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BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare?
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 19 Oct 13 - 09:58 PM Goofball, break with your normal practice and |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 13 - 09:42 PM Oh you didn't???????????? LMAO!! Back then 'Reserves' meant Gold reserves.... oh..and you did get it wrong....the 'Fed' as we know it today, would have not even been considered back then.....Look up some quotes by Jefferson about Central Banks...and what was really considered a threat, worse than a standing army....and he was right, you know.... Sorry about your sense of being 'right'! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 19 Oct 13 - 09:09 PM Because I DIDN'T get it wrong, you moron!! Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 13 - 07:24 PM What a cheesy cop out! Why don't you just admit that you had it wrong?? It won't be the first time, and probably not the last! You like to hide behind your pseudo-erudite rhetoric, but the FACT is, it's just the way you deceive people, and delude yourself, along with it. Your rap once again, just doesn't hold up. It's false...got it? FALSE! You might just consider being honest, for once in your life! Stick to the composers. GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 19 Oct 13 - 03:28 PM You have the over-simplistic conspiracy theory version of the story. Fer Chrissake, idiot, READ A BOOK NOW AND THEN!! I'm not going to waste my valuable time trying to educate someone who has less intelligence than a case of toenail fungus. It's all out there. Encyclopedias. Economics textbooks. All you need to do is read authoritative material and stop getting everything you "know" from Right Wing blogs or just saying "Me too! Me too!" whenever Wrongsonger posts something. (Egregious waste of protoplasm. . . .) Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 19 Oct 13 - 02:37 PM You moron! At that time, money was backed by gold, then later silver.. AND MINTED BY THE GOVERNMENT...not contracted to private banks, using vague 'promises' about a portion of interest charged, paying off promissory notes, for the printing of money.. The revenues, that then, funded to government was collected by tariffs, not by 'income taxes' designed to pay for the printing of money, and the interest charged for it!!...with the IRS ensuring that the bankers got paid their interest, even before a dime went for funding the government!!! That's why we have to keep on 'borrowing'..because the 'debt' will NEVER be paid off, as long as they keep printing worthless money, and charging us interest to print it!! Once again, you re-write history to suit yourself and your nonsensical political notions. Oh, and by the way, the major holders of all those notes, usually get screwed over, in the long run, if they exert too much pressure, or fear, that they've become, or are becoming too powerful!! I thought that how the Japanese, got screwed, when they were buying up a lot of our cities, back in the eighties and early nineties, was sheer evil genius. The Saudis are in line, though the Chinese might be more of a problem...Oh, and another 'BTW', the American people are huge holders of T notes....and the screw is bearing down on them as well. They use 'inflation'..just as they did with the Japanese. It's all a bunch of financial manipulations, designed to line the pockets of the international bankers, as a step to gaining control and power. Oh, and the IRS is the enforcement arm of the bankers, and THAT'S who you want running Obamacare????? Get a clue, it's NOT about 'health care'!! If you don't know this, then do some simple(or not so simple) homework....and you really should keep your illiterate opinions to yourself.....that way people won't find out how really dumb you are! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 19 Oct 13 - 01:49 PM Goofballupagus, the only froth around here is around your mouth. You might try reading up on the subject before you proceed to display your ignorance. AHA!! And scroll down to "History." Read it! And you'll find that I am right. Alexander Hamilton DID suggest the idea of a Federal Reserve System and in 1791, George Washington signed it into law. It was in and out and back in again over the next hundred years or so, then signed into permanent law by Congress in 1913. So it was deemed essential for national financial stability early on. You obviously flunked Civics class in high school. You DID go to high school, didn't you? Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: DMcG Date: 19 Oct 13 - 04:26 AM And the identical story about the NHS appeared in the Telegraph. I don't know which rags you Brits believe in, but just type in the headline and you'll see the story everywhere. And so? I'd would expect the Telegraph not to change 45% to 50%, but otherwise I see no reason why it shouldn't be the same story, since it is essentially a report of a TV program which is a report of some research, so there is layer upon layer of spin here. The issue is not whether what is said is factually true, but whether it actually means what it appears. And every newspaper, TV program, media outlet, government spokesperson, medical researcher and all the rest would like you to interpret the facts their specific way. So we need to be on our guard against such spin. And, as a rule of thumb, anything reported as x% more or less than something else needs to be treated with grave suspicion. If the figures are reported as it 'was X per million and is now Y per million' you know both the rate of change and how frequent it is, but if only the rate of change is reported you cannot work out the frequency, so key information is missing. What rags do us Brits believe? In my case, and I am sure in the view of many others, all and none, though some, like the Daily Mail, are only rarely front runners on issues of substance. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 18 Oct 13 - 11:27 PM Oh boy...another bunch of hooey coming from Firtho the Frotho. The 'Federal Reserve Bank, in it's present incarnation, is not even 'Federal' as in the government. The 'Federal Reserve' as we know it today, is a consortium of PRIVATE BANKERS/BANKS. It is about as 'federal' as 'Federal Express'! They lend us the money they print for a price(interest)..as of the present, 46 cents of every dollar, is 'owed' to them for 'interest'. The practice of them printing money, and then buying their own notes, to pay it off, is just another form of printing fiat money. Inflation, follows, that practice with a vengeance! These guys OWN the politicians, both sides, of whom you think are so wonderfully 'liberal' OR 'conservative'. When you 'claim to subscribe' to either of these, you are being played for a fool!...but then, some of you wouldn't know the difference! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 18 Oct 13 - 10:23 PM As I said, Songwronger, "It (the Federal Reserve Bank) was started by Alexander Hamilton in 1791, and its charter was signed by George Washington. It was re-upped in 1913 in an effort to stabilize the economy and be a 'lender of last resort' in precarious economic times." And like I also said, trying to educate a conspiracy theory aficionado like you is a hopeless endeavor. For heaven's sake, before you reveal the full extent of your abysmal ignorance, LOOK IT UP AND LEARN WHAT'S REAL before you shoot your mouth off!! Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Bobert Date: 18 Oct 13 - 08:33 PM My daddy used to say "the biggest fool in the room isn't known until he opens his mouth"... The wrongman has opened his mouth... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 18 Oct 13 - 08:16 PM The WSWS article: http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/10/18/pers-o18.html |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 18 Oct 13 - 08:12 PM Earth to Firth. The Federal Reserve was founded in 1913. There have been several national banks, but they were always desolved after the need passed. Not the Federal Reserve. Americans are less educated now, and most don't see the danger of centralized banking. And the identical story about the NHS appeared in the Telegraph. I don't know which rags you Brits believe in, but just type in the headline and you'll see the story everywhere. And Medicare is being dissolved. The US has health insurance for the elderly, but it will be dismantled now that we have Obamacare. From the World Socialist Website: The US budget deal: A new stage in the attack on the working class ...In his press conference Thursday morning, President Barack Obama made clear that the focus of the Democrats and Republicans will now turn to these programs [Medicare and Social Security]. "In the coming days and weeks," he said, "we should sit down and pursue a balanced approach to a responsible budget, a budget that grows our economy faster and shrinks our long-term deficits further." Obama added, "The challenges we have right now are not short-term deficits; it's the long-term obligations that we have around things like Medicare and Social Security." As a result of the massive cuts already implemented, he said, short-term deficits have already fallen significantly. Thus the government shutdown and threatened debt default have been used to establish the political conditions for the imposition of massively unpopular cuts to Social Security and Medicare, while making these cuts somehow appear "rational" and "moderate." |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 18 Oct 13 - 01:07 PM For Songwronger's education (obviously a fruitless project), the Federal Reserve Bank is not some recent conspiracy. It was started by Alexander Hamilton in 1791, and its charter was signed by George Washington. It was re-upped in 1913 in an effort to stabilize the economy and be a "lender of last resort" in precarious economic times. It is NOT some sort of evil conspiracy theory that manipulates the economy to favor members of the "Bilderberg Group" or foster the policies of "The Illuminati." Leave the conspiracy theory and Right Wing blogs alone for a while and read some history. Don Firth P. S. "Nancy boy," eh? That tends to explain why Goofus seems to think Songwronger is the bee's knees. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 18 Oct 13 - 11:28 AM ""NHS death rate is one of worst in the West: Patients 50% more likely to die of neglect than in US"" Yeah! Because they are far more likely to get into a hospital than they would be in the US, where most of them would cash in on the streets or in the hovels the poor are confined to. Even idiot conspiracy theorists in the UK don't consider the Mail a reliable source. So it must be like a bible for the US tinfoil hatters, aand your use of pejorative terms such as ""nancy boy"" speaks volumes about you, you sick bastard. Don T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: DMcG Date: 18 Oct 13 - 02:53 AM And, Songwronger, you need to be rather more careful in your links like the one to the Daily Mail about NHS rates being 50% higher than in the UK than the US. Firstly, in typical Daily Mail fashion, they have changed 45% into 50% because it sounds worse, then the study is not comparing like with like - the UK system takes everyone into account, whereas the US excludes everyone who hasn't the health insurance to get into hospital in the first place, then they have gone for the shock version of the figure: x cases per thousand is the same information, but is rarely as dramatic. I don't the figures in this case, but if the casualties for some risk went from 1 in a million to 2 in a million, you can be dramatic and say it has doubled, or you can say that it remains almost negligible: everything depends on the story you want to tell. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Ebbie Date: 18 Oct 13 - 02:48 AM "...they'll HAVE to accept government healthcare," but Obamacare IS government healthcare." Wronger What the HELL do you think Medicare is? For more than 70 years the most successful governmental program we have. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 18 Oct 13 - 12:02 AM Songwronger, if you really believe all the nonsense you've been posting, you have a serious psychological problem. My "liberal" viewpoint comes from looking at the world and at events, seeing what's there, and then making up my own mind. I don't need conspiracy theory blogs to tell me what to think. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 17 Oct 13 - 10:42 PM The posting from earlier equates the Federal Reserve with Obamacare. Both do the opposite of what they claim. Whatever else the man believes, he's right on that. I don't know what the problem is with you "liberals." You say the planet's overpopulated. You say that humans are creating some kind of "global warming" even though the planet's cooling off. You say people are using up resources, breeding indiscriminately, need to die off and so on. Well, Obama's GIVEN you the tool to cull the population. Obamacare. So grow some balls and use the goddam tool. You're all so giddy now, saying, "A few years of this and they'll HAVE to accept government healthcare," but Obamacare IS government healthcare. And the purpose of the program isn't to HEAL people, it's to RATION (deny) CARE. Like they do in Britain. Those people over there live under a Nazi-sympathetic monarchy and think the royals actually CARE ABOUT THEIR WELL-BEING! lolololol Anyway, Obama's got his meatgrinder up and running, now all you have to do is feed it. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 17 Oct 13 - 09:47 PM "The New World Order" is a well-known and totally debunked conspiracy theory, Songwronger. You are really scraping the bottom of the septic tank now!! ========== Gradually--VERY gradually--the American colossus lumbers toward becoming a civilized nation. Many European countries and a fair number of South East Asian countries have been there for some time now. E.g., a fair number of Americans fly to Thailand or other countries you might never suspect because they can get procedures like hip replacements for far less that it would cost in the U. S., done in modern hospitals by European-trained doctors, along with follow-up physical therapy, while staying in a place very much like a resort. In fact, even when you add air fare to and from Thailand, the total bill is a good bit less than what they would have to pay in the U. S. In France, there is a special corps of doctors who make house calls!! In many other countries, also, doctors will make house calls. Extremely rare in the U.S. These systems are either single payer or paid for through taxes. When a European was shaking his head over the cost of health care in the U. S., an American challenged him by saying, "But you folks pay much higher taxes than we do." "Yes," agreed the European, "But look at what we GET for it!" President Obama goes through Hell and High Water trying to bring a modicum of civilization to the United States—for the good of ALL its citizens—and look at how the Republicans, the Tea Party ding-bats, and characters like Songwronger and Goofus react! Slither back into the cave, you Neanderthals!! Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Ebbie Date: 17 Oct 13 - 09:35 PM Here is what is posted to James on James's web site. THIS is the website of a man you admire?? (NOTE: October 11, 12, 13 is past.)(NOTE: I missed finding out about the HUGE FEMA Setup in Washington DC. Wronger, no doubt, did.) At 7:05pm on September 28, 2013, 14300 said… James - The Truckers going to DC on Oct. 11,12,13 are walking into a boobytrap. There is a HUGE FEMA Setup for DC all the month of Oct. 2013 with 286K foreign troops+ tanks and a whole lot more. They have been prepping for the month of Oct. since July. WHO picked these dates for the Truckers to strike in Oct?? The Truckers are being set up as a false flag terrorism attack on DC Whitehouse. I was a trucker myself. I am with them but don't want to see the truckers get the blame for this. I believe a couple of trucks will be set-up with some kind of radioactive explosives - compliments of the evil Gov. to go off as close to the White House as possible. I'm not kidding. The Truckers really need to move this to a date in November. I am not a Gov. spook - but a truly concerned ex-trucker and patriot. Trucks that have HAZMAT licencing would be most suspect as the ones carrying the explosives since they don't have to check in at weigh stations. The Illuminati have got this already set up to use against Americans and truckers will get blamed for this. They really need to move the date to Nov. The Illuminati love to have number symbology - look at the numbers: 10,11,12,13 and the Gov. is frothing at the mouth already saying that "There WILL be a terrorist act . . ." The only reason they "know that" is because "they are the ones orchestrating it." James is there any way to get this info to the truckers ASAP? |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 17 Oct 13 - 08:35 PM And the number of uninsured in America is expected to shrink to 31 million, but the GOOD NEWS is that they will now be committing a crime by not having health insurance. The federal government will be able to penalize them (sorry, I mean "tax" them) by deducting the "tax" from their meager paychecks. Try to top that with your NHS, nancy boy. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 17 Oct 13 - 08:26 PM Obamacare will be a great success at killing off the poor and funneling more money into the coffers of the insurance companies. I expect we'll soon be up to British standards. NHS death rate is one of worst in the West: Patients 50% more likely to die of neglect than in US |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 17 Oct 13 - 08:02 PM ""No. Obamacare is worse than what we had."" Bollocks again! What you had was 47 million Americans with no health care, and those who did have health care paying ten times as much for it as we get in the UK for a tiny percentage of our income while working, and being refused care if they have a pre-existing condition, for which we are covered without limit. You are a fool Songwronger, among a nation of many similar fools. Don T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 17 Oct 13 - 07:52 PM ""So what we have here is Medicare going from inviolate (takes an act of congress to change it), to an unelected 15-member board doing what it damn well pleases with the program."" What that committee can do is very clearly delineated you prat, and if they overstep the bounds of that mission statement, of course they can be held to account. You really need to stop believing in agenda driven crap less believable than Marvel Comics. Of course, you probably do believe in Marvel Comics. They are aimed at your intellectual level, as is Tea Party propaganda. Don T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don(Wyziwyg)T Date: 17 Oct 13 - 07:44 PM ""and Bobert??? You're NOW saying you don't like Obamacare?????????"" ""Strange that we should both notice that caricature aspect of Bobert."" Utter bollocks! Bobert hasn't changed his view of health care one iota. He is merely saying what the rest of the Western world is saying, that Obama got the best deal he could, against overwhelming Republican opposition to the idea of giving a shit about their fellow countrymen, not the deal he should have got, if any of those Republicans had a) two working brain cells and/or b) One ounce of humanity. I repeat GfS, stick to the music! Don T. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: sciencegeek Date: 17 Oct 13 - 07:00 PM oh my god! a tax to provide basic health care... horrors. We should just tax people to fight wars based on imaginary weapons of mass destruction or to safeguard our vested overseas interests. Get real! Every time an uninsured person goes to the hospital ER, they can't be turned away and someone has to pick up the tab. And that's all of us who are insured... we've been the ones ultimately paying for keeping the current system afloat. As for increases in premiums... there are choices out there and assistance available. And piss poor insurance policies will whither away when the public figures out where the good deals are. And we need to make the whole system better... not whine like little spoiled children. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 17 Oct 13 - 06:28 PM No. Obamacare is worse than what we had. Under Obamacare a person's premiums and/or deductible will go up (more money for the insurance companies), and quality of treatment will go down. We would have been better off sticking with what we had and passing legislation to cap premiums/deductibles, cap hospital overcharges, etc. The man who posted at the link below sums up how I feel about Obamacare: Obamacare is the new Federal Reserve, doing the opposite of what it claims We can't see what happened to us one hundred years ago, and we can't see what is happening to us now. A century ago, a string of calculated bank failures convinced us to give away the power to control our money, which immediately led to World War I, and the sequence of perpetual wars and economic crashes that have followed ever since. Today, the passage of Obamacare has created a situation much worse, in which it has become absolutely illegal to think for yourself. Like one of those toxic psychiatric drugs, it is about to disfigure the American psyche permanently. You no longer can do the things you know are good for your health, but instead you must obey what they say is good for your health, even though you know it is not. To disregard or ignore these disastrous orders is now a criminal offense. Today, the world is scrambled in a jumble of deliberately false policies and bad outcomes with no avenue of appeal or correction. While we're focusing on one disaster, another creeps up on us undetected, and then another, and another, and another. False flag fatigue has turned our will to mush, unfathomable and irremediable frustration saps our strength, and the people supposed to give us our answers only exacerbate our distress with their pathetically criminal misrepresentations. As with the creation of the Federal Reserve and the income tax in 1913, the creation of unconstitutional, law-ordered health care expenses that are inexplicably coupled with a higher deductible on government-mandated insurance policies assure that most people will pay more money for less care, and guarantee that an already impoverished populace will quickly become both sick and broke. The Federal Reserve concept promised to bring financial stability to America but brought only runaway inflation and boom-and-bust cycles which robbed the people of their wealth. Today's dollar is worth less the five cents of what it was worth in 1913. Obamacare promises to improve health care for all, yet it will cost much more money, deliver much less care, and result in many more needless deaths. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,sciencegeek Date: 17 Oct 13 - 01:19 PM taken from Oct. 8 from Bobert: Listen, ya'll... I hate the Affordable care Act... But the only thing that I hate more is not trying something... That was and is the TeaPublican plan... Do nothing!!! Obama went to the Republican caucus early and asked them for their help and ideas... They sat on their hands... So the Dems, afraid that the Repubs would jump on them real hard if they proposed a sane program of single payer found themselves negotiating with themselves trying to get that last Senate vote and thus we ended up with... ...a Republican plan that privatizes payment thus adding 15% to health care right off the top... This sucks... I hate it because it ain't going fix much and the wrtongman hates it because he hates black people, especially those who might end up in his Whites Only House... B~ So... I have to ask... what the heck are the 'wronger & GfS going on about? Or is this just more of their distortion of the facts to start an argument? The best that has been said about the Affordable Care Act is that it is a start... plenty of work still needed to make it better. And a d*mn sight better than what has been there up to now - the insurance industry getting fat while milking the American consumer for all they could. That's what for profits do - make profits first, take care of their customers a distant second. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Ebbie Date: 17 Oct 13 - 02:06 AM The current version of Obamacare is flawed, no doubt about it. We would have been much better off going with a single payer, patterned after Medicare. However. This was all that could be gotten at this time- the GOP can take a bow for that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 17 Oct 13 - 12:26 AM Easier than addressing the issues, huh, Ebbie?....and Bobert just got called on his 'changing attitudes'....(maybe next he'll be thinking of being a KKK Tea Partier'!...ya' never know with 'them far left 'so-called' liberal southerners!!)...All they need is a black Grand Poo-bah, head of the KKK, and he'll come running!! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Ebbie Date: 16 Oct 13 - 09:21 PM I might suspect that SW and GfS are each other's alter egos- but nah. Believe it or not, SW writes better. :) |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 16 Oct 13 - 09:00 PM Obamacare and the assault on workers' health benefits Developments in two major US cities underscore the anti-working class agenda underlying the Obama administration's Affordable Care Act (ACA), popularly known as Obamacare. On Monday, Detroit Emergency Manager Kevyn Orr announced that health insurance is being eliminated for retired city workers under age 65 and replaced with a $125 monthly stipend to use toward purchasing coverage on the insurance exchanges set up under the ACA. Retirees over 65 will be moved to Medicare.... The essential aim of the ACA is rapidly emerging. Behind the talk of providing coverage for the uninsured, Obamacare was devised from the outset as a means of dismantling the employer-based system of health insurance that for decades guaranteed a basic level of health care for tens of millions of workers in the US. While Obama's counter-reform will still leave some 31 million people uninsured, it will dramatically reduce health care costs for private and public employers by hiking workers' out-of-pocket costs and slashing their benefits.... http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/10/16/pers-o16.html So, retired city workers in Detroit will lose their health insurance and be given 125 bucks per month to find their own policies. Good luck with that. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 16 Oct 13 - 08:01 PM OOOHHH Bobert!!???? I re-iterate... ...and Bobert??? You're NOW saying you don't like Obamacare????????? Does that mean you finally read it, as I did??....OR, you were wrong before???..or are you wrong now??....or you weren't one of the 'elite' who was exempted from it, because it was sooo good??? GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 15 Oct 13 - 11:03 PM ...and before it's all over, he will sign the Keystone pipeline, as well...this stuff has been brewing for several administrations now...nothing has changed,,,EXCEPT people's PERCEPTION...and the willingness to look the other way, while losing your freedoms, and our country's principles to trade them in for totalitarian corruption. Thank you, partisan idiots! Your 'adamant' perpetuation of distraction, has aided in fucking us all over!.......(and all this time you thought you were 'winning something'!!!....for free, nonetheless! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 15 Oct 13 - 09:46 PM Strange that we should both notice that caricature aspect of Bobert. As far as the IPAB, wikipedia says it "has the explicit task of achieving specified savings in Medicare without affecting coverage or quality." Fine. Obama had the explicit task of closing Guantanamo's torture chambers. And he swore he would never sign the NDAA, but he did. Point is, the chances of the IPAB carrying out some task that actually benefits Medicare recipients are next to nil in today's lawless climate. As things are now, it takes an act of congress to change Medicare. Under Obamacare it will take the whim of a 15-member board. And there can be no judicial review of the board's actions. The only way to reverse one of its decisions will be to get a supermajority vote of congress. Does anyone honestly think congress would vote against the insurance industry, simple majority or otherwise? So what we have here is Medicare going from inviolate (takes an act of congress to change it), to an unelected 15-member board doing what it damn well pleases with the program. And Obama ran on an "austerity" platform, and the Republicans want to kill Medicare, so what the hell do we think is going to happen to the program? That's rhetorical. We all know what's coming. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 15 Oct 13 - 02:35 AM You know it's rather ironic...but the Supreme Court rules that Obamacare is a really a tax...and the irony of it is, taxes and financing is supposed to come up through, from the House.....as in "Let's pass this, so we can find out what's in it".... ...and Bobert??? You're NOW saying you don't like Obamacare????????? Does that mean you finally read it, as I did??....OR, you were wrong before???..or are you wrong now??....or you weren't one of the 'elite' who was exempted from it, because it was sooo good??? It's amazing, but to pass it, Obama had to make exemptions for some of those who voted for it!!!..Meanwhile, big pharma, and insurance companies, lobbied HEAVY for it.....and then the 'so-calleds', pretend that they either hate Fascism, or that this isn't it! ..and guess what???.....I'm not so sure that the Republican's controllers are really THAT much against it, either!!! GfS |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,David E. Date: 15 Oct 13 - 01:03 AM I usually stay away from "under the blue line" because people are just too rude down here, but, there are times when I weaken and every time I do I somehow end up reading through something like this thread and I wonder... do people like Songwronger and Bobert actually exist, or are they stereotyped caricatures of extreme opposing views typed in by some ghost writer just to keep people arguing? I know, I know, just "f*ck off" because I'm a troll, right? |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Ebbie Date: 15 Oct 13 - 12:33 AM "...the 15 member board will be tasked with preventing per-enrollee spending in Medicare from growing faster than the specified target rate." Wikipedia: "The Independent Payment Advisory Board, or IPAB, is a fifteen-member United States Government agency created in 2010 by sections 3403 and 10320 of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act which has the explicit task of achieving specified savings in Medicare without affecting coverage or quality.[1] Under previous and current law, changes to Medicare payment rates and program rules are recommended by MedPAC but require an act of Congress to take effect. The new system grants IPAB the authority to make changes to the Medicare program with the Congress being given the power to overrule the agency's decisions through supermajority vote." Oh, yes. Very scary. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 15 Oct 13 - 12:18 AM This is the straight scoop on what appears to be one of Songwronger's major sources of "information:" Clicky. The "Western Center for Journalism" also publishes "World Net Daily." The main crusade of these web sites is to promulgate "trash Obama" propaganda. No lie is too outrageous, and how low they are willing to stoop has yet to be plumbed! Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 14 Oct 13 - 11:37 PM In 2014, The Obama Dictatorship Will Be Complete ...Within the 2500 pages of the comically-named Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act is cached the 2014 establishment of the Independent Payment Advisory Board. Nominated exclusively by the president... ...In short, "the Board's edicts ...become law without congressional action, congressional approval, meaningful congressional oversight, or being subject to a presidential veto." Moreover, citizens will have NO authority to challenge the Board's pronouncements in court, for ObamaCare "...specifically states that the Secretary [of Health and Human Service's] implementation of IPAB's proposals is not judicially reviewable." Therefore a group of presidential, POLITICAL appointees will have the practical power of shaping and imposing upon the American public, the laws of the land! For in addition to creating edicts loosely attached to Medicare and its myriad applications, in 2015 the IPAB will be permitted to impose price controls, taxes and "...ration care for all Americans whether the government pays their medical bills or not!" Thus even the Medicare stipulation will no longer be a practical deterrent to the Board's authority. http://www.westernjournalism.com/in-2014-the-obama-dictatorship-will-be-complete/ So, the 15-member Advisory Board will be pulling laws out of its collective ass. Claiming to be concerned about our "health" was just an act. Obamacare is a smokescreen to implement tyrannical rule. And you can kiss your Medicare goodbye. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Bobert Date: 13 Oct 13 - 08:17 PM Ain't me that can't get my mind off skin color, wrongman... It's 25 Republican governors, including Pat McCrory here in NC... Half a million poor will go uncovered because McCrory and his white Republicans in the statehouse don't much like black folk, especially if its a black president... You can go thru as many self righteously indignation hissy fits as you like but they won't change the facts here... The New South has turned back to the Old South... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 13 Oct 13 - 07:38 PM ". . . shouldn't those states be able to offer LOWER rates once they have dozens of insurance companies competing against one another to get enrollees?" One would think, but it never works that way. We have free and open competition between insurance companies now, and no matter how you slice it, people get royally screwed on premiums--or benefits--or both NOW. I've had plenty of experience with the way health insurance companies work A little government oversight and regulation could rectify all of that. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Songwronger Date: 13 Oct 13 - 06:55 PM As usual Bobert can't get his mind off of skin color. Must suck. The $95 "tax" is for the first year only. After that it will be calculated in percentages and will be very harsh. The two-digit opt out (not $100, but $95) was designed to sneak this pile of shit past the young. They'll skip the health insurance mandate and pay the fine at the end of the first year, then they'll get crushed at the end of the second, just as Obama leaves office. The states not participating in the expansion of Medicaid stinks, but if we really have a free-market economy, then shouldn't those states be able to offer LOWER rates once they have dozens of insurance companies competing against one another to get enrollees? No government interference, undercutting, lowering prices. It will be interesting to see how this turns out. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Bobert Date: 13 Oct 13 - 12:16 PM Interesting article in the Charlotte Observer today on the point that Janie made... 25 states with Republican governors are punishing their poor because they hate having a black man in the "Whites Only" House... B~ |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: GUEST,achmelvich Date: 13 Oct 13 - 10:54 AM neither mussolini or hitler as bad as fr. fintan stack! and as someone above said - if you americans* could only realise how ridiculous you are with your stupid gun laws, crazy medical system and world wide domination fixation.....and why are you all so afraid of a real alternative to a broken system that only benefits the 1%? *obviously not all of you - but enough of you do keep falling for the electoral appeal of dangerous neoliberal wreckers. however, i must confess i did believe obama when he said he would close guantanamo. the rest of the world expects far better from you (and england)than this. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Greg F. Date: 13 Oct 13 - 10:04 AM So die - not our problem. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Mrrzy Date: 12 Oct 13 - 05:58 PM Not signing up - the "tax" is cheaper. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Janie Date: 11 Oct 13 - 11:42 PM Yeh Bill. The absolutely insane NC Assembly opted to not expand Medicaid and also opted out of a State run health exchange. The result is not pretty. |
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Subject: RE: BS: So who's signed up for Obamacare? From: Don Firth Date: 11 Oct 13 - 07:54 PM Songwronger reminds me of the comment about "Nobody can clear an area faster than a trapeze artist with diarrhea!" He cranks it out faster than it can be hosed off! Don Firth |