BS: White & Right in America

Subject: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 08 May 09 - 01:03 AM

The Great Right White Movement in America has fallen from its perch like a hung over eagle after an eight year bender, spent, broke, exhausted and wondering who were they in bed with anyway.

Today even Joe the Plumber (who was neither) has quit the Republican party in disgust over spending.

Yes we all saw the Republican party obituary here on mudcat but while the party is virtually gone and leaderless (except for FOX and Clear Channel) the Right Wing Whites are still kicking. (their wives and gay people)

What are they doing now besides tea bagging?
They are turning over their McCain souvenir signs that said 'Country First' and writing "Secede from the US". Some of them even have some old signs that said 'United we Stand' that are being changed to United we stand against Obamaland or Obamanation.

The Great White Right Wing are in need of a new conservative party that Boss Limbaugh can baptize and sanctify with his blessing. The name will be simple like the FREEDOM Party or the Patriot Party.
This new party will be a big tent party able to hold Palin social issue conservatives as well as the rest of America's church going gun shooting (sometimes combined) real Americans.

Yeah I've talked about extremism run amok with cries for our first civil war with the help of talk show hosts like Savage, Beck and Limbaugh but where exactly are we on this road through Uncharted territory?   bzzz -hold on I have a call-
"Yes?...we did, Oh you mean the war between the states? yeah OK bye"
Well I stand corrected, We have had a civil war in which southern states apparently needed some space already. So civil war is not exactly a new idea.

In search of new ideas the old Republicans, who are soon to be the new White Right Freedom Party seems to be reaching back into the past to gain some old time traction and religion. Back to the glorious Reagan days, then back to the Joe McCarthy Hoover days and now seemingly all the way back to John C Calhoun making a legal argument for secession. (not too far back, 6000 years is all we get)

People were polled this week with a soft ball question like; would you support your state leaving the country ?
(they were not asked to commit treason and start killing northern liberals)
And here are the results:

Would you support your state leaving the country

Northeast 1% APPROVE 94% DISAPPROVE 5% Unsure
M WEST    3%          89%             8%
WEST      3%          87%            10%

SOUTH    8%          53%            29%


REPUBS    9%          65%            28%
DEM       2%          93%             3%
IND       3%          83%            14%



BETTER OFF AS INDEPENDENT NATION?

TEXAS    35% YES
TX REP   48% YES
GEORGIA 27% YES
GA REP   43% YES


So folks if you are white and right you should move to your own nation or make the one you're in Obama free. And if you still think I'm kidding, 3 states have already voted on articles for seperation. Now North Dakota has joined the ranks of Real Americans.
Georgia voted for articles of separation that says they will only secede if 'they' try to take our guns.

Don't forget Sarah Palin's hubby was been a member of Patriots for secession. Yeah some lawyer types might tell you that to secede is treason but when push comes to takin your gun, it would be treasonous not to attack the USA.

SO all you Right White gals and guys, to avoid confusion I suggest you drop the USA chants and change Country FIRST to County First.

In the Lobby I have all the Ingram and Limbaugh CDs and DVD available for 9.99 and Small voodoo dolls of Spectre, Gen. Powell and Pelosi. The life size effigies of Obama are marked down to only $49.95! Drill baby drill, in your own backyard and God Bless all of the Real Americans. The kind of Americans who worship the freedom to disregard anything they don't understand - like science.


White makes right
We'll never stop our fight
By God we were selected
We'll get our own elected
Our plan will be perfected
when our state will be excepted
from the
U
S
A




[wait until they find out there are no great Southern breweries and that beer trucks are subject to "export" taxes.]

things will settle right down.


Don'yell says yahoo y'all.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Mrrzy
Date: 08 May 09 - 01:11 AM

I thought it was Might Makes Right, Until They've Seen The Light, They've Got to be Protected, All Their Rights Respected, Till Somebody We Like Can be Elected...

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 08 May 09 - 01:14 AM

If Texas does secede, they could have King George Bush run things.

Didn't the Republican party replace the Whigs who liked King George in the first place?.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 08 May 09 - 01:16 AM

Mrrzy, I do remember all the Tom Lerher songs...probably because it was BD,,,before drugs :^i

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 08 May 09 - 01:43 AM

What a fuss over nothing!

1) State secession rights were decided 140 years ago. They lost.
2) A massive approximately 4% of those polled favor secession. Hell, about 12% of the population believe that Elvis (and they don't mean Costello) is still alive.
3) Probably had that survey been taken at any given time in the past, the results would have been similar...except of course just prior to the Civil war.
4) Perhaps the Republicans of Texas and Georgia polled see the demise of our Federal Republic, as the national government usurps the constitutional rights granted the states, or individual rights granted the people (which is everything, pretty much, not granted the national government by the Constitution) either through legislation, executive order or Supreme Court decisions. This is their way bringing attention to that fact.
5) This has nothing to do with who is President so much as what the President and Congress are doing, notwithstanding that some folks see racism or bigotry or just mean-spiritedness whenever a conservative disagrees with their position.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: John on the Sunset Coast
Date: 08 May 09 - 02:03 AM

"Didn't the Republican party replace the Whigs who liked King George in the first place?."

I assume you're kidding, but in case you're not, your American history is bass ackwards. The Colonial Whigs were quite anti-King George. The American Whig part was extant about twenty years, fading away after the election of 1856, sundered by the issue of slavery, never to run a presidential candidate again. The Republicans filled the void and offered A. Lincoln as their first presidential candidate in 1860. He won.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 08 May 09 - 02:43 AM

The governor of Texas has decided not to secede, and has decided to embrace socialism instead. At least he's done that for now (while receiving help from the federal government for dealing with swine flu). He may change his mind again after the flu runs its course.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 08 May 09 - 03:04 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xEzGIuY7kw&feature=related

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Barry Finn
Date: 08 May 09 - 07:02 AM

"The Great White Right Wing are in need of a new conservative party that Boss Limbaugh can babtise and sanctify with his blessing."

Well there you go. Rush met with Al Sharpton just the other day. Anthing's possible in these days.

The republicans are not going away, they're gonna join the democratics & delouse, deloude, delete & dilute the really right party. Partly out of revenge & frustration, partly because if "you can't beat 'em, join 'em" & lastly, in part to dissolve their power.

Texas cannot secede. They are already considered to be part of South America & South America, as everyone knows wants nothing to do with the Great White South. They may pray for rain & for the Mississippi to change it's course & between that & the Colorado they could become an island onto themselves.   

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 08 May 09 - 07:21 AM

Steven Colbert would be proud that some mericans are finally standing up for the dissolution of their country,

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: katlaughing
Date: 08 May 09 - 12:25 PM

Secession is treasonous by law. And, the backlash we are seeing with this bs and the old retired white guys from the military who are scared to death of "homosexuals" has a lot to do with repressed racism/prejudice, now not so repressed. It all stems from fear and they are to be pitied as well as guarded against. Perhaps in time they may let go of fear.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 08 May 09 - 12:50 PM

Personally, I think states ought to be able to secede. I see nothing wrong with that idea. Just think of how much less damage would be done to the world if it didn't have this big hulking behemoth trying to run everything all the time.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: katlaughing
Date: 08 May 09 - 12:59 PM

Oh, yes, and how wonderful it would be when one of them decides to invade another. I am sure the white supremacists would love if that had worked out for them in the Northwest.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 08 May 09 - 01:47 PM

I don't know if that would be an inevitability. The countries in Europe haven't invaded each other in a while.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 08 May 09 - 01:51 PM

The US, on the other hand, in all of it's hugeness, has invaded numerous countries in recent decades.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 May 09 - 06:27 PM

What was decided in the US civil was was not whether states had the right to secede, but whether they had the power. This is an issue that, in the years that I teach UK constitutional law, I teach, with respect to parts of Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Brick Lane and readers of the Daily Mail.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Mrrzy
Date: 08 May 09 - 06:43 PM

I figured you would, Donuel!

I just saw some of the time travel collection of Star Trek episodes, and it's amazing how the later versions were so open about when you travel back to the US in the 20th century how "violent, petty, bigoted, and selfish" humans "were" - so this isn't thread creep, really. No gentle message like Oh, the head guy is black, I wouldn't have thought of that, amazing.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Bill D
Date: 08 May 09 - 07:37 PM

"... has invaded numerous countries in recent decades."

"invaded" is a pretty loaded term for some of our excursions. Iraq...sure. Granada? not exactly... Afghanistan? *shrug*

numerous?

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Bobert
Date: 08 May 09 - 08:10 PM

Well, here's my idea...

State referendums... Yeah, if any state wants out then fine... Don't let the door hit you on the way out...

Problem is that the folks who live in the states where you have these successionist sentiments are the very same states that get more back in federal $$$$ then they pay in... Won't take 'um long to figure that out...

So here is me second idea...

Any state that wants out and gets out will have to get 2/3's the Congressional vote to get back in...

Yeah, I'm all for these crybabies getting out... They are nuthin' but a bunch of loosers anyway...

Just think how well the country would be without South Carolina or Georgia???

Bye-de-bye, ya'll...

See ya on the flip side...

BTW, when they are out that means no Social Security, no Medicare, no monet for their schools, no nuthin'...

See how long they last...

I'd give any state out there about 3 months before it would resmeble a Third World country...

But, like I said... Bye-de-bye....

B~

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 08 May 09 - 09:26 PM

And Vietnam, and we bombed the hell out of Cambodia and Laos. I don't shrug about Afghanistan, because we are still there.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Riginslinger
Date: 08 May 09 - 09:55 PM

'"invaded" is a pretty loaded term for some of our excursions.'


            Mexicans invade the US on a daily basis. A lot of politicians have been paid a lot of money to ignore it. The same thing could be happening in Pakistan.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Mrrzy
Date: 08 May 09 - 10:08 PM

Mexicans aren't "invading" - you have to be intending to keep what you take for that. They don't want to run this place either.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: katlaughing
Date: 08 May 09 - 11:08 PM

C'mon, Bill, take this one and run with it, please? It is so absurd...where does one begin? Key-riced! I can just see it now...no stop me...armed forces at the borders, hangings of any who aren't like *them*, women arrested for having birth control, interstate highways closed down in separate little "countries" oh, yes...there'd be some fine times, wouldn't there? We can invade each other and get with the self-annihilation program.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: maple_leaf_boy
Date: 08 May 09 - 11:13 PM

If they want to leave and form their own country, I don't see why they
shouldn't be allowed to do so. That's if the majority of the citizens
in their state approve. If that's their choice, then they shouldn't need anyone's permission. They have just as many rights and freedoms as all the other states.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 08 May 09 - 11:20 PM

Invaded is too strong a word !!!!!!!!!!

We prefer terms like:

Bush doctrine.
Delivered Freedom
Police action
Quell an insurection
Bring calm to a region
Shocked and awed.
Regieme change
and my all time fav - Bring Peace.


Iraq should thank us for air conditioning thier homes with bullets bomb craters and RPG holes. We've helped them cut down on electricity usage (except for the showers built by Halliburton for our troops )
Iraqi's now have the chance to vote just like Florida but without the purple finger. (Perhaps Florida should go with the purple finger method and paper ballots too)
We have brought up to date medicine to Iraq with Surgical Strikes.

But forget Iraq, forget torture, forget domestic spying, forget the manufactured division, hate and fear...a brand new clean fresh party would wash all former Republicans clean virginal and ethical angels.


When I say that ex Republicans are going to form a new party rather than just registering as Independants I am more than tongue in cheek serious. How long this will take is unclear.
I may be pulling a 'Boehner' and I don't want to 'Rush' to judgment and yodel in the 'Glen' that the 'Jindal' bells we hear this year will bear gifts to a new conservative party, but this Christmas will be significant to families of faith, unemployment and guns. It won't just be a tea party but a party big enough for Dick, Jeb, Mitt, Sarah, Lividicus and Colin.

A party for mean spirited bigoted white folks who are on the whole under educated will have to be educated by FOX talking points that certain select educated conservatives will rise again like a NEW Mesiiah with new ideas and Direction for the nation like lower taxes and deregulation* with a twist! Deregulation will only apply to Corporations "of faith".
The reality of the GOP is not like satirical slapstick parody of themselves.... they are a satirical slapstick parody of themselves.

Positive ideas like
NO!!!!!!!! ,
NEVER AGAIN,
NEVER CHANGE
Moderates are Communists
Pray and SAVE AMERICA,
STOP STRANGLING BUSINESS,
If you want class war - bring it on,
If the Socialists don't stop picking on us we're gonna take our ball and secede,
SHOOT THE DEMECRAT SOCIALIST LEADERS! etc.

Just as John C Calhoun argued for legal secession, modern conservatives will have to hire Judge Beebe and ex AG Gonzales to argue for legal treason.





PS
I see a locked up earth quake fault among Republicans. The presuure is building.
All the Republicans I used to talk to are now absent, silent or unwilling to even say hi. They have long since scraped off their GOP and Bush Cheney bumper stickers but are seething inside.


anyone else notice that the states with the worst meth epidemics coicide perfectly with Right wing strongholds?   scary thought, sorry.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Bill D
Date: 08 May 09 - 11:25 PM

"I don't shrug about Afghanistan..."

I shrug about the use of the term 'invade' there. THAT was where the 9/11 stunt was planned. Not exactly your classic invasion to pursue an enemy and try to catch him.

Vietnam? Aw... c'mon... that was just a badly managed bit of escalation! We bombed in Laos & Cambodia, but like Vietnam, doing stupid things is not equal to 'invasion'.

"Invasion" is like "folk", you can't expand it infinitely to cover everything you want to refer to.

Mexicans invading?? Mercy, Riggo...same answer to you. They may be 'objectionable' and a problem, but let's avoid stretching labels beyond usefulness.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 08 May 09 - 11:35 PM

let's avoid stretching labels beyond usefulness?

Whats wrong with you Bill? That would put every political cartonist, talking head expert and policy wonk OUT OF A JOB!

We need every job we can get right now.

stretch away.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 08 May 09 - 11:38 PM

Hey, Is the opposite of PRO-gress CONgress?

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 08 May 09 - 11:38 PM

But we didn't really pursue that enemy, did we? No, we didn't. We let him go, and then after that, we just said screw it. That's because he was never the reason we invaded that country in the first place. We invaded it, and built permanent bases there because of an oil pipeline. That's an invasion and occupation in the classical sense.


I think someone above in the thread is selling a lot of people short. Like these people for instance...

The Second Vermont Republic

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 09 May 09 - 12:21 AM

The 2nd Vermont Republic apparently believes in the golden rule.

To me the golden rule is the best and most succinct summation of everything good in the bible.

The golden rule is Empathy

The golden rule is love when decided to be obeyed by two people,

The White Right People of Faith have been so misled that they are now repeating that they are AGAINST empathy. IF you were to tell one of them that you empathize with them they would now take it as an insult.


"This Crazy Nonsense Empathetic! I'll give you Empathy, I'll empathize right on your behind!!"

verbatim quote by Mr. Steele, the Chairman of the Republican National Commitee.



A positive action that good people can take right now is to explain the basic virtue of empathy. To practice empathy and to let people know the good feeling they have is due to empathy.

That Republicans are now demonizing empathy, may be no surprise but it is an utterly dangerous ideology and perversion of love and reason.   It must be confronted, corrected and practiced.

____________________________

Some of you know my early twenties to age 34 of being a secular / political hypnotherapist for 12 years. Political only to the extent that I let people and reporters know that hypnosis can create a feeling or an attitude that is just as potent as propoganda of "gobbledegook" can create a man made perception. That perception becomes reality for some people for some period of time but truth will always take drivers seat when the delusion or post hypnotic suggestion wears off.

The local paper, the TImes Union printed this quote and soon after I had various powers that be on my heels. I was surprised that things had't changed that much since the Tudor age. Not only were the Jesuits concerned and convened a meeting over this, so did the CIA, Secret Service, IRS, Local Police ect. over the next 7 years.

Apparently I did not realize that my opinion was so dangerous in the minds of the local oligarchy. While some of these agencies did explicit harm others certainly never helped me.

To the extent that the meaning of language is important I continue to rant in my 50's about the Orwellian attacks on American percpetion, as in this recent perversion of the word,
Empathy.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: artbrooks
Date: 09 May 09 - 09:00 AM

Some places the US has or has had military forces... We invaded Iraq. We did not invade Vietnam. We invaded Panama. We did not invade Iceland. We did not invade Afghanistan. We invaded Germany. We did not invade Japan. We invaded Grenada. We did not invade China. We did not invade Thailand. We invaded Libya. We did not invade the Soviet Union. We invaded France. We did not invade Israel. We invaded Russia. We did not invade Ireland. We invaded New Guinea. We did not invade Korea. We invaded Cuba. We did not invade Australia. We invaded Italy. We did not invade Spain. We invaded Mexico. We did not invade the UK. We invaded Kuwait. We did not invade Kosovo.

And this has what to do with "White & Right in America"?

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 09 May 09 - 11:11 AM

Some people are putting too much emphasis on my use of the word "invade", while ignoring the actual point I was making. Which is that the US uses its might to interfere in the business of other countries quite often, regardless of whether or not what we did in Mexico, Cuba, Korea, Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Grenada, Afghanistan, or Iraq (and the Philippines and Hawaii) can be defined by quibblers as invasions or as other types of military aggression. And that point does relate to one of the points of the thread that has to do with secession from the union.

People can keep trying to purposely divert attention away from my actual point if they want, but personally, I think that's a waste of time.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 May 09 - 11:51 AM

I think you are bored and trying to divert this thread into one of your own agendas. It's about secession not the US "invading."


LH, good points about empathy. When I was doing empathic life counsulting I found it has really come into its own with colleges offering courses in empathy. I was pleased to see that!

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 May 09 - 12:51 PM

Why is this thread beginning to sound like an episode of Family Guy?

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Bill D
Date: 09 May 09 - 12:57 PM

".....the actual point I was making. Which is that the US uses its might to interfere ..."

Well now...that is an entirely different matter. We certainly DID interfere in other countries on a fairly haphazard basis. Some worked out, some were disasters.

Oil pipline? In Afghanistan? That was it? And you know this how?

It can be argued, (and often is), that we, as about the closest thing the world has to a trustworthy 'big brother', has **some** obligation to do **some** 'interfering' on behalf of the weak. Do Big Brothers sometimes guess wrong, or mistake personal interests for the interests of the weak? Yep...but you want we should go back to isolationism?


(I AM picky about language. "Invade" is a very loaded, important word. And I disagree with artbrooks about several items in HIS list...whether he was serious or not. Kuwait? THEY didn't call it an invasion)

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 09 May 09 - 01:24 PM

I expressed an opinion. My opinion is that I don't have a problem with the idea of secession. And I have been piled up on for having said that. Am I not allowed to express an opinion in the Mudcat? Do I have to face a gantlet of power hungry censors to seek their approval every time I want to express an opinion here? Some people seem rather consumed with their own power and status here in the Mudcat.

Perhaps we should ask the thread originator whether or not he has a problem with me expressing an opinion in this thread.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 09 May 09 - 01:30 PM

This is the opinion that I stated that the Mudcat bullies are jumping on me for having expressed, and that people are trying to drag into other directions, like the definition of the word 'invade'..

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC - PM
Date: 08 May 09 - 12:50 PM

Personally, I think states ought to be able to secede. I see nothing wrong with that idea. Just think of how much less damage would be done to the world if it didn't have this big hulking behemoth trying to run everything all the time.


I think these people really need to get over themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 09 May 09 - 01:41 PM

And by the way... I am never bored.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Bill D
Date: 09 May 09 - 01:43 PM

??? 'secession' has not exactly been the topic for many posts now.

I happen to disagree that secession should be easy/allowed, but *I* at least had said nothing about it.

You may of course offer an opinion...as you have for years. Some more...ummm.. 'controversial' opinions get strong reactions. YOU take on beardedbruce and others about their controversial opinions. That's the way it works. (I argue with BB regularly here, but we see each other RT regularly, too...and almost never mention these debates!)(and Big Mick, too)

If one feels they are being 'picked on' personally for their opinions, some re-examination of how much 'self' they want to invest in such forums may be in order.

I try to keep personalities, as much as possible, separate from ideas & opinions.....

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 09 May 09 - 01:50 PM

I posted my opinion on the subject of secession when it WAS being discussed. Please pay attention.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 09 May 09 - 01:56 PM

Actually, I always give people the space to express their opinions. I definitely challenge people on what they present as facts, but in all cases, if someone says they are expressing an opinion, I will tell them that they are entitled to their opinion. My posting history provides proof of that.

The people I'm talking about when I use the word "bullies" are the ones who don't want me to be able to express an opinion at all. These are the ones who are constantly accusing me of having an "agenda". These people think, because of their moderator status here in the Mudcat, that they have a right to censor people's ability to express an opinion, and they will slander people (with accusations of having agendas) when they don't want people to post opinions they don't personally like.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 May 09 - 03:45 PM

I have never censored you, Carol, ever. We both have strong opinions. I have as much right to express mine as you do yours. To do so is not bullying.

...they will slander people (with accusations of having agendas)

agenda: a list, plan, outline, or the like, of things to be done, matters to be acted or voted upon, etc

I hardly see how saying you seem to have an "agenda" could constitute "slander."

As Bill says, If one feels they are being 'picked on' personally for their opinions, some re-examination of how much 'self' they want to invest in such forums may be in order.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 09 May 09 - 04:27 PM

Expressing an opinion is not promoting an agenda. It is merely the act of expressing an opinion. Everyone is entitled to theirs, as I am to mine.

I see the quote above is being used as an excuse for bad behavior on the part of someone who, as a forum moderator, ought to know better. Accusing someone of being bored and only posting to try to divert the thread to one of their own agendas is a personal attack. But the one who made it is too drunk with power to really give a shit about the rules, because that person knows they will never experience any consequences for their own violation of the rules.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 May 09 - 04:31 PM

Accusing someone of being bored and only posting to try to divert the thread to one of their own agendas is a personal attack.

If you truly believe that, PM Joe and ask him to remove it. It makes no difference to me.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 09 May 09 - 04:43 PM

My experience has been that doing that is a bad idea. So I think I'll just settle for making my feelings on this known here in this thread.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: artbrooks
Date: 09 May 09 - 05:43 PM

BillD, the US "invaded" Kuwait in the same way that it did France - to liberate it from an previous invader. However, in the sense of crossing a border against opposing fire, it was certainly an invasion. My intent was to show that not all invasions, incursions or military presences are necessarily evil.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 May 09 - 08:15 PM

THAT was where the 9/11 stunt was planned. (Meaning Afghanistan.)

I've never seen any proof that that was in fact the case. It seems more likely the actual planning and organisation was carried out in more convenient places such as Europe and Saudi Arabia and the USA, with Osama and co in Afghanistan being more in the way of admiring spectators than anything.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 09 May 09 - 09:13 PM

Let us not forget President Reagan's only military invasion victory.
Grenada

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Bill D
Date: 09 May 09 - 09:20 PM

"BillD, the US "invaded" Kuwait in the same way that it did France - to liberate it from an previous invader"

of course... that was MY reason for not including it. I stay pretty literal on serious issues. The 'opposing fire' was not Kuwaiti fire.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: artbrooks
Date: 09 May 09 - 10:01 PM

Nor was the opposing fire in France French. But I really think we are arguing on the same side of the issue.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: 3refs
Date: 10 May 09 - 07:11 AM

Here I am, feeling somewhat forgotten again by our big cousins to the south. You invaded us twice and not one word about it!

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: artbrooks
Date: 10 May 09 - 08:51 AM

No, no...we invaded British Canada. Never once have we invaded the independent nation of Canada. Heck, they might make us keep it!

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: CarolC
Date: 10 May 09 - 12:55 PM

Canada is invading the US. I know... one of them lives in my house!

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: 3refs
Date: 10 May 09 - 08:09 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong. The Queens representative, Her Excellency the Right Honourable Michaëlle Jean, suspended our parlament quite recently. She did so because of...........oh ya, The Queen!
It may have been quite some time ago that most of the people in this country felt this way, but there are still some amost us that are sure that Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God, of the United Kingdom, Canada and Her other Realms and Territories Queen, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith......is still in charge!!!!!


"It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end."

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 11 May 09 - 06:49 AM

"This ...is about what the President and Congress are doing, notwithstanding that some folks see racism or bigotry or just mean-spiritedness whenever a conservative disagrees with their position."

Quote (name withheld just in case they were kidding)


Hmmm, Well raise my rent and double my credit card interest, I suppose some folks do see racism and mean spirtedness in a GOP platform of;

Gay Bashing
Good ol American Torture
Corporate Freedom to rob steal and tax cheat.
Make Christianity the de facto State REligion since the founding fathers "were all Christians"
Change election laws and build the voting machines
Cry foul over reverse discrimination despite the fact black unemployment is over twice that of whites.
Threaten secession and openly "joke" about shooting Pelosi, Reed and Obama.
Obey everything Limbaugh says or apologise or get out...
etc.


And to think I saw racism or bigotry or just mean-spiritedness ONLY because a conservative disagreed with my position which is merely the golden rule.

Lordy Lordy I better control my knee jerk reaction to racism, bigotry and mean spiritedness and try to see the bright side of the conservative platform as it is actually practiced and not stop believing my lieing eyes.
--------------------




Texas is now making noise that they have laws that would allow them to sub divide their state and get more Senators for a new "West Texas or South Texas"   Sorry Charlie the Constitution wants 2/3s approval first.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: 3refs
Date: 11 May 09 - 08:06 AM

"The United States is in no way founded upon the Christian religion "

-- George Washington & John Adams, in a diplomatic message to Malta.

"This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it." -- John Adams, in a letter to Thomas Jefferson.

In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own. -- Thomas Jefferson, 1814

The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus by the Supreme Being as his father, in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.

-- Thomas Jefferson, 1823

I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.

-- Thomas Jefferson
Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear.... Do not be frightened from this inquiry from any fear of its consequences. If it ends in the belief that there is no God, you will find incitements to virtue in the comfort and pleasantness you feel in its exercise...

-- Thomas Jefferson, in a 1787 letter to his nephew

The Bible is not my book, and Christianity is not my religion. I could never give assent to the long, complicated statements of Christian dogma.

-- Abraham Lincoln

So much for what those founding father thought about Christianity!

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Donuel
Date: 11 May 09 - 08:13 AM

You know it, I know it and even the revisionists know it but many people of faith pay cash money to believe whatever they are told by God's Lobbyists.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 11 May 09 - 02:25 PM

Does Lincoln count as a "Founding Father"?

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Greg F.
Date: 11 May 09 - 03:58 PM

He's a re-founding father.

Subject: RE: BS: White & Right in America
From: Bill D
Date: 11 May 09 - 05:49 PM

"What has been the fruits of Christianity? ...Superstition, bigotry and persecution."
-James Madison, 4th president of the U.S

"A man's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death. It is therefore easy to see why the Churches have always fought science and persecuted its devotees."
-Albert Einstein