Mandolin help

Subject: Mandolin help
From: brioc
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 11:47 AM

can any of you put me in the direction of a GOOD mandolin site. One that can give decent easy to follow instructions on combining easy chords with melodies? thanks in advance Brigid

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: PaulM
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 12:02 PM

Does www.mandolincafe.com meet your definition of GOOD?

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: WyoWoman
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 01:02 PM

I'll be checking in on this thread often because I'm considering buying a mandolin this year. I have no idea where to start, or even how chords differ from guitar chords. I thought that website looked excellent, but it might be even a little advanced for the likes o' me. I'm motivated to buy a mandolin because every jam I attend is 'et up with guitars and one can cram only so many guitars into one small living room. I'm a singer and have no real illusions about how much of a picker I'm likely to become, but I do think a mando would be fun to play.

Staying tuned ... ww

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Cappuccino
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 01:33 PM

Stay in touch Wyo, and PM if you like - I'm a relatively new mandolin player, so I may be able to assist with a few 'first steps' things.

Because I've not got that far past them myself!

One thing is worth keeping in mind - it's relatively easy to quickly produce something which sounds impressive enough to suggest you really can play it!!!

- ian B

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Ralphie
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 01:51 PM

Wyo
A bit of a clue
It's tuned the same way as a fiddle
So, all you've got to do is learn to play the fiddle, and you're half way there!
Ralphie
I must get out more......Nurse...the screens!

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Tweed
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 03:02 PM

Bobert sent me an old Russian made mando that he'd found in the trunk of a rental car. I played one song on it and then stripped it naked and am in the process of refinishing now. I've never played one before either but had been getting an urge of late to learn it. It's a neat little instrument and makes a joyful sound. Can't wait to get it back together. Here's a before clicky and a nekkid clicky.
The Russkies had put some kinda woodgrain wallpaper on the back and sides and the tuners were not too good at holding tune, or I'd have left it alone. There's nice white wood down below, I don't know why they wallpapered it.

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Sorcha
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 03:07 PM

Actually, Ralphie, I play the fiddle and when I try to play mando, the damn frets just get in the way, lol!

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Tweed
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 03:27 PM

What notes are fiddle tuning Sorcha? Does it make an open chord? I don't know what I tuned the little Russky to but it was an open tuning of some sort.

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Roughyed
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 03:57 PM

Standard tuning is from the lowest (thickest) string up G,D,A,E. If you play any string at the seventh fret it is the same note as the open string above it so you can tune that way. Another tuning is A,E,A,E, or if you don't like tuning strings higher than they should go, G,D,G,D. It's a beautiful instrument.

Oh and don't run yourself down when you start an instrument. There's no reason at all why you should not become a brilliant player - as long as you practice regularly. Other people only make it look easy because you can't see the effort they have put in over the years.

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Ralphie
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 04:24 PM

Swan...
Well said !
10% inspiration, 90% perspiration..
Ain't no other way.
Oh, and Sorcha, try taking the frets off the Mando, Should be a doddle then!
Ralphie

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Rolfyboy6
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 06:27 PM

I've been poking around with the mandolin. This is the beginners book I like. The CD is really useful. It says bluegrass but it teaches classic folk tunes applicable for any style. Also available in the UK and other countries. Teach Yourself Bluegrass Mandolin

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Sorcha
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 06:31 PM

Yea, sure, Ralphie.........the other thing I can't do is that patented Monroe right hand quaver. I can do it (tremolo) with a fiddle bow in my hand, but not a pick. I can pick a fiddle in mando position, maybe I could bow a mando on my shoulder, ya think?

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: 53
Date: 06 Jan 02 - 10:38 PM

never have tried a mandolin, i'd love to learn to play one, but i guess that i'll just stick to my guitar, that's hard enough for me to play these days, lol. BOB

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From:
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 12:23 AM

By all means, get pickin! I was over 40 when I got my first mando, and it is tons of fun. Mine is a lovely 1910-20 bowl-back 10 string [that's right! triple trebles!]

Dennis

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: brioc
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 02:39 AM

thank you all . I have visited Mandolin caFe a few times. Must look at it with different eyes next time! It has been a pleasure reading the chat on this one.I have been playing the mandolin (italian, roundback) for about 17 years including a break for about 10! Now, I only ever learned myself tunes, now I want to play chords and mix them. Make it a bit more interesting. Must try the new tuning idea, maybe I could play on that. Anyway thank you all Brigid

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Ralphie
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 03:00 AM

Go for it,Brigid....
Cheers Ralphie

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 03:43 AM

Re guitar/mando chords: guitar goes EADG (etc), mando goes GDAE, so play guitar chords "back-to-front". My first attempts at mandolining were about 35 years ago (not long after taking up guitar), but I never sussed that out till somebody told me!
Steve

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: mooman
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 05:12 AM

Dear Brioc,

Again from the Mandolin Cafe site hereis a page of simple and good-sounding "two-finger" chords that you can slip into the melodies where appropriate.

Best regards and good pickin'

mooman

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Tweed
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 06:13 AM

Ahhh..that's perfect for me mooman. I'll be printing that one for when I get mine back together again. Thanks!

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 06:24 AM

Now ...

I'm a bit biased. Well a lot biased, in fact. But the traditional mandolin player, tuning her or his instrument GDAE will not find a better free resource than the tablature archive in the mandolincafe. Click here

(If you're the slightest bit interested in why I stress the fact that I might be biased - and you're familiar with the 'cafe's tab archive - then type "derrymacash" into the search box and all will be revealed.)

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Cappuccino
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 08:40 AM

Good tab site! Didn't find you on the Search, but thanks for the link.

- Ian B

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 10:11 AM

What you mean a search on the archive didn't throw up "The Boys of Derrymacash?"

Oh well, here's a direct link!!

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Áine
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 10:52 AM

I betcha IanB didn't put the 'a' in 'macash' when he searched for ya. Anyway, y'all listen to ol' derrymacash about mandolin advice. I've heard the boy play, and he's a ringtail-tooter on the mando! (He also has the voice of an angel, but that's another thread . . .)

The Mandocafe is an excellent place for beginners on the mandolin (I know, 'cuz I am one!). Great good luck to you, Brigid!

-- Áine

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: brioc
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 01:39 PM

Oh dear derrymacash, I clicked on the direct click bit and what did I find......a whole lot of numbers and lines and stuff of that sort.............what does it mean really??? Brigid

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Cappuccino
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 03:07 PM

Hey, it's pretty good!

What entertained me about the tab is that the repeat sign at the end of lines 2 and 4 reminded me of the signature Mousethief used/uses. Look at it sideways!

- Ian B

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 04:47 PM

Brigid ...

Does this help?

Dennis Ladd's mandolin tablature tutorial

Dennis' tablature is a bit more elaborate than mine ... but the principles are much the same!

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Tweed
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 06:07 PM

I could use some advice on the mando bridge placement. The little Russky is a bit weird in that the bridge had to be set at a really extreme angle to get the tuning right. Is this a normal thing? I've checked out photos of other old world style mandolins with flat tops and they all seem to run nearly at a right angle to the string line. Any ideas or is this one just completely wacked. I was able to get it to stay in tune fairly well with the old tuners and hope the new Gotoh's will hold the strings a bit better, but the bridge thing is pretty extreme.

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: 53
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 09:17 PM

can't you tune a mandolin like a guitar? BOB

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 09:51 PM

Bob, you'll get away with a number of tunings on most stringed instruments. You could try tuning to the top 4 of a guitar but I'm not sure about string tensions with a mandolin set - the E could stay the same but the worst, one bottom G on the mandolin which would have to go up 7 semitones to make the D.

Besides that, std mandolin tuning, GDAE is a great tuning - well worth learning I think (but I am biased playing mostly tenor banjo and mandolin).

Jon

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: 53
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 09:55 PM

thanks for the help jon it is much appreciated. BOB

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: GUEST,GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 11:06 PM

I'm not much for these blue ckicky things, but I'll try...good mando help can be had \topurl{http://www.co-mando.com/,Here}, and \topurl{http://www.co-mando.com/techniques/index.htm,Here} are some helpful hints as well. The ten commandments of the Church of Latter Day Mandolinists are featured \topurl{http://www.co-mando.com/techniques/practice/index.htm,Here}, but they seem to have forgotten the one about "Thou shalt not touch thine five-stringed, animal-hide instrument of the Devil, lest Ye go out of tune on a regular basis"...enjoy.

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: GUEST,GUEST
Date: 07 Jan 02 - 11:11 PM

BLUSH

http://www.co-mando.com/

http://www.co-mando.com/techniques/index.htm

http://www.co-mando.com/techniques/practice/index.htm

well...guess I'll be gettin' back to my copy of "HTML for Dummies"...

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Cappuccino
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 02:47 AM

Thanks Guest, I like that site as well.

- Ian B

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: GUEST,frankie
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 03:37 AM

I have a pretty thick volume called The Mandolin Fakebook that I bought from Elderly Instruments a long time ago that has tabs for about 250 mandolin tunes. It contains standards of bluegrass, Irish and Old Time music for various skill levels. It won't teach you much about about the mandolin but you will learn a lot of tunes. f

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 04:06 AM

Oh, Brigid ... one last bit of help vis-a-vis tablature. I wasn't going to post this one lest it seem like gratuitous self-pluggery, which isn't done in a help thread.

However ... if you have a look at Aidan Crossey's original tunes via Pay The Reckoning you'll find around 100 tunes which are presented in mandolin tablature, conventional notation, abc and playable MIDI formats.

This might at the very least help demonstrate to you how conventional notation relates to mando tab. You could print off both versions and compare ... most of us have had to learn how to read and write mando tab pretty much from scratch. Mine looks a wee bit weird (as IanB alludes) because it's created as .txt file and can therefore be read/edited via any word processor or text editor rather than some high-falooting piece of specialist software.

A general purpose 4/4 tab template is available at the mandolincafe. I have modified this to create jig, slip jig, slide, waltz/mazurka and polka templates.

... Aidan Crossey

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: brioc
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 09:04 AM

Derrymacash, can you draw one of them pictures to the song : Constant Lovers? I got the midi from Joe Offer, and want to try out your system. The song is in G andis 3/4 time. Brigid

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 09:45 AM

It's not a tune I'm familiar with, Brigid. If you have it available in abc format (or MIDI at a pinch) then I'll see if I can help.

PM me and I'll give you an e-mail address.

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 11:49 AM

Brigid ...

Or, failing that, maybe you could confirm whether it's the same "Constant Lovers" that appears on Kate Rusby and Kathryn Roberts' album which I have at home and could work from as easily as from a MIDI.

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Rex
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 01:37 PM

To continue with what Sorcha said, John Clendennen was a fiddler for the Lone Star Playboys in the 40's through 50's and wanted to play mandolin. But he couldn't work out that fingerboard. So He got an old Harmony flattop mando and put a fiddle fingerboard and bridge on it. That way you could pluck it as a mandolin or put it up on your shoulder and bow it as Sorcha mentioned. It plays all right when you pick it. But it sure sounds eerie when you bow it.

Rex

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: WyoWoman
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 11:19 PM

THAT'd be interesting, Rex. Reminds me of when I was in high school band and I used to put my friend's clarinet mouthpiece in my silver flute. ...

ww

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Tweed
Date: 08 Jan 02 - 11:38 PM

YOWZAH!

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Rex
Date: 09 Jan 02 - 05:31 PM

Oooh I have to try that. I have a clarinet which I adore but can do nothing with and a flute that I can do not much more with. This could be fun. Maybe like a crumhorn. Thanks,

Rex

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: brioc
Date: 10 Jan 02 - 02:24 AM

Hi Derrymacash I never heard of either Kate or Kathryn. But I shall see waht I can do. The first lines of the song go like this: As I was a-walking down by the sea shore............. Brigid

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 13 Jan 02 - 03:25 AM

Brigid ...

I can't find my tape ... so working from memory.

Have a listen to this midi I've put together.

If this is the tune, then I'll tab it out in a day or two. The verse bit is 8 bars and the chorus 16 bars?

Anyway, let me know. If it's right, then I'll crack on.

Click here

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 13 Jan 02 - 03:39 AM

Oooops ...

Seems Geocities won't allow you to link to this file!

PM me with an e-mail address and I'll send the midi that way!

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 16 Jan 02 - 10:45 AM

Brigid ...

Offer still stands or ... if you'd prefer ... you could e-mail with the MIDI you've preferred and I could at least check that the tune you and I are discussing is the same one!

A final tip ... of all of the posters to the mandolincafe tab archive, Karen Josephson seems to be the one who mixes melody and chords to a greater degree than anyone else whose inclination is towards Celtic or British Isles folk styles.

You can see an example of her tablature style by following this link (Jig - The Tenpenny Bit tabbed for mandolin by Karen Josephson

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: Aidan Crossey
Date: 13 Mar 02 - 06:08 PM

Check out the latest addition to "Pay The Reckoning", my (pretentiously named, I admit!) Aidan Crossey's Irish Mandolin Tune Book Volume One ...

Aidan Crossey's Irish Mandolin Tune Book Volume One

And when you're there check out the rest of the site Pay The Reckoning

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: GUEST,A New Fan
Date: 14 Mar 02 - 08:20 AM

This is good stuff!

Not sure how it would work if didn't have Word. (I have, so it downloaded perfectly.)

Nice range of tunes ... I'd have liked to have seen a few less original compositions and a few more of the tunes the musicians in our local session play. But that's nit-picking.

Thanks for the unusual tunes (Plains Of Boyle, Downfall Of Paris, Maid At The Spinning Wheel, Jockey To The Fair) which I haven't seen in any mandolin book so far (and I have a fair few, let me tell you!).

Two questions. 1.When are Mel Bay gonna contact you with a publishing deal? 2.Is there a Volume Two in production? A Volume Three?

Go raibh mile, a chara!

Slan go foill.

(PS The rest of the site is brilliant as well. Glad you liked the new Danu album. I bought it at the weekend and I haven't stopped listening to it since. I'm definitely going to check out Ceide!)

Subject: RE: Want Godfather tabs
From: GUEST,Marlene
Date: 22 Mar 03 - 05:34 PM

One of the reasons that I fell in love with the mandolin was hearing the theme to the Godfather (Sicilian Mandolin). I bought a mandolin in July and am receiving lots of help from friends....however they are all bluegrass players. I have searched the web high and low for the tabs to The Godfather. I find them for the guitar but not a one for the mandolin. Does anyone out there have the tabs or know where I can find them? I really appreciate your help.

Subject: RE: Mandolin help
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 23 Mar 03 - 02:13 AM

Tweed - BRIDGE PLACEMENT

Lots of the old (and some new) round-backed mandos use a straight bridge; but virtually all of the newer flatbacks, A and F style, use a very highly compensated bridge or bridge cap.

If you're stringing with "gut" or unwound steel or bronze wire, a straight bridge works pretty well; but if you use wound wire, the "end effect" makes the wire sound shorter than the "physical" length. The windings make the bending near the bridge really "lossy," so a little bit of the end of the wound wire wants to act like it's not part of the performance.

The G (low string) is a fairly skinny wire with a fat winding, so it needs to be physically longer than the next -
the D (second string), which is about the same "core" as the G but with a thinner winding.
The A (third string) has a skinny core, about like the E, with a fairly heavy winding - so it needs to be about the same length as the G, while
The E (fourth string) has no winding at all and needs to be "shortened up" a bit, about the same as the D.

The result is that the bridging point is set back (longer), about the same for the 1st and 3d strings, and about 1/16 inch forward (shorter) for the 2d and 4th strings. The typical bridge cap has a very visible zig-zag along the top to "compensate" the usual strings more or less properly.

If you can find unwound strings, you can adjust a straight bridge to pretty good compensation across the four strings; but if you're using (probably converting to, on an oldie) wound strings, you need to look at a new bridge, or a "cap" for the old one, if you really want good intonation on all the strings.

John