BS: Damian Green

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 01:47 PM

Your accusations of lying against the two policemen are totally unsubstantiated

I have made no such accusation. I just point out that such unsubstantiated claims from people with history would be challenged in court. You would not get a conviction on just that.

"Groper Green..."

Green is not accused of groping. That was Clive Lewis. The Labour Party enquiry presumably chose not believe the woman's uncorroborated claim.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 01:38 PM

"Groper Green..."
Isn't there a folk son with that name?
D'you thin there should be punishment for pulling your pud at the taxpayer's expense?
Waddya think Keith ?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 01:25 PM

So a comparison was made earlier between Labour MP Clive Lewis and Tory Damien Green...

Lewis looks like a very capable and interesting chap,
but if he has a tendency to disrespect women, or at least attract complaints,
then the party needs to keep a long term close eye on his attitudes and behaviour...

Whilst Lewis may be an ex shadow minister;
he is hardly in the same league as the 2nd most powerful politician in British Parliament, Groper Green...

A position which requires much closer public scrutiny,
and a character of utmost integrity, honesty, and trustworthiness..

Green does seem lacking in all those essential areas...

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 12:56 PM

"The fact remains Jim that looking at porn is not illegal"
No it isn't Rag, though whether it should be is debateble
This isn't about the use of porn illegally, it's about a lying minister denying its use and smearing two people have claimed to have seen it
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 12:29 PM

The fact remains Jim that looking at porn is not illegal (for the most part)

What Davis should be sacked for is doing so (if the allegations prove to be true) at work and on a computer provided by his employers, that is us, the people.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 12:15 PM

" it has been widely reported that the ex-cops would be in breach of the rules for revealing information, and may be prosecuted for it."
Not because the information was wrong, just that they shouldn't have made it public, which was exactly my point
THe roke the rules by exposing what a leading member of the establishment was up to.
They were whistleblowers - whistlblowers always run the risk of persecution when they tell things that are uncomfortable to the powers that be
Your accusations of lying against the two policemen are totally unsubstantiated - you are the only one to have described on of them as "untrustworthy"   
Your an establishment arse-kisser Keith
What's your point here?
If you can accuse two policemen without proof, why can't we assume that a minister from a culture of porn-users has a stack of the stuff piled up on his computer = especially as he has also been accused separately by a fellow Tory of being a sexual predator?
Sounds like a dirty old man to me
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 11:40 AM

Jim, it has been widely reported that the ex-cops would be in breach of the rules for revealing information, and may be prosecuted for it.

That could be why their evidence is uncorroborated, but it remains an unsubstantiated claim of perfectly legal behaviour that Green denies.
It has been investigated and, according to Peston, like Clive Lewis he will keep his job.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: bobad
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 09:17 AM

Only a moron considers information and argument "bulltying" Bobad

Lol......it's hard for some people not to put their foot right into it. Sweet irony, don't you just love it.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 09:11 AM

"They would not come forward to report nothing to report, but if there WAS porn, ........"
Yesterday Sir Thomas Winsor, the chief inspector of constabulary, was critical of former officers who had breached what he believed should be lifelong pledges of confidentiality. He said: “The special powers which citizens confer on police officers are inseparable from the obligations of special trust placed in officers to enable them to do their duty. That trust requires every officer to respect and keep confidential information which they obtain in the course of their duties and which is irrelevant to their inquiries and discloses no criminal conduct. The obligation of confidentiality, and the duty not to break trust, is an enduring one. It does not end when a police officer retires.”
"Raise your hand if you recognize anybody in the piece."
Only a moron considers information and argument "bulltying" Bobad
Raise your hand if you recognize that descriptiuon
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: bobad
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 08:56 AM

This is a nice little read, How to Deal with a Progressive Bully. Raise your hand if you recognize anybody in the piece.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 08:52 AM

Jim,
You lied - there was never a sign of the feud until Green invented it

No, you lie.
Here is the link I gave you earlier.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/01/damian-green-decade-long-feud-met-officer-bob-quick

How come no other of the 20 policemen involved in the raid have come forward to claim that there was no porn ?

Or, that there was?

There must have been more police witnesses as Green was arrested at the time for a supposed security breach - don't you think they would have examined his computer at the time?

Yes! You make my case for me.

if there was no porn on it, they would have come forward before now

They would not come forward to report nothing to report, but if there WAS porn, ........

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 08:30 AM

"I said a defence in court would deem it unreliable because of the 9 year feud, and because it was not reported at the time."
You lied - there was never a sign of the feud until Green invented it and one of those policemen was in no way involved anyway
Do you honestly think you can defend a high ranking politician by accusing responsible policemen of things they have never been found guilty of, otr even involved in?
How come no other of the 20 policemen involved in the raid have come forward to claim that there was no porn ?
There must have been more police witnesses as Green was arrested at the time for a supposed security breach - don't you think they would have examined his computer at the time?
All that the police have ever said is that it was not the job of the police to comment on the contents of the computer - if there was no porn on it, they would have come forward before now
Coffe time lapse Dave - done the damage, now I'm off
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: bobad
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 08:23 AM

Is this a new defintion of troll? Someone that dares to disagree with the mudrateers?

Not new, it has always been thus with them. If you know anything about those who are confined by an ideological straitjacket it's that they cannot abide opposition and deal with it by putting labels and childish names on those who dare to disagree with them - it makes them feel superior.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 06:23 AM

Jim,
Two policemen were accused of being unreliable (by you and the accused) on no evidence whatever

I said a defence in court would deem it unreliable because of the 9 year feud, and because it was not reported at the time.

That is every reason to belive his guilt possible

Of course it is possible, but it is unjust and unfair to just assume it either of Green or Lewis.

Lewis' accuser was a Party supporter too.
Green's accuser claimed that he "hit on her." That can just mean flirting, but if he did harass her that is shameful. The Labour woman was deemed a liar by the Labour enquiry.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 05:34 AM

Yeah Dave - had my fillip f fun this morning
Back to the real world
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 05:22 AM

...and that one :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Iains
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 05:20 AM

Is this a new defintion of troll? Someone that dares to disagree with the mudrateers?

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 05:08 AM

Jim, ignore the troll.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 04:51 AM

By the way
Damien Green is a serial 'accused" in an organization where the use of porn and the harassment of women is commonplace
That is every reason to belive his guilt possible
Is his fellow Tory who accused him of harassment a liar along with the policemen you have accused of being - is the truth just confined to those at the very top of the heap?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 04:48 AM

Keith
Two policemen were accused of being unreliable (by you and the accused) on no evidence whatever
You have no right to accuse others of of being unjust when you behave like that
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 12 Dec 17 - 04:09 AM

Labour MP Clive Lewis was accused of groping by another labour supporter at Conference.
She made a complaint and the Party began an investigation.

From his political opponents here there came no presumption of his guilt.
No-one called him "purvey" and no-one made up false facts about the case.
There seems to be a difference in morality between the two political groups, Hard Left and Centrist.

The Labour investigation has cleared him, which presumably means they accuse the lady of lying.

I predict that no-one here will challenge the finding.

Peston revealed on TV last night that the enquiry into Green will allow him to remain in post.
I doubt his opponents here will accept that for a moment.
A different morality, devoid of concepts of fairness and justice.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 04:57 PM

The Daily Mail wine bloke (I got a free copy In Waitrose, honest!) stated without fear or favour last week that the Coop £4.99 Nero d'Avola is the best value red wine available in Britain today. But did Bude Coop have it? Why, of course bloody not! As I'm oop north next week I'll have to see if I can pinpoint a decent-size Coop and pray that northerners don't read the Mail. Do they actually sell any copies north of Watford Gap?

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 04:41 PM

Wanted to find a quick route to Surrey, Dave, but my bloody satnav couldn't find the road to damn Ascot...

You'll get your reward, Dave, once you persuade the management of Bude Morrisons to keep that big hole on the shelf marked "sorry, temporarily unavailable" well stocked with the Nero d'Avola. I challenged the wine aisle bloke the other day, saying that I bet he had crates of the stuff in the back room ready for when the price went back up to six quid. He looked guilty. Grr...

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 03:23 PM

What.. Ake and Tezzer exiled for ever...!!!???..

that's news to me...
We could do with a mudcat bulletin board to keep up to date with births deaths and banishments...

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 03:13 PM

It was all down to me, Steve. Send me the reward when you get a minute :-) Jim and BWM are right about the troll thing you know though. I have had a road to Domestos moment and seen the light!

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 01:14 PM

Nah, to quote Denis Healey on what it was like to debate with Geoffrey Howe, it's like being savaged by a dead sheep. He also called Maggie Thatcher "virago intacta." Must remember that one!

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 12:57 PM

"Soon there will be "NOBODY HERE to challenge your views"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 12:48 PM

And another infestation of trolls appear on the horizon to defend the indefensible
Feed them and they'll only hang around for more Steve
I think you'll find Iain's infantile abuse about as high as it gets
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: bobad
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 12:45 PM

Makes you uncomfortable does it Shaw?

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 12:30 PM

Cor, don't they hover!

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 12:29 PM

And before you butt in, Dave, well done Morrisons for having the Nero d'Avola down to a fiver...and giving me not one but two five quid vouchers at once...and giving me 10p a litre off petrol twice... I'll raise a glass to Sir Ken tonight if I'm allowed to undo a bottle... The turkeys had better be good...

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: bobad
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 12:28 PM

Soon there will be no-one here to challenge your views.

I'm sure the thought of that has them breathing hard just imagining how they can finally enjoy their ideological circle jerks without having to account for their lies and dissembling, why even the mods can join in without the worry of having to delete anyone's posts.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Iains
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 12:27 PM

"You've still got boobs and Iains to keep you warm, you lucky lad!"

Still being a fool Shaw.

Very shortly you will only have your packrats to play with.To quote your fellow rat (ad nauseam)

Different morality
Different language
Different planet

and in your case, no morals at all.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 12:19 PM

You've still got boobs and Iains to keep you warm, you lucky lad!

I tend to think that people remove themselves by being very very silly...

Go to the joke threads, Keith, and give us the benefit of your massive sense of humour. Keep it clean now... Failing that, how's about a recipe or three? I'm doing Jamie Oliver's pork fillet and mash tonight. What vin rouge would you recommend to go with it?

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 11:18 AM

Not much longer now...

Probably not.
Ake has been removed.
Teribus has been removed.

Soon there will be no-one here to challenge your views.
No diversity of opinion and no platform for anyone who disagrees with you people.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: bobad
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 10:31 AM

But you can't let go, can you............lolol.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 10:24 AM

We're not laughing, Keith. Believe me, we're not laughing. No-one laughs at the deliberate self-immolation of a pathetic deludee. Not much longer now...

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 09:31 AM

Laugh away, but the fact remains that none of you can find any fault in anything I have said about Green, while I have pointed out the absence of evidence for your claims about him including blatant lies from Steve and Jim.

Unable to answer what I say, the whole crowd of you now runs and hides.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 08:25 AM

The Humpty Dumpty theory of language

Ring any bells?

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 05:09 AM

"you can not identify a single hole in it."
"I WON"
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 04:50 AM

Mine too, and you can not identify a single hole in it.
(Or can you? Will you state what I have got wrong?)

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 04:46 AM

And there my case rests, M'Lud....

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 04:38 AM

Jim,
Pervy Damien

Have you found some actual evidence against him Jim, or are you believing your own lies. (MI5 aware of the porn, the porn reported at the time. Just lies Jim.)

Dave,
What I said about Dave was actually correct.
No it fucking wasn't

If you are anti-Green it was correct, and you can not deny that fact.
If you think you hid that in your posts you are deluded.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 04:36 AM

"Freeze them out."
Ah - but what will we do with all those shiny MEDALS and TROPHIES
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 04:08 AM

"Looks like the troll managed to divert this subject away from the awkward facts and turn it into a personal slanging match thus allowing Pervy Damien to ride off unscathed into the sunset"

There really is only one way to deal with his ilk, and that is to ignore them completely? You will never change them or their opinions by getting into arguments with them. They don't come here to discuss, all they want is to cause disagreement, division and rancour. They get a massive hard-on from seeing the result of their efforts to achieve those things. When you destroy the arguments they put forward, they wriggle, they ignore your points, they twist your words, and they lie.

In short, they are worthless pieces of shit, undeserving of anyone's attention here.

Freeze them out.

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 04:05 AM

BBC news seems have have gone a bit quiet on Green....???

This is where the tories are experts at this kind of negative muck raking and smear campaigning...

If a Labour minister had been accused of having a sly wank and groping an assistant at work,
the tory press would be pressuring the Beeb to keep this slur story alive for months...

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 03:50 AM

BWM - No problems or hard feelings with anyone here...

life under tories is too deadly serious to take anything in hobby forums too serious...


emoticon test ?? [cheeky winky sticky out tongue]

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 03:44 AM

Looks like the troll managed to divert this subject away from the awkward facts and turn it into a personal slanging match thus allowing Pervy Damien to ride off unscathed into the sunset
PITY
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 11 Dec 17 - 03:23 AM

Yeah, we still talk that ole-fashioned talk out here in the Backwoods, Steve! :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Damian Green
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Dec 17 - 04:53 PM

"I've no wish to get at loggerheads with you."

God no, John. That would be a turtle disaster!

"He's pulling your pissers"

Blimey, John, haven't heard that since I worked with the horny-handed sons of toil on Radcliffe Parks in 1972! A related pejorative of the time, used against those big girl's blouse blokes who fell a little short of being "men's men," was that they probably thought that their dicks were for pissing out of...