BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issue

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issue
From: GUEST,Crystal
Date: 17 Feb 05 - 09:35 AM

>Are ANY of our current lot honest in what they tell us?<

errrr no.

Although the Liberal Democrats have such a large student wing that any attempt to take their promise to scrap tuition fees out of their manifesto would be met with a significan drop in party membership!

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issue
From: Col K
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 07:24 PM

HONESTY
HONESTY
HONESTY

That is the most important issue.

Are ANY of our current lot honest in what they tell us?

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issue
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 06:37 PM

Don, your problem is voting for the parties you have voted for.

Robert Marshall-Andrews, current Medway Labour is first class - and unreconstructed Old Labour clause four man (and a QC).

Regrettably the head of his party is Tony B. Liar. Possibly the only less trustworthy person on the alleged left in politics is gorgeous George Galloway - although Mandy, Straw (whatever happened to him, he was solid left at the NUS in the 70s?), and Ubergruppenfuhrer Blunkett come close. Actually I'll include Darling in there. And of course the crew from the Licensing Act, where those of us who opposed it are gradually being proved to have been right.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issue
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 06:04 PM

"mob" comes from "mobile vulgus" meaning "changeable crowd".

I always like the fact that Australians use "mob" as the term for a group of kangaroos (among other things...)

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issue
From: Cllr
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 05:56 PM

oh for soem reason I thought you were english! I did POL and MODHIST (Bsc) At Brunel West London 94-98 I was a councillor in the london borough of hillingdon at the time which was fun. Cllr

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issue
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 05:49 PM

University of Victoria, Canada. Late 80s

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Cllr
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 05:18 PM

bpl when and where did study pol sci? Cllr

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 04:51 PM

The major issue remains helping people to escape poverty. Poverty is so predictive of health, education and lots of other things.

Politics has to be for the long game. We need to get the environment at the centre of all policies but I bet we wont.

Just to make my position clear........

I am, and I remain, a loyal Labour Party worker. I don't expect to agree with everything the party or the government does. But I will say this; if you doubt your councilliors and MPs go and talk to them. You will find they are honest and helpful,regardless of perty, with the probable exception of the BNP. Then go and read the Mail, Express, Sun, Star and Sport and decide who does the most honest job, your elected members or the press.

I was acessing from elswhere before.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 04:06 PM

Slaves and other such riff-raff didn't get a vote in Demos.

My PoliSci prof used to say the flaw with democracy is that it extends the franchise to people who watch reruns of Gilligan's Island. And that the only question for most of us at election time is "Do you want new idiots or is it OK to keep the idiots you've got?"

Sorry for the thread drift, back to the question. Setting aside foreign policy, why do you think the chief domestic issue will be?

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: akenaton
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 03:59 PM

Regardless of Greek roots , democracy today means to many people ,just another way that humanitys' greed and stupidity can be used to enslave them.

Democracy under Blair and Bush has become a sick joke..Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Cllr
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 03:45 PM

I misrememberedm my bad! Polis meaning city I should have as the example I usually used was policeman "man of the city"

Demos = people and Cracy = rule
Plato said that aristocracy (aristo = the best) was the most effective form of govt (as in a benign dictatership) while Democracy was the worst. Also while everyone was supposed to particpate it meant that a city state of 8,000 citizens was supported by a slave culture of approx 40.000 non -citizens mainly consisting of slaves woman and foreignors Cllr

from the bbc website

he ancient Greek word demokratia was ambiguous. It meant literally 'people-power'. But who were the people to whom the power belonged? Was it all the people - all duly qualified citizens? Or only some of the people - the 'masses'? The Greek word demos could mean either. There's a theory that the word demokratia was coined by democracy's enemies, members of the rich and aristocratic elite who did not like being outvoted by the common herd, their social and economic inferiors. If this theory is right, democracy must originally have meant something like 'mob rule' or 'dictatorship of the proletariat'.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 02:31 PM

Don ... I agree with much of what you say, although as a professional advisor to persons politique I would say that comparing the UK Government with Nazi Germany and Joe Stalin's Soviet Union is definitely a shot through the foot. Their infamy is genocide -- a grossly unfair comparison. I'm sure that's not what you meant and I didn't mean to imply you're an idiot. You're evidently not.

The monarch has the constitutional right to dissolve Parliament. It requires the consent of the House of Commons, but failure to reach such consent would represent a vote of no-confidence which would precipitate a general election. Whether a monarch would take such an step is unlikely, but I would hope not impossible.

Watch out for that etymolgy Cllr ;o). Politics derives from the Greek politicus (popular) and is a few steps removed from polis (city) ... and demos just means people, not mob. Unless you're from Teesside where it's pretty much the same thing ... just kidding Teessiders!

ake ... no offence taken. I was quite flattered to be called an intellectual, psuedo or otherwise. And now it's withdrawn - Dang.

Our participation in this discussion is proof that democracy is alive and well and working. I'll keep an eye out for further posts to be sure none of us gets whisked off in the night ... ;o)

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 02:03 PM

Gross disparities in wealth are destructive of society, and undermine and diminish democracy. And it is the engine that is driving us to trash our environment, physical and social, in a way that threatens all our future.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Cllr
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 02:02 PM

Guest 148 I find my self agreeing with you and that by and large most councillors are good honest people. I may aspire to national politics one day and indeed my role as a cabinet member does have a occasional regional and more rarely a national impact -albeit to a much smaller degree. At one point (i can't remember exactly which parliament it was but over 40% of MP's had local government experience. The Tensions between Local and national politcs are well documented. Cllr

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 01:54 PM

Cllr, I do understand the etymology, it's the lifetime experience of the practical operation on which I base my comments. When one has voted for 46 years without ever getting one truly honest and honourable representative, I feel that a certain mistrust of politicians, and politics is probably justified. I should point out BTW that my comments are directed solely at NATIONAL Politicians. On the whole I feel that local government does tolerably well, despite the interference of Westminster in their affairs.

Yes Richard, I agree, as my first post on this thread will confirm. I advocated more government AS OPPOSED to politics, and was blasted by someone who wants less government. (let everybody do as he wishes invariably means a downtrodden underclass, but what the hell, they're a FREE underclass).

Regarding the E-Mail and the boys in blue, suspect you're right, but have no intention of trying it for myself. When DOES your case come up, and can I watch you tie them in knots.....Please!

We're going tro have to wath this, RB, we are agreeing too often. Something must be seriously amiss.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: GUEST
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 01:48 PM

Individuals cannot change government quickly that would some form of not democracy.

Parties take longer but people have to talk and make agreements with each other that is the basis of party politics.

I am, and I remain, a loyal Labour Party worker. I don't expect to agree with everything the party or the government does. But I will say this; if you doubt your councilliors and MPs go and talk to them. You will find they are honest and helpful,regardless of perty, with the probable exception of the BNP. Then go and read the Mail, Express, Sun, Star and Sport and decide who does the most honest job, your elected members or the press.

As for for PR well maybe but I suspect we swap one set of problems for another. The Government of the Ols West Germany changed from Social Democrat to Christian Democrat when a small party changed sides. You might be happy with Greens and Lib Dems holding power but how about the BNP?

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: EagleWing
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 01:44 PM

Less spent on public services
Income tax cuts so we can do what we want with our money.

Since it is probably the poor that are most dependent on public services and the rich who gain most by income tax cuts I can see some small objection.

Frank L.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 01:32 PM

Less government = more effective liberty for the rich to continue to oppress the poor.

Oh, Don, try sending an email with the words Al Quaeda, terrorist, and nuclear bomb in it. You'll find an unmarked blue car with four burly people in blue suits outside your house watching you the next day. I tried it. It's later than you think.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 01:22 PM

The diffrence between politics and goverment, is in theory, the civil service and local govement officers. Professionals in goverment, rather than professionals in getting elected. They should have no party loyalty, and not overly influenced by the govement of the day. See Yes Minister/Prime Minister....
I know this is an impossible ideal, but the Civil service has become vastly more politicised since Blair came to power. This is not a good thing.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Cllr
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 01:06 PM

Politics is neither good nor bad it can be either depending on how it is operated- Poli is from the greek, city. Democracy translated from the greek is Mob Rule. (also as defined by Churchill as the worst form of government except for everything else.) I believe that the greater stabilty given to our elections is better for utilising the first by the post system because IMHO proportional reresentation reduces the link from the locality to the elected member. And at least I can continue a discussion without introducing LAMBentable insulting comments which if one were of in to that sort of thing one could say that it was was equally applicable to any party where there is a large majority. However in '83 the conservaties took Tony Benn's seat in east Bristol now Labour haMajority of over fifteen thousand. Cllr

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 12:38 PM

That Tory would almost certainly do less harm buggering sheep, than Tony does buggering the British population.......Food for thought?

It seems to me that most people labour under the impression that "politics" and "government" are synonymous. Not so!

Government, in its purest form, has to do with the benefit and welfare of those being governed.

Politics ( I will not use the word purest in the same sentence), has to do with the benefit, welfare, and preservation of the party governing, and its hangers on, often to the detriment of those being governed.

It is a given, in the UK, that the government will devote the majority of its time and energy to political survival. This simple fact may be the cause of the prevalent feeling of being over governed. There is insufficient time left in which to make reasoned and sensitive legislation, which explains why so many "knee jerk reactions" and sledgehammer policies find their way on to the statute books, leaving to the overworked judiciary, the job of translating misconceived and inept laws into some kind of justice.

Until there is a balance shift away from politics, our much vaunted mother of perliaments isn't worth a tinker's damn to us Brits, and that ain't happening any time soon.

The sole redeeming virtue of our system is that I can express these views without fear of a visit by secret police in the early hours of tomorrow morning. How long that will last, I wonder?

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: GUEST,Bunnahabhain
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 10:33 AM

What IS wrong with less Goverment?
Nothing, except it would require those in power to decide that we know what we want to do with our money than them. Money and power are addictive.

There are too many people with a vested intrest in expanding the state for it to be cut back without a huge political effort, which would need the backing of the electorate, and that can only come from the mass realisation that a change in the system is needed. Something we've not seen since Thatcher.

There are over one million people employed by the NHS. If it were propoposed that the health service was reformed, so a large proportion of them now worked for the private sector, there would be a huge opposition to it. The state has a near monopoly at the moment. Reforms would reduce this position of power. People are afraid of change, even it is likley they would be better off as a result.

Yes , there are some things goverment should do. Just far less of them than it does

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: GUEST,democat
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 09:53 AM

Too much government
Too many laws
Too many people asking the govt to solve their problems
Too much support for failing.

Whats wrong with:

Less government
Less spent on public services
Income tax cuts so we can do what we want with our money.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: GUEST,McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 08:16 AM

"...in the constituency where I live the sitting Tory MP would be voted in if he was caught live on TV buggering sheep..."

That's an interesting approach to electioneering. Otherwise, I take it, he'd be defeated?

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Stu
Date: 16 Feb 05 - 04:34 AM

The truth is successive governments have kept our unfair 'first-past-the-post' voting system because once in power it gives them a better chance of staying there. A system of proportional representation would give smaller minority parties a real chance to influence the way the country is run, and keep existing politicians on their toes a little more.

Blair got away with Iraq etc because his majority is so huge he can effectively do what he wants. This is hardly democratic, as no-else is listened to when taking policy decisions or drawing up legislation to steam-roller through unpopular laws.

As for not voting, I take your point Les but in the constituency where I live the sitting Tory MP would be voted in if he was caught live on TV buggering sheep, so safe is his majority.

I have no say in how the country is run, I feel betrayed by Blair so do not want to vote Labour and the Lib-Dems are way behind anyway, so I will exersise my franchise but spoil the ballot - different to not voiting because of apathy.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Cllr
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 08:45 PM

yes Mcgrath I agree with you and as the conservative party do not think the home secretary should have this abilty I suggest you all go out and vote tory at the next election. cllr *runs and ducks*

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 08:30 PM

But a constitution where, at least until recently, there were virtually no fixed safeguards, if a government with a solid majority were to decide to discard inconvenient things like trial by jury or any number of other matters of some importance.

To some extent the fact that we are now tied into a wider system of human rights legislation and courts does provide some safeguards, but pretty shaky and desultory ones.

If a whipped parliament does allow the present Home Secretary to lock citizens up in their own homes for as long as he chooses, without any kind of court hearing, it is going to be quite some time before that can get struck down effectively.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Cllr
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 08:09 PM

Oh hang on, I just read Don's post We do have a written constition it is an uncodified constition but written never the less and to quote a book on constitution.

The following is paraphrased from an essay I wrote on the subject a few years ago. My source material "Politics UK" a Prentice Hall publication."A constitution can be defined as a system of laws,customs and conventions which defines the composition and powers of the organs of the state (such as government, Parliament,and the courts) and regulates the relations of various state organs to one another and of those state organs to the private citizen. The british constition differs from most in that it is not drawn up in a single codified document and as such it is described as an "unwritten" constitution However much of the constitution exists in "written" form. Many Acts of Parliament such as the Parliment acts 1911 and 1949 are clearly measures of constitutional law. Those acts constitute formal, written - and binding - documents. To describe the constitution as unwritten is thus misleading. Rather, what Britain has is a part written and uncodified constitution." Cllr

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Cllr
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 08:00 PM

Im a county cllr; I am politically responsible for a fifty eight million pound budget (at least for a few more weeks) Whilst a lot of it is tied up in contracts wages and government duties and legislation I still have the opportunity to make a difference. Cllr

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 07:25 PM

You will find Don's point about the dictatorship of the majority rehearsed in less inflammatory language in all the major textbooks on English constitutional law.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: akenaton
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 05:06 PM

BPL   Im sorry, the last sentence in my last post should have ended with the word intellectuals.
The sentence was not meant as a jibe at you, but at a small group of self confessed highly intellegent people who live here.
                      Apologies ...Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 04:38 PM

BigPinkLad, I will defend that (idiotic) statement. In terms of the fact that we cannot prevent them from doing whatever they wish, there IS little difference. We are as powerless as the populations mentioned above.

Unlike the US, we have no basically unchangeable written constitution, and there is, in theory, nothing to stop a British government from suspending elections, and ruling permanently, which would be defineable as totalitarian. The fact that no government (since Oliver Cromwell) has done, or would do, anything like that does not invalidate the argument. They could!

Had I claimed that our government was as evil as the other two, that would indeed have been both idiotic and indefensible, but I did not.
We can't, however, know what kind of party might attain to power in the UK in the future. Get the point?

DT

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: akenaton
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 03:23 PM

Don T ....Im beginning to like your posts more and more.

Big Pink Lad ...Im surprised at your language. It seems clear to me that our democracy is a sham.
We may not yet use the military to repress protest , but just give them time, "Its comin'yet for aw that"
I reckon in another 20 yrs UK will be a fully fledged police state, inevitable ending for a "capitalist democracy".
Hows that for an oxymoron you psuedo intellectual?....Ake

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 02:52 PM

In essence this is little different than Germany under Hitler, or Russia under Stalin.

That's an indefensibly idiotic statement.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 02:41 PM

Profound radio vox pop quote from the streets of Liverpool;
"I don't vote 'cause it makes no difference. If it made a difference they wouldn't let us do it."
Discuss!

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 02:28 PM

Would be nice Les, if true, but I'm afraid it's not. We have this wonderful system here called the whip. It gently guides party MPs toward the government (Tony) POV.

One line whip:- "We'd realy like you to vote with us, and we'll explain why there isn't a conflict of concience. And we did give you the key to the members' loo".

Two line whip:- "We will take it seriously amiss if you don't vote with us, and sanctions might be applied. Your key to the members loo may be in jeopardy".

Three line whip:- "You will vote with us, or we'll cut your bollocks off, and you won't need a key to the members' loo".

Nobody ever changes anything until he is Prime Minister, and experience suggests that all changes he makes from that point on will be for the worse. Hence my comment above, re. independent candidates. It may not be practical, but it might possibly produce 635 MPs who are not afraid to vote for what they know is right.


Whether that would be better or not, in terms of results achieved, I know not, but it would be closer to what is really meant by democracy.

What we have now is a ruling clique who cannot be controlled, because their seats (votes) outnumber all other parties combined.

In essence this is little different than Germany under Hitler, or Russia under Stalin.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 12:45 PM

Democracy - the worst system of Government except all the others.

All power to critics every politician needs them on their shouldres all the time.

Not voting - hard to see what it achieves.

Voting is not enough. If your care about democracy and you feel able to contribute, the place is inside current politcal parties. Many of Tony Blairs critics are inside the party. The rank and file are not happy people.

If you want to actually change things, that's the best place to work.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 09:40 AM

What would be entertaining would be if Labour rompee home nationally, and Tony Blair got chucked out in his constituency, Sedgefield. Sadly it's still pretty safe for him, though his vote and his majority did go down quite a bit last time. He's sitting on a majority of 17,713 (as against 25,116 the previous time. Maybe if the others dropped out and Martin Bell stood as a clean-up-the-stable candidate...

Here's the BBC site which gives you all those kinds of details about the last election results.

And here is another site that gives stuff about MPs voting records generally - "They work for you". This is the Tony Blair page, but all the other MPs are all in there too.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 06:13 AM

But remember its not the same Tony.
As he said
first he wanted to be all things to all men.
Then he thought he knew best.
But now he's nice and cuddly and trusrworthy and is ready to backle down and do what we want.
And can someone explain why we have in charge of the country the only man in Britain who can lose money on every property deal he tries.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Stu
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 05:04 AM

DougR - do not believe all your see on Fox news!

As said in the previous few posts, most people in the UK view Blair's cosying up to a right-wing nutter as extremely disturbing, and want him to stop.

As for his approach to terrorism, even though the NI peace process is in trouble at the moment, it proves the only way to stop terrorist violence is to address the issues causing it directly and TALK to people (not pre-emptive strikes), however repugnant that my seem to you.

I shall vote, but will probably spoil my ballot as I think no party is worth voting for.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: EagleWing
Date: 15 Feb 05 - 05:04 AM

"How about, please leave teachers alone to teach and stop playing politics with kids futures. They did promises a 5 year moritorium on educational change when they got in the first time, but I'm still waiting for it to start!"

Oh YES! I have lost count of how many changes I have had to try and take into account over the last few years. As a supply teacher I don't always get to hear of them until I go into a school that's struggling to fit in the new fad with the other demands made by a government whose priorities are "education, education and education" but who never actually consult educationalists.

Frank L.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: GUEST,A fair man
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 07:40 PM

May I go one further than Don and Richard and point out that it was the USA's cultural and economic imperialism - of which those in the two towers were in fact the troops - that created the situation in which those without arms who wished to defend their cultures had to turn to violence?

Like the hypocrisy that attacks Ken Livingstone, I am tired of the hypocrisy that funds terrorists who attack the UK, but screams "foul" when its own forces of oppression get their comeuppance.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 07:35 PM

Hello Don, may I for once agree with you?

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 02:39 PM

No DougR,

The PM's POV on arse licking your own crazy leader, is very much UK business, and most of us want him to stop. Please go peddle your "Support the dishonest bullies" message to those who might buy it. I believe you'll find most of them in the southern half of your own country.

DT

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 02:32 PM

One good thing about having an officially Tory Government was that, when it tried to impose cuts on local services, our local council in Harlow could be relied on to at least try to resist, and to protect us. Now they just roll over and cooperate.

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: DougR
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 01:35 PM

I'm only interested in the PM's POV on fighting terrorism, Kevin. The rest is the business of the people of GB.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 01:28 PM

Hmm. Maybe Lib Dem or Green then. Many of the issues canvassed above are important - and it was not a question of what single issue would make me vote for (or against) New Labour, but which issue is "the most important".

That leaves me with the health service - cleaning, reversing privatisations, etc - or maybe honesty in politics (look at the way we have been lied to about Iraq, the Licensing Act, and almost everything else under the sun)

How about housing - permitting housing authorities to build new social housing?

Re-nationalising rail?

Stopping PFI and other priviatisations all round?

Pensions? bring back SERPS!

An excess profits tax on oil companies and banks?

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 01:01 PM

And yet in your country, Doug, he'd count as a raving left-winger (so would most of our Tory Party for that matter).

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: DougR
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 12:42 PM

I'm not familiar with all the issues facing the voters in GB, but one thing I hope is that the election does not cause your current PM to be replaced.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: Forthcoming UK election - important issu
From: Cats
Date: 14 Feb 05 - 12:38 PM

How about, please leave teachers alone to teach and stop playing politics with kids futures. They did promises a 5 year moritorium on educational change when they got in the first time, but I'm still waiting for it to start!

And Cllr... Mike's quite a good name... ouch.:-)))