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Miking up a Session?

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cyder_drinker 06 Apr 02 - 02:00 AM
Liz the Squeak 06 Apr 02 - 03:40 AM
RichM 06 Apr 02 - 08:15 AM
Jon Freeman 06 Apr 02 - 08:32 AM
RichM 06 Apr 02 - 08:46 AM
GUEST,Shazam 06 Apr 02 - 12:05 PM
greg stephens 06 Apr 02 - 02:10 PM
Menita 06 Apr 02 - 02:13 PM
cyder_drinker 06 Apr 02 - 07:04 PM
Jon Freeman 06 Apr 02 - 07:15 PM
sophocleese 06 Apr 02 - 10:16 PM
53 06 Apr 02 - 11:03 PM
GUEST,.gargoyle 06 Apr 02 - 11:12 PM
Sir Roger de Beverley 07 Apr 02 - 08:38 AM
RichM 07 Apr 02 - 09:12 AM
treewind 08 Apr 02 - 08:44 AM
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Subject: Miking up a Session?
From: cyder_drinker
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 02:00 AM

We have a Session here in our local Irish club, which the Landlord pays us some towards our Irish music centre. The problem is, in the club the acoustics just suck. A large lot of people, all talking loudly, combined with a lot of soft furnishings and the biggest of all sins for an acoustic music venue, polystyrene ceiling tiles.
We're thinking of using a couple of mikes and amplifying to some speakers, maybe across the room. Does anyone have any experience of this kinda situation they'd be willing to share?


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 03:40 AM

Radio mikes are good, can be acquired fairly cheaply, easily passed around, no leads to get caught up in.... You can get little stands so they sit on the tables, or big stands to make them more obvious. Trouble is you could find yourself doing a 'Car 59' impression in the middle of a slow ballad...

"In 1846, on March, the 14th day" ckshshck "pick up at 38 Acacia Gardens, anyone deal?"

LTS


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: RichM
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 08:15 AM

I have my own performance sound equipment, for the two bands that I am in.
To get decent amplification, you need good mics, good placement of same---and, players HAVE to have some sense of how to use the equipment, how to place themselves in relation to the mics.

You also have to decide who the amplification is for: the audience? or the players? ie, where do you aim the speakers? If it's at the players, you have to deal with the large possibility of feedback...

Rich


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 08:32 AM

I've only played in once in a miked up "session". Personally, I thought the effect was worse than the chatter... but then again, I was against going to that sort of degree of "pub entertainment" to start of with under the "session" banner...

Jon


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: RichM
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 08:46 AM

I tend to agree with Jon...I go to sessions too, and I prefer unamplified.
Rich


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: GUEST,Shazam
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 12:05 PM

I'm gonna be boring here; have you checked with the landlord that it's ok to use equipment ie amps etc., that haven't been PAT Tested. If an accident occurs, his insurance might be invalid. Also I think circuit breakers have to be used as well.


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: greg stephens
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 02:10 PM

at the risk of sounding like a "what is the meaning of folk" argument, I would go along with the anti-mike brigade. At least, if you are going to call it a session; obviously if its a public performance paid for by the landlord its a different kettle of fish all together.


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: Menita
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 02:13 PM

What does PAT tested mean?


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: cyder_drinker
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 07:04 PM

PAT is Portable Appliance Testing. It means someone has to plug an approved testing device into your equipment (amp, electric drill, whatever) and issue a certificate that says it's safe to use.

The session is paid for (sort of - the money they give us pays for the hall we use for our Irish music group on Saturday mornings). The reason for the amps/mikes is the club we have the session in is an acoustic nightmare, and no-one outside the circle can hear us.
The current thinking is, that the tables we use will be reserved for us, and we will suspend a microphone from the ceiling over each table. The mikes will be connected to a mixer, the output of which can be fed into the amp system they use for the big TV set. So the speakers are already there, we just have to figure out a hookup.
However, this means that someone will have to be driving the mixer - to shut off the mikes when a tune has finished so our conversations aren't relayed across the hall!
The session, just to clarify, is not a "circle" where everyone takes turns (like paltalk), there are maybe 15-20 musicians all playing at the same time.
I am gainst the idea myself - when the commitee voted, my input was "find a pub with better acoustics". But that's committees, and the music group needs the money to keep going. We're stuck between a rock and a hard place, I reckon!


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 07:15 PM

FWIW Cyder, my input would have been the same as yours but good luck - let us know how it goes.

Jon


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: sophocleese
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 10:16 PM

cyder drinker, "the tables we use will be reserved for us, and we will suspend a microphone from the ceiling over each table". Can you move the tables and make the circle smaller? That way you can at least hear each other.


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: 53
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 11:03 PM

I think that the vocals definetly needs to be miked, and any of the other acoustic instruments also. Electric guitars have their own amps, and may be the drums also. Everything needs to be in the mix.


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 06 Apr 02 - 11:12 PM

The Field, in San Diego, has a simple mic system for instrumentals. Four omni-directionals suspended from the overhead beam about three meters off the flour. Great for a circle, lean in or lean out for lead parts. Speakers throughout the pub create a natural tone. Simple and fun.

Sincerely,
Gargoyl


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: Sir Roger de Beverley
Date: 07 Apr 02 - 08:38 AM

I had a situation where we had a session in a small room in a pub which was OK for sound but the rest of the pub wanted to hear what was going on. The answer was a PZM (pressure zone microphone)stuck on the wall, which effectively turns the whole wall into a mic, and the speakers outside the room in the pub - most of the musicians didn't even know that they were being amplified!

Roger


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: RichM
Date: 07 Apr 02 - 09:12 AM

Gargoyle and Sir Roger have made some interesting suggestions. I have a good omni mic which I rarely use anymore- I may try it for a session.

I've never used a PZM, but it sounds useful.


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Subject: RE: Miking up a Session?
From: treewind
Date: 08 Apr 02 - 08:44 AM

The omni suspended over the middle of the group sounds like a good idea.

If you've got a PZM and a table in the middle of the musicians, the PZM in the middle of the table could be neat, except it might blow the cones off the speakers every time anyone dropped a jar on the table.

It will only work well if there isn't too much background noise (talking etc) in the session area itself.

Miking up everybody individually is likely to be a mess practically and a disaster musically.

Anahata


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