BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 17 Sep 09 - 10:28 PM

The House throws Acorn under da bus:

(UPI) The U.S. House, by a wide margin, voted to bar the community organizing group ACORN from receiving any federal funding.

The House, on a 347-75 vote, passed the bill cutting off federal funding to the controversial Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, The Washington Post reported. The organization came under heavy, bipartisan criticism last week after a surreptitiously recorded video emerged in which two conservative activists posed as a prostitute and pimp and received advice from a Baltimore ACORN employee on how to avoid paying taxes.

All House Republicans present for the vote backed the measure, as well as 172 Democrats. Seventy-five Democrats opposed the measure.

The Senate earlier this week passed a bill, 83-7, to bar ACORN from receiving federal housing grants from the Department of Housing and Urban Development, the Post reported. Officials said the upper chamber is considering a total ban similar to the measure passed by the House.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 17 Sep 09 - 01:50 PM

"Schwarzenegger sent a letter to Attorney General Jerry Brown asking his office to look into ACORN's activities in California,..."


                Does anybody seriously think Jerry Brown will do anything to investigate ACORN?

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 17 Sep 09 - 01:21 PM

By the way, investigation is a good thing. But if ACORN is not found to be guilty of all of the things the propaganda machine of the right wing is throwing at them, I expect that the people smearing them in this thread will somehow forget to inform us.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 17 Sep 09 - 01:12 PM

One of the videos shows the worker telling the client that she had shot her husband to death. All of her ex-husbands are still alive and well, according to the local police. LOL She nailed 'em.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 17 Sep 09 - 12:55 PM

Strike 5, The Governator rolls Acorn under da bus:

AP: LOS ANGELESâ€"Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger called on California's attorney general Wednesday to investigate ACORN, the community organizing group that has recently come under fire in videos produced by conservative activists.

The videos show the group's workers offering advice on how to set up prostitution businesses, the activists have said.

Schwarzenegger sent a letter to Attorney General Jerry Brown asking his office to look into ACORN's activities in California, the Los Angeles Times reported.

The advocacy group was criticized after employees were caught on camera appearing to advise a couple posing as a prostitute and pimp to lie about the woman's profession to get housing help.

The most recent video, released Wednesday, was filmed in San Diego. A man appearing to pose as a pimp asks a worker if Tijuana, Mexico, is the best place to bring underage girls into the U.S. The man replies, "yes," saying he has a lot of friends there who can assist.....

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 16 Sep 09 - 08:23 AM

Strike four, the Senate rolls Acorn under da bus: WSJ

On Monday, the U.S. Senate voted 83-7 to strip Acorn, the premier community organizing group on the left, of more than $1.6 million in federal housing money meant to assist low-income people obtain loans and prepare tax forms. This dramatic step followed last Friday's decision by the U.S. Census Bureau to sever its ties with the organization, one of several community groups it was partnering with to conduct the nation's head count.

Both of these actions came after secretly recorded videos involving employees in Acorn's Brooklyn, N.Y., Washington, D.C., Baltimore, Md. and San Bernardino, Calif. offices were televised on Fox News. The videos were recorded by two independent filmmakers who posed as a prostitute and a pimp and said they were planning to import underage women from El Salvador for the sex trade. They asked for and received advice on getting a housing loan and evading federal taxes.

In response, Acorn has so far fired four of the employees seen on the videos. But it claimed the videos were "doctored" and accused critics of a smear campaign and "racist coverage" of the incidents.

Such rhetoric in the past has deflected scrutiny of Acorn tactics, such as street demonstrations and boycotts against banks to force lower credit standards for home loans, which a congressional report found contributed to the subprime loan mess. But now Acorn may be finally running off the rails.

Last week, 11 of its workers were accused by Florida prosecutors of falsifying information on 888 voter registration forms. Last month, Acorn's former Las Vegas, Nev., field director, Christopher Edwards, agreed to testify against the group in a case in which Las Vegas election officials say 48% of the voter registration forms the group turned in were "clearly fraudulent." Acorn itself is charged with 13 counts of illegally using a quota system to compensate workers in an effort to boost the number of registrations. (Acorn has denied wrongdoing in all of these cases.)

A growing number of people once affiliated with Acorn want nothing more to do with the group. Marcel Reid, for example, was one of eight national Acorn board members who were removed last year after demanding an audit of the group's books. She notes that Acorn received $7.4 million in contributions from the Service Employees International Union (SEIU) between 2005 and 2008 but actively fights unionization efforts by its own employees. Ms. Reid also notes that Acorn was sanctioned by the National Labor Relations Board in 2003 for illegally firing workers trying to organize a union.

In 1995, Acorn unsuccessfully sued California to be exempt from the minimum wage, claiming that "the more that Acorn must pay each individual outreach worker . . . the fewer outreach workers it will be able to hire." The decision to file that lawsuit was made by Wade Rathke, who founded Acorn in 1970 and was its long-time leader. He was forced by the group's board to resign last year after it found that he'd engaged in a cover-up of a nearly $1 million embezzlement of Acorn funds by his brother Dale, then the group's chief financial officer.

Mr. Rathke now the chief organizer of a New Orleans-based local of the SEIU, a key Acorn ally is out with a new book, "Citizen Wealth," in which he touts a vision of "maximum eligible participation" by Americans in welfare programs as a way to force radical social change.

Regardless of the wisdom of that vision, it's time to follow the lead of the Census Bureau and cut the government's ties to the highly dubious characters surrounding Acorn. (The group has taken in more than $53 million in direct funding from the federal government since 1994, and substantially more indirectly through states and cities that receive federal block grants.)

Acorn's allies in Congress have long stopped every move to rein it in. Rep. Steve King (R., Iowa), for example, has tried six times to get House floor votes restricting Acorn's access to federal funds but has been blocked by Speaker Nancy Pelosi's hand-picked Rules Committee members. Some Democrats have grumbled. Michigan's John Conyers, chair of the Judiciary Committee, urged a hearing be held on Acorn abuses in March, but later told the Washington Times "the powers that be decided against it."

There is a chance the latest scandals will convince Democrats that Acorn is too toxic a political partner. And President Barack Obama, who once ran a voter-registration program for an Acorn partner (Project Vote) and then worked for Acorn as a lawyer on key cases, has every incentive to distance himself further from the organization.

Former Acorn board members tell me the group has always been confident it will be protected. After the Nevada voter-registration fraud indictment last May, Bonnie Greathouse, Acorn's chief organizer in the state, told the Las Vegas Review-Journal that "we've had bad publicity before" and survived. "People always come forward to our defense. We're just community organizers, just like the president used to be."

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 10:01 PM

Oops. I guess that's what we'll find out later on.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 09:59 PM

I guess that's what we'll find out later one.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 09:54 PM

"...its the responsibility of the people who made that video to prove they didn't make it all up by showing... that the words we hear in the video are the same words that the ACORN workers are hearing."

                   I don't think they'll have any trouble doing that!

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 06:15 PM

I don't know why anyone would think I would be stupid enough to fall for a tactic like quoting one post of mine in a thread, ignoring all of the others, and try to suggest that that one post proves that I haven't provided any documentation.

On the other hand, its the responsibility of the people who made that video to prove they didn't make it all up by showing all of the footage they took, including the parts that were edited out, and blacked out, and to prove that they didn't overdub the real words that they were speaking to the ACORN workers - that the words we hear in the video are the same words that the ACORN workers are hearing.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Bill D
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 06:09 PM

Two different issues: whether ACORN is still legally operating in MD, and whether it is 'responsible' for actions some of its employees may or may not have engaged in in several states.

IF it needs to re-do its charter or permits, that should be decided by proper authorities and dealt with. I see that document, but I have no way of knowing what it is about.

The other issue is whether Fox and their 'crew' created a fake story to entrap someone and what the relevance is. It is so obviously an attempt to get something...anything... 'on' ACORN,,,but it sure doesn't look to me like anyone at ACORN is guilty of anything except a couple of employees being stupid.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: beardedbruce
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 05:15 PM

"CarolC - PM
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 03:47 PM

It's been doctored all along. It is obviously edited and overdubbed. There are blank parts and obvious edits. Until the makers of the film can show that they didn't fabricate the "evidence" they say the video represents, it couldn't possibly stand up in a court of law. And if it can't stand up in a court of law, it can't be taken as fact. It's an obvious fake. "


Not documentation. It is opinion. Until YOU can show that it has been faked, I have to consider it undocumented.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 05:02 PM

I've already provided documentation for my accusation.


I saw the documents, but I have no way of knowing if they are genuine or not based on what I saw. They aren't on a government website.

The suggestion that having a Democratic governor and legislature would cause them to not enforce the law in the case of ACORN is, however, without any basis in fact.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: beardedbruce
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 04:10 PM

"CarolC - PM
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 10:00 PM

More like they're just cranking out the fabrications as fast as they can doctor them"





Waiting for you to provide some documentation of your accusation, or a retraction.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: beardedbruce
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 04:00 PM

Did you even look at them?

You MUST be kidding- MD has a Democratic gov. and legislature.


You asked for the documents, I gave them to you.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 03:26 PM

Seems like if that were true, they would have been closed down for business in Maryland in 2006.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 02:55 PM

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/11320897/ACORN-Illegally-Operating-in-Maryland

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 01:45 PM

According to what documents? The post above says according to the following documents and then doesn't provide any documents.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 01:28 PM

" Exclusive: ACORN Illegally Operating in Maryland

by Mike Roman

Last week, we saw some pretty disturbing activities revealed in the undercover footage from ACORN Housing's Baltimore office. By any measure of conduct, the actions of ACORN's employees should never have happened. It turns out the actions shouldn't have happened for another, very simple, reason: ACORN can't legally operate in the state of Maryland.

According to the following documents, ACORN, Inc.–the parent organization of all things ACORN–forfeited its corporate charter in Maryland in 2006. ACORN Housing forfeited its corporate charter in 2008. Any ACORN office in the state of Maryland is potentially operating illegally.

The Maryland Attorney General has made noise about prosecuting the intrepid journalists who undercovered the misdeeds of ACORN employees. Perhaps he should focus instead on how ACORN was able to operate without a license in his state."

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 15 Sep 09 - 07:17 AM

Well, I guess we'll see where it goes.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 10:00 PM

More like they're just cranking out the fabrications as fast as they can doctor them.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 09:54 PM

I don't think they sat on it for months, but days. What I think they did was to anticipate that ACORN would come out, as they did, and proclaim the first incident to be a fluke and say it could never happen again, and then fire the employees.
             That's exactly what they did, so the journalists came out with a second tape. ACORN floundered around for a while, and then became indignant and threatened to sue. I think the journalists anticipated that as well, and then un-canned a third tape while announcing that they have even more evidence.
             Now it looks like ACORN can either go away quietly, or face the wrath of the additional evidence. The ball is in ACORN's court.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 09:44 PM

And if they had any real evidence of the things they are accusing ACORN employees of doing, and they sat on it for several months, they would be accessories to the crime of trafficking in child prostitution. If they knew that ACORN employees were counseling people on how to set up child prostitution rings and they didn't go immediately to the authorities with that information, they would be aiding and abetting that crime themselves.

That's why they are only calling for the government to defund ACORN. They know they haven't got any real evidence of anything like what they are accusing ACORN employees of doing and they know that the authorities would not accept their fabricated "evidence".

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 09:38 PM

Doesn't matter how many tapes they have if they're all fabricated hoaxes. They can have a factory in FOX's basement cranking the SOBs out 24/7, and it still won't make any of it true.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 09:26 PM

They've got a third tape now and some other things. My guess is they've had this material for a while, and now they are dribbling it out. They are demanding the government de-fund ACORN.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 04:10 PM

No, it looks like there were probably grounds for dismissal. They were counseling people to not be entirely honest. But the part that was probably fabricated (and that the employees themselves say was fabricated) was the assertion that the employees were told that the people they were talking to were a prostitute and a pimp who were going to start a child prostitution ring. That's the part that was fake. And it's pretty obvious when listening to the questions and the responses that the employees were answering different questions than the ones we heard on the video.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 04:04 PM

If the tapes are fake, the people who were fired are probably lining up to file a suit against ACORN.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 03:47 PM

It's been doctored all along. It is obviously edited and overdubbed. There are blank parts and obvious edits. Until the makers of the film can show that they didn't fabricate the "evidence" they say the video represents, it couldn't possibly stand up in a court of law. And if it can't stand up in a court of law, it can't be taken as fact. It's an obvious fake.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Bill D
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 03:40 PM

"The employes are on ACORN time..."

C'mon PDQ... you can do better than THAT to connect a couple stupid people's flaws to the principles of an entire organization....

It seems to me that the doubtful "plausible explanations" started with the rigged 'sting' in the 1st place.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: pdq
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 03:16 PM

Oh, now it's supposed to be "doctored tape".

No evidence of that. It's just a lawyer's attempt to deflect the heat with a "plausible explanation". We all saw that trick pulled for eight years under Bill Clinton.

The employes are on ACORN time and are clearly advising the young couple to break the law and to lie on their government loan application.

Sounds like federal laws are being broken here. Is Eric Holder listening? Doubtful that he cares.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 03:11 PM

I would suggest that they didn't find any "suckers". I would suggest (and the evidence does appear to back this up, and ACORN's attorney is threatening legal action on the basis of this) that what happened was that the people who made the films had tried unsuccessfully for months to find a "sucker" and when they couldn't find any, and in their desperation to smear ACORN, they resorted to falsifying the evidence.

There still is zero proof that things happened the way the makers of the video have tried to make them look, and more than ample evidence that they fabricated the whole thing.

That's not entrapment. That's something else entirely.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Bill D
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 03:02 PM

and in any case, I wonder if 'entrapment' is involved in any of this. I have seen no assertions that ACORN employees had suggested any illegal activity of this sort before Fox invented the idea and went out to see if if they could get someone to bite.
The claim by ACORN is that they pulled these 'stings' for several months before they got any suckers. I'd venture that in almost any large organization, 'some' lower level employees could be found who would say similar things. Remember, there is not even any allegation by FOX that ACORN employees did anything more than offer 'suggestions'.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 02:48 PM

On the other hand, the video contains both images as well as conversation. Surveillance cameras do not record sound. So ACORN may have some grounds for action in that regard as well.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 02:39 PM

But doctoring a tape for the purpose of making it look like something happened that didn't, and then using it to defame people certainly is actionable in court.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: pdq
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 02:34 PM

There is a fine line here that some people are blurring.

I believe it is illegal to record voice and conversations. It is not illegal to record images or then all video survaillence
cameras, such as in a banks or convenience stores, would be illegal.

Also, if this is illegal, 60 Minutes has been breaking the same laws for over 40 years.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Bill D
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 02:14 PM

Go to the page Carol C links to and read the PDF files at the bottom, from ACORN's law firm to Fox News.

You will soon see that there is more to the story.
Fox 'may' have broken the law itself by making ANY videos that all parties did not consent to, and possibly by altering them before broadcast.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 02:12 PM

Letters from Acorn's attorney to Roger Ailes, FOX president...


Dear Mr. Ailes:

The Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now ("ACORN") has begun a careful investigation into the doctored videotape being played by FOX News, on line and on the air, allegedly showing an ACORN staffer in Baltimore giving dubious tax advice to people claiming to be a pimp and a prostitute.

It is very clear that the questions being asked are a voiceover, placed on the tape by the film maker. The staffer involved claims that the questions she was asked were not the questions asked by the voiceover online. In face, she denies ever giving tax advice to people identifying themselves as a pimp and a prostitute.

These tapes were clearly filmed several months ago. They are not "news"; they are a form of "art". FOX News certainly had time, if it believed that the tapes had news value, to ask ACORN to review the tapes and to comment about their accuracy.

It is ACORN's position, at this time, that the videotape is doctored and that the voiceovers change the real dialogue. We demand, as counsel to ACORN, that FOX cease publication of these tapes unless it can produce proof that the conversations actually took place.


Dear Mr. Ailes:

As a follow-up to my letter of September 10, 2009 concerning FOX News' publication of videotapes purporting to show ACORN staffers giving tax advice to an actor posing as a prostitute.

After looking at the law, it is our conclusion that the filming and broadcast of the conversations at the Baltimore ACORN offices violates (...)10-42(a)(1) of the Courts and Judicial Proceedings Article of the Maryland Code, which makes it unlawful to willfully intercept, endeavor to intercept, or procure any other person to intercept any oral conversation unless all parties to the communication consent. FOX News, the filmmakers, and the producer of the videos have clearly violated this statute. It is also our belief that the tape broadcast today, involving ACORN's Washington, D.C. office, violates (...)23-542 of the D.C. Code in that the conversation was recorded for no purpose other than to cause injury.

ACORN and the women whose conversations were taped have authorized us to commence an action for damages and injunctive relief addressed to FOX News, the producer of the videos, and the filmmakers. We demand, in advance of that litigation, that FOX immediately withdraw the videos from the air and from the internet until a court rules on the lawfulness of the distribution and broadcast of the videos.

(Links to PDFs contained in the ACORN link in my previous post.)

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 01:55 PM

Statement from Bertha Lewis, Chief Organizer, ACORN Regarding Recent News Reports

The relentless attacks on ACORN's members, its staff and the policies and positions we promote are unprecedented. An international entertainment conglomerate, disguising itself as a "news" agency (Fox), has expended millions, if not tens of millions of dollars, in their attempt to destroy the largest community organization of Black, Latino, poor and working families in the country. It is not coincidence that the most recent attacks have been launched just when health care reform is gaining traction. It is clear they've had these tapes for months.

We are their Willy Horton for 2009. We are the boogeyman for the right-wing and its echo chambers. If ACORN did not exist, the right-wing would have needed to create us in order to achieve their agenda, their missions, their ideal, retrograde America. This recent scam, which was attempted in San Diego, Los Angeles, Miami, New York, Philadelphia to name a few places, had failed for months before the results we've all recently seen. I am appalled and angry; I cannot and I will not defend the actions of the workers depicted in the video, who have since been terminated. But it is clear that the videos are doctored, edited, and in no way the result of the fabricated story being portrayed by conservative activist "filmmaker" O'Keefe and his partner in crime. And, in fact, a crime it was - our lawyers believe a felony - and we will be taking legal action against Fox and their co-conspirators.

We will not be intimidated by this international conglomerate, which has made as its mission the destruction of our organization. ACORN members are committed to the empowerment of their communities - Black, Latino, poor, and working families – at the deepest level. We are an organization committed to halting the foreclosure crisis and keeping people in their homes. We are an organization committed to ensuring quality, affordable health care for every American. We are an organization that will not be stopped in our commitment to our members and our communities...

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 14 Sep 09 - 01:44 PM

Third strike for ACORN:

The scandal surrounding the left-wing activist organization ACORN has spread to New York, with employees at its Brooklyn office caught on video helping supposed ladies of the night get loans for their dream houses of ill repute.

Rather than reminding the women that prostitution is dangerous and illegal and advising them to change their careers, counselors at the social-services group shockingly offer suggestions on how they can launder their earnings.

"Honesty is not going to get you the house," a loan counselor at the offices told two activists posing as a mortgage-seeking pimp and prostitute.

"You can't say what you do for a living."

ACORN workers in two other cities, Baltimore and Washington, DC, had already fallen hooker, line and sinker for the hidden-camera sting operation by two conservative activists.

Four ACORN employees have been fired as a result of the earlier videos, and last Friday the Census Bureau severed its ties with the group, whose members had been hired to do canvassing during the 2010 census.

Mayor Bloomberg spoke out on the controversy today.

"Prostitution is illegal in this state and I don't know why they would -- why an organization like ACORN, who's trying to encourage voter turnout and voter registration, why they're getting involved in any of that stuff," Bloomberg said. "But clearly it's not appropriate and they shouldn't have been doing it. Whether they broke a law or not I don't know. You'll have to talk to the legal (authorities)."............

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Sep 09 - 10:15 PM

It's not that difficult to prove that voter fraud is extremely rare. Allegations of voter fraud (one person attempting to cast a vote under someone else's name) are made quite a lot, and almost none of them turn out to actually be legitimate cases of voter fraud. They almost always turn out to be cases of human error or two people having the same name and birthdate, or people voting by absentee ballot before the election and then dying between the time they send in their vote and the actual election day.

On the other hand, election fraud, one example of which would be purging the voter rolls illegally as has happened in recent elections, is a real problem and has resulted in large numbers of people being disenfranchised.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 13 Sep 09 - 09:03 PM

Carol - How would you ever prove that? LBJ used to laugh and joke, and prided himslelf on winning elections with fraudulent votes.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Sep 09 - 04:17 PM

Whether or not that is true, it has nothing to do with ACORN. However, while there are a lot of accusations of voter fraud in US elections (in particular, those that benefit the Democrats), the vast majority of those accusations are without any basis in fact. There is far more election fraud being engaged in by Republicans, that effects vastly larger numbers of people, than there is people casting votes fraudulently in favor of Democrats.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 13 Sep 09 - 04:13 PM

I would agree, the Democrats gain from large numbers of people voting, whether those voters are legally in the country, properly registered, or vote in multiple precincts doesn't seem to concern them.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Sep 09 - 04:08 PM

The Democrats don't use suppression of votes as a tactic. That tactic doesn't serve them. It only serves the Republicans. The Democrats benefit from large numbers because the majority of people don't benefit from Republican agendas. That's why it is a specifically Republican tactic - republicans don't do as well as the Democrats when there are large voters turnouts.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 13 Sep 09 - 08:48 AM

Of course, isn't that reason enough. The other side does the same kind of thing every chance it gets. That's the beauty of a two party system.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 13 Sep 09 - 12:38 AM

The Republicans are targeting ACORN for one reason only. We know they don't give a shit about any of the things they are accusing ACORN of, because they do many of the same and also many worse things themselves. The only reason the Republicans are gunning for ACORN, is because they register a lot of Democratic voters. Because the agenda of the Republicans is so completely detrimental to the well being of the majority of Americans, and to this country, the only way they can get elected is to suppress the votes of those who vote for Democratic candidates. That's it. That's the only reason.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Sawzaw
Date: 13 Sep 09 - 12:14 AM

Next thing ya know, those brainless jerks will be smoking weed and saying Who cares???

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Bobert
Date: 12 Sep 09 - 06:08 PM

I love it!!!

Here a couple of low level punks might or might not have done something as ACORN volunteeers/employees... Who cares???

I mean, let's keep things in some level of perspective here... Look at the number of Repubs who have been caught doin' stuff that the good reverand said not to do, including trying to solicite homosexual sex... Throw in assholes, who BTW would have been shot or arrested had they been lefties, showing up with guns at protests where the president is speaking... Then you have all the lies... Way too many to keep track of... Death squads and death camps and, henny penny, anything else that anyone can think up and what???

A couple ACORN folks might have........

Beam me up... The Repub apologists have had their brains sucked out by aliens and are now operating completely brainless...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: Riginslinger
Date: 12 Sep 09 - 05:53 PM

Carol, I would agree that Republicans are no better and maybe worse than Democrats. After all, they're all politicians.

               ACORN, on the other hand, could have a meaningful role to play in the public arena if it would tighten up its management and maybe limit itself to things in which it has more experience. Much of the public sees it now as a huge loosely affiliated group controlled by political operatives who are simply in it for what they can get for themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: Spread the Truth About ACORN
From: CarolC
Date: 12 Sep 09 - 02:39 PM

Considering all of the coverup activity that The Family is guilty of, for instance covering up a Republican lawmaker's affair with one of his staffers (and the wife of another staffer), by insisting that they both be paid quite a lot of hush money, I would say that the Republicans are not any better than the Democrats in that respect, either.