BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: The Sandman
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 08:58 AM

if the BNP managed to send all the immigrants away,they would still have economic problems.
the multi nationals would just relocate to where labour was cheapest.
multi nationals will also relocate[if they think it necessary to boost profit],to where they can get away with environmental abuse,and poor working conditions,and where they have to pay less tax,if the skilled work force is not there, they will then attempt to import a skilled workforce.
the policies of the BNP wil have no effect in sorting out the economic problems of Capitalism.
the multi nationals corporations are stronger than any political party including the BNP,
However they can be embarrassed, as Shell have been, by the internet.
focus on the proper enemy,the enemy is the system,not the immigrants.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Gervase
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 09:13 AM

how about answering the questions stacked up at your door before starting some new avoidance tactics.
I think we all now realise that it's BNP policy not to answer questions. Enough have been asked of BNP George, foulplay and the other sock-puppets here, and no answers have been given. They're intellectually and morally bankrupt, it would seem.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 09:45 AM

Their moral and intellectual bankruptcy is not their only problem GW (unfortunate initials, those LOL).

It seems to me their greatest challenge is their apparent lack of friends and supporters, a lack so overwhelming that they are forced to steal identities, and use them to invent fictitious support on a social networking site.

Billy-No-Mates is a social lion by comparison.

WHAT A JOKE THEY ARE!

The day of Griffin's funeral, they'll probably need to import labourers from some African village that's never heard of him, to carry his coffin.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: fairplay
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 09:46 AM

OK, I give in. Mass immigration isn't happening and the country couldn't exist without it. Islam is good for women and gays. The BNP is totally insignificant and a huge threat. The UAF isn't violent or run by the SWP. I have now landed on Planet Madcap and am fully on message.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 09:58 AM

""I have now landed on Planet Madcap and am fully on message.""

NO! You haven't JUST landed. You've been there all along. Welcome to the REAL world, where England is being "swamped" by a total black and Asian contingent that is actually about 4.5 to 5.0 percent of the total population. CATASTROPHE? THE END OF CIVILIZATION AS WE KNOW IT?

NO actually. The jobs they have taken are the ones English people don't want to do for themselves.

I remember well the years when I couldn't get a pint of milk, or a loaf of bread, after 6.00pm.

My local corner shop stays open till 10.00pm.

What is the difference? Well it's run by a nice, hardworking Asian family, and very handy it is to have them available, with everything from food to fusewire. Washing up liquid to falling down liquid (booze).

They are making this country such an awful place to live in....NOT!

I'd say, on balance, better keep th immigrants.......AND DEPORT THE BNP!

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Royston
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 10:12 AM

Now we are making progress, Fairplay.

OK, I give in. Mass immigration isn't happening and the country couldn't exist without it. Islam is good for women and gays. The BNP is totally insignificant and a huge threat. The UAF isn't violent or run by the SWP. I have now landed on Planet Madcap and am fully on message

Mass immigration: you're right it is NOT happening. Not at least in any way that can be described as "mass", "unfettered" or "swamping".

Islam / Women: That some Muslims are misogynists does not make *Islam* or *all muslims* misogynistic. Because they dress and think differently to Europeans does not make *all muslim women* suppressed or down-trodden. If you took the trouble to get to know your Muslim neighbours you would see that family dynamics are pretty bloody similar to Europeans. Man of the house gets his ego massaged (if he's lucky) while everything gets done the way the missus wants it.

Islam / Gays: When was the last time you saw or heard a Muslim in the media, courts or press or on the streets of this country making life miserable for gays? Never, or rarely. However, the homegrown Aryan Christians - constantly banging on about hellfire, damnation and actively going to the courts for the right - THE RIGHT - to disriminate against gays in the provision of public services: The recent case of public sevants refusing to enable same-sex civil partnerships being just one example. So, yes I am pretty comfortable about my Muslim neighbours on that front; they are entitled to their private views and they keep them pretty private.

BNP: Insignificant now, but a real growing danger if left unchecked.

UAF: Not violent - you keep alluding to this violence but you never give an example. Because there isn't one. I don't regard throwing eggs at Griffin as violent. UAF is not run by the SWP. There are a lot of stakeholders, the largest is the UCU and the long list of unions that support it via the TUC. Most left wing political figures and activists have their roots in SWP. So do I. I left it about 15 years ago because I disagreed with it. What IS your point?

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Lox
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 10:20 AM

Ask a Moslem woman if Islam is good for women ...


Then provide evidence of UAF aggression.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 11:23 AM

I don't know whether you would class this as "evidence", but all I can do is cite acouple of cases from my locality.
You misrepresented me by saying.."Your point of view is that the government uses immigration as a tool to bring wage ratesdown"..when what I actually said was "the govt encourages immigration to control wage rates"....as you may know it is illegal to force workers to except less than the minimum wage.

I mentioned earlier about the many fish farms round here who pay the minimum wage, they used to employ local workers on the minimum wage...which is basically starvation wages.
The fish farm company decided to keep the minimum wage rate yet increase the number of hours worked for some and bring in short term contract work for others....this being advantageous to the farm company financial terms, but means that the workers were left with less money at the end of the week.

A dispute started which ended with some of the workers leaving and the rest returning to work on the new terms.
The shortfall in staff is made up by bussing in 25 Eastern European workers daily from the nearest town....by public transport of course subsidised by the taxpayer.

The most common other cases are in the building trade.
A local developer had run short of cash and applied to an agency which suppies Polish building workers at £10 per hr, far below the daywork rate for a local tradesman.....the job took months to complete....in fact it was never properly finished as the Polish gang disappeared before completion.
I was asked by the developer to finish the job and on inspection I found it to be a real "botch up" the workers involved were obviously not tradesmen. I finished the job to the best of my ability but much of the work will need to be undone.
The deveoper is very angry, but as I said to him,"did you really expect to get a decent tradesman for £10 per hour?

This scenario is occuring on quite a large scale in Scotland.

I also know quite a lot about the Asian community especially in Glasgow, who are indeed very hardworking, but the problem my Goan friend tells me is a social one.....the Asians have no intention of integrating with the indigenous Glasgow people whom they see as people of low morallity, given to drunkeness, violence and godlessness, in fact, as you "liberals" would say they are bigotted against the Scots.

I expect you to start a new thread complaining about this forthwith!

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 11:38 AM

Royston. "BNP: Insignificant now, but a real growing danger if left unchecked."

I don't think it's possible to overstate the growing danger of the BNP, and of the other European fascist parties. At the moment, the BNP consists of a hard core of several hundred nutters, with proven unpleasant fascist credentials. They are surrounded by a much larger coterie of politically naive and largely passive members. Most of this lot appear to be little more than card carriers, and I'd guess that an awful lot of them are in fact lapsed members. Their electoral successes have been few and minimum. They have taken a number of council seats, with a high proportion of re-election failures; they won two seats in the Euro elections, purely because the Labour vote collapsed; and in the Norwich North by-election they were right down there with the lunatic fringe, on just 2.74% of the vote.

On current performance therefore, the BNP is highly dismissable as a gang of right wing lunatics who will never pose a threat to anyone.

The problem is that Griffin and co know perfectly well they will never get elected to government via constitutional means. They are in fact merely marking time until they can acheive their ends by unconsitutional means.

Their theories are founded on a combination of nazi white supremacism and something called survivalism. This is an idea, which started going the rounds of the far right about thirty years ago, namely that western society is decadent and doomed and headed for collapse. The BNP's take on this is the collapse will be brought about by a combination of economic chaos, oil shortages, climate change, and mass civil disorder. In other words they are planning to claw their way into power on the back of the same kind of socio/economic nightmare which was 1920s Germany.

How far their prognosis will prove correct of course is anybody's guess, but I would certainly tick at least two of those boxes. In other words there's worrying time ahead, and if they ever acheive their aim, then God help us.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Royston
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 11:57 AM

Ake, I think your last post is a long way beneath your intellect

the Asians have no intention of integrating with the indigenous Glasgow people

Define your "integration". Do you want a Muslim to start drinking alcolhol or if, a woman, to start getting her tits out for the lads on a Friday night? A presbyterian or baptist Christian (both churches prevalent in Scotland) would be a lot closer to the Muslims in their views of society than many secular scots. So why do have to single out Muslims for some extraordinary expectation that they should have to become a brown-skinned facsimile of a working-class white folk? Do you not see that your mind is running on a set of racist preconceptions?

So one builder got a load of cheap Poles to bugger up a job. What about the crap English that have buggering up jobs in greater numbers for a longer time. In the last year I've had my car repaired after an accident, new fences put in and trees cut back, and the whole house decorated...by Poles...and compared to *some* of the crap British contractors I've endured over the years, they've all been a bloody breath of fresh air.

Again we see your preconceptions. To you there just has to be one "bad" Pole, Muslim, African etc etc and you think you've got "the lot of them worked out". We all know there are crap builders all over the world. I have found - as have a lot of people - that Eastern Europeans have skills and work ethics that are lacking in this country; that's why they have come here and that's why they have been largely succesful here.

By the way, you said that a private employer employed these Poles through a private agency and they took public transport to work. What on earth was your point about public subsidy? What...fare-paying foreigners should be excluded from public transport. Ake, are you taking us back to southern USA apartheid now?

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: jeddy
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 12:24 PM

i think what ake was trying to get at is that SOME of the immigrants that live in this country don't try to learn the language or try to make conversation when sitting on a bus, whatever. someof them don't invite the nieghbours to join their kids in paddling pools,or round for tea.

please don't shout at me saying that there are white folks like this, I KNOW THAT! but i think it maybe is more obvious when an immigrant does it, don't ask me why, but it seems to be.

when any group of people try to make their own comunity(?) others always feel on the outside of it, i wonder if this is why there is a seemed devide?

i might not be able to understand someone very well but am alaways happy when someone makes the effort to talk to me.

take care all

jade x x x x

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 12:55 PM

Excellent my dear, you *are* becoming a real liberal and a bit of a star into the bargain.....:0)
Royston you are pathetic! I made it clear that the statement was made by my Indian friend who has many aquaintances in the Asian community

The story about the cheap workers was to provide a bit of evidence requested by Lox....I am well aware that there are cowboy workers in Britainthe point is that these people were vetted by an agency and prepared to work for much less than UK tradesmen....This is relatively common in Scotland don't sound so surprised.
The fact that they happened to be Poles is incidental they could have been any nationality of immigrants prepared to work for less money than locals.
I was answering Lox's point about wage rates and Don T's point about multiculturalism. The rest of your post is abusive nonesense.

What a joke! you ask me for evidence that the immigration encouraged by Blair and Co affected wage rates, and when I do so you brand me a bigot!

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 01:16 PM

I'm the kind of gobby sod that will start up a conversation with just about anybody, on just about any subject.

I talk to people, and if they indicate that they are not interested, I drop it.

I'd have to say that the proportion of Asians, Muslims, Jews, Christians, whatever, who are prepared to interact is roughly the same, whatever their origins.

Muslim women, are ill treated in my experience, just about in the same proportion as Christian women, and never make the mistake of believing that all muslim women wearing the Burka, are forced to do so.

In fact the reverse is true. Most muslim women are brought up to a degree of modesty that white women have not seen since pre World War One, and covering up is natural to their way of life.

The number that are oppressed is most likely about equivalent to the number of battered white women. The point is that bad news being good news for the Media, those are the ones you hear about.

As for integrating into Scottish society, wouldn't that be better left until AFTER you integrate all the Rab C Nesbitt clones, who have as yet not been assimilated?

Meanwhile try a little old-fashioned "Live and let Live".

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Lox
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 01:16 PM

From: akenaton - PM
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 03:26 AM

Paragraph 3

" ... immigration used as a tool to control wage rates is bad policy ..."

Maybe you misrepresent yourself.



I'll come back to the rest later.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: The Sandman
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 01:33 PM

here is something interesting.
the irish government has spent 150 thousand euros deporting an asylum seeker to Ghana,plus 36 thousand deporting a Georgian man in march,a total of 1 .2 million was spent deporting 264 people since the start of 2008.
that is 1.2 million,that could have been spent on the health serviceand other social services.
plus the millions they have wasted on useless electronic voting machines.
has the BNP thought what the cost would be of deporting all the people they consider undesirable,or would they indulge in a bit of ethnic cleansing.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Royston
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 01:47 PM

No, Ake, you don't get away with that.

IF you were just making a point about wage-rates then you would have stopped the story at the local developer who employed people at £10/hr, a lot less than the "going rate".

But you chose to carry on with a load of stuff about the quality of work and you made a fatuous comment about them being subsidised by the taxpayer when, in fact, you just meant that they travelled on a public bus, like everyone else. So what is your point again Ake?

Then on the issue of your celebrated Goan friend, this "integration" is clearly something close to your heart because you chose to offer this as criticism of Glasgow Asians. Why should they not be entitled to be clean-living, alcohol-free, religious people? Go on Ake, why not? I love my drink - fine wine and real ale - but I am rarely drunk, never violent, never antisocial. I look down on town-centre yob & drinking culture. Most people do. So what's your point Ake?

Then, most wonderful of all, having established (doh!) that Muslims and some other asians don't like drinking and loutish behaviour - YOU made the link that these asians must therefore be prejudiced against Scots: so YOU ascribe these attributes to all Scots do you Ake?

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 01:51 PM

Royston and Don .....You seem to have absolutely no problem denigrating British steriotypes yet become incadescent over perceived steriotyping of foreign nationals.....How curious!

Lox.... "control wage rates"is correct.... you said "lower wage rates" something, which for most low paid workers, is impossible.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:12 PM

The point I was making is that on under the minimum wage people travelling to work would never be able to afford the forty mile bus fare, the fact that it is heavily subsidised allows them to do so, while locals club together in cars.
In other words the taxpayer subsidy is assisting in the undercutting of local labour.....nothing to do with racism or Southern segregation
I can't believe you really said that...and meant it.

You Royston were the one who started making disparaging remarks about British women    "Do you want a Muslim to start drinking alcolhol or if, a woman, to start getting her tits out for the lads on a Friday night?"

I dont denigrate Glasgow Asians for their lifestyle, but they obviously do not want to integrate for the reasons my friend has given!


Who *are* the bigots here!

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Royston
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:14 PM

No Ake, you don't get away with that either.

Show one instance where I have set up ANY stereotype to be denigrated.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:20 PM

British women are prepared to get their tits out on a friday night!

I think you're just living in hope Royston!

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Royston
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:22 PM

Ake,

the question by me:

"Do you want a Muslim to start drinking alcolhol or if, a woman, to start getting her tits out for the lads on a Friday night?"

Says nothing about any person or group of people. I asked it in response to your suggestion that Asians were somehow not integrating because they disapproved of drunken and "immoral" behaviour. My question is, and was, what do you want asians to do, that they might qualify as "integrating". I over-estimated you.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:28 PM

Crap British builders with an inadequate work ethic??

and dont think I'm letting you off with that last cop out!... I know what you meant :0)

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:32 PM

Jeddy won't like you talkin' about young ladies "tits" either :0(

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:34 PM

OK Ake, you've caught Royston making ONE throwaway comment, which a purist such as yourself might consider denigratory.

But you said Royston and Don.

Where do you feel you've achieved a moral elevation relative to me?

As far as I am aware, the only adverse comment I have made on this thread relates to the BNP, and with respect, I would insist that nothing I have said could possibly denigrate that filthy crowd.

Based on their own words and actions, there would seem to be little or nothing that could be said to make them look worse than they actually ARE.

And, those who support them, no matter how you rationalise it (and rationalisation is YOUR speciality), must be aware of the obnoxious aims and objectives of those they support, and are therefor tacitly agreeing to a fascist, and racist doctrine.

No way out Ake. Lie down with dogs, and you get fleas.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:35 PM

Ah'm away fur ma tea noo ...jist gie me a shout if the smellin' salts work....:0)

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Royston
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:36 PM

No Ake,

You introduced the crap polish builder, I introduced the existence of *SOME* crap British builders I've come across. I was extremely careful about that, go back and read it again Ake.

What you *THINK* you know (in response to your "I know what you meant" comment) is largely irrelevant and certainly a product of your *apparent* tendency to see the world in "nudge nudge" stereotypes; it is nothing to do with my arguments or carefully chosen words.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Royston
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:38 PM

Don,

OK Ake, you've caught Royston making ONE throwaway comment, which a purist such as yourself might consider denigratory

He certainly has not!

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Lox
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 02:42 PM

OK,

I don't need to ask any Goan friends for opinions on the views of Asians.

First of all, when you talk about Asians I presume you mean people from the Indian sub continent as opposed to Chinese, Japanes, Thai, Vietnamese or any of the other groups of Asian immigrants in the UK.

Second of all, when you talk about people from the Indian sub-continent, do you mean Pakistanis, Indians or Bangladeshis?

Thirdly, are you talking about Moslems, Hindu's, Sikhs or (in the case of many Goans) Roman Catholics?

Lets narrow it down to the "Moslem Community" for the sake of argument.

Firstly, it should be noted that Goa is a primarily Roman Catholic and Hindu region, so I would venture that your friend isn't a Muslim - would I be right?

regardless of this I would still have no need to give him pride of place as any kind of expert witness.

As you may have noted from threads on this subject that I have contributed to in the past, I spent many years Living in Leicester.

Leicester contains the largest South Asian demographic outside London.

During my time in Leicester, I spent a year and a half living on Bridge road, which is a side road next to the intersection between East Park Road and Green Lane Road.

This area of Leicester is known for being populated almost exclusively by people with their origins in the Indian sub-continent.

This includes 2nd and 3rd generation "British - Asians", the ancestors of whom come from India, Pakistan and Bangladesh as well as Uganda, Kenya and Tanzania.

It also includes recent Immigrants from India, Pakistan and Bangladesh.

There are numerous Mosques, Hindu Temples and Sikh Temples.

I would sometimes see no white faces for days at a time except when I went to work or into town.

What was their collective homogenous political viewpoint?

Well lets start with the Muslims ...

... well they didn't share the same opinions on anything ... they were like you and me - they all had their own opinions and disagreed vehemently with each other just as you and I do, and they were all intelligent and informed as you and I are, and some of them were rich and some poor and some Labour and some Tory ...

One example was two shops that existed on opposite sides of the same street.

One of them sold a drink called Qibla Cola.

I was informed that Qibla-Cola was being produced as a deliberate way of undermining the hold of Coke and Pepsi on the local cola market.

It was a politically motivated product that offered an alternative to the discerning Moslem.

The shop on the oher side of the road sold Coke and Pepsi. When quizzed, the proprieter told me that the Qibla is the name of the sacred Black stone in Mecca and that he viewed Qibla-Cola as a cynical and blasphemous exploitation of a culturally sensitive and religiously significant icon.

I knew the names of every kid on my street and their parents and they knew me - it was like a Hovis Advert but the Families were all from the Indian subcontinent whether directly or indirectly.

My neighbours and friends in the area were warm hearted generous honest kind people who I will always remember with fondness.

When I was in court over custody of my little girl, the entire street was prepared to come and testify on my behalf.


Now!!



Here's the point.

When I went into town and spoke to white Leicester folk, I often heard the criticism that they isolate themselves and don't integrate and think they're better and ...

... basically all the stuff that your expert witness apparently told you about the "asian" community in scotland.


Like you, the people I heard it from did not live there and never went there but shared second hand testimony gleaned from Asian Mates


There was a shop three doors down from my house that was run by a man called Shabir and his Wife Shahida, They had tw daughters called Mariam and Hadra who played with my little Girl.

Why did they bringg their kids to work?

Because they lived in a white area and couldn't play outside their home without receiving abuse.

They were 6 and 4 respectively at the time.

They had Shit put through their letterbox, they had "Al Qaeda" painted on thheir Garden wall, they had eggs thrown at them ... etc etc etc ...


They never once showed me any resentment for being one of "them" but were in fact extremely happy that they could show their kids evidence that white people aren't all so cruel.


This testimony is my honest truthful experience in a very restrictive nutshell, curtailed mainly by the need to go and make dinner.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: GUEST,stringsinger
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 03:40 PM

They may have increased their votes but they will never
represent the British people in their diversity. It's kinda' like Sarah Palin, here. There are the hard-core followers and the people
who sort of laugh at the silliness of it all.

The British Nationalist Party has to remain conclusively
a oxymoron. It's kind of like the moral majority here, neither moral or a majority.

Frank

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 03:49 PM

Agree with you entirely, Frank. Except for one important point that I raised right at the start of this overlong thread. The number of people voting for the BNP didn't increase, it decreased. The problem is that people stayed away from the polling stations in droves and the votes for the other parties decreased even more. They got in as a result of increased abstention, not increased votes. Now, I'm a bit of a fan of the old anarchist motto, "Don't vote, it only encourages them," but the downside of this is it assists some quite unpleasant specimens to slither out from under the stones. A few more votes for the Green Party (one of the only vaguely socialist parties in the UK) then we'd have a very different story in the north west of England.

Happy birthday, by the way. I always enjoy your posts.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: jeddy
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 04:15 PM

ake, :)

nice post lox,

it is awful that kids of every skin colour and every nationalilty can't play out all together.
if left to the kids themselves i don't think there would be a problem.

after all how much language is needed for tag or kerbie?

it seems to be us adults( and for myself i use the term very loosly) that seem to have the problem. some people think tht walking past a group of teenagers is threatening, but when you think about it they are just hanging out. this is the same for any group of people, it is the them and us thing. at festies it is folkies and locals. in inner cities it is still them and us.you will always have it, but we should try to make it decent people and wankers WHATEVER colour of nationalilty they happen to be.

if someone doesn't talk to me i tend to think of them as a snob or above chats no matter what the skin colour.
we have never been afraid to go into shops run by asians, or anyone else. the thing that gets me no matter what, is the loss of manners. if someone smiles at you it is polite to smile back.

i am not above making assumptions about people, no matter where they come from, we all do it but it is on what grounds we are judging someone that makes the difference.

i understand why if you are in a diferent country you would want to stick with those who are similar to you and speak your native tongue. we are all programmed to seek out others who are the same as us, the hard bit is trying to get out of the habit!


oh yes... tits while i like them, i do prefere them on someone who has a modicum of self respect!   i too look down on those who go out get bladdered and get into trouble. i don't mind the odd flash but when sober please so you can at least remember who you have done it to!

ithink that both me and my other half were born one generation too late, as we seem to have the morals of our elders.. *dig* :)

it might seem like i am backtracking but i am trying to understand the way i look at things.

take care all

jade x x x x

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Lox
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 04:20 PM

"if someone smiles at you it is polite to smile back."

In our culture ...


Something my Greek friends constantly find hilarious to the point of tedium is the British tendency to sa "sorry" at just about every given opportunity ...

... sorry can I get that basket, sorry but do you know where the toilets are etc etc etc ...

... Something that has always worked for me no matter who I am talking to or where has been making eye contact and being polite and friendly.

Every now and then you meet someone with a problem, but they do not fall into racial or cultural categories.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: fairplay
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 04:44 PM

Don T

I'm with you. Immigration policy should be based on shopping convenience.

Fairplay on Planet Madcap

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: jeddy
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 04:53 PM

see now why can't i sound that concise and to the point?

jade x x x x

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: jeddy
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 04:58 PM

sorry if that was a little short lol, or maybe hehehe.

j x x x

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Lox
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 05:02 PM

How Ironic that fairplay, an advocate of English nationalism, should be so utterly inept at English comprehension.

Maybe that's the problem - these foreigners with their good educations are showing him up.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 05:46 PM

""I'm with you. Immigration policy should be based on shopping convenience.

Fairplay on Planet Madcap""

If you are trying to prove that you are a toatal fool, congratulations. It's working.

The shopping isn't the point. The propensity for working hard, paying their way, and fitting very easily and usefully into the local community, entirely contrary to the stereotype presented by yourself and others, THAT'S the point you clown.

The only good thing about your posts on this thread is the fact that youy submit consistently as a member, and not as an anonymous guest. If you can learn to weed out some of the racist drivel, that might help.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: GUEST,Russ Meyer
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 03:08 AM

Is there either point or meaning to the recent posts above ?
Name calling, lies and back slapping is all I see. I don't think I have ever read such a load of * in my life.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Gervase
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 03:17 AM

Aye, plenty of lies. All of them from the BNP sock-puppets. Care to answer any of the questions? Oops! Sorry, I forgot; the BNP refuses to answer questions, doesn't it "Russ"?

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Royston
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 04:21 AM

I have to agree with Gervase, Russ. You've come here, rolled out a few tired bits of old racist claptrap, had it all blown away with evidence, refused to answer any of the questions and now all you've got left is to complain that the subject was allowed to be discussed.

Well, this is why the BNP vote is reducing and its why it will continue. All you've got, Russ, is a thin tissue of lies over your corrosive prejudice and malice towards those different to you. You are easily exposed as a sham and you have nothing of substance or of value with which to counter the removal of your lies.

Whatever the arena in which the BNP chooses to try to sell its poison (like trying to appopriate folk music and dance) there will be plenty of decent and intelligent folk (like the FaF member) ready to shove it straight back at you!

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: jeddy
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 07:20 AM

has anyone else heard of this gay mass shooting in ....televive(?) i think i could be wrong. i just caught a headline so i am not sure.

this is the sort of thing the BNP will approve of, cleansing the world of undesirables.

take care all

jade x x x x

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: The Sandman
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 08:30 AM

in answer to the original poster.
disillusionment with the main parties,economic hardship,lack of understanding that the BNP policies,will not produce an economic revival.
it would appear that the BNP has not gained votes,but that other parties votes were down,whereas the small support of the BNP remained static,so that could be interpreted as apathy or people refusing to vote as a protest.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: GUEST,Russ Meyer
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 08:53 AM

Not sure Jade, but there was a shooting in Tel Aviv.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: jeddy
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 08:59 AM

that's the one. i knew there was a V in there somewhere. anyone know of any details yet?

jade x x x x x

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: GUEST,Russ Meyer
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 10:36 AM

From Reuters "Israel's gay community was rocked on Sunday by the killing of two people in a homosexual and lesbian youth centre and the possibility they fell victim to a hate crime in the Jewish state's most freewheeling city.

"The biggest shock is to think that it happened in Tel Aviv, which is the most tolerant city in the country.

Witnesses said a masked gunman clad in black opened fire on Saturday night in a basement club belonging to the Tel Aviv Gay and Lesbian Association, which was hosting a weekly event for teenage gays.

The attacker killed a 26-year-old man and a 16-year-old girl and wounded 13 people before fleeing, hospital officials said.

"He simply fired all over the place," Or Gil, 16, told the YNet news website. "At first I thought it was prank, or a toy gun. After the killings, it was quiet, completely silent and then people came to help the wounded."

Police said they were still searching for the attacker and that the shooting was not an anti-Israeli attack by a Palestinian but gave no other details, citing a court order banning publication of details of the investigation.

Tel Aviv Mayor Ron Huldai said the motive for the shooting was still unclear.

If the incident proves to be a hate crime, it will mark the most serious attack against the gay community in Israel's history.

Condemning what he called a "horrific killing," Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told his cabinet: "We are a tolerant, democratic country governed by the rule of law and we must respect each and every person."

GAY PRIDE

Although coastal, cosmopolitan Tel Aviv has a bustling gay scene, open homosexuality is less welcome in conservative areas.

Annual gay pride parades in Jerusalem meet with often violent protests from ultra-Orthodox Jews, who view homosexuality as an abomination against God.

Four years ago, an ultra-Orthodox Jew stabbed three parade participants in Jerusalem. They survived. The attacker is serving a 12-year prison term.

Nitzan Horowitz, an openly gay legislator, said he had no doubt there was a connection between the latest killings and what he termed incitement against the gay community in Israel.

"We demand that the government put an end to this hate campaign and that the Education Ministry institute proper information and education at schools in order to prevent the recurrence of such shameful events," Horowitz said.

Despite anti-gay sentiments among some religious Jews in Israel, gays serve openly in the military. Israel accords same-sex couples a measure of legal recognition and cohabitation rights, though Orthodox religious authorities control formal nuptials in the country.

An 18-year-old woman, who gave her name only as Alona, said she ran outside at the sound of gunfire.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 10:39 AM

Would all right thinking people who live in areas of England that have had their area swamped by mass immigration, please leave this thread now. Then the remaining Guardian readers can continue to preen and massage each other in private.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: GUEST,William Kempe
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 11:01 AM

Quote - NO actually. The jobs they have taken are the ones English people don't want to do for themselves.

But us English wouldn't work at those poor wages, and quite rightly so when we have mortgages and families to feed !
If we were given opportunities to do the same work in a different country for approximately 5x the wages we'd receive at home, I'm sure we'd all jump at the chance . .

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: jeddy
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 11:23 AM

i never thought i would be saying this but.. thanks russ. i never thought to look for myself, i am still getting used to this pc lark.
well, that plus i am bloody lazy!!

jade x x x

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 11:28 AM

Paco Rabanne said: "Would all right thinking people who live in areas of England that have had their area swamped by mass immigration, please leave this thread now. Then the remaining Guardian readers can continue to preen and massage each other in private."

Please share with us your evidence of "swamping"... And then let us know what your definition of "swamping" is. At least we'll have a clear idea what's going on in your head.

Subject: RE: BS: So why has the BNP gained votes?
From: GUEST,Russ Meyer
Date: 02 Aug 09 - 11:31 AM

No, problems Jade, glad to help.

Paco Rabanne, I'm with you on that one, as I said earlier, leave them to slap eachother on the back. Sounds like you live in an area much like my own. Did you ever reflect back twenty years and look at your area now ? I know I do and it bloody angers me.