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Origins: Rain & Snow / Cold Rain and Snow

DigiTrad:
COLD RAIN & SNOW
ON MONDAY MORNING
RAIN AND SNOW
THE HOLLY TWIG (A Week's Work Well Done)


Related thread:
Penguin: On Monday Morning (4)


GUEST,BIG Malc - Super folkie 24 Nov 00 - 01:57 AM
Rick Fielding 24 Nov 00 - 11:30 AM
Pinetop Slim 24 Nov 00 - 02:00 PM
Noreen 25 Nov 00 - 12:34 PM
DebC 25 Nov 00 - 04:07 PM
GUEST,Roll&Go-C 24 Feb 01 - 05:00 PM
Joe Offer 24 Feb 01 - 09:07 PM
Mark Clark 16 Jul 03 - 09:30 PM
Mark Clark 16 Jul 03 - 09:43 PM
michaelr 16 Jul 03 - 11:05 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 23 Nov 04 - 08:27 PM
Ferrara 23 Nov 04 - 08:38 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 23 Nov 04 - 09:18 PM
Malcolm Douglas 24 Nov 04 - 12:08 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 24 Nov 04 - 12:20 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 24 Nov 04 - 12:32 PM
Malcolm Douglas 24 Nov 04 - 01:57 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 24 Nov 04 - 03:33 PM
GUEST 24 Nov 04 - 04:25 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 24 Nov 04 - 10:31 PM
Jim Dixon 26 Nov 04 - 09:16 AM
Charley Noble 11 Jan 08 - 08:34 AM
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Subject: Rain & Snow
From: GUEST,BIG Malc - Super folkie
Date: 24 Nov 00 - 01:57 AM

Oh I found me a wife and i loved her with all my life but I lost her in the cold wind and snow,,, CHORUS wind & snow wind & snow I lost her in that old wind wind ans snow


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 24 Nov 00 - 11:30 AM

Intersting version. Seems to have been REALLY messed about with.

Obray Ramsey's recording on Prestige, reads:

"Oh I married me a wife, she gave me trouble all my life. Drove me out in the cold rain and snow!"

Later on he makes a dire threat.

"It's all I can do, it's all I can say. and I ain't gonna be treated this-a-way."

Rick


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Pinetop Slim
Date: 24 Nov 00 - 02:00 PM

In another version,it's implied that he carried out the threat: Well she came into the room, where she met her fatal doom


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Noreen
Date: 25 Nov 00 - 12:34 PM

But is anyone going to post the lyrics?


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Subject: Lyr Add: COLD RAIN AND SNOW ^^
From: DebC
Date: 25 Nov 00 - 04:07 PM

I recorded "Cold Rain & Snow" in 1997.Anyone who would like an mp3 of this, send me a private message.

COLD RAIN & SNOW

I married me a wife, she gave me trouble all my life
Put me out in the cold rain and snow
rain and snow
Out in the cold rain and snow

Well, I've done all I can do to try to get along with you
No longer can I stay
can I stay
No longer can I stay

See her walking down the stairs, combing back her long yellow hair
My love's got cheeks like a rose
like a rose
My love's got cheeks like a rose

She went into her room,where she met her faithful doom
Goin' where those chilly winds don't blow
winds don't blow
Goin' where those chilly winds don't blow
^^
Line Breaks
added.
-Joe Offer, who coincidentally was listening to Deb's Long Grey Line-


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Subject: Lyr Add: RAIN AND SNOW ^^
From: GUEST,Roll&Go-C
Date: 24 Feb 01 - 05:00 PM

Well, let's add a version of this song that is closer to what Obray Ramsey used to sing:

RAIN AND SNOW
(Traditional – Learned from the singing of Obray Ramsey in 1963)

Oh, I married me a wife,
Gave me trouble all my life,
Ran me out in the cold rain and snow.

Refrain:

Rain and snow, rain and snow, rain and snow, oh, Lord,
Ran me out in the cold rain and snow.

Well, she came down the stairs,
Combing back her long yellow hair,
And her cheeks just as red as a rose.

As a rose, as a rose, as a rose, oh, Lord,
With her cheeks just as red as a rose.

Oh, I did all I could do,
For to get along with you,
And I ain't goin' be treated this-a-way.

This-a-way, this-a-way, this-a-way, oh, Lord,
And I ain't goin' be treated this away.

She came into the room,
There she met her fatal doom,
And I ain't goin' back there no more.*

No more, no more, no more, oh, Lord,
And I ain't goin' back there no more.

Repeat first verse.

* Obray sang this line identical to the previous verse.

I always think a song has more power when it leaves some of the plot to the imagination.

I understand the Grateful Dead had an interesting version of this.^^


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Joe Offer
Date: 24 Feb 01 - 09:07 PM

Roll&Go-C, would you mind sending me an e-mail and telling me who you are? You don't have to register as a Mudcatter (but it's free, with no strings attached). You've posted a couple of good songs that I harvested ^^ for inclusion in the Digital Tradition database. We usually included the initials of the person who posted the lyrics, so they get some credit for their submission, and so we can contact them if we have questions about the song later.
Thanks.

-Joe Offer (click to e-mail)-


Here's the Traditional Ballad Index entry for this song:

Rain and Snow

DESCRIPTION: Singer's wife gives him trouble, runs him "out in the cold rain and snow." She comes downstairs combing her hair, saying she'll no longer be mistreated; he kills her (, lays out the body, then trembles with cold fear)
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: 1916 (Sharp-EnglishFolkSongsFromSouthernAppalachians)
KEYWORDS: marriage violence crime homicide corpse death wife
FOUND IN: US(Ap)
REFERENCES (1 citation):
Sharp-EnglishFolkSongsFromSouthernAppalachians 116, "Rain and Snow" (1 fragment, 1 tune)
Roud #3634
RECORDINGS:
Dillard Chandler, "Rain and Snow" (on Chandler01, DarkHoll)
CROSS-REFERENCES:
cf. "Nine Hundred Miles" (tune)
cf. "Reuben's Train" (tune)
ALTERNATE TITLES:
Cold Rain and Snow
NOTES [43 words]: The liner notes to Chandler's recording lump this with "Sporting Bachelors." I demur; that's a humorous cautionary tale, while this is a tragedy. - PJS
It seems to me I've heard this done with a somewhat humorous twist, but certainly it's a distinct song. - RBW
Last updated in version 3.5
File: RcRaAnSn

Go to the Ballad Search form
Go to the Ballad Index Song List

Go to the Ballad Index Instructions
Go to the Ballad Index Bibliography or Discography

The Ballad Index Copyright 2022 by Robert B. Waltz and David G. Engle.


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Subject: Lyr/Tune Add: RAIN, SLEET AND SNOW
From: Mark Clark
Date: 16 Jul 03 - 09:30 PM

Here is ABC code for a variant of “Cold Rain and Snow” I learned from friends about forty years ago. I'm sorry, I don't know the history of this version. I was reminded of it when I saw Peter T.'s thread “Music Theory Mavens: D down to C, etc.?.”

      - Mark


X:1
T:Rain, Sleet and Snow
C:unknown
M:4/4
L:1/4
Q:1/4=150
K:D
"D"DG|G>GFG|"D"A w:Well I mar-ried me a wife she gave me trou-ble all_ my life, She
"C"EGGA/G/|(A w:put me out in the rain_ sleet and snow,_ Rain and
"C"(G3A)|=c2(A/G/)E|"D"D4-|D2z>D|
w:snow_ rain sleet_ and snow,_ She
"C"EGGA/G/|(A w:put me out in the rain_ sleet and snow._
W:
W:
W:
W:Well I married me a wife she gave me trouble all my life,
W:She put me out in the rain sleet and snow,
W:Rain and snow, rain sleet and snow,
W:She put me out in the rain sleet and snow.
W:
W:I've been half way 'round the world looking for that little girl,
W:The one who put me out in the rain sleet and snow,
W:Rain and snow, rain sleet and snow,
W:She put me out in the rain sleet and snow.
W:
W:I've done all I can do to try to get along with you,
W:And I ain't a gonna be treated this a way,
W:This a way hey hey this a way,
W:No I ain't a gonna be treated this a way.
W:
W:I'm goin' out and rest my back on some lonesome railroad track,
W:And listen for that lonesome salty dog,
W:Rain and snow, rain sleet and snow,
W:She put me out in the rain sleet and snow.
W: W: (repeat first verse)


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Subject: ABC Add: Rain Sleet and Snow
From: Mark Clark
Date: 16 Jul 03 - 09:43 PM

Oops, I forgot to encode the “<” and “>” symbols that ABC uses. Sorry, we'll try that again.

      - Mark


X:1
T:Rain, Sleet and Snow
C:unknown
M:4/4
L:1/4
Q:1/4=150
K:D
"D"D<F[|"C"G<GG>G|G>GFG|"D"A<A(A/G/)E|D3z/D/|
w:Well I mar-ried me a wife she gave me trou-ble all_ my life, She
"C"EGGA/G/|(A<G)GG|"D"D4-|DzDF|
w:put me out in the rain_ sleet and snow,_ Rain and
"C"(G3A)|=c2(A/G/)E|"D"D4-|D2z>D|
w:snow_ rain sleet_ and snow,_ She
"C"EGGA/G/|(A<G)G<G|"D"D4-|Dz3|]
w:put me out in the rain_ sleet and snow._
W:
W:
W:
W:Well I married me a wife she gave me trouble all my life,
W:She put me out in the rain sleet and snow,
W:Rain and snow, rain sleet and snow,
W:She put me out in the rain sleet and snow.
W:
W:I've been half way 'round the world looking for that little girl,
W:The one who put me out in the rain sleet and snow,
W:Rain and snow, rain sleet and snow,
W:She put me out in the rain sleet and snow.
W:
W:I've done all I can do to try to get along with you,
W:And I ain't a gonna be treated this a way,
W:This a way hey hey this a way,
W:No I ain't a gonna be treated this a way.
W:
W:I'm goin' out and rest my back on some lonesome railroad track,
W:And listen for that lonesome salty dog,
W:Rain and snow, rain sleet and snow,
W:She put me out in the rain sleet and snow.
W:
W: (repeat first verse)


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: michaelr
Date: 16 Jul 03 - 11:05 PM

Grateful Dead lyrics are at this site.

Cheers,
Michael


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Subject: Lyr Add: BACHELOR'S SONG
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Nov 04 - 08:27 PM

Several names, several versions, several tunes. Usually ends with the murder or death of the wife or she is whupped and left.
Benjamin Britten set it to music in his "Eight Folk Song Arrangements;" No. 1, Lord, I Married Me a Wife (from Sharp's verse).

One version that is different from the rest was sung by Mrs. Ollie Gilbert, Arkansas, 1959.

Lyr. Add: BACHELOR'S SONG
(The Holly Twig, Willow Green,
I Married Me a Wife, Rain and Snow)

When I was a bachelor, bold and young,
Courted a widow with a clattering tongue.
The kisses that I gave her was a hundred and ten;
I told her I'd marry her, but I didn't say when.

Monday morning I married me a wife,
Hoping to live a happy life.
She ripped, she tore, she cursed, she swore--
The like I never heard before.

Tuesday morning I went to the woods,
A-hoping that she'd prove good.
I cut me down a little willow green;
I believe it's as keen a one as ever I seen.

Wednesday morning I whipped her well.
I whipped her more than tongues can tell.
I told her that she's better not be;
The Devil would take her and take her for me.

Friday morning, the break of day,
There she lay, as cold as clay.
Roof and proof and a little patch of cane;
The Devil taken her off in a little shower of rain.

Bachelor's Song


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Ferrara
Date: 23 Nov 04 - 08:38 PM

This is the title song of Elizabeth LaPrelles new CD. Her lyrics are close to the version posted by DebC, slightly different and without the last verse. Elizabeth learned them from a recording of Betsy Rutherford of Galax, VA. They're on her web site.

When Elizabeth sang it for Sheila Kaye Adams, Sheila Kaye gave her still another set of lyrics that was more or less a murder story.

Rita


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Subject: Lyr Add: WHEN I WAS A ROUSTABOUT (?) (from Talley)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Nov 04 - 09:18 PM

From "Negro Folk Rhymes," Thomas W. Talley

W'en I was a "Roustabout," wild an' young,
I co'ted my gal wid a mighty slick tongue.
I tol' her some oncommon lies dere an' den.
I tol' dat we'd marry, but I didn' say w'en.

So on a Mond'y mornin' I tuck her for my wife
Of co'se I wus 'spectin' an agreeable life.
But on a Chuesd'y mornin' she chuned up her pipe,
An' she 'bused me more 'an I'd been 'bused all my life.

On a Wednesd'y evenin', as I come 'long home,
I says to myse'f dat she wus all my own;
An' on a Thursd'y night I went out to de woods,
An' I cut me two big fine tough leatherwoods.

So on a Frid'y mornin' w'en she roll me 'er eyes,
I retched fer my leatherwoods to give 'er a s'prise,
Dem long keen leatherwoods wuked mighty well,
An' 'er tongue, it jes' rattle lak a clapper in a bell.

On a Sadd'y mornin' she sleep sorter late,
An' de las' time I see'd her, she 'us gwine out de gate.
I was feedin' at de stable, lookin'out through a crack,
An' she lef' my log cabin 'fore I could go back.

On a Sund'y mornin', as I laid on my bed,
I didn' have no Nigger wife to bother my head.
Now whisky an' brandy jug's my biges' bes' friend,
An' my long week's wuk is about at its end.

No. 217, with music (# 78 in "Leading Themes" notebook).
"Thomas W. Talley's Negro Folk Rhymes," ed. C. K. Wolfe, 1941 (1991), The University of Tennessee Press, pp. 125-126.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 24 Nov 04 - 12:08 PM

At first sight, a connection between Rain and Snow and The Holly Twig seems tenuous, but you never know. Perhaps there are "missing links" that would make it more clear. The latter song, according to Sabine Baring-Gould, appeared on English broadsides in the later part of the 18th century. You can see a C19 edition at Bodleian Library Broadside Ballads:

Weeks work completed.

Of course, there have been plenty of other songs on the same basic subject.


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Subject: Lyr Add: I MARRIED ME A WIFE (from Vance Randolph)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 24 Nov 04 - 12:20 PM

Guest ClareZ has inquired about English roots to this song.

Sharp reported three Virginia texts in "English Folk Songs From the Southern Appalachians," but was the song ever found in the British Isles or Ireland? See note on the Benjamin Britten arrangement of Sharp's tune in an earlier post.

Vance Randolph noted that his father sang a version, "a bit on the ribald side," in South Carolina about 1865 (Not found in Randolph-Legman, "Roll Me In Your Arms." Under a different title?).

Lyr. Add: I MARRIED ME A WIFE

Monday mornin' I married me a wife,
Toodelum a ride yo riddle lum a ray,
Monday mornin' I married me a wife, for her,
Monday mornin' I married me a wife,
Thinkin' I'd lead a diff'rent life,
Sing fa diddle i day.

Tuesday mornin' I took her home,
Toodelum a ride yo riddle lum a ray,
Tuesday mornin' I took her home, for her,
Tuesday mornin' I took her home,
Thinkin' I'd have a wife of my own,
Sing fa diddle i day.

Wednesday mornin' she cussed and swore,
Toodelum a ride yo riddle lum a ray,
Wednesday mornin' she cussed and swore, for her,
Wednesday mornin' she cussed and swore,
Said she knowed she'd kill me sure,
Sing fa diddle i day.

Thursday mornin' I whupped her well,
Toodelum a ride yo riddle lum a ray,
Thursday mornin' I whupped her well, for her,
Thursday mornin' I whupped her well,
The truth I ain't ashamed to tell,
Sing fa diddle i day.

Friday mornin' I took her back,
Toodleum a ride yo riddle lum a ray,
Friday mornin' I took her back, for her,
Friday mornin' I took her back,
An' Saturday it was lonesome Jack,
Sing fa diddle i day.

My big bottle was my best friend,
Toodleum a ride yo riddle lum a ray,
My big bottle was my best friend, for her,
My big bottle was my best friend,
An' my week's work was at an end,
Sing fa diddle i day.

Sung by Mrs. Marie Wilbur, Missouri, 1923. Randolph, "Ozark Folksongs," vol. 3, No. 367, with music.

There is a book in which the author uses this song as the theme for an exploration of attitudes towards wives in the late 17th and 18th centuries. I don't know if she found or included any early versions of the song.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 24 Nov 04 - 12:32 PM

Posted before I saw Malcolm's comments. The Bodleian broadside establishes the song in the British Isles no later than mid-19th c.

These songs depart from Obray Ramsey's "Rain and Snow." How much he was influenced by them remains a question.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 24 Nov 04 - 01:57 PM

According to Frank Kidson, the famous Joey Grimaldi used to perform a version of Week's Work (1820-ish). The poet John Clare knew it, and later on several of the early 20th century collectors found forms of it in Southern England (see, for example, On Monday Morning) and of course it's been found often enough in America too; at the moment, though, I'm inclined to think that we're talking about two separate songs here (I buy still less Dick's suggestion in the DT that there might be a connection between Week's Work and The Wife Wrapped in Wether's Skin) but little is certain in this life.

It occurs to me that there is another broadside song on the same general topic that might bear looking at:  Woeful Marriage.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 24 Nov 04 - 03:33 PM

Not mentioned by Malcolm, but he discussed these songs under "On Monday Morning" in Notes on Songs, p. 104, of his revision of the Penguin Book of English Folksongs- "Classic English Folk Songs," 2003, The English Folk Dance & Song Society.

There seem to be a large number of these songs about unsatisfactory wives stemming from the 18th century, including Charles Dibdin's "The Tidy One."
(It must have been a trying period for husbands).


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Rain & Snow
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Nov 04 - 04:25 PM

My appologies to you Q.

I thought you meant the inquiry was bogus, not that the thread had been replaced. I has searched for this in the archives under variou names, but did not find this threa, so thanks very much.

ClaireZ


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE SCOLDING WIFE (from Sam Henry)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 24 Nov 04 - 10:31 PM

A different song, but with some of the same ideas, is included in Sam Henry's "Songs of the People," p. 503, with music.

Lyr. Add: THE SCOLDING WIFE

Come all ye sprightly sporting youths, wherever you may be,
You'll never know your misery till married that you'll be,
For if marriage be a paradise, I'm sure it's I can tell,
It is my firm opinion that I never will do well.

Refrain
For she's aye, aye scowlin', an' she's aye scowlin' me,
She's for everlasting scowlin' and she canna let me be.

When neighbour Tam and I go out, our whistles for to wet,
My wife she falls a-bawling and I think I hear her yet,
There's nothing I do like so well as a bottle and a friend
But that I dar'na mention for fear I might offend.

There's nothing I do like so well as a dish o' dainty meat,
But she cooks it up sae claty that yin bite I canna eat,
And if I ever chance tae thraw my lip or gi'e my heed a nod,
She says, 'You're gettin' saucy, you may go and chew your cud.'

When that I come home at night from market or from fair,
She'll meet me at the durestep an' drag me by the hair,
She sets me in the corner and she'll buff me a' aroon,
And if ever I chance to miss a clout she'll hunt me roun' the toon.

Now to conclude and finish, I've got nae mair tae add,
But I'll lave it to the company if my case it isna bad.
I trust that something it will come that parted we will be,
And I hope the divil will get her yet before she finishes me.

claty = dirty, muddy, messily. thraw = twist. durestep = doorstep.
John Henry Macaulay, Co. Antrim. Other titles; "The Married Man," "The Bad (Wicked) Wife."


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Subject: Lyr Add: WEEKS WORK COMPLETED (from Bodleian)
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 26 Nov 04 - 09:16 AM

From Bodleian Library Broadside Ballads, Harding B 25(2022):

WEEKS WORK COMPLETED
C. Croshaw, Printer, Coppergate, York [between 1814 and 1850]

On Monday morning, I married a wife,
Thinking to lead a sober life,
But instead of being married, I had better been dead
Than ever enjoy'd my marriage bed.
                                      Laddeio.

On Tuesday morning, to my surprise,
A little before the sun did rise,
She opened her clappers, began to roar.
I thought in my heart she would never give o'er.
                                      Laddeio.

On Wednesday morning, I went into the wood,
Thinking to do my wife a little good.
I cut a twig of the holly so green,
As fine a twig as ever was seen.
                                      Laddeio.

On Thursday morning, I put it to dry.
On Friday morning, I did it try.
I beat her back and beat her ribs
Until I broke my holly twig.
                                      Laddeio.

On Saturday morning, she began to roar.
I thought she'd never give o'er.
The devil came in the height of the game
And stole her away both blind and lame.
                                      Laddeio.

On Sunday noon I dined without
A scolding wife or a brawling bout;
So now I will enjoy my bottle and my friend,
And have I not made a rare week's end?
                                      Laddeio.


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Subject: RE: Req/Add: Rain & Snow / Cold Rain and Snow
From: Charley Noble
Date: 11 Jan 08 - 08:34 AM

Evidently this was one of the first threads that attracted my attention when I was lurking as guest "Roll & Go-C." If only I knew then what I know now of the dangers of indulging in a single clarifying post!

I did come up with a substitute line for the one that Obray Ramsey repeats in my original post:

She came into the room,
There she met her fatal doom,
And I ain't going back there no more!
No more, no more, no more, oh Lord!
I ain't going back there no more.

I've always assumed that it was the man who voices the 3rd verse:

Oh, I did all I could do,
For to get along with you,
And I ain't goin' be treated this-a-way.

But I suppose it could have been the woman.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble


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