BS: UK General election December 12 2019

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 16 Nov 19 - 03:51 AM

When I first read that poem, which was when I was back at school, I found it quite confusing. It becomes clearer when you learn Logue was a pacifist and very active in CND. So it is very likely that he felt Labour was not left wing enough: hence the 'deep in my heart/I am a Conservative' couplet.

I am sure he would be far closer to Corbyn than Johnson - but still think Corbyn is not left wing enough.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 16 Nov 19 - 03:42 AM

From the poetry of Christopher Logue


I shall vote Labour
I shall vote Labour because
God votes Labour.
I shall vote Labour to protect
the sacred institution of The Family.
I shall vote Labour because
I am a dog.
I shall vote Labour because
upper-class hoorays annoy me in expensive restaurants.
I shall vote Labour because
I am on a diet.
I shall vote Labour because if I don't
somebody else will:
AND
I shall vote Labour because if one person
does it
everybody will be wanting to do it.
I shall vote Labour because if I do not vote Labour
my balls will drop off.
I shall vote Labour because
there are too few cars on the road.
I shall vote Labour because I am
a hopeless drug addict.
I shall vote Labour because
I failed to be a dollar millionaire aged three.
I shall vote Labour because Labour will build
more maximum security prisons.
I shall vote Labour because I want to shop
in an all-weather precinct stretching from Yeovil to Glasgow.
I shall vote Labour because
the Queen's stamp collection is the best
in the world.
I shall vote Labour because
deep in my heart
I am a Conservative.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 16 Nov 19 - 03:40 AM

Latest polls:

Panelbase: CON: 43% (+3) LAB: 30% (-) LDEM: 15% (-) BREX: 5% (-3)

PaddyPower Majority Odds (Previous in Brackets):

       Tories: 8/15 (4/7)(1.53)
       No overall: 7/4 (13/8)(2.75)
       Labour: 20/1 (20/1)(21)
       Lib Dems: 150/1 (150/1)
       Brexit Party: -* (250/1)
If Paddy Power is correct, it is looking GOOD!!!!
Seems the also rans are stumbling at the first fence!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 16 Nov 19 - 03:30 AM

This could be an interesting week. The Labour Manifesto will be issued, but the Conservative one is not expected just yet. That will create a difficult few days for people like Javid who are stressing their fictitious costs of the Labour proposal. Time and again they are likely to be challenged that the figures they quote are for things not in the manifesto, while simultaneously still unable to cost theirs. And if they start saying what they think the actual manifesto will cost, they will again be open to challenge that they are putting more effort into costing the Labour proposals than their own.

I am convinced that this is going to be an election of individual wards. The conventional approach of seeing what Sunderland does (or other early declarer of the ward result) and basing predictions assuming that everywhere is likely to be an unusually poor guide to what actually happens.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: The Sandman
Date: 16 Nov 19 - 03:20 AM

I will vote for the labour party

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 06:20 PM

I think things are getting interesting. The NHS stats that came out yesterday, reflecting pretty accurately nine years of Tory misrule, and the broadband coup today that has wrongfooted the other parties and that is difficult to argue against, could be gamechangers. On top of that, Farage and his motley crew are rapidly imploding on the back of his severe political misjudgements. It's just whether anyone's listening...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 09:59 AM

At the moment the BT share price is down 1%, which is higher than it was on Nov 12 and roughly on trend for the last month. The announcement does not look as if it had a sustained impact. Of course, as with all share prices, that can change.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 07:56 AM

BWM - much as I love you and would never abuse you.

You are not engaging with the point that puzzled me, you are calling me a Daily mail reader - which frankly hurts. And comes nowhere in answering my question.

i really don't think our history, which has as many bloody tyrants as any other country, is the reason why people would risk their lives to get from Austria to here. I REALLY don't get it. And by the look of it - neither do you. Its just never occurred to you.

i will probably vote for he veggie munching little bumhole - but I don't have to agree with him, or like what he's done to the party I have voted for all my life.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 07:11 AM

The broadband initiative is a brilliant move.
Snigger, snigger
BT’s share price dropped almost 4% on opening this morning, following Labour’s late-night announcement yesterday that they plan on nationalising parts of BT to provide free full-fibre broadband to every household. They’ve costed it at £20 billion, which, in comparison to the rest of Labour’s manifesto, borders on pocket change…

Doing the media rounds this morning, McDonnell has promised re-nationalising British Telecoms really is the “limit of their ambitions”, however it has been pointed out he said the same thing when announcing he’d nationalise water, energy, rail and the post office…

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 05:51 AM

Y’know Al, for somebody who has achieved notoriety for playing the victim, and pissing and moaning about other people’s rudeness, you can be a very insulting fucker yourself, can’t you?

I tried to present a case which makes sense and isn’t mired in the racist propaganda of the Brexit Brigade. If you’re so intellectually bereft that you can’t understand the perfectly sound facts and reasons I presented, and feel the need to vent your considerable spleen on me, there’s nothing more I can say, other than that I suggest you find another victim.

Have a nice day.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 05:38 AM

National polls will not greatly influence my voting decision.'
Nor do I expect that my voting decision will affect the national result.

That depends where you live, JHW. In my ward, the Conservatives had a majority of 31. The Tory is an ERG member, the defeated Labour man was strongly remain. There was at least one vote on the Brexit dance where speaker had a casting vote, and cast it with the government (which Brexiteers overlook as it does not fit their tale about him.) Had a handful of people voted, or voted differently, that vote and possibly the course of Brexit itself could have changed.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 05:35 AM

The broadband initiative is a brilliant move.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: JHW
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 05:32 AM

'National polls will not greatly influence my voting decision.'
Nor do I expect that my voting decision will affect the national result.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 05:19 AM

I would have thought the vietnamese would have a closer cultural ties with france than us.

You're not listening BWM,   to what I'm saying. You're just coming with the dial a remoaner typical response.

I am genuinely puzzled as to why someone would risk their life to come here from Austria - I believe it was in the case of the Vietnamese. The EU generally though. As I believe you keep telling us. We will losing all the brilliant opportunities of employment in the EU for our own citizens, if we were to leave the EU. These people are not just trotting down the road to find another job. They are risking their lives. There must be some logic in it. I realise I won't get it from you.

I don't read any newspaper s these days. I have always driven on the left when it comes to voting - none of the right wing papers have ever disgraced my home.
You thought processes have been got at BWM.. Try to to achieve some independence of mind in your dotage. take a leaf out of jim's book.

here he is every day defending his pitch against the barbarians. try to be more like him. you know it makes sense.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 04:50 AM

Taking that a little further, Backwoodsman.

Let us focus on just that section who have for to Calais and still want to get to the UK. why don't they just stop in France?


well, a lot do, as BWM said. Then again as he said, the UK has a history of tolerance. while we have plenty to worry about here with racial attacks we are still a more welcoming country in many respects. For example, France has laws banning the hijab in public. Whatever you may think about that, these migrants have lost home, family, and jobs. Almost all they have left is their sense of identity. And banning the hijab takes even that away from them.

When Belsen-Bergen was freed by the allies there were lots of things sent to their aid: food, clothes, medicine. One day they recieved a large box of lipsticks. The initial response was, in modern terminology WYF? But afterwards some of the people involved said it was the single most important parcel they recieved because it gave the women back a sense of identity" they were women again, not objects.

It does not do to underestimate the importance of the sense of identity; it can outweigh everything else. In some ways, that is the real driving force of Brexit for many people.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 15 Nov 19 - 02:42 AM

You’ve been reading the Daily Fail and listening to that pair of lying c**ts Farage and Johnson again, Al. You’ve fallen for their nonsense, which is designed to appeal to their audience’s confirmation bias’, a.k.a. ‘Tell them what their prejudices want to hear’.

The truth is that the UK gets fewer asylum applicants than many of the other ‘top’ EU Member-States - fewer than Hungary, Sweden, Italy, France, around the same number as Belgium, Austria, and Switzerland, and considerably fewer than Germany - click the link and scroll down to the table headed ‘Number of First-Time Asylum Applicants’.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_migrant_crisis

And the answer to your question is, why wouldn’t the minority of migrants who attempt to come to the UK want to come here? Over the past couple of centuries at least, we have been a country that welcomes the weak and disadvantaged, we have stood up and fought tyrants not only for our own freedom but, more importantly, the freedom of other, weaker nations, we have built a successful economy, and we have (for the time being at least) a reasonably decent system of health and social care.

And we speak English - still the standard business-language and Lingua Franca of the whole world.

You like living here - so much so that you want to pull up the drawbridge, isolate us from the world’s biggest trading bloc - our nearest neighbours - and stop ‘them foreigners’ from coming here. Isn’t that what the Brexiteers’ mantra, Cummings’ rabble-rousing slogan ‘Take Back Control’ is all about?

In other words, they see the UK as Safety and Opportunity. Why wouldn’t somebody running from rape, murder, starvation, and other horrors we can only imagine, or even simply economic need, want to come here? And why would any decent, civilised, humane person want to stop them?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Nov 19 - 09:57 PM

What I never understood about the immigration business is this.

Those poor people who died in the container, and those people in camps at Calais - why are they so desperate to get here? To risk their lives!

After all they're out of the danger zone. they're in a country with a better economy that us. by all accounts better health service, better wages, better education system...

What is the attraction of Britain?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Nov 19 - 05:23 PM

And get this. Migration from the EU down by two-thirds. Migration from outside the EU up by 21%. Businesses who depend on EU migrants struggling. The immigration we could control, from outside the EU, is not controlled and it won't be a lot different after brexit. And the nasty smirking arrogant bugger who's spouting her vicious bile about "controlling our borders," Patel, wouldn't even be here at all had "our borders been controlled" when her folks wanted to move here. You couldn't make it up.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 14 Nov 19 - 04:26 PM

For this reason alone, no decent, responsible, ordinary person should vote for the bunch of A-holes who have put the NHS into this position...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 14 Nov 19 - 03:34 PM

The 'Climate change by Numbers' programme says three mathematicians 'reveal three numbers that tell the story about the past, present and future of the earth's climate."

I have yet to see it, but I am EXTREMELY sceptical that three numbers can reveal any such thing. It would be at best an extremely gross generalisation. Not least because it is numbers: three formulae would still be extremely coarse, but might give some vague chance. But even then, it would probably be curve fitting to data, not explaining data.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Nov 19 - 03:16 PM

"I'll be watching both with interest."
Doubt if Trump the Tweeter and Boris the Braindead will be
One will be changing the locks in preparation for the result of the forthcoming impeachment, the other will be awaiting his master's orders
Both area largely responsible for what is happening to the Planet
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Stanron
Date: 14 Nov 19 - 09:44 AM

There are two programs on BBC4 this evening (UK) about climate change. The first at 9 pm is a documentary investigating a data breach at the University of East Anglia in 2009 that suggested scientists had manipulated data to exaggerate evidence of climate change. and the second at 11:20 pm called Climate change by numbers. I'll be watching both with interest.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Nov 19 - 08:12 AM

Just a reminder that at the time Climate Change has now become a major international probe - - major flooding in Britain and Venice, Bush Fires in Australia, regular devastating hurricanes............... all the climate change chickens coming home to roost at the same time, The Tories have pulled Britain out of the International Climate Change Discussions on the orders to the White House thug now being investigated for impeachment
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 11:31 AM

Jim if you propose childish arguments backed with childish jibes it would seem eminently sensible to treat you as a child. Serious communication with you is demonstrated to be an impossibility time after time.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 11:25 AM

not long now!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 11:22 AM

”Facts are very awkward! Little jimmie first said:
Britain has always been ruled by educated apes.

I merely queried his nonsensical statement. The backward man should try to keep up with the narrative. Perhaps the name is very apt?”

Nothing to do with Jim, Baby Staines. You brought up Wilson, Callaghan, Blair and Brown, not Jim - time to take responsibility for your own nonsense, all there in black and white for everyone to see.

And, in true barrack-room lawyer ex-squaddie fashion, you resort once again to insults when you have no case. Pure muppetry, and completely ineffectual - I couldn’t care less about a fool who has nothing but insults in his armoury.

Back to ignoring the ignorant, methinks.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 11:07 AM

"vapourware will reduce."
I doubt it - what politicians promise will always be "like the barber's cat - all wind and piss (as my mam used to say) unless Corbyn breaks the mold
So far, so good
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 10:27 AM


In a very odd way, I'm finding that I can't take any interest in this election campaign

I know what you mean. I think, for me, it is because there is nothing of substance. The Tory wild estimates of Labour spending are clearly fake, but Labour has not yet said what its real commitments are. The Tories are making no end of announcements but all uncosted and almost all without timescales.

Maybe when we actually get manifestos the vapourware will reduce.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 09:45 AM

"Little jimmie first said:"
RThere goes that insecurity again
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 09:01 AM

Facts are very awkward! Little jimmie first said:
Britain has always been ruled by educated apes.

I merely queried his nonsensical statement. The backward man should try to keep up with the narrative. Perhaps the name is very apt?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 07:14 AM

LOL! :-)

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 07:08 AM

Ok. Just this once then :-)

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 07:05 AM

And, of course, allowing oneself the occasional bit of Nigelism can be very satisfying and liberating. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 07:01 AM

Sorry Dave! But, as Baby Staines so frequently says on this forum, “Awkward things, facts, aren’t they?”. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 06:56 AM

Stop that right now, John! :-)

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 06:26 AM

”Britain has always been ruled by educated apes.
Does that include Wilson, Callaghan, Blair and Brown?

more stunning stupidity off little jimmie.”

Wilson, Callaghan, Blair and Brown never ruled the United Kingdom, any more than Heath, Thatcher, Major, Cameron, May, or Johnson did.

HM Queen Elizabeth ll has ruled the UK since 1952, and continues to do so today. I would have expected a Right Wing Extremist - especially one whose indoctrination during his time as a squaddie would, if he’d been paying attention, have educated him appropriately - to know that.

More stunning stupidity off ‘Seaman’ Staines’s stooge.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 06:25 AM

My dad always called the Daily Express the Daily Liar. I see that it came out as "fun duty" in the paper's website too. I've always regarded it as my duty to have fun. The rest of the Express piece appears to be fake news.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 06:11 AM

‘Corbyn is coming for your car!’ Labour plots huge cost hikes to cut drivers by 60%

That will be a sure vote catcher in rural constituencies!
"An internal Labour Party report has revealed plans to increase fun duty and company car tax, along with mandatory road pricing and charges to park vehicles at work. Motorway speed limits will also be reduced in order for cars to travel more slowly and pollute less. And all planned road improvements will be scrapped too. But the Tories have warned a tax rise this could hit struggling motorists the hardest. It is now clear that Labour have secret plans to clobber hardworking people with a barrage of tax hikes on their family car, that would leave families with less money in their pockets.

“Labour’s extreme economic policies would be a disaster for drivers.

Tackling climate change is vital but independent experts and even Labour’s own unions say their promises don’t stack up.”

Tim Roache, head of the GMB union, which is Labour’s third-largest funder, also highlighted the policy would result in the “confiscation of petrol cars,” which could put “entire industries and the jobs they produced in peril.”

The madness that is Labour!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 06:06 AM

I see that Sayeeda "why-was-she-ever-a-bloody-Tory" Warsi* is getting increasingly animated about the widespread culture of Islamophobia in the Tory party, rightly so too. Am I alone in detecting the distinct whiff of hypocrisy in the air, considering the concerted onslaught of mostly false accusations against Labour over the last few years?

In a very odd way, I'm finding that I can't take any interest in this election campaign. It could be brexit exhaustion (brexhaustion?) on my part. Maybe I'll warm up a bit as time goes on...

*Along with Dominic Grieve, Justine Greening and Sarah Wollaston...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 05:25 AM

I saw that DMcG. It confirms exactly who is running the right wing and brexit extremists. It should be plastered all over by the remain campaign. A vote for brexit is giving the thumbs up to unelected multi-millionaires to run the country!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 04:57 AM

I see Arron Banks is telling the Brexit Party to stand down more candidates 'There are 48 hours to save Brexit and save the country from a Corbyn government," Banks said.'


He doesn't sound confident of a huge Tory majority, does he?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 04:44 AM

Britain has always been ruled by educated apes.
Does that include Wilson, Callaghan, Blair and Brown?

more stunning stupidity off little jimmie.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 04:21 AM

A highly educated King PASSING HIS EDUCATION ON TO HIS FAMILY
Britain has always been ruled by educated apes
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Nov 19 - 04:06 AM

Brtainless Boris - A King's scholar at Eton(awarded for academic excellence) Degree from Oxford.
Braindead corbyn - Privately educated until age 11, then Grammar school(one of the top 50 schools in the country)left with 2AL grade E.
Then Corbyn began a course in Trade Union Studies at North London Polytechnic but left after a year without a degree after a series of arguments with his tutors over the curriculum.

Corbyn an excellent example of the old adage:
You can lead a horse to water, but cannot make it drink!

Boris supped heartily at the foot of Athena, Compo got lost on the way.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 12 Nov 19 - 08:26 AM

Interesting to see the out-in-the-open love affait between Fascist Farage and Brainless Boris
Not sure who going to be 'The Fuehrer' and 'Il Duce' if they get anywhere
PITY CHARLIE ISN'T AROUND TO IMMORTALISE THEM
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 12 Nov 19 - 07:38 AM

Back in the ‘80s, the leader of one of the two major parties was out on the streets, campaigning against the Apartheid regime, and for the rights of black citizens, in South Africa. The leader of the other of the two major parties was out on the streets, burning £20 notes in front of homeless people.

No need to even say which one is which, is there?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 12 Nov 19 - 04:37 AM

. I expected you to point out that it was not so much destroying the ring as the quest to destroy the ring that impacted his homeland. Still, let's leave this as a Brexit thread than change it into some sort of online book club.

It is obvious you are referring to Corbyn as Gollum as, in the unlikely event he becomes PM, the country will be transformed into an economic wasteland
https://www.ft.com/content/439d7270-cfb8-11e9-99a4-b5ded7a7fe3f
Their crowning insanity is the wish to nationalize everything from hospital pharmacies to energy suppliers.

But of course to pursue this insanity Labour first has to implement brexit, but display their usual sleight of hand by not making this
clear to the electorate. Such a policy runs counter to EU legislation.
"Under Article 107(I) TFEU, the actions of member states must not distort competition. Interventions by EU member states in the economy can be ruled unlawful if it can be shown that they use state resources, distort competition, distort trade between member states or give enterprises a selective advantage. Article 87(1) TFEU covers “any aid granted by a member state or through state resources in any form whatsoever which distorts or threatens to distort competition by favouring certain undertakings or the production of certain goods, in so far as it affects trade between member states.”

Competitive tendering dominates EU law with the exception of certain defense related industries.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Nov 19 - 08:39 PM

They do what they do whether we respond or not - but I' take your point
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Mossback
Date: 11 Nov 19 - 05:49 PM

"Stuff a sock in yer gob, eh?"

Why ?

Why, Jim? Because the only reason they keep it up is to stick a finger in your eye, and you keep on encouraging them to do so ad nauseam ..

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Nov 19 - 04:12 PM

It's official then. Johnson and Farage are joined at the hip. What a nightmarish creature Brexit has spawned!