BS: uk by-elections

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Iains
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 03:58 AM

I wonder why children under 18 are not given the vote? Perhaps Shaw could give us an explanation, polymath that he is. Perhaps he would like to extend the vote to a foetus as well. There are two avenues available in a democracy to institute change. This is either by the ballot box or revolt.
Not voting, hiding in a hole in the ground, bleating "don't know who to vote for" is simply a cop out. Sadly democracy works purely on majority votes. Surely this is not too hard a concept to grasp. Some may not like it but that is what the reality is. The majority rules.
No matter how much analysis takes place after the event, or how many excuses are put forward, the result still stands.

The most facile argument put forward is " but I paid my taxes". Well
I had a beef pie for my dinner yesterday. SO what?
"And of course we have the stupid proposition that "those that did not vote have a voice too". Well I can state quite categorically that they may have a voice but there ain't nobody has any intention of listening.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 03:43 AM

Raggy, if you go back enough generations we are all African. Nationality is really rather a poor label to characterise yourself by. We are who we are, where we were born doesn't determine that, where we were brought up can have an effect. But its what we make of ourselves that is important.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 03:37 AM

The people of Scotland seem very welcoming to refugees and other immigrants. Should they get themselves independence and remain in the EU I might see whether that could include me.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Teribus
Date: 11 Mar 17 - 03:17 AM

Steve Shaw - 10 Mar 17 - 06:53 PM

"Assertions without evidence. As ever."

But Shaw??? You and your pals do that ALL the time, and seem to think nothing of it. If you are too idle, or too disinterested to challenge the assertion with facts and figures that counter it why comment at all.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Raggytash
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 09:00 PM

Akenaton:

Your dislike of "foreigners" shines like a beacon in your last post (as in many previous other posts)

If you want these people to "resettle" in their "country of origin" just how many generations have to "resettle" (my inference of your post)

My forebears where not English. I would have to go back a thousand years to find one who wasn't born and bred here, does that me "English"?

I doubt if there are more than a handful of "pure bred" English people in the entire nation.

I'm sorry, but not surprised,to say that you come across as an out and out racist.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 08:25 PM

"They need to be careful which holes they stick their fingers up when they bowl me though!"

Pity there are no holes in bingo balls then, Dave. You might just have hung on to clickety-click and two fat ladies in that car park that time. As it is, I'm up before the beak next Tuesday for fraud over those photocopied bingo cards. Ah, how the mighty have fallen...

See you next Tuesday (as they say), Dave? No, thought not...

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 06:53 PM

Assertions without evidence. As ever.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: akenaton
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 05:31 PM

The two main issues which affected the voting pattern in Scotland.
1.... To remain in the EU was the declared position of both the SNP and the Scottish Labour Party.

2.....The real effects of unregulated immigration has yet to be felt by people living in Scotland, most economic migrants being Polish or Romanian. Both groups usually have adequate English and seem perfectly willing to integrate into Scottish society.

The vote in Scotland was influenced by these and other factors like some farmers who get huge EU grants for doing fuck all.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 02:59 PM

The mind boggles, Dave. This thread has mutated (for the better) from by-elections to by-the-livin'-'Arry!

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 02:31 PM

:-D They need to be careful which holes they stick their fingers up when they bowl me though! Anyway. As I keep telling you. I'm not overweight, just underheight

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Raggytash
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 02:07 PM

The attempt at humour from terikins is indeed a welcome change. Mind you Dave, if he ever saw you he does have a point !!

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 01:12 PM

The people in that bar in Chicago Gnome probably thought that being your shape and size, the "fag" would be more likely to roll you - down the sidewalk like a bowling ball.

Well done Teribus! You really are getting to know what trivial means now. We just need to work on the rest of your mental problems and we may crack it.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 11:41 AM

"They were not."
Then refute them with something other than denials
It really doesn't get more difficult than that
Jim arroll

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Teribus
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 11:16 AM

"I have listed the effects that Brexit has already had over eight months since the decision was taken and has not even started to be negotiated, as well as the future implications - were they accurate or not?" - Jim Carroll

They were not.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Teribus
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 11:01 AM

The people in that bar in Chicago Gnome probably thought that being your shape and size, the "fag" would be more likely to roll you - down the sidewalk like a bowling ball.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 10:36 AM

I got into no end of trouble in bar in Chicago when I said I was going outside to roll a fag...

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 09:57 AM

When Jim said fag-waving, I thought he meant Farage, who waves fags all the time. Yanks, a fag this end means a cigarette. 🤡

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 09:32 AM

Well, couple of issues with your post Iains.

Firstly, many of the people who did not vote still pay their taxes to a government who they elected and expect to do the job they were elected to do. They have every right to complain and every right to withhold their vote should they decide that that should not have to do to their highly paid MPs job for them.

Secondly, you will find that the very people on here who use 'the majority has won so stop whinging' argument are the same people who reckon Donald Trump won a majority vote and should therefore be in the White House. He did not. The popular vote went against him. Not saying you are in that camp but this is the type of hypocrisy that goes on.

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 09:19 AM

Nigel -
This was your statement
"After decades of no-one listening to the calls to change or leave the EU (mainly ignored because both of the main parliamentary parties were in favour of staying)"
The list you produced was of calls by the main political parties
Your implication as that the British people were not being listened to by "the main political parties"
You really need to make up your mind on this one.
I have listed the effects that Brexit has already had over eight months since the decision was taken and has not even started to be negotiated, as well as the future implications - were they accurate or not?
Something else you need to make up your mind on.
Not one of you has acknowledged the racist content of the campaign and what has happened so far
I won't begin to list the consequences of Fascist groups in Europe taking the cue from the Brexit campaign in order to gain power in countries like France, Holland... and elsewhere
Was listening to a very depressing interview with a Hungarian extremist this morning
I repeat what I said earlier - Brexit and Trump have achieved in a matter of months what Hitler failed to do in a decade and a half
I really didn't expect to see a repetition of this level of politics in my lifetime
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 09:02 AM

Jim:
Ther was at no time in my lifetime, calls for Britain to leave the E.U. -
The BBC Say differently.

it was sold on the fag-waving idea of standing "on our own two feet" Homophobia as well now?

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 08:55 AM

"The populace has spoken."

Well no-one under 18 "spoke" (approximately fourteen million of 'em, all of whom are going to be severely affected for far longer than the rest of us). and 28% of those over 18 did not "speak." Just about half of the populace in all "spoke" so just over a quarter of the "populace" are taking us out of the EU. Doesn't exactly look like "the populace have spoken" very decisively, does it?

Iains, though your silly post doesn't deserve a response, let me repeat. First, you do not know why individuals didn't vote. It could be that a large number were undecided and concluded that the most honest thing to do was to abstain. Are you seriously suggesting that those people have lost the right to have a say? Second, they still pay their taxes. In our system, like it or lump it, paying your taxes entitles you to play whatever part, or no part at all, in the democratic debate in this country, including using your vote. In my time I've abstained from voting in elections for local councillors (they are not generally affiliated to parties round here) or for officials in my trade union for the simple reason that I didn't know the candidates sufficiently well. It is not for you to prejudge people for not voting. It could well be that an honest abstainer in the referendum made a far more moral decision than some lout who voted because he thought it would keep Johnny Foreigner out. Think before you post.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Raggytash
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 08:34 AM

Nigel, A small majority of people who voted at the referendum voted to leave. The people who voted to remain have been told by some on here to "deal with it"

However in Scotland the majority voted to remain. Quite clear and straight forward.

The independence vote was an entirely separate issue and we cannot know how that vote would have panned out if the Scottish people knew at the time that the UK would leave the EU.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 08:30 AM

"We have a system in Britain that does that as well."
No "we" haven't (I live in Ireland but I was born in Britain and spent my life there up to retirement
Ther was at no time in my lifetime, calls for Britain to leave the E.U. - no letters of protest in the press, no street demonstrations, no public meetings calling for Brtian to leave.... not a peep, other than the viciouness of nationalist parties like Ukip and the BNP
It has always been a ploy of rightist organisations to claim they are 'the voice of the people'
The referendum was run, not on a basis of a discussion of the consequences as a whole - many politicians warned of the social consequences and the economists stamped on the idea firmly, pointing out that the economy needed stability and not the uncertainty of such a momentous move.
it was sold on the fag-waving idea of standing "on our own two feet" and getting rid of "parasitic emigrants" - that was Ukip's policy summed up perfectly in the poster showing Farage standing in front of hordes of obvious foreigners.
The first reactions after the vote was announced was reported incidents of immigrants being asked when they were going home and a sharp rise in racist incidents.
THe economic forecasts are nor beginning to come home to roost - an unstable economy which is forecast to take a decade to steady up, a budget aimed at workers - notably the self-employed, the potential loss of what remains of our industry to foreign firms (Vauxhall is the first, but not the last) - and a situation where the unemployed of Britain will no longer be able to freely move in Europe to seek work.
Export firms are facing the return to closed frontiers, longer delays and losses in custom and profit.
All for the luxury of keeping out the people who have added enormously to both our economy and our culture
Sad and sick
Scotland's decision to remain in The U.K. was now writ in stone and stands to be reversed; Northern Ireland is facing several major setbacks - a backward step for the Peace Process, a return to closed borders, and severe economic difficulties
All brought about by a slim majority of a decision taken by 70% of the British electorate
One wonders how, knowing what we now know, they would vote now.
I'm not a betting man but I'd certainly put a fair amount on that particular horse.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Iains
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 08:29 AM

Those that have a vote and choose not to use it have no right to complain if the outcome is not what they desired. The right to vote underpins democracy. No arguing over the percentages alters the fact that the majority wins. That is the majority that could be bothered to vote. Those that for whatever reason choose not to vote have zero influence on the outcome. It is as though they do not exist.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 08:00 AM

We have a PR system in Ireland, not perfect by any means, but if forces those in power to listen to things that concern people and, to a degree, respond to them
We have a system in Britain that does that as well. After decades of no-one listening to the calls to change or leave the EU (mainly ignored because both of the main parliamentary parties were in favour of staying) people started voting for UKIP.
Enough did this that the only way the conservatives could avoid losing masses of votes was to promise a referendum.
The result of the referendum is that we are leaving the EU.
The populace has spoken. A portion of them spoke to leave, a smaller portion spoke to remain. Such is democracy. Of those who chose not to speak we can make no valid assumptions. The split may have followed that of those that voted, or it may have been noticeably different, in either direction. Whichever is the case, it matters not. They had the chance to vote & chose not to.
Of those that voted, the majority were in favour of leaving the EU.

Scotland had earlier voted decisively to remain part of the UK, and as such were included in this, not as a separate nation, but as part of the UK.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 07:24 AM

"Of those who chose to vote the majority chose to leave the EU."
But iw=s as not the majority of the people - which is what Steve said,
There's another thread running at present on how people feel about voting and politics
At present in Britain, those voting in elections are around 665; only 72% votd in the Brexxit referendum
That not only calls into question any decision taken at election time, but the the political system.
Disillusionment is the mother of extremism.
The voting system will never be changed while it favours those in power.
We have a PR system in Ireland, not perfect by any means, but if forces those in power to listen to things that concern people and, to a degree, respond to them
The privatisation ow water (suits some people, I know), is still being fought over several years after its introduction, thanks to the Irish people taking to the streets in vast numbers - it wouldn't happen back home.
Millions of people tok to the streets opposing Blair's WMD adventure - he went ahead and narrowly avoided being tried as a war criminal
Who was in the right?
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 07:11 AM

Yes I know that, Nigel, but claiming that "the people have spoken" when 62% of "the people" either didn't speak at all or spoke the other way is a ploy, no more than that. People who don't vote don't forfeit their place in our democracy, you know. They still pay their taxes. For one thing, you don't know why some people didn't vote and it's very dodgy to make any assumptions, especially when expressed pejoratively, as Teribus has done. And, let's face it, "the people" only "spoke" to advise the government what to do. The bottom line is that it would be suicidal for the government to countermand the referendum vote - but not illegal. There was no majority of the electorate for either remain or leave. Some crowing brexiteers seem to be forgetting that. Hence the situation in Scotland.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 06:57 AM

Of those who chose to vote the majority chose to leave the EU.
Until, and unless, the UK changes to a system where voting is compulsory, the only results that count are the results from those who choose to vote.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 06:13 AM

Cheers, Dave and Raggytash, but I never feel the urgent need to respond to Iains the forum buffoon. One fine day we may just get an unvarnished objective opinion from him on something or other, unspiced with bitterness and jealousy (he does have plenty to be jealous of, let's face it). Definitely not worth taking on his inanities. Rudeness seasoned with ignorance.

Nigel, no-one had a majority for anything in that disastrous referendum. Well over a quarter of the electorate didn't vote and almost half the ones who did voted remain. 38% of the electorate are leading us to hell in a handcart. If I had a quid for every time I've screamed at the telly when some dickhead has declared that the "people have spoken," etc., I'd be able to afford the spending-money euros for my next trip to Italy. At the moment I'd be lucky to get a euro for a quid!

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 06:06 AM

"The majority does not mean the same as an entire national group"
No it doesn't Nigel - I stand corrected - a bad choice of words
But as British democracy stands at present, the Brexit vote was undemocratic in forcing a minority decision on the Scots people.
A true indication of how the Scots feel about Brexit will hopefully be sought by Scotland voting for Independence
One of the things Brexit has achieved is the possible break-up of the United Kingdom
As far as how Brexit is enacted, it has to be subject to existing law - a populist-arrived at decision cannot over-ride that
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 05:54 AM

Jim:
Brexit . . . Scotland voted against it, so an entire National Group within the British Isles has had something it does not want
It's not 'an entire National Group'. Remain had a majority in Scotland. Others in Scotland voted to leave. The majority does not mean the same as an entire national group.

If you can totally ignore those who voted to leave in Scotland, then, by a similar method, the argument could be made that Britain, as a national group voted Leave. And this includes the Scots.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Iains
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 05:48 AM

Raggytash.

I would be more than happy to back off when I see a token effort in the same direction by others. Other points of view will inevitably exist, and everyone will try to defend their corner. This can be done without constantly belittling the opposition. Destroy the argument, not the person.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Raggytash
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 04:20 AM

Iains, Before you criticise others TOO much perhaps you could look at some of your own recent posts.

"DtG what on earth are you on about"

"Hey Raggytash Isiah 5.21"

"Jimmie Matthew 7:3-5 King James Version"

"An interesting by some to my post of 28th Feb 17-11.44am Matthew 7.16"

"DtheG Glad you enjoyed the pancakes. I like mine with maple syrup"

"D THE G To be associated with a mythical gang is far superior to being in a pack of curs doncha think?"

"............ either put up or shut up you silly little man"

"I assume arrogant was the next word out of the box after insecure. If you want to insult people each time you post Jimmy try and ring the changes"

"................ better trade your sandals for some hiking boots, the next socialist party is way over the horizon"

"So all in all, no surprises, is Labour sinking to the bottom of the swamp"

Not exactly edifying are they.

We're all guilty to a greater or lesser degree and in your defence you do post some interesting comments on occasion, but you cannot really criticise others when you do the same thing yourself.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 04:05 AM

Iains. I am sure Steve can speak for himself but the thing that strikes me most about your litany of so called attacks is that each and every one is a response. Now, I guess you would like to be included in the cabal that I refer to as speaking a different language but before you commit yourself maybe you would like to consider what is meant by 'attack instigating mode'. Maybe it means that an attack is instigated from scratch rather than as a defense to another attack? Is that so difficult to understand?

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 03:52 AM

"What I find strange is the silence here lately on the abolition of the House of Lords."
A;lmost as strange as your total refusal to respond to both the actions of Trump and the obvious detrimental effects of Brexit
You have refused to comment on both.
I have no time whatever for the medieval establishment that is The House of Lords, but, like the security services in the US, when they do happen to work to our advantage, you can only welcome their actions as crumbs from he rich man's table
Brexit is not only an economic and political mess, for Britain and also for its near neighbours - here in Ireland, it stands to totally wreck the peace process that has been struggling to help heal the scars over the last few decades.
Scotland voted against it, so an entire National Group within the British Isles has had something it does not want and economicaly, most certainly does not need, foisted upon it by little Englanders who have the strange idea that it can stand on its own two feet with no manufacturing industries, an accelerating gap between those who have and those who have less and less every day.
As far as the Lords are concerned, they are going by the book and demanding that any exit from Europe is done by the book.
Brexit was a populist vote instigated by racist scum like Ukip playing on the xenophobic fears and prejudices of the British people - "get rid of the foreigners and all your problems will be solved."
The Nazis of Germany were elected by such populism - had they been opposed six million Jews would not have been exterminated.
It is quite likely that France, Holland, and several other countries will elect fascist administrations in the near future with the help of the combined encouragement of Brexit and the goose-stepper in the White House.
Both will have achieved in a matter of months what Hitler failed to do over a decade and a half - let the fascist genii out of its bottle.
How about replying replying to the consequences of this stupid, flag-wagging decision Ake, instead of whingeing every time somebody put a legal obstacle in the way of your frightening Brave New World
People like you really do need top be stopped in your gallop - you stand to fuck up the future with your prejudices and hatreds
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Iains
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 03:21 AM

" It's rare that we go into attack-instigating mode."
Pull the other one Stevie boy!
Here are some examples of your non attack instigating mode:-

1)Have another ten pints, Bill. Hope your head's ok in the morning!

2)Now listen up for once, cloth-ears. I shall say this only twenty more times (my calculation as to how many times I'll have to say it before it finally sinks into whatever pile of poo passes for your brainbox

3)Now toddle off and go and pester someone else

4)He and bobad are two cheeks of the same sorry arse. No substance, no debating skills, no-nothing trolls. Here for the fight only. Even Keith and Teribus aren't of that ilk. An arse, what's more, that even an Asda George underpant, were it sentient, would rebel against. Ignore 'em

These are typical nasty Shaw responses just from one thread.
You make a point of talking down and insulting everyone that disagrees with you, accompanied by your own brand of arrogance. You and the rest of the pack all come out braying in unison. I suggest you collectively pull the stone back over your head and remain with the rest of the low life. None of you are very nice people and you destroy many threads with your combatitive behaviour.

attack the person
attack the grammer.
attack the spelling
use pathetic adjectives to further you arguments like childish, newbie, minnow.

Squeal like stuck pigs when the same tactics are used against you.

You treat this forum as your own personal fiefdom, where you set the rules.

If you do not agree with the content of the thread, no one is forcing you to contribute and your latest fixation on mopeds merely demonstrates how pathetic you are.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 03:18 AM

Good to see you getting into the spirit of things as well, ake. The abolition of the House of Lords has as much to do with the latest by-elections as bikes, flowers and hamsters I suppose but you do need to use your imagination a bit more.

:D tG

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: akenaton
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 02:52 AM

What I find strange is the silence here lately on the abolition of the House of Lords.

It used to act as a reasonably independent body to scrutinise Govt policy, but over the last thirty years it has been stuffed with political cronies and failed politicians, making it if anything more corrupt than the shower who inhabit the commons.

I wonder why the pro establishment "socialist" crowd here have fallen silent?

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 02:39 AM

When my daughters hamster shuffled off her mortal coil on new years eve it was rather upsetting but a few days later we buried her in the garden. Shortly after that I was putting in some tulip bulbs and was very tempted to put some on the hamsters final resting place so, when the grew, I could say something about tulips from Hamsterjam.

But I decided against it on the grounds of taste.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Teribus
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 02:17 AM

Feel free to Shaw - won't bother me at all.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Raggytash
Date: 10 Mar 17 - 02:03 AM

It's spring again, I'll bring again Tulips from Amsterdam !

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 08:10 PM

Very, very tired stuff, Bill. I'm warning you now, nay, threatening you. Carry on like this and I'm going to regale you mercilessly with the botanical names of each and every variety of narcissus I have in my garden. And it's a big garden. And if that doesn't work, be advised: I have tulips...

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Teribus
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 07:53 PM

"perhaps an "uncle" (eg your dads best mate) is part of the family." - University Rag

Ehmmm I hate to point this out to you Raggy. The fact that you and Jom accept and sometimes might offer up sloppy, slapdash interpretations to support your case - those who compiled the Statistics that Jom chose to quote DO NOT. It is their job to name and identify relevant categories - and to them and the police who would investigate the crime - "your dad's best mate" would NOT be classified, or regarded as being part of the family.

So only 26% of cases involve a family member - no sort of majority at all.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 05:44 PM

Never been a motorbike person. No car until Mrs Steve and I got hitched in 1976, though she had a Morris Minor called Boris. Then a Morris Minor called Mildred, then a Dolomite 1850 (wolf in sheep's clothing), then a Toyota Carina estate which never broke down but which was a rusty bucket, then a Cavalier Estate which had a weird habit of suddenly cutting out, refusing to start for anything between ten minutes and 24 hours, then behaving perfectly normally again (I cured it by swapping the distributor), then a nippy little Vauxhall Nova in faecal brown, then a Daewoo Nexia (cheap car, expensive mistake - cambelt snapped tens of thousands of miles prematurely and wrecked the engine), then a nice little Peugeot 106 disel, then a beaten-up old Fiesta, now a Focus 1.6TCDi, the only new car we ever bought - great car. Mrs Steve has a 10-year-old MX5 which I love to pieces. Hairdresser's car my arse!   

Apropos of this below-line forum's ethos, or lack of it, the pattern is that we soft-centred pinko sandal-wearing bearded PC apologist lefties tend to simply react. Even over-react. It's rare that we go into attack-instigating mode. That's the territory of Teribus, Keith and the minnow Iains. I exclude bobad because he never actually argues any point and simply snipes. I also exclude akenaton because he a sort of (French accent, please...) "idiot non-savant" around here. This little cabal come here with an agenda, and having an agenda means a complete inability to discuss in a measured way. That's why I've decided to exercise my free speech (are you listening, Bill?) by ignoring/taking the mick out of/making fun of these blokes. What else is there to do?

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Raggytash
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 05:05 PM

In 1975 I bought a Suzuki T250J Hustler. I bored it out to 305cc added racing tank, clip on's and rear sets. Proper little racing bike. Fantastic in a straight line but almost lethal on corners.

I took it to the TT races and on "mad sunday" tonked it round the circuit riding like a maniac. Really riding like a maniac.

Over the 36 mile course I averaged 56mph, Mick Grant that year averaged 112.96mph. Double my speed plus a touch.

The lap record is now 133.962mph. How they achieve that is beyond my comprehension.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 04:32 PM

I had a road to Damascus moment some time back, Raggy. Hence the

Different morality
Different language
Different planet

Comment I make.

What it boils down to is that some members of this little society do not, can not or will not understand others. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with anyone. They is just something blocking normal communications and once you realise this you will realise that there is no point even trying. Keith puts it down do me (and by association presumanly you, Steve and Jim) having no morals and being shit. I guess Teribus will put it down to something similar and go on about education while ake will enter his own dream world where liberal is a bad thing, fascism is good and socialist means something entirely different to anyone else.

I would not put it down to any of that nor blame any of the 'opposition' or lay the fault at their door. I would simply say that there is a major and unresolvable communications break down. I don't know why and I don't know how to fix it. Believe me, I have tried. As there is no point in trying to communicate complex ideas between all us 'usual suspects' we may as well just talk about anything.

Now, what other bikes did you have? I passed my test on the Lambretta and gave up being a 'mod'. Traded it in for a Triumph T110. Which was crap. That went in a straight swap for a Honda CB400 which, in 1971, no one wanted. I fell in love with Honda at that point and had 2 more. A CD125 and the afore mentioned CX500. I doubt if I will bike again but if I do I may revert to parka and aviator shades and get a Vespa GTV300. But I will probably bottle out spend the money on either a MGTF or a Triumph TR7. Luckily, being a gnome, I can still get in and out of something so low :-) Although I admit I did struggle with my mate's Lotus Elise!

Cheers

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Raggytash
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 03:29 PM

PEDANT ALERT

When a man who abuses a female, or perhaps less commonly, a woman a abuses a male, common parlance indicates that a friend or an acquaintance perhaps an "uncle" (eg your dads best mate) is part of the family.

Jim understands this, I understand this.

It is only uneducated idiots who would prefer to castigate certain sections of our society, in order to inforce their own prejudice opinion, that do not understand this.

Racist, bigoted louts to a man. You fit that bill very well Teribus.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 02:58 PM

How do you get "vast majority" from 26%? (or even 'vasy majority')?"
The one single identifiable group is family members -
Friends and acquaintances could be from anywhere - teachers, clergymen, neighbours, schoolmates and their parents, fellow scouts and guides, sports instructors......
Family members make up an identifiable quarter.
Leaving the rest as opportunistic strangers
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Teribus
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 02:28 PM

Wrong again Raggy, better stick to saying S.F.A.

By the way WTF was the name of this college you went to in Oxford and was that "the" Oxford in England? Whoever sent you there should apply for an effin' refund.

Normal categorisations of personal relationships:

Family (blood relations) - it is usual under normal circumstances that you are acquainted with them and that you are on friendly terms with them, but this may not always be the case.

Friends - outwith the family group and personally selected.

Acquaintances - People you happen to know slightly in passing who are not friends.

Perfect Strangers - You don't know them from Adam.

So like you Jom was wrong with his - "the vasy majority of paeophilic incidents take place within the family" - Jim

The within the family bit excludes friends, excludes acquaintances and excludes perfect strangers so according to the statistics supplied that accounts for 26% of the total - so as Nigel pointed out not a "vasy" majority at all.

Subject: RE: BS: uk by-elections
From: Raggytash
Date: 09 Mar 17 - 12:15 PM

30 plus 26 Nigel