BS: Vegan mudcatters

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 03 Nov 14 - 08:58 AM

just spent a delightful musical weekend with a wonderful buffet... great for omnivours and vegetarians alike. However, for the few vegans present and those with specific food requirements, it was a challenge for the staff to meet everyone's needs. By Sunday they had it worked out pretty well, but it made slim pickings for a day.

If I were setting up the menu, I think I would have served polenta with grilled mushrooms and other seasonal vegetables.... or risotto along the same lines.

Then I wondered if a peanut stew or gumbo would be appealing. The roux is made with flour and oil, browned to the desired color so it forms the proper base to be used with a rich vegetable broth. Any thoughts?

One vender there is from Senegal and we discussed the foods available there... rice, fish and more fish. Meat is a luxury. He laughed about how he would be so sick of fish, but now here it's a treat.
My later thought was about how a not for profit group is working to make golden rice available to countries like Senegal that suffer from serious and potentially fatal Vitamin A deficiencies... and the opposition to this from groups who equate GMO with Frankenstein scenerios. Reluctance from farmers is mostly because the yields are lower than their regular varieties. They need the income from larger yields. Never an easy answer it seems.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 03 Nov 14 - 02:10 AM

Ed, homemade Spicy Beanburgers are IMO miles better than the ones you get in the frozen vegetarian foods isle. If I pan fry (which I usually do, and which is a calorific but much tastier option) I will often serve them straight onto a hearty bed of salad greens or crispy slaw dressed with coriander (or whatever I have) and lime, and miss out the potatoes and bread rolls that they usually get partnered with.

I use onions and peppers finely diced and fried in a little oil, mashed cooked kidney beans, sweetcorn (usually drained tinned for convenience), sufficient oats / and or breadcrumbs for a firmish dough - you're after the texture of playdough (a flabby beanburger is a nasty thing), and I use finely crushed tortilla chips to coat them. Lots of chilli, cumin and salt (yes the evil salt) in there too.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 03 Nov 14 - 01:57 AM

Let us know if you cook anything SRS?

Otherwise, vegans or dairy excluders/reducers may be interested in this latest study on milk, currently doing the rounds: Not so good for bones after all?

Or you can read the original article in the British Medical Journal

"a new study from researchers in Uppsala University in Sweden suggests that consuming more milk could actually be associated with higher mortality and bone fractures in women and higher mortality in men.
   "I've looked at fractures during the last 25 years. I've been puzzled by the question because there has again and again been a tendency of a higher risk of fracture with a higher intake of milk," said the study's lead author Karl Michaelsson, a professor at Uppsala University.
   The study, published in the British Medical Journal, utilized data from two large, long-term Swedish studies of adult men and women, which asked about their dietary habits -- how much and what types of milk and dairy products they consumed.
   Women who consumed three or more glasses of milk a day had a higher risk of fracture and a higher risk of death. Men who drank three or more glasses of milk a day had a slightly higher risk of death -- mostly associated with cardiovascular death -- compared to those who drank less than one glass a day. And there was no reduced risk of fracture as milk consumption increased."

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 01 Nov 14 - 05:08 PM

Whoa - that's quite a hefty cookbook. It filled my mailbox yesterday. I look forward to reading through and planning a few new dishes.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 01 Nov 14 - 04:58 AM

Apparently, it's World Vegan Day today.

By way of celebration, The Independent newspaper has a few recipies which may interest people here.

Whilst I'm certainly no vegan, I think that the Spicy Burgers look particularly good.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: olddude
Date: 31 Oct 14 - 12:54 PM

hey
but they are only good in a month that has an R in it. Or is it ARRRR

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 31 Oct 14 - 02:37 AM

Oldude, that must be the Merlot talking! I thought vegans were supposed to make terrible eating?

You can't fatten the buggers up on a diet of lentils and kale! There's no tasty muscle tissue or fat to be had. All scrawny and composed of bone and sinew.
Plus have you seen how unhealthy their hair and skin is; pale skin, lank hair.

I wouldn't eat that!*









*Kidding, none of the vegans or vegetarians I've known have fallen into this stereotype.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: olddude
Date: 30 Oct 14 - 08:01 PM

I like mashed potatoes and fried vegan great with a nice merlow.

. Hannibal lecter

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 30 Oct 14 - 12:01 PM

I have a couple of types of quinoa at the house, and really like the dark variety, it's nutty tasting and cooks well in the rice cooker.

I've always been an oatmeal eater, and in the last couple of years have switched to steel cut oats. They take longer to cook and it's easy to scorch if you're not vigilant at the stovetop, so I have a small crockpot with low wattage that I set up overnight. The oats and some cut up dates and a little salt are topped by the appropriate amount of boiling water. By morning it is perfect.

I bring garden surplus to work and hand out to coworkers. It's a pleasure to see someone get all giddy about a pound of okra or a beautiful smooth eggplant picked only hours earlier. I have plenty at home to cut up, cook, freeze, can, etc. Sharing the wealth is a good thing. We are entering the second tomato season of the year.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 30 Oct 14 - 08:16 AM

Amaranth was a major grain in pre-Columbian Mexico. Must be cooked for digestability, but not all that hard to grow. Leaves are also edible... but not well suited to mechanical harvesting like cereal crops.

I find it a bit bland on its own, but it can be blended in with other flours. Biodiversity in food stocks is a very good idea and should be encouraged.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 30 Oct 14 - 04:40 AM

And the App for Android Phones:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.fatsecret.android&hl=en_GB

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 30 Oct 14 - 04:27 AM

SRS: "considering cutting out a lot of meat, looking for alternate sources of food protein,"

As I posted above, believe it or not you don't actually need a lot of protein. Only 46g a day for adult females. All food sources have some protein content, as such you're only likely to become protein deficient if you're very malnourished, or in other words, starving.

Otherwise, for vegetarians all forms of dairy and eggs are high in protein. While strict vegan sources include beans (legumes), nuts and seeds, and all forms of soya (including beans, tofu, milk and tempeh.) Wheat protein or gluten ('Buddhist Meat') is another popular vegan meat sub, though naturally not suited to those with gluten intolerance. Lastly quinoa, that South American grain (actually a seed, but never mind) I've mentioned a couple of times here, is high in protein.

For those going full on vegan, and concerned about their nutrient intake, a food logger is a good idea. There are a number of free online sites where you can track your daily intake of all nutrients, including protein. I use FatSecret, but there's also Cronometer and MyFitnessPal to name a couple of others.

Fat Secret Food Log

Food logging is quite a good idea if you're just interested in observing your food habits. If wanting to lose or maintain weight, it helps to get a picture of where your excess calories may be coming from for example. As well as how much saturated fat, salt or sugar you may be routinely ingesting without really being aware of it. It also encourages honest self-appraisal for those who may either over eat (or indeed under eat) for whatever reason; whether due to snacking, nibbling, inappropriate portion sizes, alcohol, sugary drinks and so-on. I think their a very useful tool. And as said, good for those anxious about getting enough of the right nutrients if making dietary shifts, such as going vegan.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 29 Oct 14 - 08:27 PM

Ye gods yes, those damned avocados! Can't trust the things at all if you're having people round. You can get them to what you think is the perfect ripeness, or even buy those "ripe and ready" ones - but there's the severe danger that, when you cut into them, they will be seriously blackened, or very fibrous, or both, inside. I always buy twice as many as I think I need. If things are good I secretly eat approx. an avocado and a half in the kitchen before serving up the grub, unbeknowns to the missus.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 29 Oct 14 - 02:48 PM

a friend who is Greek Orthodox observes Lent in their tradition, which is pretty much vegan for 40 days. They seem to have degrees of observance for meatless and fasting. Makes giving up chocolate for Lent seem only for wimps.

when we have musical get togethers, the potluck meals are wild because of the food restrictions for so many of the folks. each dish ends up with a label to keep it safe.

so I guess there really is no one answer for everyone... what is great for one person can kill the next guy or at least end them up in the ER.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 29 Oct 14 - 02:34 PM

I'm not impressed with the Peruvian avocados. They don't ripen as easily and aren't as creamy. It appears to be another product picked too early and shipped too far.

North Texas is a very good climate for eggplant, tomatoes, peppers, okra, and much more. Summer is so hot everything kind of languishes, but fall is glorious with cooler days. The first frost is typically in mid-November.

Perhaps not vegan, but considering cutting out a lot of meat, looking for alternate sources of food protein, and looking for healthy meat that doesn't come from feed lots, confining pens, etc. It might be considered progress.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 29 Oct 14 - 02:09 PM

"Once I decided that I wasn't risking hellfire for eating meat, I only go vegetarian if it's a normal part of the dish I'm having... and a little meat on the side helps keep it all in balance."

It would appear that there is only one vegan mudcatter on this thread!

Though I veer towards being more 'vegan' (or rather more correctly, I tend to either exclude or minimise animal-products most days of the week, but that's just too many words to type) than not on most days, I currently still eat fish about once a week.

We had steamed salmon fillets tonight along with a large chilli, garlic and ginger laced winter vegetable and wholewheat noodle stir fry. Boof, am I stuffed. Finished of the Swedish Glace too.

Lunch was surprisingly good, I had a Peruvian style quinoa salad packed into avocado halves; so not an animal product heavy day overall, barring the wild salmon fillet. Plenty of those 'good' fats today too.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Oct 14 - 09:48 AM

LOL...

Pasta Fagioli - A traditional Italian soup. Serve with a crisp salad and a hot loaf of garlic bread and you have a meal! Serve with grated Parmesan cheese on top."

look up trattoria recipes... quick & easy & nourishing. ceci in a tomato base soup with rosemary. broad beans simmered with finely sliced fennel or just the leafy tops, smoked ham optional.

the one legume I have a problem with is fava... genetics there, so I just do without.

Lentil soup was a standard, love the smokey flavor of the ham. Lentils are also prominant in Indian dishes. And you don't need to soak them overnight.

Once I decided that I wasn't risking hellfire for eating meat, I only go vegetarian if it's a normal part of the dish I'm having... and a little meat on the side helps keep it all in balance.

That's my motto... keep it all in balance and moderation. And avoid the artificial krap - period...

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 29 Oct 14 - 09:13 AM

Sgeek: "back when I was a kid & we had meatless Fridays, pasta ceci was a favorite dish... elbow macaroni with marinara sauce and chickpeas..."

I've only recently discovered the blessed combo of pulses with pasta (yes, I know, forgetting minestrone). Of course the Italians have been doing it for donks, but it's not the kind of food you often see promoted on telly / in mags - or if it is I've missed it somewhere.

As for aubergines, I tried growing these outdoors in a sunny concreted area. I actually grew aubergines! Not very many and not very large, but aubergines outside in the UK nonetheless. A Spanish variety, suited to cooler and damper climes:

http://moreveg.co.uk/shop/article_AUBDEL/Aubergine-Berenjena-De-Almagro.html

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 29 Oct 14 - 08:50 AM

sorry Steve... brain freeze moment got you & chantyranger blended together... now there's a visual for you... lol

eggplants and peppers are two vegetables that need more sun & heat than I can get on our hill most years, so I get them from local farmers down in the valley where the micro climates are more favorable. Eggplant is often used in Italian cooking to replace meat - the texture makes a more robust dish.

back when I was a kid & we had meatless Fridays, pasta ceci was a favorite dish... elbow macaroni with marinara sauce and chickpeas... and a side dish of stewed zuchinni. simple but good.

dang, but I'm ready for lunch already!

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 29 Oct 14 - 06:53 AM

Sciencegeek: "What will always baffle me is vegetarian bologna or salami... big bucks for a few measley slices. WTF?"

Agree, there are better things to put in your sandwiches / wraps anyway. I'm a massive fan of hummus - including the plethora of bastardised alternatives (one of my favourite hummus-style dips/spreads is a cannelloni bean puree flavoured with garlic, lemon and fresh rosemary.) I've got a shed-load of sun-dried tomatoes at the mo' so I'll be making a batch of sun-dried tomato tapenade with those shortly. I think the key to decent vegan food, is looking outside of one's own food-culture, so many other traditional food-cultures make huge use of grains, vegetables and pulses.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 05:29 PM

Oi, sciencegeek, I don't think I've even mentioned tofu! In fact, I don't even know what it is.

Yes, eggplants/aubergines. I found I can't grow 'em very well in the humid Cornish climate - they seem to start rotting before I can harvest them. So I buy 'em, but caveat emptor! Bought ones can have incredibly tough skin that stays tough even when cooked. I test with a finger nail before I buy (yes, I know...), and, if they're brownish/seedy/fluffy inside when you get them home, they're useless. I reckon the best thing for aubergines is moussaka, but there's a brilliant Sicilian dish, very veggie, called pasta alla Norma (named in honour of Bellini's Norma) which uses chopped-up aubergines. There are several variations of this dish, but whatever you do you should sprinkle the cooking eggplant slices with dried oregano. You won't regret it.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 04:14 PM

I bought some avocados recently as they were on offer. Some are still firm, but this is what I'm having for lunch soon as they're ready. A Peruvian inspired dish of avocado stuffed with quinoa salad: Peruvian nom nom
I very rarely buy fancy stuff like quinoa, but it makes pleasant change from couscous now and then, plus its supposed to be terribly good for you.

I have read that there are those who argue that 'we' shouldn't buy quinoa because demand is pushing up the price and it's starting to become too expensive for native Peruvians to eat, so they're turning to other food staples that have a less glamourous appeal to Western foodies, however I doubt the farmers themselves would disapprove too much of more people wanting to buy their produce? I wonder what others here think of such issues?

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 03:40 PM

Skipping down to the bottom, I haven't a chance to read much right now, but I'm interested in the concepts of permaculture. Permaculture.org in Australia - not sure which site is actually the original, but it is an important innovation in restoration of lands. The scale is perhaps a limiting factor.

An idea to toss around.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 03:27 PM

it's not just alternative agriculture... but alternative marketing.

When in NY City, the local streets in Queens are just filled with assorted storefronts that sell every kind of fruit, vegetable, meat, spice from all different cultures...

but that doesn't exist in many other US cities large or small... in fact, many are urban deserts that are underserved by grocery chains and trying to shop for fresh food is challenging at best. Some not for profit groups have set up farmers markets on street corners to help serve these communities. Growing healthy food that people can't get access to is a logistical issue that needs more work to fix.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 02:57 PM

LOL... great minds... or maybe appetites?

I may have tried tempeh many years ago... I found many vegetarians back then couldn't cook worth a d*mn... which was very disappointing. Eating should not be some kind of penance, in my opinion.

Being half Italian, I grew up eating fresh vegetables and salads with meat as a balanced part of the meal. I never encountered the meat and potato menu until I went away to college... boy, put on a few pounds that first semester.   

The hubby thought he hated broccoli, until I steamed it for him with fresh lemon juice squirted on it. He didn't realize it's supposed to be green, not grey and mushy... lol.

What will always baffle me is vegetarian bologna or salami... big bucks for a few measley slices. WTF?

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,cs
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 02:33 PM

Sorry sciencegeek I've just repeated what you already said! Ever tried tempeh, feented soya beans with fungal stuff? I think you can even make it, though I think growing it might freak me out a bit..

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 02:27 PM

I've yet to try gluten / seitan. Aka 'Buddhist meat': so called as it comprises a part of 'Temple cuisine' which is becoming an increasingly popular option for vegans who want to be able to eat out - the ' Hoving Hut' chain does this kind of food I believe. However I'm looking forward to trying it as its incredibly versatile stuff from what I've seen.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 01:01 PM

while I enjoy tofu... I'm a sucker for braised gluten...

stir fried with fresh aspargus or in chili or curry sauce... I can polish off a whole can all by my lonesome. It is the main ingredient in many mock meat dishes for buddhists... sometimes called seitan.

Chantyranger, maybe this would work in your stroganoff instead of tofu. The texture is chewy like beef.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 12:06 PM

sorry... left out this

if you watch how tofu is made, it is immediately apparant how similar the process is to making cheese... bean curd made from "soy milk" by curdling and collecting the curds and then pressing them into blocks. The proteins in the "milk" differ from those in dairy, but proteins still tend to act in similar ways.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 12:02 PM

cream of tartar.... :)

I challange you to find the dairy in Potassium bitartrate. Common usage is not absolute, just common.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 11:12 AM

Yes, it can.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 11:10 AM

LOL... raw tofu is not my taste, but the local Chinese takeout makes a bean curd & vegetable soup that I adore... filled with cubed tofu, shredded nappa, sliced mushroom & assorted other fresh vegetables & seasoned with a ton of minced garlic and thickened with cornstarch to the point the spoon sticks up straight. I order that with a carton of rice and get two meals out of it.

Vegetable soup with a thin broth needs ginger to make me happy and works as a snack; but the thick soup makes a fine meal. To each their own, I guess. :D

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 11:05 AM

but genuinely creamy

Something without cream in can't by definition be that.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 10:57 AM

Sciencegeek, I think you're bang on target there regarding tofu. Unless you're a hardened tofu-head, then tofu raw in salads*, tofu processed into 'mayonnaise', or tofu used in classic dishes where it has no natural home (such as the stroganoff), can be quite unappetising! It's quite easy to get put off the stuff if your only experiences with it are in adaptations of classic western meat and dairy dishes.

The best way to get to know and like tofu, is among the flavours and styles of cuisines where it is at home: it's friends are chilli, sesame, honey, lemon and lime, miso, soya sauce and so-on. It partners naturally with rice, noodle and steamed or stir-fried vegetable dishes. It must be pressed, and ideally marinated before cooking. Whether you bake it or fry it, cook nice and hot to get a crisp outside, and a soft inside.

I love the stuff. But it is quite common for people, including vegetarians, to have a rubbish experience with it and decide it's horrible!










*puts hand up: I'm a hardened tofu-head - raw tofu in salad is fine by me (I like it cubed with cous cous, crisp salad veg, lemon and olive oil.)

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 10:17 AM

Despite my inopportunely timed declaration that I never have sugar (oh no!) Last night we tried another vegan sub that Mr. spotted and picked up specially to surprise me. Swedish Glace 'icecream.'

It can't call itself ice cream of course because it contains no dairy - despite the fact that the worst imaginable gelatinous goop can and does get called "ice cream." For comparison I looked on the ingredients list of a supermarket 'value' brand of "Ice Cream" the first ingredient it contained was "partially reconstituted skimmed milk concentrate", the second of course sugar, and the third, well well what a surprise "vegetable oils" - so no actual cream then, despite being legally allowed to call itself that.

Anyhow waffling off topic somewhat there, but the Swedish Glace was good, certainly better than expected by either of us. Distinctive vanilla, light but genuinely creamy (no jelly like goop) and quite convincing all around. Only downer was I thought it was a bit too sweet. Lots of good reviews at Ocado for it too: Swedish Glace vegan 'ice cream'

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 08:33 AM

Steve... any idea why your wife is so opposed to tofu? texture? flavor?

One of my favorite dishes is ma bo tofu, especially when the tofu is deep fried first to give it more texture. Bean curd can be prepared so many different ways and absorbs the flavors of sauce or seasonings as to be unique in each dish.

I'm not much for shopping, but I can spend a long time wandering the isles of our local oriental food stores... Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Indian, Thai, Vietnamese... beats any department store or mall to my way of thinking. And chatting with the college students who are there looking for a little bit of home is a great experience... for both of us.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 28 Oct 14 - 04:41 AM

Interesting Steve, that Scicilian 'red pesto' is close to the Spanish Romesco! Indeed it's fascinating to see how many nations have variants of each other's classic dishes.
Pilaf springs to mind, Pilau or Puloa being the Indian variant, just one of many; it crosses all borders, with so many countries having their own special take on rice cooked in broth, and variants on the same name all follow it wherever it travels. I actually have a map in one cookbook illustrating how it may have spread with migration to different parts of the world. And how in each new part of the world variants would develop ttha made use of local ingredients.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 11:39 PM

Tonight I made Moskowitz's recipe for mushroom / tofu stroganoff...we'll, almost her recipe, as my omnivore wife hates tofu, so I used eggplant instead. Very thinly sliced mushrooms and onion, minced garlic, with black pepper, dried thyme, very little salt, and a sauce made from raw cashews soaked for a couple of hours, then put through a food processor, with veg broth, added to the sautéed vegetables with wine and tomato paste. The recipe is in Isa Chandra Moskowit'z's book "Isa Does It." We both loved it.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 11:18 PM

This discussion reminded me of a favorite I haven't made in a while - eggplant Parmesan. I grow my own aubergine and have various ways of using them. The breaded and fried is pretty greasy, but I freeze the breaded cooked slices then pull out a couple, warm and serve with a plate of pasta and a good marinara sauce (made from my organic onions, garlic, peppers, tomatoes, and herbs). All prepared with the good Lebanese olive oil I mentioned above.

Tonight I set up a skillet of shallow olive oil and cooked several batches that are now in the freezer for meals this winter. Mmmmmm! I usually used inexpensive corn oil for this, but the omega 3 talk got me thinking, so I used the good stuff. We shall see how it turned out soon.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 07:22 PM

I should have said that you could use pecorino instead of the parmesan. It definitely adds a perky touch with a tangy hit, which I love. The missus isn't keen, unfortunately, which is why I stick to parmesan. There are no rules.

Well, please the missus. That isn't such a bad rule. At times. I do have limits.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 07:12 PM

Quote: "We have pasta three or four times a week and my repertoire in that regard has expanded beyond recognition."

We like pasta, but I do tend to stick to pretty basic recipes that I know:
I like puttanesca, with black olives and capers - super easy from storecupboard ingredients. Also penne al'arrabiata (or indeed any pasta shape), with heap loads of chilli. I often make bastardised pesto with whatever herbs I have. Also a basic tomato and garlic most frequently.

Any suggestions for other vegan-friendly ideas?

Begod, you're a person after me own heart! Unfortunately, your puttanesca (aka whore's pasta) omits anchovies, which I regard as sine qua non for that dish (Neapolitans may demur). Whatever, make your own tomato sauce for it with tons of garlic and basil, and don't use too much of it. I like to intensify my tomato sauce by adding sundried tomato paste, but that's just me. I hate claggy pasta dishes. And no bloody parmesan!! As for arrabbiata, avoid the cheapie penne pastas and make sure you buy bronze-die rigatoni. Yes it's more doughy but it's a delicious option. Don't use fresh chillis for arrabbiata: use crushed chilli flakes. Don't diss me 'til you've tried it. It's what Italians do in any case. And by all means go veggie, but I only do two arrabbiata dishes, one with chicken and one with wild keta salmon, the latter added raw to the sauce at the last minute before stirring into the rigatoni.

A very nice Sicilian dish that is veggie is pasta alla Trapanese. You blend skin-on ground almonds (definitely grind your own) with crushed garlic and plenty of it, loads of pestle-and-mortared basil, a worrying-large amount of EV olive oil, parmesan and a truckload of the best raw tomatoes you can get your hands on - cut 'em up. Just squidge the whole bloody lot to smithereens with your bare hands to make a sort of rough, rustic pesto. Stir that into cooked spaghetti and dole out on to warmed bowls. You'll die of happiness, especially if you wash it down with some Sicilian red.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Peter Kasin
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 04:23 PM

SRS. Thank you ordering my sister's book! Yes, Guest CS, that's the one. Sciencegeek's post about greasy chips brings up a good point, that one can have a healthy veg diet or a very unhealthy veg diet. I'm currently reading a fascinating book: Salt, Sugar, Fat: How the Food Giants Hooked Us, by Michael Moss. It's investigative reporting at its best. God, how we need more journalists like that. I keep low on oils for the reasons given by others here. Very informative posts, everyone, no matter where you are on the veg / omnivore diets. Thank you all for posting here. Keep 'me coming, eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 12:15 PM

there are two organizations that seek to save heritage genomes... Seed Savers Exchange and The Livestock Conservancy... species adapted to local environments and preserving genes that have often disappeared in the commerical breeds/varieties.

Many mail order seed catalogs will have sections of heritage seeds- no GMO there. GMO is valuable tool that is grossly misused by the mega corp agribusiness.

Oh, and just a small aside about potato farming in my neck of the woods... they aren't just growing table potatoes... many acres are planted in "chipping" potatoes.... as in what we here call potato chips... Greasy, over salted slices of deep fried potato that now come in every flavor imaginable. And technically vegan... lol...

And in the counties that lie just south of the Great Lakes, businesses need to register their water withdrawals from the drainage basins... including the vegetable growing farms that rely on irrigation to grow their crops. Those who grow grains rely on "dry farming"... rainfall and snowmelt provide the soil moisure to grow the crops. Raising food of any kind is challenging and under appreciated ... latest bumper sticker... I farm so you can eat. You're welcome.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 11:20 AM

SRS, you're right about the Omega 3 : 6 ratio stuff, which can get way out of whack if you use too much in the way of certain polyunsaturated vegetable oils in particular. It's something I should personally pay close attention to. A good Omega balance promotes healthy brains, and healthy brains are happier and more stable brains.

We're also fortunate in the EU to have mandatory labelling for GM ingredients in foods. Monsanto has spent an absolute fortune on campaigns opposing bills all over the States that would enable the buying public to know whether or not the food they are purchasing and consuming, contains GM ingredients or not. Monsanto have even threatened to sue various States that have tried - based on public demand - to implement bills giving the public the right to know whether or not their food products contain GM ingredients. Just goes to show you that you get as much 'democracy' as you can pay for, eh? The only alternative for people in the States who prefer not to consume GMO's (for whatever reason, as should be their right) is to buy organic, which is a horribly expensive option for anyone on a low to middling income. It's great however that you're able to grow your own. We dabble a bit with easy veg that takes care of itself, but I'd like to do more next year.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 10:10 AM

nothing less appealing than croquettes that are dry throughout... I think the secret is mayonnaise...

the texture of the salmon mix should be moist like tuna salad and just firm enough to hold a shape while you roll it in a coating mixture of bread or cracker crumbs. That seems to seal in the moisture and get the crunchy outside. The rest is practice, practice, practice...

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 09:35 AM

P.S., Chanteyranger, I just ordered a copy of your sister's book.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 09:27 AM

Some Monday morning musings:

This thread got me poking around for more information about some of the foods I use. I'm a gardener, I have lots of veggies, but I don't grow grains, rice, corn, etc. I don't have meat or dairy production and I don't raise poultry for meat or eggs. I live on a creek but since it runs through an urban area, I wouldn't eat anything out of it (thought it at least has a lot of diversity).

I have weighed the information on some products and thought I was making a healthy choice, only to realize later that I needed to look beyond what was essentially hype. Case in point: grape seed oil. I thought it was healthy and good for frying, but it is in fact rarely cold pressed, it's usually chemically processed, and it is high in Omega-6. When exposed to the high heat of frying, it undergoes some unhealthy transformation. I bought a bottle recently, thinking using a little in my misto oil sprayer wouldn't be bad, but I'll get rid of it instead. I just read the article linked, and remember a recent conversation on a radio program by my organic gardening guru. They recommend macadamia oil instead.

Here is a well-cited article about the differences between Omega-3 and Omega-6 oils.

I am eating a lot less meat than I used to. I drink whole organic milk and use butter instead of margarine that I grew up on. The oil I use most is olive oil that I buy in 3-litre bottles from a Middle Eastern grocery. Their oil isn't commingled from all around the Mediterranean, it comes from one country at a time, often labelled as the product of a specific town. Much better than "oil from Tunisia, Italy, Greece, Spain, and Turkey." You know that can't turn out well.

I eat a lot of beans and rice, and go in cycles as far as eating pasta. A vegetarian diet with a lot of fruits and vegetables isn't easy - too many adulterated products are out there. Chemical fertilizers and pesticides, and the genetically modified plants like grains mean you have to choose your grain products carefully.

I do eat meat, but more often than not it is an ingredient in a complex dish, it isn't a slab of meat on a plate. I eat wild caught salmon, but since this is more expensive than farm raised, I don't eat as much as I would like. There are other choices - canned fish such as salmon and mackerel and sardines - that can provide healthy omega-3 and protein, and canned fish is quite cost effective. If I ever figure out how my mother made the salmon croquettes she fed us when I was a kid, I'll be in heaven. Moist on the inside, crispy on the outside, and made from inexpensive canned salmon.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,sciencegeek
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 09:11 AM

love this pasta recipe from a trattoria at Mystic, CT years ago... sadly no longer on the menu.

angel hair pasta cooked al dente

saute garlic in olive oil for a few minutes and then add a loosely torn head of escarole into the pan and cook a few more minutes.

Add a cup or two of chopped tomatoes, a tablespoon of capers and a sprinkle of basil, oregano & thyme.

Bring to a boil then reduce the heat and cover with a tight lid to let it all steam and meld the flavors.

When the escarole is tender, it's done and you can add to the pasta & let it absorb any remaining liquid.

Plate it ... & I like a nice romano cheese grated on top to give it a bit of a bite.

On a different note... too many folks carry on about veganism the way reformed whatevers try to "bring the light" to others. I rarely drink anything alcoholic and have lost more than one family member to alcoholism... but I find I truely resent evangelic teatollers who carry on about the evils of alcohol and look down on anyone who differs with them.

I do not care to eat large amounts of meat, but I do enjoy it and and will use broth, stock and small amounts of meat to enhance my meals. Over the years I have learned what my body needs and at age 63 I have no medical issues other than some osteo-arthrisis I can trace back to old injuries. And at my one and only colonoscopy, the doctor said that whatever I was doing, I should keep it up because I pased with flying colors. All of which I can thank to having "good" genes and a reasonable diet. There is no "magic bullet" that will cure everyone and that includes diet.

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 06:13 AM

Quote: "We have pasta three or four times a week and my repertoire in that regard has expanded beyond recognition."

We like pasta, but I do tend to stick to pretty basic recipes that I know:
I like puttanesca, with black olives and capers - super easy from storecupboard ingredients. Also penne al'arrabiata (or indeed any pasta shape), with heap loads of chilli. I often make bastardised pesto with whatever herbs I have. Also a basic tomato and garlic most frequently.

Any suggestions for other vegan-friendly ideas?

Subject: RE: BS: Vegan mudcatters
From: GUEST,CS
Date: 27 Oct 14 - 04:19 AM

Dani - it's really not all that hard to get enough protein without meat or dairy. Everything has protein in it. I'm logging my food intake currently, there are a number of free websites and apps that enable you to do so quite easily, though it can be a bit of a faff intitially. I'm using FatSecret. Yesterday I logged *over* my daily requirement for protein - according to WebMD adult women require 46g and I logged 53g - and that was on a virtually-vegan day and with reduced food intake - I logged 1400 calories, which is about 3/4 of my daily calorific needs as I'm losing weight.

daily requirements

I had sugar-free muesli with soya milk for breakfast. Plus apple juice.
A wholemeal wrap stuffed with kidney beans, tomato, spinach greens, and avocado for lunch.
For dinner I had lasagne made with wholewheat pasta, veggie mince ragu and an almond milk bechamel, topped with pangritata (a vegan "poor mans's parmesan" made with breadcrumbs and garlic). Plus a tossed salad.
Later in the evening I had a mug of cocoa made with soya milk.

While everything contributed to my daily protein intake, there was 25g of protein in my portion of lasagne, and 10g in my cocoa alone.