BS: Coping with women (A male thread)

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 04:56 PM

Wildlone - I quite agree, but it's a done thing now. However, am being persuaded about the bike anyway....

Matt - 22 may be a long time single, but it's an even longer time married/attached and unhappy.... A partner is not the be all and end all of a relationship. And neither is getting married the magical door to perfect harmony and bliss. The world does not stop when the ring hits the finger, you have to keep working at it. Just sitting back and expecting your self reliant, opinion sharing, beer swilling, belching farting girlfriend to turn into Betty Crocker overnight simply because you stood before a judge or a priest and said yes, ain't gonna work no matter how hard one or other of you tries. It has to be both of you, and you both have to accept that the other changes and has different requirements at different times.

Don't lose the spontenaiety, if you used to surprise her at work with a card or flowers, or jump her as soon as you got to her house (within reason.....) then do it occasionally, it will help keep interest going, and she will still feel you care about her as a sexy person, rather than a washing/cooking/cleaning accessory.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,Dancing Mom
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 04:49 PM

I would NEVER have married my husband if we hadn't lived together first. You don't really know someone until you live with them. As stated above so wisely, it's essential to maintain your own interests and "space" as well as honoring hers.But you do need to find a common interest that you can share together. Hell, I wasn't sure about ANYTHING when we moved in together! But it's been a learning and growing process that I needed very much, and we will celebrate our 18th wedding anniversary next month. Blessings, Sharon

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Matt_R
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 04:48 PM

Oh don't worry, I have found her!! And incidentally her name is Kim, and is 29! I was just on the phone with her...

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Kim C
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 04:21 PM

Matt, do not despair. Mister was 32 when I met him and never married. I was 21 and didn't want to date someone who had already been married but I didn't want to date anyone my own age because the guys I knew were pigs. I know, however, there are LOTS of exceptions to my "don't trust a man under the age of 30" axiom. One day the lady will appear who understands that and can appreciate you. :-)

We did live together for about 4 months - this was AFTER I had the engagement ring on my finger. I was not going to live with him otherwise.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: wildlone
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 03:30 PM

Get a motor cycle its much more fun.
dave

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Matt_R
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 03:12 PM

Time alone??? 22 years is enough time alone for me, thank you very much!

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: annamill
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 01:46 PM

Buy "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus". I know your initial reaction may be "Poooo". So was mine. It is a very helpful book and it would help almost any situation where the two sexes must relate to each other.

It helped me to understand the need for men needing time alone. It was something that used to hurt me. Woman seek each other out when they hurt and cannot understand a man's need to be alone at this time.

I think this book may be especially helpful in your situation if you feel this is something you really need to do.

Let her read it first ant then you read it too. It doesn't just explain why men act as they do.

And good luck!

Love, annamill

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,El Gringo Viejo
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 12:59 PM

As the old song goes,"TELL HER LIES AND FEED HER CANDY" GRINGO

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: kendall
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 12:23 PM

Peg, my ex and I agreed on that space thing. She was so logical, if she wanted to go to the opra, and I didn't, she would invite a friend to go with her. If I wanted to go to a Bluegrass Festival and she didn't, I would go alone. If I went to the opra when I didn't really want to go, it would be spoiled for both of us. That makes no sense. Too many people are stuck in that "Siamese twin syndrome" they think of marraige as two halves coming together to form a whole, when it should be two wholes coming together to enjoy each others contribution."In order to form a more perfect union.." If you have to ask permission to go across the street, RUN dont walk, and for chrissake dont move in with her!

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 12:01 PM

Ah yes..."What's The Use of Wings?". I love that song...

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,jude
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 11:55 AM

Roots and wings. Relationships need both freedom and closeness. Love doesn't smother it sets free. Everyone needs space, both physical and emotional. This does not mean you don't wannt to be close or love someone it means being with them is a choice, and all the more valued because it is a choice. There's a line in a song - if you give your love its freedome , it will stay a while, if it leaves you it was never yours to own. Don't kill love by preconcieved ideas of what it "should" be, and getting frustrated when things dont match expectations
I'd also echo what was said earlier in the thread you have to like/ accept yourself before you are ready to share your life with anyone else. And now having done the profound bit for the day - off to the lingerie shop to indulge in some glorious new undies.
Jude

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 11:53 AM

I wasn't Ella! And I was SURE I put an exclamation mark at the end of that post!1 BTW I got a B on the Rennie poster...so far my highest mark in the class!

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Ella who is Sooze
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 11:49 AM

Matt...

Guest is just trying to bait people with that last one... Don't rise to the bait. It's all a load of twaddle!

Not a typical female.

puh huh HAH

Michael bloomin Bolton..... NEVER>>>>>> I SAY NEVER!!!!!

lol...

do say YES to mad week long chocolate cravings tho!

Don't take the bait Matt!

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 11:45 AM

Well, by GUEST's set standards, I am glad I am not a "typical male".

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 11:42 AM

...say goodbye to: the bathroom, lounging around in your underwear all day, foul language, The Three Stooges, beer for breakfast, football on Sunday, breaking wind or burping at the table, spitting, picking your nose while watching TV, TV, "your" music ("your" music will be usurped by "her" music), anything at all having to do with erotica or sex, cigars, poker, strip clubs, dirty jokes, sports cars, and all vestiges of behavior even remotely associated with the typical male....

...say hello to: gardening, leisurewear, Good Housekeeping, Michael Bolton, poodles, the color pink, bowling, tofu, aerobics, Volvos, PMS, "headaches," church, Emily Post, self-help books and instructional videos on home improvement, humor like "Amusing Anecdotes" in Reader's Digest, dieting, Ladies Auxiliary meetings in your living room, movies like "The English Patient," Oprah, "white" sales and shopping.

Deny her the satisfaction and castrate yourself now, while you are still able to choose and make your own decisions.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From:
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 11:13 AM

if this is a woman you have to cope with my suggestion would be not only to not move in with her (which is something I can't fathom under almost any circumstances...if you love each other enough get married, if you don't, keep looking) but to set her free and both of you look for someone you can't live without. If there is no such person that you find, well, that happens. But you probably will. mg

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: UB Ed
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 11:09 AM

Guest 1, would you please be so kind as to take whatever animosity you hold for Spaw to another thread (maybe even start one)? I see nothing Spaw said in this discussion to inspire such a post from you. I respectfully ask you respond to whatever he said in the original forum used.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,Karen
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 11:05 AM

"It's not what they call you that you should worry about, it's what you answer to."

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,#1
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 10:55 AM

Hey Spaw, isn't it time for you to call someone

Obnoxious Asshole

again? Youv'e got both me and gargoyle to choose from this time. That should make your day.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Kim C
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 10:32 AM

Don't move in together unless you are planning on getting married.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: UB Ed
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 10:15 AM

Ed, if you're worried about no longer being able to turn her off. DON'T MOVE IN!

Previous comments above reference communication. Absent a relationship where you both want to communicate, you got nothing. You only turn people off you don't care about.

I'm assuming you would only want to "turn her off" when you disagree. How then, do you propose to resolve the dispute? IMO, both partners need to commit to communicating lovingly and effectively if any relationship is to work. Regardless of your opinion regarding the merits of her position, it doesn't matter. She is taking that position because she feels its important and its up to you to work to understand why she feels that way (Same goes for her and your feelings). After you've done that, you can then make a determination as to whether its worth it to continue to hang out.

Another perspective; people learn how to have relationships and this is part of your learning experience. Hopefully you both love each other and our willing to work hard learning together not to screw it up. If not, then its right to move on and you both learned something to take into the next relationship.

Now about those knickers....Got any thong action going?

Ed

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Fibula Mattock
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 10:07 AM

Go on holiday with her first. If you can survive that, it's a nice indicator. Don't you discuss this kind of stuff with her? That's gotta be a necessity - English Jon is right.
Good luck!
Fib - (female), who conveniently fell in love with her flatmate (male).

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: English Jon
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 09:28 AM

I think a lot of it is, you don't get to know someone untill you live with them. If it's been going well so far and you want to take the plunge, do it, and good luck.

Otherwise, you can either break it off entireley, or keep going as you are. Basically, there's no point asking us. Do what feels right for you. Maybe try talking to your lady about it? how does she feel?

I guess everyone sometimes needs a retreat, male or female. Give each other enough space within your relationship, you should be fine. Being in each others pockets all the time might give you problems though.

Good luck

English Jon

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: MMario
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 09:17 AM

Ed - if I knew the answer I'd probably be in a relationship of my own. I do know I have lost several chances because I was too scared of committment to even TRY to commit - and I kick myself continously because of that.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: LR Mole
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 08:48 AM

"Keep warm," the wizard said
"Ride close together.
"Remember laughter. You'll need it,
"Even in the blessed land of ever after."
--James Thurber

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: KingBrilliant
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 06:32 AM

Everyones' relationships are different. If it suits you both then thats fine - you don't need to conform to everyone elses idea of perfect love.
If you have reservations then just make sure you each have an escape route if it turns out not to work. If you need personal space then make sure that's OK by both of you and it shouldn't be a problem. Make sure the space is available.
Don't expect perfection - expect to have to work at things a bit & expect some give & take. Don't give up to easily - but be realistic if its not working.
If you wait until you're completely sure of things then you might miss out - take a bit of a gamble.
Best of luck to you both.
Kris

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Grab
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 06:04 AM

You'll be lonelier in a relationship you don't want than in no relationship at all. Got a couple of female friends (one moved in with her boyfriend, one got married) who wanted to live with someone bcos they didn't like being on their own. Neither relationship worked, and both women are still sorting their lives out - one with the millstone of a mortgage she can't afford to pay and negative equity so she can't sell.

If you move in together bcos you love the person, and moving in is preparatory to a long-term relationship and marriage, that'll work. If you're just moving in together as something to stop you both being on your own, it'll never work.

"Had enough" is an interesting choice of words. If you both argue/fight now, moving in together is NOT a good choice! One thing you'll both need to get, though, is that it isn't necessary to do everything together - if you like going out to live music and she doesn't, there's nothing wrong in you going on your own.

Graham.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: bbc
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 05:40 AM

There are worse things than being alone. Unless you can become content being alone, you're not ready to be a good partner. And unless you are looking to see what you can *give* in a relationship, rather than what you can *get*, neither of you is likely to be happy, long-term. If you just want sex, pick somebody up at a party!

bbc

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Ella who is Sooze
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 04:43 AM

I agree with LIz.... and the pants thing! We got to look at your pants... which isn't always nice..

And yes... don't put male only... gets us curious!

:)

E

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Peg
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 01:08 AM

I understand the "needing alone time" thing; honestly. I am not married and never have been but I do know if ever it is to happen I will need some space of my own and I will also probably occasionally wanna go off travelling by myself, too...

I am just saying I support that bit...because I think many couples tend to think that unless they are CLOSE all the time and do everything together there must be something wrong...

I think after a time this sort of thing can be deadly to a relationship; for me, anyway. Everyone is different and some couples do just fine being in each others' space all the time...

Guess that is why I am alone. I am also not afrid to be lonely. And I think it is fear of loneliness that causes MANY people to stay in relationships in which they are not happy...

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: CarolC
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 11:09 PM

Do you need ANY MORE insight into whiles of the female mind...than the above thread clearly labeled MALE?????

--GUEST_gargoyle

Hey GUEST_gargoyle... The thread is titled "A male thread". Not "A thread for males". So being the lovers of men that many of us females are, we naturally flocked to it. Can you blame us?

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,#1
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 10:50 PM

To make them behave use a coping saw.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Noreen
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 10:40 PM

Caiti, I read Homeless' post as him realising that he'd got it wrong- not that he was blaming anyone else... just sadder and wiser.

Re Ed's original question- I don't know the answer (even if I had been invited, as a mere female, to contribute..) :0)

Noreen

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Amos
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 10:06 PM

Hey dude --

Bear in mind you are proposing a long term (relatively) engagement in mutual creation. So I suggest you learn as quick as you can what different attitudes, styles, methods and semantics of communication mean when they are received by this lucky lady, and make damn sure you take that into account when you feel like induling your bottomless selfhood. 'Cuz iffen you don't, you'll be limper than a wet biscuit and sadder than a dry goldfish promptly. This isn't aboiut a "me" and a "her". If you can't shift over far enough to start designing and energizing an "us", I suggest you retreat now while your head is still attached. Suffer the loneliness until you learn the remedies there unto which work.

Regards,

A

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Matt_R
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 09:51 PM

Ouch.

Subject: ed: give us a break, don't do it.
From: cait
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 09:47 PM

ah geez.

i can't...

homeless, you sound like a few blues tunes i've heard...lessee:

'my woman up and left me and i can't figure why (leaves out part about drinking, drugging and being an immature asshole) now i'm so broken hearted i may just lay down and die...'

marriage did all that to you? or did you do all that to a marriage?

piffle. you guys should marry each other, there's misery keeping company.

huh.

*caiti*

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,_gargoyle
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 09:45 PM

Do you need ANY MORE insight into whiles of the female mind...than the above thread clearly labeled MALE?????

Pandora, Pandora, Pandora

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,_gargoyle
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 09:40 PM

Look, it ain't like you're marrying the chick.

If it works out GRAND....if not... then move on.

Woman are monogomists
Men are poligymists
Its a wonder....we all arn't poligymists.

(Stolen/memorized 35 years ago...source forgotten)

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Helen
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 09:25 PM

Zebedee,

I can relate to your need to know that you will have some personal space. Hubby and I are mid-40's and only got married a couple of years ago. Both of us have been mostly single for the major part of our lives, before that, so we have built up our own ways of living.

I was very concerned that both of us would have trouble adjusting to living in the same house, but we respect each other's needs for time to ourselves, and we communicate pretty well.

Yesterday, by sheer Mudcat coincidence, there was a topic on the radio about a recent men's conference in South Australia. The topic they were discussing on the radio was that, to put it in Ozspeak, "every bloke needs a shed", i.e. men need a place to potter about, do what they want, on their own or with their mates.

The thing that made me laugh knowingly was a listener who phoned in and said that the first thing he did when he moved to a new house was to build a shed/garage. That's the first thing that hubby did when he moved in here. Now he has a 2 storey playhouse which he spends a lot of his spare time in. He also uses it for card nights with his mates. He has to set up his workbench, but he does his computer fixing upstairs for himself and his friends, so it's his haven.

On the topic of garages, as well, there has been an ad on tv here where a man is fixing up engines on the kitchen table and his wife is ringing around garage building companies. The punch line is that *she* ends up sitting in the garage, all nicely set up, watching tv and being as happy as a pig in mud, while hubby's space is still the kitchen table.

So, my advice is: get a shed, or your own space, figure out a workable arrangement between you to respect each other's need for space, and just do it.

All of the reservations still apply though. I've moved in too quickly with people and regretted it totally and very soon, too. Make sure that this lady is truly the one you want to be with. Don't make the decision based on anything other than knowing, without doubt, that she is the one you want to spend your life with.

I was 42 when I found my hubby and we both knew within a very short time that this was *it*. If this isn't it for you don't pretend that it is - that's the worst mistake I ever made in my life, before I met him. And moving in with the wrong person doesn't get better, it just gets worse and worse, and more difficult to get out of withouth both being wounded.

Sorry for the long rant,

Helen

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: SINSULL
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 09:09 PM

Serve you right if they are cotton Lollipops! Then again, that and knee socks are all it takes to get Spaw off and running. Anyway...Zeb - love her enough to talk about your need for space. We women love meaningful conversations.

In my whole life I have never known anything "without reservation". That would take all the fun out of it. Work together on making it work. Grow together or grow apart. Those are my platitudes for today!

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: MarkS
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 08:29 PM

Oh, and if you want to keep this thread going, stop back from time to time and describe her knickers. After all, you did describe it as a mans thread!

Well somebody had to make a chauvanist, sexist wisecrack, no?

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: MarkS
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 08:21 PM

Unless you KNOW that it is right without reservation, it isn't.
If you THINK that it is right, but still think you need your own space, it isn't.
Unless both of you know that it is right, don't do it, because just getting a roommate will be emotionally devistating for both of you.
That being said, use your head and we wish you well!
Mark

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: kendall
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 08:12 PM

Some excellent advice. Especially from Jeri. Also from Little Neophyte and Doug. My advice, communicate. By that I dont mean just waiting for her to inhale so you can tell her off. Listen. Really listen, and turn the goddamn football game off while you are doing it. Make sure you both agree that each needs alone time, and, that that privacy is to be honored. If she runs into the bathroom to cry, dont kick the door down. Wait for her to come out (saying you are sorry for the upset will often do it) then hold her and tell her you love her. Come to think of it, why the hell am I still single?

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: GUEST,Karen
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 08:10 PM

Wow! Talk about mixed messages! In your first post you're worries are "I won't ever be able to turn her off". In your second post you say "I love her very much". Why would you want to "turn off" someone you "love very much"?
I'm not doubting what you say are your feelings for your girlfriend but I do feel YOU are doubting your feelings for your girlfriend. Yes, everyone needs their own space and as Little Neo wrote "If you both love each other, you will be sensitive to each other's need for space and time alone." (BTW: nicely said, Little Neo!). I'm guessing though there's more to it here (as many have already noted). Does she do something that annoys you? Is she clingy? Is she an inane chatterer? Does she expect you to spend all your free time with her?
You need to figure out if you just want time alone or if you want time away from her. That's important!

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Jeri
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 07:58 PM

Sounds to me like you do love her, but you're just a bit scared. People madly in love would think nothing of moving in together, and not forsee any problems because the world is all perfect and warm and misty, and little hearts float around in the air. People who've known each other a bit longer may be more practical - doesn't mean there's any less love.

I'll echo what LTS said - TALK! It would be a good idea to do so before you moved in. Just let her know that you need some time on your own - it's just the way you are. Don't save up your concerns until they turn into frustration and anger.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Mr Red
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 07:57 PM

GBS & Lerner & Lowe said between 'em.
"how to handle a woman" ....... "is to love her"
So simple innit?
er ... NO been there done that. There's definitely a knack to it. Danged if I know what it is.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Little Neophyte
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 07:50 PM

Zebedee, I tend to agree with Catspaw.
You say you 'love her very much' yet you start this thread off with a posting that gives an impression that you have not really discovered what loving another person is all about. If you believe those words you wrote.... 'I expect that I will always feel this way, and unless I make a commitment one day, then I'll have a very lonely life', That to me is a pretty self-absorbed way of going about making a major decision to move in with someone you say you really do love very much.
Everyone needs time alone. If you both love each other, you will be sensitive to each other's need for space and time alone.
To me it sounds like you are going about this decision full of fear. Just be aware of that. To be fearful of a major decision like this, 'one foot in, one foot out', is not the best way to move in with someone who you feel you truly do love. Approaching this decision the way you appear to be approaching it may make you feel safe, but it will also limit the depth of intimacy you will be able to discover within your relationship with your girlfriend & yourself.

Little Neo

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Homeless
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 07:47 PM

Zebedee -
(said very emphatically) regarding your #1 above - don't fall into that trap. I thought the same exact thing, but got married thinking, "Maybe I'll grow into the relationship." After nine years of fights, two jail terms, a 4 year stretch of unemployment, and living in the streets for 5 years, I finally realized that marriage isn't a good thing for someone who's not ready for it.

You need to know you are ready to commit, before you do. Don't do it anyway thinking you may grow into it. There are things worse than being lonely.

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: vindelis
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 07:18 PM

Advice? Dont't get married - it's cheaper to borrow. Seriously though - at the end of the day it all comes down to LOVE and RESPECT. If you have that for one another you will go far. (Oh and as an 'Uncle' of mine once advised his new son-in-law "don't forget those two magic words 'yes dear.'" ( As LTS I'm also from 'Venus').

Subject: RE: BS: Coping with women (A male thread)
From: Zebedee
Date: 24 Apr 01 - 07:18 PM

Spaw,

You're probably right.

However two thoughts spring to mind:

1. I expect that I'll always feel this way, and unless I make a commitment one day, then I'll have a very lonely life.

2. I love her very much. I do however need a house where I can be on my own sometimes. And I think I've found one!

Ed