BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Musket
Date: 09 Oct 11 - 06:51 AM

I suppose that by saying a doctor in a hospital has a gut feelings about mobile phones, it must be true that they are the root of all neuro problems?

One doctor having a gut feeling isn't evidence, ask that actual doctor! (One thing I have learned since interfering in healthcare and for that matter being married to a doctor, is that having human hunches is secondary to their obligation to be evidence based. it's what sorts the real ones from the quacks, and this guy must be a real one. Don't confuse a gut feeling with a professional opinion. My wife has a gut feeling I eat and drink too much for my own good whilst she has a very healthy diet. Yet the evidence is that she picks up every cold and bug going while I remain fit as a butcher's dog.

RF radiation is around us and if you go back a few hundred years, it was still around us. Research is ongoing as to whether the frequencies and power levels of man made RF in certain instances can have an effect that our cells are not evolved to withstand. (Hence the possibility of leukaemia clusters being a plausible smoking gun to set your hypothesis on.)

But the jury is out and going back to the stone age ain't going to stop solar flares, the effect of our magnetosphere or atomic decay radiation all around us.

Me? I'd go for a pint or three and enjoy life. Hang on! Pubs open in ten minutes! (Would be before now, but it is Sunday and the bloody Christians have the right to interfere with my social life...)

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 08 Oct 11 - 08:37 PM

There ya go Dick... fry up some rodents. Let's get at it and do some real research. Seems like the big money only wants ta warn people about kids livin near power lines on accounta they might hafta pay out money for that... not fer old fellahs like you and me... and 9, of course, although I think 9 is goin out in a ball of fire even if he don't live near power lines. He's got style eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 08 Oct 11 - 11:11 AM

Guest,999-
If I have become mean-spirited (which I don't believe I have) it's due to the prevalent Anti-Scientific trend in thinking. If you don't or can't test hypotheses, then they remain unproven guesses. The hypotheses that Jack Campin just suggested is certainly plausible; the expected result if it were, in fact , true would be an increase in lung cancer near power lines. The supposed problem, I believe , is leukemia.
In any case, the hypothesis is easily testable by exposing lab rodents to dusty environments with and without low-frequency EMR being present.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,Jack Campin
Date: 08 Oct 11 - 08:31 AM

One suggested mechanism for damage to health from high-voltage power lines is rather indirect. The lines act like an electrostatic precipitator, putting charge on fine particles of pollutants as they drift past the wires. The result being that the particles are more likely to stick to your lungs when you breathe them in, some way downwind and well beyond the distance where any direct biological effect of the electromagnetic field would occur.

This was published (with empirical evidence that it actually happens) in some honest-to-god refereed journal a few years ago.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 07:30 PM

"I can't prove that that power line radiation doesn't affect tissue, but I also can't prove that there aren't evil spirits that live near power lines that cause measles, of cancer or warts."

Why have you become so mean-spirited?

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Paul Burke
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 06:52 PM

Well, while you're saving the children from Big Powa, remember the sacrifice you're making- every post, POW! there goes another kitten, or bunny rabbit, or meerkat...

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 06:37 PM

Fact is, youse are endageringing kittens by forcing them to live near power lines you heartless bastards! Why subject these kitties to such a horrible end?... measles, cancer, warts... you will have to answer some day when you go to pay that final bill at the power company.

Just make sure you put your account number on the cheque. They seem to get pissed about that for some strange reason.

Stop using the internut? How can I spread the wierd about this danger unless I use massive mediums?

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 06:20 PM

Gnu- There's an immense difference between low-frequency radiation's effect on things, and microwave-frequency radiation's effects. I can't prove that that power line radiation doesn't affect tissue, but I also can't prove that there aren't evil spirits that live near power lines that cause measles, of cancer or warts.
When you say you ain't no scientist, I can only agree.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Paul Burke
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 06:08 PM

Gnu:

Stop using electricity and killing other people's children then. That means stop using the internet.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 05:35 PM

Power delivery, IEEE Transactions, vol. 17 Issue 2, 2002, "Evaluation of the potential for power line noise to degrade real time differential GPS messages broadcast at 283.5-325 kHz.":

"The new Nationwide Differential Global Positioning System network uses the 283.5-325 kHz band to broadcast differential GPS (DGPS) correction messages. Concern has been expressed that power line corona and gap discharge noise could degrade the performance of DGPS receivers using this band...."

Cutting to the heart, if you are lost, do not use your GPS near a power line.
The article goes on to say that nearby nonpower line RF noise sources also may disrupt performance, such as those in vehicles.

Google the article if you are interested in its content.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 05:17 PM

But do you suspect this guest has no children?

Look, I ain't no scientist but I and my cousin have had tumours and the head neuro doc at the NYU school of medicine, a relative, said cell phones suck years ago... no need to show him any studies. Now, the WHO and Health Canada... oh, nevermind. Build yerself an aerie on a pylon and fry yer ass. Me? Nope.

As far as the studies go, big brother ain't gonna tell ya shit. So, fer me, why bother getting in bother? Fer me, it's a no brainer.... why take the chance when you don't have to do so? YMMV.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Paul Burke
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 04:32 PM

That's how people misread technical reports. It says:

There are known biological effects at levels WELL ABOVE 100uT.
The average exposure being above 0.3uT is rare.
The level DIRECTLY below power lines can be 20uT.

So far so good: even below power lines the level is well below that known to cause harm.

Then it says:

Childhood leukemia is rare (about 49000 cases; the child population of the world is perhaps 1 billion, most of whom live in areas with electric power).
1-4% of children live in fields greater than the average 0.3uT field.
The number of cases that MIGHT be attribuyed to ELF is 100-2400 (in a population of 1 billion)
A (disputed) study suggested that this (small) possibility might be doubled from tiny (1 in 400000) to slightly less tiny (1 in 200000).

Compare the 2400 worldwide cases with 5000 children killed/ seriously injured in traffic accidents in the UK in 2001 -child population 1 million- a thousand times the risk.

Note that it does NOT say that these children live in areas of 0.3-0.4uT- it is above this, and it doesn't say how much above. The dispute about the study cited is stated to be partly procedura, but in all epidemiological cases there is the problem of detecting effects that are well down in the "noise".

And note what I said previously: if you have electricity, you EITHER have pylon lines with high electric, but low magnetic, fields; or underground lines with low electric, but high magnetic, fields. The alternative is no electricity.

And I suspect Guest Guest Housebuyer isn't a child (though s/he might have them).

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,GUEST: house-buyer
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 04:13 PM

Many thanks for all the responses, suggestions, anecdotes &c. I've been doing some research of my own (including the extraordinary powers that some utilty companies have to appropriate land, including parts of gardens) and find much common ground with the materials posted here. Suffice it to say that I'm seeking a home elsewhere, but will invest in a 100m measuring-tape in order to establish distances for myself. Yes, M theGM, the use of the word "current" was directly intended, though I alternated between it and another word... (rather like "powers" above).

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 03:02 PM

LOL gnu, your poor garden! But I know you don't mean that!

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 02:40 PM

Eliza... the earth is flat and the sun revolves around the earth until proven otherwise.

Paul's suggestion that kittens be used in studies is certainly worth merit in my opinion. If I can catch the little bastards that have been messing up my garden, I will offer them to anyone doing any studies... of anything.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 01:39 PM

Paul, I've read the Factsheet you kindly provided, and as I understand it, the following two facts emerge:-
1) Long-term exposure to values above 0.3-0.4 microteslas cause a twofold increase in childhood leukaemias.
2) The level underneath powerlines is generally 20 microteslas.
Thus, living under or very near a high-tension line would surely be rather unwise???

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Paul Burke
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 12:06 PM

World Health Organisation Fact sheet N°322 on the effects of electrical and magnetic fields, June 2007:

Following a standard health risk assessment process, the Task Group concluded that there are no substantive health issues related to ELF electric fields at levels generally encountered by members of the public. Thus the remainder of this fact sheet addresses predominantly the effects of exposure to ELF magnetic fields.

However, if you've already convinced yourself that power lines kill kittens, or that the CIA are tapping your phone, no evidence is ever going to persuade you otherwise.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Musket
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 07:35 AM

I used to work on high voltage systems but I'm alright noooOWWW. (Ok, I did. We supplied at 6.6KV down our pit when I was an electrician there and when I worked on the pit top, one winding house had an 11KV motor. Serious stuff.....)

Seriously, there may be long term issues, and there may not be. I am aware that there are very long term clinical studies being carried out in a number countries on this and other RFI type issues such as mobile phone masts, microwave repeater towers and TV transmitters.

The UK has laws governing exposure of magnetic flux and radio waves in clinical settings, (covering X Ray, scanners, ultrasound etc) and if anybody is interested, the regs are called The Ionising Radiation (Medical Exposure) Regulations 2000, (IR(ME)R 2000.)

These ensure nobody has unnecessary exposure in a medical setting. Now, I am sure there are good reasons why exposure levels are set in law, and the background to the tolerance levels may have a bearing on this discussion. However, the strong local exposure through, (to give the best comparison) MRI scanners will be umpteen times as powerful as living near a pylon. However, for a much shorter sustained period.

Interesting stuff. I assume it will be some time before the long term studies can give us anything conclusive but I don't see it as an issue till told otherwise, my take on it.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 07 Oct 11 - 04:55 AM

Thank you, gnu, I think I might try that. We have a lovely little bridge in our village, over a mill-race. That should do nicely! My husband isn't at all amazed. In Africa, such things are perfectly normal. Will let you know how I got on!

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 11:24 PM

Just spoke with an engineer friend of mine who's in the electricity business. I asked him if he'd encountered any studies that showed any link between harmful health effects from radiation caused by high-voltage lines. His answer was no. He was aware of the flawed study done in the late 1970s, and nothing has come up since that's conclusive one way or the other.

I'll look on Mr Google again, but I ain't holding my breath.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 09:33 PM

C'mon-Tissue is tissue. I've never seen evidence that carcinogen studies on lab animals isn't applicable to humans.
That's how carcinogenic properties of cigarette smoking were established.
If you want to believe, go ahead. But it's no more reasonable than than some other popular beliefs.Intelligent design, anyone?
Mice live for a few years, BTW.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 05:48 PM

I did chuckle Q, but it is PI and there is bound to be someone that would be terribly offended just for the sake of it.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 04:49 PM

Of course, rats are faster; the laboratory rat may produce up to 5 litters in a year, but the response of rats to the EMF stimulus may not be applicable to humans. Hence my mention of kids as an alternative. Takes longer.....

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 04:43 PM

Well now, let's take that a step further... if mice age MUCH faster than humans and your postulate is that they won't live long enough to be affected, is that a reason NOT to do a study? Perhaps there is more than meets the eye in that very postulate. Perhaps they actually would be affected due to their "accelerated" aging?

That is to say, one cannot determine (read predict) the outcome of an experiment before one performs the experimant. I say, fry up a few rodents. That's what they are for.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 03:20 PM

Q-
Breeding cycle for mice is about 6 weeks. You can get lots of generations in a much much shorter time period than this hypothesis has been argued about. If you want to be cautious, fine. Bit it's a matter of belief, not science.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 03:03 PM

Eliza... take a couple of pieces of metal rod (copper wire works best) and bend them such that one leg will cross your palm and be about one inch longer than your hand is wide. The other leg should be about a foot or more. Make a "fist" with your thumb pads against the nails of the index and middle fingers such that the rods may move freely in the inch or so diameter "hole". Point the rods straight ahead. Walk over running water. Try this on a bridge at first... a wooden bridge if possible.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 02:44 PM

Laboratory tests cannot produce answers to this question overnight- several generations of rats- or about two if kids are used- to test carcinogenic probability.

Hence the National Institute of Health assessment, which really says it behooves us to be cautious about long term exposure.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 02:25 PM

My Irish Grandfather was a water diviner. Perhaps I've inherited his ability, which might explain my sensitivity! Actually, now I think of it, I'd like to try. Wonder what you have to do? (I never knew him, so never discovered how he did it.)

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 02:10 PM

50mm away? So, 50mm of your finger gets exposed every time you turn the light off... seems a rather low dosage over time to me.

I get the same feeling travelling transversely under power lines or over running water. This does not happen when I am stationary or travelling parallel to either.

I have heard some people say that devining water or electical power is hogwash but I have done it as a resident engineer on many construction projects. I was never without my divining rods when I travelled to remote sites... try to find a suitable tree in northern or coastal Labrador from which to cut a divining stick(s).

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 02:08 PM

Bert. No. I have too much respect for lab rats. But testing on sufficiently large samples of suburbanites is prohibitively expensive. Cages would have to be huge,and the number of lawns that would have to be mowed is extremely large. here might even be some with moral or ethical objections.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Paul Burke
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 01:00 PM

The choices for society are fairly simple. We have electricity, carried overhead at high tension on pylon lines. It's safe, flexible and cheap but ugly. Or we have electricity, carried below ground at low tension but high current. It's very expensive and inflexible, and it wrecks the archaeology and drainage wherever it goes. You may also have to demolish houses if they are in the way, and the high magnetic fields involved are more likely to have health implications than high voltage, because the high voltage is far away and the high current close by. Or we do not have electricity. Some of you may live remotely enough from civilisation and all it provides to consider this option, but society as a whole does not.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Bert
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 12:56 PM

Are likening Suburbanites to lab rats, Dick;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 11:44 AM

Clearly, if there is a doubt about the damaging effects of low-frequency EMR, this should be investigated. But investigation is not the same thing as assuming that what might be actually is.
It's an easy enough hypothesis to test, if you're willing to accept the fact that there's a faint possibility tht some lab rats might be harmed.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Penny S.
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 06:59 AM

I do know that under high tension cables near Bluewater a friend got a small shock from a wire fence running parallel to the lines. The sort you might pick up from metal objects after walking on synthetic carpet.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 06:36 AM

I really am not sure of the dangers, have always been aware that there are concerns and do agree that they do not look very nice and seem to stand out. However, it would not put me off buying a house near them if I liked the house and the area and the price was right. I live not all that far from electricity pylons and also not all that far from the sewage works :) and was always amazed when the houses around me were built that those directly under the overhead power lines and close to the pylons sold just as quickly as those that were not and for the same prices. I am also close to the River Nidd and some beautiful countryside and walks. I am in an area where houses sell well but having said all of this I would still have some concerns about re-selling in the future, just maybe not enough to put me off.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Bert
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 06:07 AM

I wouldn't buy a house near a pylon 'cos they are so bloody ugly.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 05:32 AM

Have to say, I'm a great believer in orthodox science, and take on board all the points explained here about the physics etc of electricity and magnetic fields. I do feel a bit silly, and I admit it. But I still have these reactions. Maybe they're psychological (or 'neurotic' as one poster suggested) I'm quite reassured by the lack of risk explained here, so thank you. Will try to drag myself into the 21st Century and accept modern installations and development, but still have illogical reservations!

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 04:26 AM

re the inside car protection argument - my girls and I were all 3 of us unwell before we got out of the car at the Rollrights Stones. As soon as we parked up actually. Parking is on road quite near. None of us felt unwell at Stonehenge. At Avebury only 2 felt unwell and one so unwell she could not walk the entire circle and we had to stop car when leaving past avenue of standing stones so she could be sick. We were all adults. So no kids getting car sick thing.

Eliza - I get a rising gullet feeling. Upper chest and throat feel full. Bit of nausea and sometimes bit of dull headache. Quite dramatic, because I typically sing in the car and suddenly I will stop, before I realise that I feel funky and before seeing a transformer substation. TheSilentOne (husband and driver) used to ask what's wrong. Now we both know why.

As an aside, does anyone know why some people cannot wear windup wrist watches? When I was 8 I received my first Timex. And as soon as I put it on it stopped keeping time. My Dad yelled it me. Thought I'd over wound it. I hadn't touched the winder. Took it off and it worked again. Put it on it stopped. This happened with about 4 different wind up watches from 8 to 30 years. Battery op watches tended to die quite quickly too. Don't bother with watches now. Use my phone for the time.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Paul Burke
Date: 06 Oct 11 - 02:17 AM

There's nothing funny about high voltage electricity. The field strength is high - a 240kV high voltage grid line, 50 metres away, gives 4800V/m - but otherwise it's the same electricity that's in your house, much closer. The UK 240V supply would give the same field strength at 50mm, so if pylons make you feel ill, so should turning the light off. There is about ten times the field standing on the platform of a 25kV European railway.

The magnetic field from the lines is even less of a problem, as the high voltage means a correspondingly low current. A gigawatt transmission line at 500kV carries about 1500A per phase. The field diminishes with the square of distance, so 1500A 100m away is about the same as 15A 10m away, in other words the ordinary fields around your house.

The ELF restrictions proposed are really the result of massive lobbying from the neurotic and there is no evidence of effects at the level of exposure you get from electricity transmission.

On the other hand, as others have said, many people find pylon lines unsightly, and superstition has its effects - it might be easier to sell a "haunted" house.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 08:29 PM

Q:

My apologies. That's why I've shot myself in the foot a time or two.

Point I was trying to make--which MAY be your point, is that if PG&E allow that on their site, what's the real story?

AND, I'll have you know, I do NOT know what a URL is. Never have, never will. An' that's that.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 08:27 PM

"The lack of positive findings in animals or in mechanistic studies weakens the belief that this association is actually due to ELF-EMF, but cannot completely discount the finding."
Like I said.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 06:51 PM

Above, I gave the url for the NIEHS-NIH summary, and an extract from the report.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 05:56 PM

The World Health Organization--the following from a Pacific Gas and Electricity page--disagrees with you, Dick.

"It is our opinion that based on evidence to date, ELF-EMF exposure would not be listed in the "Report on Carcinogens" as an agent "reasonably anticipated to be a human carcinogen."

The NIEHS agrees that the associations reported for childhood leukemia and adult chronic lymphocytic leukemia cannot be dismissed easily as random or negative findings. The lack of positive findings in animals or in mechanistic studies weakens the belief that this association is actually due to ELF-EMF, but cannot completely discount the finding. The NIEHS also agrees with the conclusion that no other cancers or non-cancer health outcomes provide sufficient evidence of a risk to warrant concern."

That is from a PG&E page. People critical of that should look further.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 05:37 PM

If you're not a believer in anecdotal physics, Is's difficult to imagine how low-frequency EMR could affect living tissue. Microwave frequencies are something else again.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: treewind
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 05:28 PM

If you're in a car, then whatever the cause of feeling odd near power lines it's not the electric field because there isn't any inside a hollow conductor like a car body. You can sit inside a car and even have it struck by lighting and you're perfectly safe.

A house is a different matter, especially if there's a garden or the street outside is near the power lines.

Anahata

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 04:50 PM

Personally, I wouldn't live anywhere near a pylon, transmitter, transformer, power station etc. Like you, VirginiaTam, I'm quite sensitive to these things. Whether it's my imagination or not, I feel as if my head is 'full' when passing underneath high-tension cable from pylons in my car. I swear if I was blindfolded in the passenger seat, I could tell you exactly when we passed underneath one! Our bodies have polarity, and strong magnetic fields must surely have an adverse effect on our cells. Our poor bodies have enough to cope with, pollution, noise,stress etc etc. Let's give them a chance by trying to live in a house reasonably free of trouble!

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 04:08 PM

There must be something true about negative effects of electricity pylons. I don't why but I feel really unwell when we drive near or by transformer stations. Often sense before I see them. Been so ill once we had to stop the car shortly after passing one until the nausea passed.

And my daughters and I have all had hiccups (simultaneously) and unwell feelings near stone circles.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 03:56 PM

No, it was just you. Shows your latent homosexual tendencies. Karen is a nurse. She can help you understand that such feelings are natural as long as you don't start trying to grab handfuls of gravel. Then it gets much more complicated.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: catspaw49
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 03:51 PM

Am I the only one who first read this title as "Python?" I'm sure I don't want to live around any electrically charged python.....................

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 02:50 PM

Good point Eliza. Buy cheap, sell cheap... BUT, if one needs to resell quickly for whatever reason, well, there it is.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,Eliza
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 02:42 PM

You may consider not buying a house which will be difficult to resell later. Your concerns about these pylons will no doubt be shared by your prospective future purchasers. Childhood leukaemia clusters have been found in the vicinity of strong magnetic force fields, but clusters do not necessarily constitute conclusive evidence.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 02:41 PM

Certainly so Q. Empirically, adult cancers can be attributed to SO many factors that analyses of data are rendered useless. The fact that is a "weak" link in the study of children seems to me to preclude such a choice based on what you said... caution is the better part of value... essentially.

Of course, do you wanna die happy or live until you ain't? It's a matter of personal choice. >;-) or >;-( as you wish. >;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 02:14 PM

National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences- National Institute of Health (U.S.)
"Studies conducted in the 1980s showed a link between magnetic field strength and the risk of childhood leukemia. After reviewing more than two decades of research in this area, NIEHS scientists have concluded that the overall pattern of results suggests a weak association between increasing exposure to EMFs and an increased risk of childhood leokemia."
"The few studies that have been conducted on adult exposures show no evidence of a link between residential EMF exposure and adult cancers, ..... Based on these reviews, the NIEHS recommends continued education on practical ways of reducing exposures to EMFs."

In other words, erring on the side of caution is understandable.

http://www.niehs.nih.gov/health/topics/agents/emf/

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 02:10 PM

"Do any Mudcat members know something of this matter, and if so, could they indicate where I might quickly find out more about current thinking? " - from the OP
<><><>
Would it be out of place to post a word of admiration for this locution? Pun intended or fortuitous, I wonder?

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Bill D
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 02:03 PM

I remember standing directly under some big lines in Butte, Montana many years ago, and I could actually hear them 'humming'. It was a very disconcerting sound and I have since noticed car radio interference when very close to one.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:50 PM

200 and 400 kV lines create relatively strong electromagnetic fields. The best study so far seems to have been done in California but as far as I can find out quickly, the results were suppressed, although for what reason(s) I don't know.

There are two places you might wish to read. Google




FAQ for Health Effects of Transmission ... - Power Line Health Facts


Living By Power Lines


From what I've read over the years, living too close can be risky to your health. Hope this helps.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: gnu
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:38 PM

Electromagnetic waves and fields are dangerous. I cannot support that statement nor do I have time to "google". I just would not locate near a high voltage power line.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:36 PM

My own take (note- my personal opinion) is that there is no danger unless they fall on you.

However, when I bought my house, I rejected one because it was close enough to major transmission lines that shortwave (and other) radio reception was poor. At the time I was an avid listener, but my wife's complaints about squawks in the night cured me of the addiction.

Subject: RE: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: SINSULL
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 01:01 PM

google maybe?

Subject: BS: Dangers of Electricity Pylons (question)
From: GUEST,GUEST; house-buyer
Date: 05 Oct 11 - 12:22 PM

At present I'm looking to buy a house (first time). Among those I saw was one which seemed significantly cheaper than I'd have expected, by comparison with others in the general area. I noticed that there were some tall steel structures, in a line, several hundred yards away, and about two hundred yards from the house there was the concrete base for another. I know these are for the support of cables carrying electricty, and remember somethng, years ago, about concerns that high-voltage lines might cause health problems for those living nearby. Do any Mudcat members know somethng of this matter, and if so, could they indicate where I might quickly find out more about current thinking?