BS: What if there was no Mudcat?

Subject: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Azizi
Date: 03 Dec 05 - 10:34 PM

What if there was no Mudcat Discussion Forum?

Would you miss it? And if so, what would you miss?

I'll start.

If there was no Mudcat, I would definitely miss it.
I would miss conversing with people from all around the world-most of whom I'm likely never to meet, but many of whom I feel I'm getting to know through the comments they post here.

If there was no Mudcat, I would also miss reading interesting, insightful, and just plain fun posts about music and non-music subjects.

And I would miss posting comments and exchanging comments with others-which brings me back to my first point.

Your turn.

What if there was no Mudcat Discussion Forum?
Would you miss it? And if so, what would you miss?

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Rapparee
Date: 03 Dec 05 - 10:50 PM

If there was no Mudcat it would have to be created.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Dani
Date: 03 Dec 05 - 10:56 PM

Perish the thought, Azizi. Without having found the Mudcat, I'd be missing:

- Some of the best friends of my heart

- The courage to make my own music

- A world view much informed by the differing people/opinions/outlooks of Mudcat

- a bodhran, and all that it is teaching me before I even get to play it

- new opportunities to love

... and more than I can think of at this hour.

Thanks, Azizi, for the reminder of what a gift this whole thing is.

Dani

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Amos
Date: 03 Dec 05 - 11:39 PM

I would be so bored in my odd spare moments I'd probably take up crossword puzzles.

A

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 12:24 AM

Way back a few months ago when the 'cat was having enough troubles to make me a bit paranoid, I surfed up a couple of other "highly recommended centers of social and intellectual interaction" and bookmarked them.

I'll admit - if no one tells on me - that I've watched them since, waiting to see if anything invited my participation.

One site claims over 60,000 posts since I started observing - - - and nobody's said anything yet ... ... ... .

It's a vast, empty, and very sterile world out there...

John

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 03:40 AM

Someone once said " as breathing is my life, to stop I dare not dare. "   
Mudcat is like oxygen to me, I need it.

eric

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 04:27 AM

We would be doing something else!

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 04:38 AM

I'd have more money and less friends.
G.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 06:24 AM

I'd probably have go back to work full time..... perish the thought!

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Donuel
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 06:36 AM

I am accustomed to discovering that a forum supposedly dedicated to the exchange of ideas, poetry, lyrics, art and politics has either disappeared or banned my participation.

A few of the most recent sites that have banned my participation, usually for anti Republican opinions or inflamatory thought pictures, have been:
The Democratic Underground
The Liberty Forum
Renderosity
Salty Poetry
String Asylum
Maestronet
and a multitude of dozens of other sites I can not even remember at this hour.
The last two I listed actually succeeded in bilking me of donations amounting to less than $400.

It takes a small man to carry a big grudge whose concepts of authority and power is examplified by their need to silence others.

If mudcat died an un natural death the ashes of the most insightful people would settle and the flow of thought would be re born.
The mix of people here is an azeotrope of ambrosia and mud.
When John mentioned a site that had nothing to say I heard a song in my head "60,000 posts and nothing to say". Those kind of sites are a prolific pasturized potion of petty pathetic posts...

sorry if I spit.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: kendall
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 07:19 AM

I'd be single.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: ard mhacha
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 07:29 AM

Now we know, it`s out on it`s own.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: mack/misophist
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 09:25 AM

I would have found/learned many fewer interesting things.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 09:35 AM

Imagine there's no mudcat
It's easy if you try
No bullshit below the line
Above it only sky.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: gnu
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 09:43 AM

What is the sound of one 'Cat posting?

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: CarolC
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 09:44 AM

If it had never existed, my life would be very different than it is right now. The Mudcat completely changed my life in just about every respect.

If it ceased to exist right now, I would definitely miss it. I have met many people from many parts of the world through the Mudcat, many of them just online, but also well over a hundred in person. The Mudcat has made my world so much bigger than it was before. I would miss having the opportunity to meet and become friends with the kinds of people I've met here.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Flash Company
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 10:03 AM

Sheila's opinion is that if there was no Mudcat she'd get to see me in an afternoon.
Seriously, I would feel that I had lost a lot of friends, and my best way to show off now I can not sing. You can't stop the ideas forming, and I have to let them out somewhere.

FC

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 10:29 AM

Donuel, that's Bruce Springsteen you hear, singing "57 channels and there's nothing on"

Dani

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Charley Noble
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 10:34 AM

I would have found it more difficult to find musical contacts all over the world that share a common love of traditional style folk songs, and a sense of humor that seems to go along with that love. Sure, I might have been able to track you folks down without Mudcat but it would have taken me years more!

And for those of us who share a relatively obscure interest such as nautical songs and poems, Mudcat at its best provides a critical mass to share opinions with, access new and old songs, attend special events, and even collaborate on occasion virtually or in person.

As a songwriter and performer Mudcat has helped me grow and I value the new friends I've been able to make through this website.

I am exploring other websites such as Oldpoetry.com but Mudcat, despite its flaws, remains my favorite.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Severn
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 11:36 AM

I'm old enough to flash back to those old Raleigh cigarette ads where they'd say. "What would you be missing if you didn't smoke Raleigh?", and all the furniture in the room gotten through the Raleigh Coupons included in every pack disappeared one by one with the sound of a "Ding"! (Of course the standard joke of the time was that 10,000 Raleigh coupons could buy you an iron lung, but I digress....) Anyway, here's what I've gained in slightly less than a year among you.....


New friends I've talked with, both in print and in person, too numerous to mention. Others, whose posts I've read benefitted by or were entertained by, but have not been personally acknowledged--Know you ARE apprieciated! The feeling of community, help and guidance offered and exchanged when needed, forgiveness given when nescessary.
Being there with me through some rough times, shared or unshared.

Access to new and old music, in print, sampled, heard live, bought and exchanged among aforementioned friends.

Knowledge gained and shared. The chance to act as an authority one minute on one thread and a student with a blank slate the next on another, either acknowledged or by merely lurking. The chance to engage in meaningful dialogue of all sorts. Information about people and things in other places that stacks of old National Geographics in an attic couldn't begin to touch. The opportunity to express myself creatively and to bounce ideas, serious and humorous, off of some of the sharper minds I've had the pleasure to encounter and be inspired by them.

The excuse to spend many pleasureable hours that could have been wasted on housework, paperwork, chores and drudgery with the likes (and dislikes) of you, which reminds me.....I've got a stack of things to do that I've put off, so I'll catch you folks later.....

...But thanks again! I'm a better man for having been here.

Stradling the thin line
between sentiment and sediment,

Severn

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: gnu
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 12:00 PM

"Stradling the thin line between sentiment and sediment, Severn"

Awww Sev, sniff, sniff. Very well put.

I'll ditto what Sev said, and others, on accounta I couldn't say it near as well. I'll just multiply it by about five years.

Ya know, it's kinda odd that I still haven't accomplished the very thing that brought me here. It was a request for help in finding a recording of a song I have never, to this day, heard sung. I don't care anymore. I am just enjoying the Café, it's regulars and irregulars. I hope I can hang around for another five years.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Once Famous
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 12:42 PM

I really would not care and would find something else as moderately interesting to do.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 01:01 PM

there are people on here whose opinions and thoughts i respect and admire... them i would miss.

on the other hand if there were no mudcat i'd probably be a helluva lot better musician.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: CarolC
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 05:19 PM

That's too bad, GUEST,04 Dec 05 - 01:01 PM. Musically, I was completely isolated, with no one to help me learn what I needed to know to be able to do what I wanted to do. I found my musical mentors here in the Mudcat, and the help I've received has made me a far better musician and a far better accordionist than I would have been otherwise.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 05:40 PM

til i flashed on Mudcat I was one sorry dude. drink and debauchery were my life. now I have shunned the works of satan and I revel in the refined intellectuality of mudcat.

here I can think deep cyberthoughts and express myself cogently, honestly and breathe the heady fragrances of cyber freedom.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: leftydee
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 07:55 PM

If there were no Mudcat ......Martin Gibson would have to find another group of people to annoy

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Peace
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 07:57 PM

"here I can think deep cyberthoughts and express myself cogently, honestly and breathe the heady fragrances of cyber freedom"

'Ready anytime you are, CB!'

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Peace
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 09:42 PM

"The famous movie director Cecil B. DeMille was directing one of his "cast-of-thousands" extravaganzas, and the time came to shoot the big action scene. He set up three camera stations, just to make sure that the effort went on film. Finally, at seven a.m. on the big day, he yelled, "Roll 'em!," and the action began. For ten hours, chariots raced, horses ran, soldiers fought, swords clashed, and thousands of extras did their thing. Finally, exhausted, he went to the first camera station to find the cameraman pounding his fists on the ground. "I can't understand it," he cried. "The lens cap got left on the whole time and we got nothing." A little shaken, C.B. went to the second camera station to find the cameraman pounding his fists on the ground. "I can't understand it," he cried. "There was no film in the camera the whole time and we got nothing." Upset now, C.B. thought at least he had the third man for backup, and went to his position. The cameraman greeted him jovially and called out, "Anytime you're ready, C.B.!"'

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: GUEST,Joe_F
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 09:44 PM

I spect some of the juice would find its way back into rec.music.folk.

--- Joe Fineman    [e-mail]

||: Better to shut your mouth and be thought a fool than open it and remove all doubt. :||

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 10:04 PM

What if there was no Shatner?

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Bobert
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 10:10 PM

Well, it's been 'bout 7 years now when my late wife, Judy, died os cancer leavin' me in our house with nuthin' but a compudder..

Sniff...

Well, one night I called my sonm and asked him how to turn it on and then, somehow ended up at Tweedsblues... Now fir those of you who ain't been to Tweedsblues, its like Mayberry, R.F.D. and so I set up shop there... It was the only place I hung and still do, fir that matter..

Then Spaws come over and was visitin' Tweeds so I followed hi back home to the big city an' so I stop in here at night to fight with the knotheads, to get a few new ideas and to occasionaly talk a little music, though there ain't a lot of bluers players in Mudville....

Then I go back home to Tweedburg, where things ain't as agressive and folks talks a little slower an'...

But, yeah, I would miss the Big City life... You know, the excitement... Folks out on the streets all day and night long, talkin' 'bout anything and everything... Hey, I think we all need some of that...

But we also beed a little of Tweedsburg just to keep us balanced...

Hey, don't have to be Tweedsburg but something like that...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: number 6
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 10:16 PM

Tweedburg .... is that like Sussex N.B. ??

If there was no Mudcat ... I dunno .... something about this place. I think we all are in someways alike .. whether we like to admit to it or not is another question.

Reminds me in some ways of my Thread ... 'why do we come to the Mudcat?.'

sIx

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 11:48 PM

"What if there were no Mudcat?" he said, pedantically.
-Joe Offer, believer in the subjunctive-

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: GUEST,the wonder thinker
Date: 04 Dec 05 - 11:59 PM

"what if there was no Mudcat?". Then there would be no Joe Offer!

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 01:47 AM

That, too....

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: GUEST,Boab
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 01:55 AM

----we'd all be quite sure that NOBODY could possibly support GWB-----

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 02:50 AM

Every I time I try to access the forum and get the report "www.mudcat.org. not found" I can suspect my feelings if there really were (right so, Joe?) no MC at all.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Hrothgar
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 04:28 AM

There would be something - Nature abhors a vacuum.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 06:55 AM

Note to Joe Offer and other grammatically erudite folks:

I confess that I struggled with the right grammatical form for this thread's title.

I wasn't sure if "was" was right or if "was" was wrong.

I went back and forth, back and forth with these words.
I was stuck in a pitt of indecision. At one point I even found myself humming the verse "Is you is or is you ain't my baby?" and shifted to the "Fuzzy Wuzzy was a bear" song.

I knew that I had to chose right since I couldn't go back and edit my own words like I can on The Annexe...

And I knew that using the Preview feature wouldn't help, cause it wasn't like I could spot my error..

I just-didn't-know-right-from-wrong.

And so, at long last, I decided to stop doubting myself and I went with the word "was". My [erroneous?] thinking was [were??] that since the word "Mudcat" was a singular noun, I should use the singular verb "was" instead of the plural verb "were".

But I still wasn't sure about this oh so momentous decision, I one last time went over the grammatical form in my head for "it". And "it were" sounded wrong. So that's why I chose "was".

So now you tellin me I chose wrong???!!!

Oh, woe is me!!!

My bad.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 07:05 AM

Webster's New Universal Unabridged Dictionary defines subjunctive as:

   1. adj. 2. in grammar, designating or of that mood of a verb used to express condition, hypothesis, contingency, possibility, etc., rather than to state an actual fact: distinguished from imperative, indicative.
   2. n. a verb in the subjunctive mood; specifically, the subjunctive mood.

"Few things annoy me more than to hear, "If I was you ..." Most who actually know that there exists a verbal mood called the subjunctive agree that it appears to be vanishing in common usage. Earlier in the twentieth century, grammarians and linguists proclaimed the subjunctive's death and argued that this was no big loss, as its historical role in English had been weak and inconsistent; some even went so far as to say that in Modern English its usage is "pretentious". The fools ! The subjunctive mood is a beautiful and valuable component of the English language, and instead of dying out, it actually is enjoying a subtle revival."

'www.ceafinney.com'

Giok

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 08:02 AM

"Few things annoy me more than to hear, "If I was you ..."   me too!

as a friend once said "If you were me, you'd do exactly what I'm doing! If you were fantasising being me, you could then behave any way you think I should"

back to the show - without Mudcat I would have a few less friends, probably no cyber-friends, and would certainly not have met a lot of interesting people who popped into Sydney on their travels. I would also lack about half a metre of CDs (but I'm sure I would have filled the shelf with other CDs) and several interesting ornaments, postcards & chrissy cards.

I also would have spent half as much on air mail postage as I did recently!!

Mudcatter Sandra in Sydney

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Naemanson
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 08:42 AM

No Mudcat?! Oh, wow, breathing back to normal, no the Mudcat is NOT going to go away. Whew!

If there was no Mudcat how would I keep in touch with my friends from around the world? Oh, that's right, I wouldn't have any friends in Australia, New Zealand, Japan, England, Wales, Scotland, Canada, Belgium, Iceland, France, and, of course, the good ol' US of A. I'd never have met all the wonderful people I've met in the last five years. I wouldn't have shared all the strange things that have happened to me since 2000. I wouldn't have heard all the wonderful music I have listened to. I would never have known... just oh so much.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Amos
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 08:54 AM

Azizi:

It's not a matter of singular versus plural. You say "you were" in speaking to a single person. It is a matter of mood and tense.

The same word "were" is used to form the past tense when talking about something thata lready happened (you were reading posts, they were shopping) as is used for the subjunctive mood which expresses conditional or possible, where it is used in first, second and third persons, plural and singular. (Eg: If I were in Kansas right now, I'd barf. If you were as good as you think you are you wouldn't have the jitters. If only you were here. If Big Bob were here right now, you would be sorry you said that...etc.)

It is a very arbitrary system, but it works pretty well. If Fuzzy Wuzzy were a human I am sure he would agree.


A

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 09:11 AM

I would that he were!
G ☺

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 09:22 AM

Thanks, youze guys.

If it were not for Mudcat, I wouldn't have known I was wrong.

Oops...I were wrong??

Umm, I guess I still don't get it. I'm off to read those post again.

Best wishes,

Azizi

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Rapparee
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 09:23 AM

Amos, jist last night we was at the store and I saw a whole bunch of people who was buying things right and left. They was snatchin' up them Xratedboxes and Tinkle Me Elmos and Nicotinepatch Dolls and all, yanking them off the shelves so fast they was leaving scorch marks.

Use of the subjunctive, like the use of the pluperfect, is often dependent upon what impression the author wishes to achieve. Now, I can easily compose grammatically correct sentences -- even entire paragraphs! -- but do not always choose to do so. Even a compound-complex sentence is not beyond me. After all, I have graduate work in ENGLISH!!! (Literature, I'll admit, but we were required be able to differentiate between a noun and a verb or they wouldn't permit us to take even our Bachelor's degree.)

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Big Mick
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 09:33 AM

If there were/was no Mudcat, I would miss it terribly. If there had never been a Mudcat, I would not be anywhere near as diverse and knowledgable musically as I am now. Never mind the extraordinary friends I have made here.

Long may she wave,

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Amos
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 09:37 AM

"Was" wrong. Past tense of "be". You can say "IF I were to make a wrong decision..." referring to something that has not happened but might, or is considered as possible. But when you are speaking of something that DID happen, you use the past tense (I was, you were, he was, we were, y'all were, they were...). The fact that the same word is used is unfortunate because "were" (plural past) is not the same word as "were" (singular or plural, any person, conditional, hypothetical, subjunctive)"If only I, he, she, it, we, you they, were here...".

Hope this helps.


A

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: MMario
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 09:58 AM

If there were no Mudcat - I would not miss and mourn the lives and loss of several people who became friends for far too short a time.

I would sorely miss those who are still "here"; certainly miss those I've met and interacted with at FSGWQ Getaways and Mystic Sea mUsic Festival.

the worst thing would be I wouldn't know what I was missing.

Subject: RE: BS: What if there was no Mudcat?
From: Azizi
Date: 05 Dec 05 - 10:04 AM

Well, all I know is that it was a beautiful day in the neighborhood when I found Mudcat.

Note the reference to that "Mr Roger's Neighborhood" song. "Mr Roger's Neighborhood" was {were-oh never mind} taped in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. That's one of that city's claim to fame.

Alot of people aren't exactly fond of that kiddie program. But Mudcat is based in the state of Pennsylvania since that is where Max lives. So, I figure that Pennsylvania has redeemed itself.

:o)