BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 16 Oct 14 - 01:26 PM

Dallas County judge Clay Jenkins issued an order that the 75 county residents being monitored "stay at home." Papers must be served individually to each of them.

The nurse who travelled had relatives at Kent State, Ohio; they have been asked to stay off campus for 21 days.

The above news from LA Times, Oct. 14, 2014.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 16 Oct 14 - 01:13 PM

Second nurse affected. She travelled on a commercial flight with 132 passengers and crew, who should be isolated.
The six crew members have been put on paid leave and observation for 21 days.

The CDC requires anyone who has had contact to use controlled transport only, avoiding public carriers.

Public Health authorities are trying to contact all 132 passengers.
This incident shows how the virus could be spread rapidly through contacts.

(Nonsense calculation brought too mind- say 3 of the 132 develop symptoms. How many people could they have come in contact with? &c.)

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,Nina
Date: 15 Oct 14 - 09:08 PM

Oh my gosh, this week a guy got on a Metro bus in Los Angeles, a Route 33 that goes from downtown L.A. out on Venice Blvd. and he pulled off his mask shouting out that "He had Ebola and don't mess with me" to the driver. Driver of the Metro bus let everyone off the bus including this guy and he took off so the police are looking for him. They think it is a hoax though. I sometimes take that bus but not recently. How scary though.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 15 Oct 14 - 08:58 PM

The two vaccines the WHO suggested for prioritized testing have been mentioned here before.
One is the U. S. government Agency NIAID plus GSK developed vaccine, the other the Canadian Government PHS and U. S. drug company, Newlink, vaccine.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,Mrr
Date: 15 Oct 14 - 08:28 PM

Yikes, mg. Read it, O do.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 15 Oct 14 - 06:48 PM

I should say that I have been potentially exposed, and I live in a very out of the way place. I won't trace the steps but it leads to Liberia very directly. I am not expecting anything of course, and we hopefully would have heard if she developed the disease. But that is how easy it is to spread. And I do not believe for a minute that it can't be spread until symptoms are active..at what point do you determine that? There is a whole lot of grey area there. I work for a university and we are under orders now to report any trips to high-risk places and there is a quarantine we are supposed to follow I think..I did not read it too carefully.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Bettynh
Date: 15 Oct 14 - 05:46 PM

Dr. Kent Bradley, the first American flown back from Africa with ebola, is now donating his blood plasma hoping it will do good. He was unable to donate to the man who died because blood types made that impossible. I think I remember this happening before in another outbreak (perhaps as seen on pbs's NOVA). Chances are it won't hurt.

The two new drugs are vaccines rather than treatments for already-infected patients. For the technical minded, the comments on the linked page are detailed and interesting.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Oct 14 - 05:03 PM

some suggested naturopathic chemicals.

http://drsircus.com/medicine/ebola-saving-lives-natural-allopathic-medicine

http://drsircus.com/medicine/ebola-saving-lives-natural-allopathic-medicine

I suspect help will come quite a bit from this direction..not a cure all but maybe a way of saving some marginal lives, especially as there is probably a synergy between various of these suggestions.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 15 Oct 14 - 08:10 AM

Another of the carers infected in Texas.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,Mrr
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 09:49 PM

Right, GregF. That's why we aren't calling for hysteria but for the outbreak to be rationally dealt with.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 09:26 PM

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/14/health/scientists-rein-in-fears-of-a-virus-whose-mysteries-tend-to-invite-speculation.html

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 02:20 PM

This is going far afield, but see the Army Study Guide, Section on Field Facilities for Human Waste Disposal.
Most armies use similar guides, but one of the military units sent to Haiti used none, and they left open defecations near the rivers. A Cholera epidemic was the result.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 02:00 PM

don't know why not. there are also wands which could be waved over potties etc. burn. burn. burn. flame throwers on stainless steel? DOn't know. don't sit down too soon after.

here are some suggested antiviral oils..due diligence required of course.
http://www.sustainablebabysteps.com/antiviral-essential-oils.html

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 02:00 PM

Who will profit? So far three possible vaccines, two of which (if accepted for treatment) are large drug concerns, Smith Glaxo-Kline, and Johnson and Johnson. In the end the large concerns have the means of producing the vaccines in large quantities.

Protective gear comes from several sources. Uline is one, a large company making all sorts of containers and packaging, warehousing equipment, protective clothing, &c.

Lakehead Industries and Alpha Pro Tech stocks have jumped, as investors bet that Ebola will increase, and increase the need for Hasmat suits and other protective wear.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Bettynh
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 01:55 PM

Q, would portapotties with ultraviolet disinfection be possible? Should our army, which is setting up isolation compounds, be looking for them? Do they exist? I know UV is used in some sewage treatment plants, but I have no idea how they work or on what scale.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 01:54 PM

some essential oils are antiviral. i think tea tree for one. some can be taken orally if prescribed by a knowledgeable person but i don't know if the antivirals can. but at least stuff could be sprayed. we have not heard enough about burning of clothing, bedding, etc. i don't know how much should be or is being done. there is of course a shortage there of just about everything...but no shortage of textiles worldwide that could be donated.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 01:44 PM

Those guest posts about research ethics were me, sorry, at work.

There are doctors using anti-viral drugs, mostly AIDS drugs, and seem to be having some success but one can't tell.

And they don't NEED hazmat suits, they need gowns and gloves galore.

Treating the symptoms of flu usually saves the patient; the flu, left unchecked, will not take over every organ and turn it into a liquid virus bomb. Treating the symptoms of Ebola does not, and the virus does.

Excellent questions above, also. Cui bono indeed.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 01:39 PM

Ultraviolet light is also anti-viral; it "disrupts their DNA, rendering them incapable of perfoming cellular functions."

Cannot be used at anti-viral levels with humans &c. Damage to skin, eyes and immune system.
Above from Wikipedia.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Bettynh
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 01:27 PM

OK, time for some questions we might be able to answer with internet sleuthing.

Who will profit from this epidemic? I'm sure the factories that manufacture personal protective gear (suits, masks, boots) are working overtime and churning out full capacity. Where are those factories? Are they well run? Are they run for the profit of a small group (family, for example) or anonymous shareholders? Who is responsible for quality control? Maybe a few emails letting whoever they are know they are being watched could make a difference.

What are the side effects of ramping up production? I know chlorine is very toxic and yet it's the only stuff I've heard mentioned for decontamination. Who makes it? What are the consequences to ramping up production? Who's watching that? Perhaps the same could be said for the plastics in the suits.

When setting up ebola isolation compounds, what could be the unexpected consequences? Perhaps the hardest question of all. Remember, hospitals set up in Haiti that treated successfully many broken bones and crush injuries were directly responsible for a cholera epidemic that killed hundreds (or thousands, I'm not sure) because they neglected their latrines.

Perhaps we all could take some time to think about the ebola epidemic, not just watch it unfold.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Jeri
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 01:18 PM

Ultra-violet light (UVB) is used to kill bacteria. I haven't seen anything suggesting it's effective against viruses.

There ARE anti-viral drugs. I don't see a whole lot of detail regarding anti-Ebola drugs.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 12:49 PM

MMRV vaccine for measles, mumps, rubella, varicella since 2005. Provides fairly long-term protection. Stimulates the active immune response.

Flu vaccines are different every year and provide protection against the current crop of viruses. These vaccines provide "significant protection," hence not totally effective. They will not protect against flu strains not included in the mix.

Some of the Ebola vaccines being developed will include protection against some other viruses. 2016?

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 12:01 PM

the ebola Robot that kills viruses with uv light.

Is that being marketed by Ron Popeil or Ronco?

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: mg
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 11:52 AM

Checck out the ebola. Robot that kills viruses with uv light.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 10:46 AM

Ebola is usually fatal.
Those others usually are not.
Ebola is an epidemic yet to be under control, and likely to be a pandemic.
It is being compared to AIDS, except it kills much quicker.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Greg F.
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 10:12 AM

The flu is treatable.

The flu and measles, as viruses, are "treatable"with palliative care only -

Just like Ebola.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 12:46 AM

was saying that i believe it probably is treatable. some people recover. some combination of immune strengthening, antiviral medicine, coconut oil, bleach, sunlight, good basic medical care, quarantine, ultraviolet light, essential oils, nutrition, chinese herbs, prayer, music therapy, whatever...will cure a lot of people. we have to be willing to suggest everything, we have to throw things at it that may or may not work, we have to look for local cures that might be under our noses..i don't think it is noncurable but i think it spreads so fast you don't have the luxury of time to sort it all out.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 12:41 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Donuel
Date: 14 Oct 14 - 12:40 AM

In two days a nurse and a ship medic are now in hospital with ebola.


Exactly one province in Liberia is Ebola free perhaps due to 3 rules.
Quarantine
No travel .
Pay faith healers to stay out

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 10:35 PM

The US gvernment is working on a vaccine for rabies/ebola.

http://beforeitsnews.com/prophecy/2014/10/what-rabies-ebola-hybrid-vaccine-in-the-making-government-patented-proof-i-dont-make-this-stuff-up-2464566.html

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 09:32 PM

Right, they will volunteer for ANYTHING. Can't do informed consent in those cases. Can't test ethically. Doesn't mean don't do it, just don't pretend you're doing it ethically.

And testing a vaccine in Maryland, really, will only test for side-effects of the vaccine, which while a good thing to know is hardly the critical aspect.

And we have a grip, GregF, nobody is saying other diseases aren't bad, but this thread is about ebola breaking out. And again, who cares how many *americans* something like this kills, it's about Sierra Leoneans, Guineans and Liberians.

Malaria is treatable.
The flu is treatable.
Measles are treatable.
Ebola is not.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 09:13 PM

Get a grip, eh?

Annual US cases of Influenza ± 31,816,763
Annual US death toll from flu is ± 36,000.

Annual cases measles worldwide is 20 million
Annual deaths from measles worldwide is 164,000

Annual cases malaria worldwide is 207 million
Annual deaths from malaria worldwide is 627,000

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,mg
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 08:17 PM

how do you ethically test? When people are dying like crazy? Ask for volunteers in that area of course. Especially the health care workers. Ambulance drivers. People whose lives are on the line. You will get volunteers. Also, the vaccine might not work or it might do awful things. At this point in the game, it is a risk quite a few people would take.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 07:19 PM

Another vaccine plus booster technique, successful with monkeys, is being tested on human volunteers. It was developed jointly by NIH (U. S.) and the Swiss Okairos, a biotech company owned by British GSK.

Like the Canadian vaccine test, it is being used in varying concentrations on 20 volunteers.

These are first phase tests.

A third vaccine, Johnson & Johnson, is moving towards tests in early 2015.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 07:18 PM

I was trained on 2, but 3 makes sense, although the CDC says more isn't necessarily better.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST,Rahere
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 06:01 PM

Mrzzy, how many glove layers do you use? My hazardous environments paramedic mate uses 3, so you've always got a layer between you and anything potentially nasty: outer layer splits at the wrong time, you've still got a second you can clean, and a third to get that one off once "clean - we think".
The UK is a bit more stringent, I think, than Spain or the US: nobody goes into the hazardous area, the staff work through half-suits from outside it. At the moment, at least. I suspect they also use negative pressure in that area.
The biggest worry is someone travelling to the nearest hospital by bus because they don't drive and the ambulances are on strike ( as they were this morning).

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 05:42 PM

How in the world do you test a vaccine where there are no patients with the disease, in Maryland?

How on earth do you think you can *ethically* test a vaccine where the patients *are* right now, being Guinea, SLeone and Liberia?

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: olddude
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 05:30 PM

If a highly trained nurse can get it with protection gear. I want a travel ban

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 02:29 PM

CBC news (13 Oct. 2014) the source of the article on the Canadian Ebola vaccine.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 02:27 PM

Trials began in Maryland today of a Canadian-developed Ebola vaccine.

These will be the first human tests of the vaccine, developed by the Canada National Microbiology Laboratory in Winnipeg.

The vaccine proved effective with primates and other animals. The U. S. Defense Threat Reduction Agency is working with the Canadian developers (BioProtection Systems).

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 01:06 PM

The report cited by Jack Campin from the Guardian is just a shit-stirrer. Read it and draw your own conclusion.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Bettynh
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 01:00 PM

No, deployment in a year means deployment in a year. It makes no statement about the reason for the deployment, just an assessment of that unit's readiness. Often, they deploy to third-world countries for educational (and, I'm sure, propaganda) purposes. If they don't actually set up and use the hospital, they stand to lose their expertise. If this epidemic spurs the formation of a world-wide emergency medical team, they might be a logical part. Certainly, we're hoping this epidemic will be controlled within a year.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Jack Campin
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 12:45 PM

Racism in the US healthcare system's response:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/09/ebola-scare-race-frisco-dallas-texas-monnig-duncan

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Greg F.
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 12:37 PM

Annual US cases of Influenza ± 31,816,763
Annual US death toll from flu is ± 36,000.

Annual cases measles worldwide is 20 million
Annual deaths from measles worldwide is 164,000

Annual cases malaria worldwide is 207 million
Annual deaths from malaria worldwide is 627,000

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: olddude
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 12:31 PM

New case In Texas the nurse that treated the guy is now infected

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 12:29 PM

Thanks! And thank your son!

Deployment in a year means they don't think it's coming under control any time soon. Yikes.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Bettynh
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 11:33 AM

Folks in the USA can view PBS documentaries on the news show Frontline and the science show Nova. It's possible that folks outside the USA can access these via youtube - they're both listed when I look, but access seems a bit political. Both are very informative - the NOVA discusses the current treatment and ethical discussions around giving the Americans the untested treatment. The Frontline shows the logistical difficulties involved.

My son is in the Army Reserve, trained as a mechanical technician specializing in setting up and maintaining hospital equipment. He feels his group is preparing for deployment in about a year. We're watching this outbreak closely.

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: akenaton
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 04:16 AM

Will we welcome the swallows back next summer?

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Oct 14 - 01:39 AM

Mid-october case count:

Total Cases: 8400

Laboratory-Confirmed Cases: 4656

Total Deaths: 4033

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 12 Oct 14 - 03:38 PM

Right, it's the getting back out again that is so hard. More than half my training in using gloves for mice in research involved taking the gloves off, and that was just gloves. It's bloody hard to get out of a hazmat suit covered in haz mats.

I read an interesting chronology which I won't link to because it was on (shh!) wikipedia, where we know all is true. Seems to have started with patient 0 just before new year's; I started reading about it in May, and started this thread in July. Now there are probably about 10 thousand cases in probably more than 3 countries, since it's statistically more likely that there are people dying in uncounted scores upcountry, given that they are dying in counted droves in cities and towns, than that every single ill person is in a city or town given that this is West Africa, and the idea that the virus stops at the borders still bothers me... just because no one's been identified with it in a decent hospital in, say Abidjan, doesn't mean it isn't all around villages bordering Liberia and Guinea, and I repeat, the scary thing isn't it getting out into the developped world, the scary thing is what it's doing right now to real people right there.
I feel like the poor schmuck under the table with the irrepressible chick admonishing him to stop repeating himself in What's Up Doc - I am not repeating myself I am not repeating myself o my word I'm repeating myself

Subject: RE: BS: Anybody else watching Ebola break out?
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 12 Oct 14 - 01:10 PM

The article goes on to say that the nurse had on full protective gear, according to Texas Health Resources.

I watched a video that showed protective gear being sprayed before removal, &c. It seems that it is difficult for the person wearing the gear to effectively sterilize the gear without help.