cultures in many parts of the Middle East should count then.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 30 May 15 - 08:23 AM

The subject is "cultural genocide".

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 30 May 15 - 08:18 AM

One of the first acts of colonisation was to send in the church representatives to teach 'the savages' the error of their ways.
This lead to the collapse of native cultures, the break-up of communities and the dependency of people to survive on the crumbs that dropped from the white-man's table
The Belgians were responsible for the deaths of up to 10 million Congolese, in the drive for rubber - failure too meet quotas resulted in the tapper's hands being amputated.
Sounds like genocide to me.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST
Date: 30 May 15 - 06:43 AM

The system of Empire was in most cases based on taking control of land and stealing the 'surplus' generated by it's previous occupants, in some cases (e.g. British India) with the aid of local elites.

Actual genocide - killing off the previous occupants - mainly happened due to economic migration.

The cultural changes seem to be mainly due to the activities of organised religions, especially the catholic church.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 30 May 15 - 04:03 AM

The system of Empire was built on cultural genocide and some of today's poorest countries are the products of those monoliths.
The planet is still being plundered and entire peoples are being absorbed and their cultures destroyed in the pursuit for wealth, oil and timber are obvious examples.
The process used to be known as 'civilising'.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 30 May 15 - 03:20 AM

mg-Stalin's campaign against the Ukraine is counted in the total for USSR-

Keith- About 400,000 of the Yazidi are in the the Kurdistan area of Northern Iraq. Perhaps another 50,000 are under the care of Syrian Kurds, and a smaller number are in Turkey. As to the women, that have been sold into slavery, I have heard that Iraqi Kurds are very quietly making efforts to buy them back. There is, of course, no hope for the dead.

EdT-"What is the best future course?" Well, thank you for asking;-)

As terrible and enormous as these events are, most people barely know about them. The estimates for genocides/democides in the 20th Century run as high as 270 Million, but with a few exceptions, they are rarely spoken about. And for the most part, that is after the fact.

Before we can deal with these things, we have to a least acknowledge them. And that is as far as I've gotten on this...

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 29 May 15 - 05:50 PM

Genocide of the Yazidi.
Their religion predating Christianity and gone in a few months, their girls and women taken into slavery.
A daily atrocity against Shia and Christian.
Who cares?
Who will do anything?

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 29 May 15 - 05:10 PM

Did we forget Ukraine? Although was it them? or Russia?

Holdolamor??

Anyway, at noon on Sunday, this Sunday, they are ringing bells across Canada and hopefully around the world, for the children who were abused in residential schools across Canada. Please ring a bell.

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: Ed T
Date: 29 May 15 - 03:40 PM

So, Stim, what's the best future course-especially for the countries who "claim" to be leaders in human rights? What is your suggestion for that?

Is it best to "continue the course" , just because such activities continue today in third world countries and under questionable leadership? Or, are there lessons to be learned from the past and a higher road to be selected?

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,Stim
Date: 29 May 15 - 03:15 PM

EdT-The better question might be, how many countries haven't? Every empire (including the ones that preferred to call themselves democracies or people's republics) has felt the need to convert, displace, or just plain exterminate people who had the bad luck to have gotten there first.(we like to use terms like "indigenous" or "aboriginal", but the truth is that humans are migratory by nature)

The last hundred or so years have been particularly bad--in the 20th Century, democide, which has been roughly defined as "murder by your own government"(and a term created because "genocide" was too restrictive) surpassed war as the leading cause of unnatural death. And the numbers aren't even close--there is a new name for murderous gov'ts-mortocracies, and they are classified by the numbers they have killed-

Megamurders are those gov'ts that have killed a million or more, and include Japan, Cambodia, Ottoman Turkey, Vietnam, Poland, Pakistan, North Korea, Mexico, and Tsarist Russia

Deka-Megamurderers are gov'ts that have killed ten million or more, and include the big ones that we all know--People's Republic of China, USSR, Nazi Germany(a bit of a surprise that they only rank third), and a dark horse, the Kuomintang Republic of China(at least for those of us who forgot that Chiang-Kai-Shek committed the single most horrific act in human history when, on July 9th, 1938, he blew up the dike at Huayauankou on the south bank of the Yellow River, flooding 21,000 square miles, killing more than a million of his own people, and leaving 12 million homeless)

Cento-kilo murderers(100,000 or more, and who are an anticlimax, compared to the above) Include Attaturk's Turkey, the UK, Portugal, Rwanda and Indonesia.

In addition to these deaths, one of the better kept secrets concerning "The Good War" is that between 500,000 and 2 million ethnic Germans died between 1944-1950 as the result of displacement, evacuation and expulsion, much of which was related to the redefinition of borders in the Pottsdam Agreement.

Though the US, in this time period, at least, didn't murder enough of it's own to make the list (like it did in the 19th century), it certainly was a party to some of the above--and don't mention the wars...

Subject: RE: BS: Cultural genocide
From: GUEST,just a-passin' thru
Date: 29 May 15 - 10:55 AM

Yeah, once the glam rock stars stopped wearing "Free Tibet" shirts, the plugged-in/disconnected generation went back to its oblivious bliss.

Now your gentrified noo-yawk neighborhoods are spawning hipsters with ironically crappy instruments playing ironically corny music, so, once again, the inauthentic is sexier than being engaged with reality.