BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?

Subject: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Doc John
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 06:29 AM

We hear much, from right wing Christian groups and from some Feminists, about the exploitation and trafficking of women in the sex industry. Remember the silly laws Jaqueline Smith tried to introduce when she was home secretary. But hardly a word about exploitation and trafficking of women (or anybody) in other industries: people who work long hours, in poor conditions for low pay, often the taxpayer subsidising the bosses so they can pay low wages. So sex is the dirty work, not exploitation. Complain about the latter and the CBI and their government lackies would resist. The unions have been emasculated, of course, and New Labour did nothing to abolish the anti-union laws.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,cs
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 07:06 AM

Though I don't think you have to be either a right-wing Christian or a feminist to object to the slavery of women in the sex industry. Feminist commentators or activists, will obviously be focused on global issues that effect women in particular.

As for right-wing Christians however, I've no idea what their bag is, but I'd have assumed anyone calling themselves a Christian would be concerned about human rights abuses in general - be that the slavery of women in the sex trade, or of children in Indian carpet making factories.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 07:26 AM

While I agree with your comments on human trafficking, exploitation, and sex slavery folks, there is a considerable number of prostitutes who are neither slaves, exploited, nor trafficked.

Many prostitutes choose that way of earning a living because it is vastly more remunerative than stacking shelves at Sainsbury's, slogging away typing letters in an office, or cutting the hair of affluent middle class women.

It could be argued that these "prostitutes by choice" are in fact exploiting the poor sad bastards who come to them because they can't attract females. As to their being exploited by pimps, there too a reciprocal benefit exists, insofar as the girl is protected from assault by punters, at least to some extent.

Outside of the sex industry, one still needs to take a balanced view of the situation. Some of those Asian children are very unhappy about us deciding they shouldn't work, as in many cases they are a significant contributor to the finances which prevent their parents from starving.

It is a grave error to attempt to impose the customs and mores of one's own culture, upon a radically different culture, without considering the reasons why that culture exists in its current form.

Just a few thoughts to balance the argument.

Sometimes it isn't absolutely clear who is exploiting whom.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Lox
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 08:01 AM

"Sometimes it isn't absolutely clear who is exploiting whom."


Isn't it yet another case of people with miney exploiting people without?


Maybe better to be a prostitute than to cut some rich womans hair ...

... better yet to be a rich woman with somebody cutting your hair ...


Though admittedly there are many variables and philosophical complexities invlved ... for both women.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,cs
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 08:46 AM

Don, I agree with your post. John specifically spoke of human "trafficking" - that's the trade in human beings bought and sold as property - or in other words slavery. As far as my own post was concerned, I use the term "slavery" to mean nothing less: people forced against their will into slavery.

It angers me that the media use the term 'sex workers' to describe slaves, as there are of course many, many prostitutes who are perfectly content with *their choice* of work. It's an utter nonsense to conflate forced slavery with a willingly chosen profession.

Similarly, while we may object to children working in other countries, if they are bringing home a wage to their family, then it's a slightly different situation to where children in India are being abducted from their homes and sold into slavery.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: akenaton
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 08:49 AM

Well, it might be fun for some people to promote the idea that some women see it as just another job, but that is simply a mans excuse to exploit women.

In the little town near me, the only "prostitutes" are young girls who are addicted to heroin and have a child to support.

They are unable to go for help, or apply to join the methadone programme in case the child is removed by social services.

They finance their habit by travelling to Glasgow and working the streets two or thre times a week....and every trip their self esteem gets lower.

The real criminals are the men who presume these women have a choice, or even enjoy what they do; and exploit them without mercy.

Prostitution is certainly not sex in the sense that we all think of it, but a cruel form of oppression inflicted on women by creatures who give beasts a bad name.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Thompson
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 08:52 AM

I was chatting to a prostitute a while ago, and she looked at the time and said: "Oho, time to get to work" - and then, with an air of sarcastic praise to her upcoming customers - "Ohhh, you're so great, that's so big, oooh, never had sex like that..."

I was astonished. "What?" I said, "Is it not just plain sex?"

"Oh no!" She gave a laugh. "It's all about making them feel big and powerful. That's what they give you the money for."

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: saulgoldie
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 10:05 AM

Sex is NEVER just sex. It is always, um, loaded.

The issues with prostitution are mostly related to its status as being illegal, to the inequitable treatment of women in all cultures (to at least some degree), and to the inequitable distribution of wealth.

If governments and religions would stay out of people's sexual behavior among conscious, mentally capable, uncoerced adults--note the Libertarian qualifications--we would be a long way towards alleviating most of the related problems.

If wealth was more fairly distributed among the citizens of spaceship earth and women in general were treated more fairly, they would probably choose other options than to submit themselves to the vulnerability to disease and possibility of violence, not to mention the dehumanization.

OTOH, some women, and also men would likely choose it, anyway. I mean, under my ideal circumstances it would be safer, more highly remunerative, and fun, as sex of choice can be.

Anyway, what is prostitution, exactly? Is it prostitution if someone enjoys a free expensive evening of food and entertainment and then has sex with the spender? Is it prostitution only when there is a specific agreement to exchange goods or money for sex?


"I have a fancy car, a beautiful condo with a fantastic view, loads of jewelry, and I go to lots of very interesting and exciting events, and I get to sleep with one man." (Marriage? Prostitution?)

"Yes, I have all that, too. I just sleep with many different men who give me less money each time."

How many partners "giving" how much money or goods make it prostitution?

Sex always involves some sort of exchange of goods, services, emotional satisfaction. It is only the circumstances that differ. The human drive to do it is our most powerful drive, even more than our very survival. Nature makes it that way, because all she needs from us is to make another generation of us.

Saul

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: akenaton
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 10:30 AM

I've spoken to some of the girls on my travels, I've yet to meet one who thought it was fun or a choice.
Or for that matter, anything to do with nature or procreation.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 29 Nov 10 - 10:35 AM

Of course, the widespread vilification of prostitution (and pornography etc.) is about sex. The traditional price of sex for a man is lifelong marriage, i.e. feeding the woman even when she is no longer attractive. Prostitutes are price cutters, they would be even cheaper if they were not brandmarked socially. Similarly, porno shops and their customers are being derided.

These ideas, much older and more widespread than Christianity, can be called conservative, i.e. striving to stabilize existing ways of society.

Feminists may emphasize that they do not need men at all, but still appreciate being highly priced.

Thus, complaints about exploitation are mostly pretexts. (There are other such pretexts and also good arguments.) Exploitation is certainly a real problem, but it is actually fostered by forcing prostitution into "demimonde".

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 02:40 AM

Sadly here in Bristol prostitutes are mainly young girls with a drug habit and with a young child to support (possibly by the pimp they are working for) particularly in the Red Light district of St. Paul's. It has always been that way as far as I can remember.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Donuel
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 04:14 AM

Is writing just words?

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 04:36 AM

That nobody take me wrong: Fighting exploitation and misery is a noble cause. Fighting extramarital sex is arguable. Fighting extramarital sex on the pretext of fighting exploitation (but tolerating other kinds of exploitation) is hypocrisy.

Therefore those who want to help the exploited should watch their tongues (and hearts) not to be mistaken for hypocrites. Outrage and condemnation rarely solve a problem.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 05:28 AM

I am not outraging it my comments was just through observation. St. Paul's is a pretty good community now especially within the last few years with a number of successful carnivals under their belt and it is nice to go there to check some health food shops and spice markets etc. But you can't help but observe it, most people visiting the area know what the area was and is about don't make judgements as used to be the case so it is just accepted.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 06:20 AM

Acutely to whoever   said it above, a Chrian angle could be of the merging of spirits. That is neither right or left wing, just a belief..There is something to be said IMO for pure and simplie faithfull relationshiips

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 07:11 AM

"...The traditional price of sex for a man is lifelong marriage, i.e. feeding the woman even when she is no longer attractive...."

What a thoroughly unpleasant, and disturbing, comment.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 08:21 AM

>If that was the case I would still be with my ex-husband now. I would rather jump off the nearest bridge.<

That was me.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: bubblyrat
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 08:40 AM

I can only say that, in my experience, the answer to the thread title is (or rather was) , yes .
   Certainly,those members of "The Oldest Profession" with whom I had any dealings in Hong Kong, Singapore,Edinburgh and Plymouth, all appeared to be quite happy with their chosen life-style, were not,as far as I was aware ,drug-addled single mothers,and showed no signs of having been coerced,threatened,or mis-treated in any way. Indeed,they were pleasantly "normal" in many ways ; the "proprietress" at the establishment in Danube Street, Edinburgh, was charming,polite,and courteous, as were her "staff",who were,frankly,delightful,and the ladies in Hong Kong were utterly charming too (and beautiful !).
             Why did I do it ?? Well,in each case I had been at sea for some time,and was a fit,lusty ,20-year-old .So what's your problem, you who referred to "poor sad bastards" ?? Get a life, man !! Mind you,that WAS 1967 ; I think that things were much more laid back (no pun intended) in those days.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 09:18 AM

Is prostitution just sex??? No... I've read that as many as 20% of the older "Johns" don't want the sex at all but just the company of a younger woman...

That's what I've read... I donno???

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 10:13 AM

Times are changing though with the growth (no pun intended) of male escorts. From a male point of view is it just sex or money with them? I would be really interested to know, not personally for me of course.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 11:01 AM

Patsy:

"...The traditional price of sex for a man is lifelong marriage, i.e. feeding the woman even when she is no longer attractive...."
What a thoroughly unpleasant, and disturbing, comment.

describing not my own idea about relationships, of course, but a traditional concept which is deeply rooted in the subconsciousness of many societies. It may even be in our genes. If we fail to realize that, we may be trapped to use invalid arguments, and worse, achieve effects we did not want.

Bobert et al.: Please note that the title of this thread is shortened, I think it was meant like: Are those who publicly oppose prostitution actually against sex?

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 11:01 AM

(That was of course me, Grishka)

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 12:20 PM

Thanks, GUEST... And, no... I like sex but then again I'm for decriminalizing prostitution... For the most part, it is a victimless crime...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Slag
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 03:40 PM

As one of those crazy rightwing Christians, I'll tell you what I'm against: The exploitation of my fellow human beings any time, any place anywhere, be it economic, physical abuse, sexual abuse, slavery or any such. I think, I would hope that this is fairly consistent with the views held by most who are conservative or liberal Christians; Christian in more than just name.

As for prostitution, at it's best, it is a crime against self. It reduces the act to meaninglessness, satisfying an animal urge. It can undermine family stability, self-esteem and it opens one to deadly diseases that are transmitted in intercourse, to name just a few objections. At the same time, I understand the human need for contact and for some, it would seem, there is no other recourse. I would condemn no one but encourage higher goals for one's self.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: akenaton
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 05:20 PM

Are those who publicly oppose prostitution actually against sex?

Sex is suppose to be pleasurable to both participants.
I dont suppose the young girls who find themselves forced by addiction to have sex with anonymous men derive much pleasure or emotional contact from the experience.

To me, the act seems more akin to rape.....and none of us are in favour of that
A credible drugs rehabilitation regime would be preferable to subjecting young women (and young men)to degradation and life threatening situations

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: olddude
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 05:56 PM

Slag nailed it hands down.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 06:53 PM

akenaton, you are mixing arguments exactly in the way I described, which may get you into difficulty if someone takes the trouble to dispute with you. And, as I wrote, if politicians take your cues, they may cause effects you didn't really want. Slag's seems to profess being against extramarital sex under any circumstances, a position easier to defend in theory. In practice his two statements may prove contradictory, i.e. priorities and compromises are necessary. "Right wing" policies are often associated with being more concerned about inhibiting extramarital sex than exploitation (which may thrive in illegal or stigmatized situations).

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: gnu
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 06:58 PM

FWIW, ditto Slag. Sums it up, really. Just thought I'd "vote".

gnightgnu.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: olddude
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 07:14 PM

I didn't read that at all into anything slag said ... please re-read his statement on the specific question this thread was about

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Bill D
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 07:32 PM

Rich Texan to girl in bar: "Say...would you be interested in being my companion for a week in Acapulco with $10,000 cash added for your personal expenses?"

Girl looks him over and thinks for a minute...: "Hmmm...yeah, I'd be interested in that deal!"

Rich Texan: "Well, honey.... what about a quickie in the alley for $25?"

Girl: "What? Are you crazy? What do you think I am?"

Texan: "Honey, we've settled that....we're just haggling over price!"

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 07:57 PM

olddude 30 Nov 10 - 07:14 PM, you are probably referring to my statement of 30 Nov 10 - 06:53 PM (would be a good idea to mention my nick). Well, I took the clue from Slag's undermine family stability and his self-characterization as a rightwing Christian, but maybe you're right and his position isn't that easy to defend either.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: olddude
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 08:13 PM

Oh no offense taken Girshka I am sure :-). I think Slag is just like me in that regard. I don't judge others either ... I can only try and keep myself on track and sometimes it is a full time job LOL ...

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Nov 10 - 08:54 PM

No matter... Reality is that prostitution has been with us for thousands of years and it will continue so do we stick our heads in the sand and go, "horrors" and continue to prosecute people for which, in 99% of the cases, there is no victim or do we accept reality and get it out of the back rooms... And get it somewhat regulated so that the "product" will be safer for all involved...

I mean, it's easy to sit back in the comfort of one's home and pas judgment... The real world ain't our homes... It's on then street... If we are truly compassionate, Christian or not, we accept reality and try to make people psychologically and physically safer and in a better place...

Decriminalize prostitution and all victimless crimes!!!

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Slag
Date: 01 Dec 10 - 08:09 AM

Thanks OD. No, I can understand being so lonely that a little human contact bought and paid for beats sticking a gun in your mouth, I suppose but paying someone to say "I love you, I love you" while going through the motions seems to me, even sadder yet. To reach out for real human contact is the beginning of human understanding and self-worth. You are never going to get that from an erzat relationship of one hour or less.

The other extreem is being young and dumb and full of cum. That's just playing with fire IMO. The odds are not in your favor. And then when young studdly decides to settle down what images come to mind? What turns him on? Potentially big relation problems on the horizon (onamonpia, pun not intended).

Again, who am I to judge anyone about such a thing? I can't. I just see it as opening yourself up to a lot of hurt and harm. If you respect yourself, if your aims are high, I have to believe that you will treat the ladies with all due respect and high esteem. If you aim low you'll hit your target every time but you sure wont win any prizes.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Bobert
Date: 01 Dec 10 - 08:50 AM

That's the point, Slag... We do force people to "aim low" with prohibition... We take what could be just a normal transaction and turn it into something illegal... In making it illegal then we have the stigmas that go with it and next thing ya' know we have a culture of very indignant people sittin' in judgment and we have further degraded that "normal transaction" into something that is now immoral or dirty or worse...

I mean, lets get real here... We have folks who think it is perfectly okay to drop bombs on folks, to bully and teach their kids to bully folks, to hide income away from tax collectors in the Camen Islands, to kill doctors, etc. and all of that is just mainstream accepted behaviors that when folks are caught there isn't this "Eww-la-la" crap but let two adults engage in sex where money comes into play and it's, "Horrors"???

Beam me up, Scotty...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Dec 10 - 11:14 AM

This issue seems to be viewed exclusively from the male point of view, when the victims of prostitution are nearly always women.

The effect on the self esteem of any woman who practices prostitution, for any reason, must be incalcuable.

Men can exist without a partner, if they are incapable of being part of a relationship, there is always masturbation.

I'm amazed the Mudcat women have listened to this shit with little protest.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Dec 10 - 11:26 AM

I've never used a prostitute in my life, tho' I've had offers from various poor souls....I've always spoken kindly to these women and given them something to help them in money.

I have always felt sorry for the women,being forced to debase themselves to a stranger,for god knows what reason......certainly not the "human need for contact"

I wonder how many here who view prostitution as just a job, actually make use of the service provided......very few I'm sure.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 01 Dec 10 - 11:38 AM

`Men can exist without a partner, if they are incapable of being part of a relationship, there is always masturbation.`

The same can be said of women.

Should also be noted that there are male prostitutes. That said, the second oldest profession in the world certainly has dangers. I think it should be legalized and controlled--thereby taking it away from gangs and OC. IMO and FWIW.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Dec 10 - 11:55 AM

Yes I agree 999 but I think we should try, as much as possible, to make sure women and young men are never in a position where they are forced to sell themselves
We are really quite an inhumane society under the skin.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,999
Date: 01 Dec 10 - 11:57 AM

I could not agree with you more, Ake.

(PS Message me under my old name and send me your e-mail adress, OK. Have an mp3 to send you.)

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Slag
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 12:40 AM

Yes Bobert. You make several good points but listing other "wrongs" doesn't justify anything. It merely creates a list.

It would be interesting to hear more from the women folk but to label a serious (for the most part) discussion as shit because of the absence of feminine input is a blanket dismisal of all the foregoing. Not logical unless you are just using the generic term. If so, my apologies.

I would be willing to bet dollars to doughnuts that most who enter this "profession" are forced into it one way or another. That's the initial resentment. No little girl ever says "I'm gonna grow up to be a whore!" and we would probably all be amazed at how many boys and young men are forced into this "profession" (slavery in my book).

Lower than low are the leeches who live of the degradation of these folks. These are the ones who need to be charged with the crime. Society OUGHT to address the issues, both individually and corporately, that tend to force folks into this life and bring the hammer of justice down on the scum who suck off the wages of the prostitute.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Patsy
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 03:05 AM

I wonder if society had been more liberal thinking instead of having Victorian double standards perhaps there might not have been such a need for prostitutes. Is it possible because of the Victorian taboos about sex it could have contributed to men sneaking off to seek prostitutes and then taking the moral high ground about it just to show a respectable face?

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Monique
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 04:18 AM

One, two, three, four and a deeper insight
No further comment...

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: InOBU
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 06:17 AM

I run a small museum in New York City, the Museum of the American Gangster. Perhaps the main theme of our museum can speak to this issue. In many Nations, we are caught between two concepts which are core to most western national political identities. We are trapped between our moral certainty and the ideal of liberty. In looking at how organised crime became what it is today, in the USA, many start with Prohibition, we do not. We begin with the Underground Railroad. Perhaps it is because, as many of you here know, I am a Quaker, but it is a perfect model for what is wrong with criminalisation and its repercussions. For decades Quakers and other social reformers and members of some other Utopian religions broke Federal law for their belief in liberty. Now that is a crime most would like to think they would have committed in those days. In fact, few, even few Quakers did break the laws against helping free our sisters and brothers in bondage. Those few who did, immediately upon winning the abolition of slavery, started both the Women's movement and the Temperance movement. Many were shocked when Prohibition led to extreme violence on both sides, a government acting on ideals of moral certainty mandating that industrial alcohol must contain deadly levels of poison, and the machine gunning of un-armed rum runners. As the pendulum of American history swung towards moral certainty we came very close to the pole of totalitarianism, when 10,000 Americans were poisoned and died from a Federal policy. On the other side of the equation the law breaking for liberty swung further and further towards the pole of anarchy with the introduction of the Thompson sub machine gun to that side of the pendulum swing.

So, in the face of laws of moral certainty, and the struggle for liberty, women in the sex industry find themselves without power, pulled between the anarchy of crime and the oppression of laws of moral certainty. Without the balance of worker's rights and respect for marginalized communities' right to liberty, the first victims will be disempowered women - those who are drug addicted and lost.

That seems to me to be the story here... AND NOW a word from our sponsor. When in NYC drop by the Museum of the American Gangster, 80 Saint Marks Place museumoftheamericangangster.org ... you will be challenged to think while having a grand old time.
All the best
Lorcan (InOBU) Otway

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Bobert
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 07:20 AM

Exactly, Lorcan... Take the "moral certainty" out, mix in a little of that "liberty" and next thing ya' know we have a new way at looking at things...

BTW, ya'll... Yeah, if a woman is being forced into prostitution then there really isn't all that much "liberty" involved... That is a bad deal... But not all woman are "forced" into prostitution... I have known a couple of prostitutes (not that way) who were not at all forced into anything at all... Both were well educated and not what alot of folsa have in their minds as being the stereotypical "hooker"...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: akenaton
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 11:09 AM

Oh but there is a stereotypical hooker Bobert.

and if an addict cat get their fix, or a substitute, that are forced to sell whatever they have.....I've seen it first hand.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Doc John
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 01:04 PM

... of forced to steal whatever the can and however they can

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Grishka
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 03:35 PM

Most people wouldn't do what they are doing if they didn't need the money. Even musicians, "... they smile when they are low." Although we all know about exploitation and unfair treatment, we may have difficulties to define it precisely. Karl Marx and many others failed. As I wrote, it must be fought; best ideas win.

Prostitutes, whether feeling bad or not, will often try to hide their profession because they fear to be scolded by Philistines, or pitied, or missionized.

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: Bobert
Date: 02 Dec 10 - 05:12 PM

The assumption that all prostitutes are forced into it is a major fallacy...

Subject: RE: BS: Is Prostitution Just Sex?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 03 Dec 10 - 01:00 AM

Is Prostitution Just Sex?

No, it's about MONEY!

GfS