BS: Israel European?

Subject: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 11:01 AM

Why can Israel take part in European sports?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 11:07 AM

"take part"? what? when? That's not much of a question as stated.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Stu
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 11:36 AM

It won the Eurovision Song Contest a few years ago.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 11:49 AM

It's probably asking why Israel is in the UEFA Cup (Union of European Football Associations) when you would not generally regard Isreal as a European county.

The answer is surely that what geographer's regard as the continents is not absolutely settled even amongst themselves; that the majority view for geographers is not necessarily the same as politicians would define it; and that other organisations, be they Football Associations or multinational companies, will use the labels as suits them, thank you very much.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,sorefingers
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 12:16 PM

Wellll several Islands in the American side of the Atlantic are European, ie governed by and use the currency of Europe, so why not Israel? Most of its people so long in Europe they are European, I don't see why they should not be admitted to European sports.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Sorcha
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 12:17 PM

More to the point, who cares?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: artbrooks
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 12:24 PM

If the Union of European Football Associations is the reference, one could ask the same question about Turkey, Azerbaijan and Uzbekistan.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 12:26 PM

They compete in the Eoropean Championship games but surely they do not belong to Europe?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 12:35 PM

Israel, sport & political boycotts

It is a compromise. To exclude all (or most) Muslim countries for not following the rules of the respective sports federations is impossible due to political reasons. So the present solution is accepted.

But it still leads to interesting conflicts. Last year, in football, a European team with an Iranian player had to play Tel Aviv. The Iranian player had to play acording to his contract with his club if his coach wanted him to play. If he would have played he would have been punished by his government when returning to Iran. So he got himself injured (officially).

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 12:50 PM

Australia will compete in football in Asia from this year on. For historical reasons, Cyprus, Turkey, and Russia alo compete in most sports in Europe though one could argue that they also could compete in Asia. Egypt is another country situated on two different continents but competing only in one, namely Africa.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 12:54 PM

Which contient is Israel on, then?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: artbrooks
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 01:40 PM

Israel is located in Southwest Asia

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 01:43 PM

Not Europe then?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: artbrooks
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 02:11 PM

Southwest Asia

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 02:16 PM

Surely, this is part of the bigger problem. Israel is a state populated - one way or the other - by European Jews.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Ebbie
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 02:31 PM

Question: Since Russia is in both Europe and Asia, which part is allowed to play in European contests? *G*

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 02:47 PM

There's quite a bit of Russia in Europe, including its capital city. So Russia is a European country for sporting contests. In the current European Athletic Championships (or track 'n' field as the Americans say), one of the Russian athletes was from Vladivostok!

Very little of Turkey is in Europe - just the bit round Istanbul. And none of Israel is in Europe.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: artbrooks
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 03:15 PM

This from Wikopedia: Israel is about 80% Jewish. Of the Jews, 68% are Sabras (Israeli-born), mostly second or third generation Israelis, and the rest are olim — 22% from Europe and the Americas, and 10% from Asia and Africa, including the Arab countries. There is no breakdown of the ethnicity of the Sabras' parents, grandparents, and so forth.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 04:35 PM

So why are they allowed into European competitions?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 05:12 PM

Do you only ask questions, Gerry, or do you also read the responses?

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 05:28 PM

"So why are they allowed into European competitions?"

It would seem because you ain't got dick to say about it.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 05:32 PM

"But if the linkage between sports and politics has declined since the 1970s, it has intensified in the international arena as the country's Arab neighbors sought to isolate the Jewish state from 1973 onwards. Ironically, this tactic backfired. For while Israel was expelled from all Asian sports' federations, it was eventually accepted into the European sports' bodies, enabling the country to compete in many of the world's most prestigious competitions such as the European Athletics Championships, the European Swimming Championships, the UEFA football cups, the European Basketball cups and all other major European tournaments."

There. Next time, Gerry, do your own research. And one question for you: Why shouldn't Israelis be allowed to participate in European sports? Does it bother you that much? Trust me, the religion don't rub off.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Azizi
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 06:36 PM

"Egypt is another country situated on two different continents but competing only in one, namely Africa".

Wolfgang, I wasn't aware that Egypt was situated on two different continents. Egypt seems to be located entirely in Africa. What two continents are you referring to?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 13 Aug 06 - 06:39 PM

Likely that is a reference to the Sinai which is considered to be in Asia, not Africa.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 14 Aug 06 - 05:42 AM

It just seemed strange to me that a middle eastern country should be represented in Europe, like having their cake and eating it.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Azizi
Date: 14 Aug 06 - 08:23 AM

This may be off-topic a bit, but I need to make this point-
Egypt is entirely located on the continent of Africa.

So many times for some many reasons so many people have tried to dissassociate Egypt from Africa. I'm not saying that you Wolfgang or you Peace are trying to do that. However, your words might be misconstrued by others accidently or on purpose.

So for those who want to believe that Egypt or part of Egypt is located elsewhere, see this link Geography of Egypt which comes with a map.

Here is an excerpt from that website:
"Situated in the Northeastern corner of Africa, bounded by the Mediterranean Sea from the North and the Red Sea from the East, with the Sinai Peninsula constituting a link to Southwest Asia, Egypt enjoys a unique, strategic location at the crossroads between Africa, the Middle East and Europe. Throughout its history, Egypt has been a country where various cultures met and interacted. Egypt's total area is over one million square kilometers, yet only a narrow strip in the Nile Valley and the Delta is cultivated land."

-snip-

I hope this makes it clear that "the Sinai Peninsula constituting a link to Southwest Asia" does not mean that the Sinai Peninsula is in Southwest Asia.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 14 Aug 06 - 09:36 AM

Wikipedia :

"Its land borders are the Suez Canal to the west and the Israelâ€"Egypt border to the north-east. The Sinai Peninsula is in Southwest Asia (also called West Asia - the more geographically accurate term for the European term of Middle East) while the rest of Egypt is in North Africa. For geopolitical purposes, the Sinai is often considered part of Africa (as the rest of Egypt is)."


So as Africa has to end, and Asia start, somewhere, it's a grey area. I don't know why it bothers you though, unless you feel that having a bit of Egypt out of Africa diminishes it as an African state.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: artbrooks
Date: 14 Aug 06 - 09:59 AM

A Google on "Sinai Peninsula" will give a number of sites. Most of the ones that bother at all place the Sinai in Asia; perhaps the official Egyptian government site that Azzizi linked to has a different perspective, for whatever reason. The Gulf of Suez is certainly longer, deeper and wider than the Gulf of Akaba, which is likely why it is the dividing "line" between the two continents.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 14 Aug 06 - 10:29 AM

Of course, Egypt is not situated completely in Africa. Historically, the gulf of Suez has always been considered the divide between Africa and Asia. The largest part of Egypt but not all of it is in Africa. There is no question of misconstruing my words for I have said what I wanted to say.

Let's look at where Azizi has got her map from. It has been taken from the official site of the government of Egypt:

Egypt State Information Service (Location of Egypt)

That's what Egypt says about its location on that government site:

The Arab Republic of Egypt is located in the north-eastern corner of Africa and south-western Asia...
Location: Northern Africa, bordering the Mediterranean Sea, between Libya and the Gaza Strip, and the Red Sea north of Sudan, and includes the Asian Sinai Peninsula (my emphasis)

I also don't understand why it bothers you, Azizi.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 14 Aug 06 - 10:32 AM

In terms of plate tectonics (which is the only reality behind the division of the landmasses into continents), Sinai and Arabia are a separate plate on their own, and actually part of neither Africa nor the main body of Asia. But on that criterion, India isn't part of Asia proper either.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Azizi
Date: 14 Aug 06 - 12:25 PM

I stand corrected. My apologies to both Wolfgang and Peace.

A small portion of the nation of Egypt is in south-western Asia.

However, the majority of that nation is located in the continent of Africa.

As to why it bothers me that some folks find all sorts of reasons to disconnect Egypt with the continent of Africa, I suppose you can figure that out without me going even more off topic in this thread. And if you can not, that's another topic for another thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 14 Aug 06 - 06:09 PM

No apology needed for me, Azizi, but thank you anyway.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,hugo
Date: 15 Aug 06 - 07:05 AM

Imperial Politicians have always seen Israel as a sort of "Jewish Ulster"...a settler state planted on behalf of western interests [ie oil ] among arab people.
It has not gained acceptance with its neighbours because it is inherently a racist and aggressive state ...a militarised democracy controlled by its generals as a writer put it well in the Guardian today.
The reason for the planting of this state is its use to police the Middle East on behalf of Britain [at first ] and since the second World War , America.
Because of its militarised and aggressive nature it has no friends among its neighbours hence its turn to Europe and the daft Eurovision song contest etc.
hugo

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Ernest
Date: 15 Aug 06 - 07:31 AM

Very intelligent since there is no oil to speak of in Israel.

And the idea of "wiping Israel out of the map" is neither agressive nor racist... and control by a theocracy is of course much more progressive than democracy.

Are you the Hugo that has been locked away in the basement all these years? They shouldn`t have done that... ;0)

Ernest

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 15 Aug 06 - 07:54 AM

Israel has no oil, nor Jordan, but the oil pipeline from Iraq passed through Palestine, which was one reason the British were none too keen to give the inhabitants the independence that they thought they had earned.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,hugo
Date: 16 Aug 06 - 03:48 AM

To Earnest
Israel has no oil itself...true.... I never said it had.
However ,Israel serves to police the region on behalf of US imperialism.For example it attacked the Suez Canal in Egypy in 1956 to put down a marker as to its future intentions as an aggressive state.

It is no accident of history that with the importance of oil emerging at the end of the 19th century the Balfour Declaration was announced in 1917.

Since its formation Israel has served to intimidate the arab masses and the local arab ruling classes in the region.

However, the psychological and actual terror seems to be having a reduced effect as Hezbollah has stood up to and faced down the Israeli war machine.
hugo

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Ernest
Date: 16 Aug 06 - 05:19 AM

Israel is the land where the jewish people lived in biblical times. The idea of forming a jewish state in thate place was developed by the zionist movement (Dr. Theodor Herzl) in the 19th century.

So the idea that Israel was "planted" in its place by the British and Americans is nonsense.

Israel has been attacked by its neighbors in 1948, 1967 and 1973 plus countless suicide bombers, rockets etc. So if you call Israel "militarized and aggressive" what do you call this?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 16 Aug 06 - 06:05 AM

Massive non-sequitur Ernest. Sussex was Welsh 2000 years ago, as was Scotland, and the USA was populated by Red Indians. If we all return to our homelands I'm not sure where I'll go- Normandy or Spain perhaps, but the Normans came from Scandinavia and their ancestors perhaps came from somewhere in central Europe or west Asia, not long before the Romans destroyed the Jewish state.

What's more, Zionism didn't take off until it had political support from the world's great powers, which support resulted from a mixture of guilt, religious nuttery, romanticism and an eye for the opportunity.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 16 Aug 06 - 11:17 PM

Hugo, Ego, Wego, Igo...

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 16 Aug 06 - 11:28 PM

Hugo needs someone else to hate--just to give the Jews a break for a while.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,Bee Bee
Date: 17 Aug 06 - 10:17 AM

I think the original question is a good one - why is Israel allowed to participate in European sport etc? If we follow the line that one contributor made, that most Israelis are European (whether that's true or not), then we should also include many other countries in 'Europe' such as the US, Australia, New Zealand etc. If Israel has upset Asian countries so much that it has been banned from competing in their championships, why should Europe take them in? For many years South Africa was banned and had nowhere to run, jump, or play football at all. Perhaps Israel could compete in the Americas championships, given who their closest ally is. I personally think that European competition should be for those nations whose land falls entirely or partly in Europe. Israel's does not.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: greg stephens
Date: 17 Aug 06 - 01:59 PM

I nam surprised nobody seems to have raised the obvious parallel example. Berwick-on-Tweed plays football in the Scottish league I believe, though the town is actually in England. Historical connections, etc, etc, just like Israel/Europe. Obviously this upsets some people, which is an interesting phenomenon; as is Azizi's strange anger when someone pointed out the obvious fact that a bit of Egypt appears to be in Asia. (of couse, it depends on what you mean by Asia.Or Europe. Or Africa). Others find it irritating that a chunk of Turkey seems to be in Europe.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 17 Aug 06 - 05:55 PM

Derry City FC is a Northern Irish football club playing in the Football League of Ireland.

And there's two bits of Spain in Africa (Ceurta and Melilla).

And there's bits of France all around the world that belong to the European Union.

It's a confusing world!

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 17 Aug 06 - 06:00 PM

"Others find it irritating that a chunk of Turkey seems to be in Europe."

We had many sparce times when I was a youth, and having a 'chunk of Turkey' anywhere in the house would have done wonders for the cat's nerves.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Azizi
Date: 17 Aug 06 - 08:22 PM

Off topic:

Greg Stephens,

In your 17 Aug 06 - 01:59 PM post, you refer to my "strange anger when someone pointed out the obvious fact that a bit of Egypt appears to be in Asia. (of couse, it depends on what you mean by Asia.Or Europe. Or Africa)"

-snip-

Aside for the fact that your statement shows that "obvious" is not always "obvious", it's interesting to me that you or anyone else could think that anything I wrote in my 14 Aug 06 - 08:23 AM post or the only other post I've written to this thread besides my initial posts and this one-on 14 Aug 06 - 12:25 PM-could be interpreted as expressing anger.

I suppose we have different interpretations about what constitutes angry words.

Oh, well-different strokes for different folks.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 17 Aug 06 - 08:26 PM

I didn't find A's post to be angry, pissed off or upset. Same, normal level-headed gal who's posted here for years--and not always on topic, unlike the rest of us . . . :-).

And speaking of punctuation, has anyone noticed lately that kids just do NOT give a darn! (That one was for Les, although he may not come to this thread?)

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 01:46 PM

Most Israelis, it seems, are European. Israel is another extension of colonialism and Israelis are no different than the European settlers who displaced the indigenous people of North America.

They have to play games in Europe because nobody in the neighborhood wants to play with them.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: bobad
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 01:53 PM

End discrimination. Hate everybody.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: artbrooks
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 03:04 PM

According to Wikopedia, "22% [of Israelis are] from Europe and the Americas". This hardly seems like "most" to me.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 04:53 PM

Art - This may give you a more accurate picture:

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Society_&_Culture/demographics.html

According to Wiki - "Jewish 80.1% (Europe/America-born 32.1%, Israel-born 20.8%, Africa-born 14.6%, Asia-born 12.6%), non-Jewish 19.9% (mostly Arab) (1996 est.)"

You have to remember that although those born in Israel are considered to be Israeli born, it doesn't mean their parents were from Israel. In fact, European immigration to Israel is very high.

I'd like to know exactly how many of Israel's Jews were actually born in the Middle East.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 05:00 PM

Maybe a better question would be, "how many Europeans have immigrated to Israel in the last thirty years.?"

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST,sorefingers
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 05:13 PM

Well Dinivan besides the what the papers say, ahem, there are loads of Eurpeans in Israel - not all of them Jewish either - in Kibbutz, travelling about with their European Jewish friends/famalies etc, and the rest.

It would be very foolish to dismiss the European Jewish element in modern Israel.

Be well drink more real ale!

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: robomatic
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 05:32 PM

Many "Europeans" got there from somewhere else. Or have the Picts successfully been able to terrorize the Celts Romans Normans Saxons and Vikings out of Occupied England?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: artbrooks
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 05:49 PM

The numbers at the Jewish Virtual Library are essentially the same as Wikopedia's. The numbers you quoted, which are the ethnicity percentages, indicate that about a quarter of Israelis (32.1% of 80.1% is 25.7%) are "European/American, which is still hardly a majority. I these numbers are suspect, since there is no allowance for any ethnic merging. Most Israelis (68% of 80.1%, or 54.5% plus 19.9% non-Jews, for a total of 74.4%) were born in Israel. Or would you consider an Israeli with one European-born grandparent "of European descent?" Or 2? Or 3? Or 4? How about the ones descended from Europeans who immigrated in the 1800s? The 1700s? That all sounds as racist to me as the idea that any Black American with any fraction of African descent cannot possibly be "white", whatever that word means.

All of which has nothing whatever to do with why Israel plays in European football leagues.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: dianavan
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 08:59 PM

Agreed, sorefingers. It would be very foolish to dismiss the European Jewry of Israel as insignificant. Its equally as foolish to bring up the picts when it is only the last 50 years or so that has seen large numbers of European/American immigrants in Israel.

Zionist apologists are grasping at straws.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 09:03 PM

Jew haters are masking their anti-Semitism behind lots of bullshit.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 09:05 PM

A better question would be why do some people hate Jews so much that they worship terrorism when it's done by Hezbollah?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 09:13 PM

Australia has now been shifted to the Asia region for the Soccer World Cup.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 09:15 PM

Will Israelis from the Sinai be allowed to participate?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: freda underhill
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 09:24 PM

Peace, why do people identify so strongly with an aggressive superpower? does it make the weak feel strong?

why do you continually accuse people who have challeng Israel's actions in Lebanon of being pro hezbollah? you are trying to project your own goodies/baddies cowboys/indians mentality on others. We are not looking at the conflict in those black/white terms.

and as i have said, again and again and again, i do not support any terrorist organisation, whether it is funded by imnsurgents or by the US.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 09:28 PM

"We are not looking at the conflict in those black/white terms."

Who is this 'we' you speak of?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: freda underhill
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 09:37 PM

think about it.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 09:38 PM

"and as i have said, again and again and again, i do not support any terrorist organisation, whether it is funded by imnsurgents or by the US."

And where or when have I ever said you do?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Azizi
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 10:29 PM

I'd like to consider the original question of why Israel joined the European Football Association from a historical {and perhaps sociological?} perspective.

Thanks to google, I found this website: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIFA

Here is an excerpt from that website:

"The Fédération Internationale de Football Association, known worldwide by its acronym FIFA, is the international governing body of Football (soccer) and the largest sporting organization in the world. Its headquarters are in Zürich, Switzerland, and its current president is Sepp Blatter...

Under the auspices of the President, FIFA [is split into six confederations which oversee the game in the different continents and regions of the world. National federations must claim membership to both FIFA and the confederation in which their nation is geographically resident for their teams to qualify for entry to FIFA's competitions (with a few geographic exceptions listed below):

    AFC - Asian Football Confederation in Asia and Australia
    CAF - Confédération Africaine de Football in Africa
    CONCACAF - Confederation of North, Central American and Caribbean Association Football in North America and Central America
    CONMEBOL - Confederación Sudamericana de Fútbol in South America
    OFC - Oceania Football Confederation in Oceania
    UEFA - Union of European Football Associations in Europe.

Nations straddling the traditional boundary between Europe and Asia have generally had their choice of confederation. As a result, nations including Russia and Turkey have chosen to become part of UEFA despite the bulk of their land area being in Asia. Israel, although lying entirely within Asia, joined UEFA in 1994, after decades of isolation by many of its Middle Eastern neighbours. Kazakhstan was the latest nation to make the move from AFC to UEFA, in 2002.

Guyana and Suriname have always been CONCACAF members despite being South American countries.

Australia have been given permission to join the AFC instead of the OFC from 2006 onwards. Australia have long lobbied for a change, because their national team is very much stronger than the other Oceania teams. No team from the OFC is offered automatic qualification to the World Cup; instead the winner of their section must play a play-off against a CONMEBOL side, a hurdle at which Australia have traditionally fallen. Perhaps ironically, Australia successfully qualified for the 2006 FIFA World Cup by winning just such a playoff in a penalty shootout against Uruguay, just a few months after the clearance to move was granted."

-snip-

So there ya go. The answer to the question "Why is Israel a member of the Union of European Football Association?" is that "although lying entirely within Asia, [Israel] joined UEFA in 1994, after decades of isolation by many of its Middle Eastern neighbours."

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 10:36 PM

Well, that's that then. Good one.

Now, the larger question: Who put the bomp in the bomp shuh bomp shuh bomp?

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Azizi
Date: 18 Aug 06 - 10:40 PM

Being geographically challenged :o} it took me a moment to figure out that the Middle East is part of the Asia.

But fwiw, here's some information on the Asian Football Confederation:

The 46 member Asian Football Confederation (AFC) is the governing body of football in Asia, excluding Cyprus and Israel. (Nations with some European and some Asian territory, such as Turkey, Russia, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Armenia and Georgia, are instead covered by UEFA.) It was founded in 1954 in Manila, Philippines. The main headquarters is located in Bukit Jalil, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. The current president is Mohammed Bin Hammam of Qatar...

ASEAN Football Federation
Main article: ASEAN Football Federation
Australia (invitee)
Brunei
Cambodia
East Timor
Indonesia
Laos
Malaysia
Maldives Republic* (invitee)
Myanmar
Philippines
Singapore
Thailand
Vietnam

[edit]
East Asian Football Federation
Main article: East Asian Football Federation
China PR
Chinese Taipei (Taiwan)
Guam
Hong Kong, China
Japan
Macau, China
Mongolia
North Korea
South Korea
[edit]West Asian Football Federation
Main article: West Asian Football Federation
Bahrain
Iran
Iraq
Jordan
Kuwait
Lebanon
Oman
Palestine
Qatar
Saudi Arabia
Syria
United Arab Emirates
Yemen

[edit]
Central and South Asian Football Federation
Main article: Central Asian Football Federation
Afghanistan*
Bangladesh*
Bhutan*
India*
Kyrgyzstan
Nepal*
Pakistan*
Sri Lanka*
Tajikistan
Turkmenistan
Uzbekistan

...

Israel, who qualified in 1970, is now a member of UEFA. Australia, who joined AFC in 2006, qualified twice as a member of the OFC, in 1974 and 2006..."

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asian_Football_Confederation

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: dianavan
Date: 19 Aug 06 - 12:05 AM

Like I said, "They have to play games in Europe because nobody in the neighborhood wants to play with them."

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Aug 06 - 12:08 AM

As I said.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Les from Hull
Date: 19 Aug 06 - 04:06 PM

'Geographically challenged' - sounds like a modern euphemism for obesity!

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: GUEST
Date: 19 Aug 06 - 04:46 PM

They're not a part of Europe and shouldn't play in the UEFA just because their neighbours don't like them. Their actions towards Palestine is not entirely sporting.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: Peace
Date: 19 Aug 06 - 04:50 PM

There is absolutely NO sport in war, and that is what Israel, Hamas and Hezbollah are fighting.

Subject: RE: BS: Israel European?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Aug 06 - 06:20 PM

Whatever reasons there might be for Israel being included in some generally European competitions or organisations, such matters as where the citizens of Israel or their parents lived are completely irrelevant.

Lebanon is another small country in Asia for which quite a good case could be made for a similar arrangement.