BS: It's good for you.

Subject: BS: It's good for you.
From: Stanron
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 08:01 PM

Tomorrow's Papers preview came up with the news that small amounts of dark chocolate, cheese and red wine, are once again good for you.
I think I might be making some chocolate covered cheese fingers to go with tomorrow night's Merlot. Yummie. Any one else tempted?

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 10 Apr 16 - 08:11 PM

Well, as a part of my strictly non-veggie diet, today has included generous amounts of butter (on my hot cross buns), mozzarella and parmesan, too much red wine and dark chocolate sauce on my home-made ice cream. The important thing is that tomorrow will be different.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 01:21 AM

Trouble is that there are always these dietary contradictions one must take into account. Prime example that always occurs to me is that red wine is wonderful for the heart but absolutely destructive of the liver.

≈M≈

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Mr Red
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 03:24 AM

Alcohol - the alcohols (congeners) that give the brew colour and flavour are not ethyl alcohol and the liver has a harder time digesting them or their byproducts. Hence headache sooner if you are a red-head (?) like me or hangover if you are not. Pick you dosage.

Chocolate & cheese can give some people migraine. Not me thankfully.

People differ.

But there is this well accepted theory that many toxins become detrimental above finite doses, but are holistically beneficial below that.
Think belladonna. Think vitamin C for gawd's sake!

As I try to highlight: homo sapiens evolved ever larger brains by cooking food, and that included meat that they gorged on occasionally. The gorgeousness is more frequent these days.
Huge Stan - we have a problem!

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Stanron
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 03:48 AM

Who are you calling huge? If it weren't true I'd be offended. Anyhow it's all paid for and there's plenty of space.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Rapparee
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 10:38 PM

Chocolate covered fingers? With cheese? What sort of people are you over there? Here in the States some folks bite their fingernail, but that's about the extent of it.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: leeneia
Date: 11 Apr 16 - 11:51 PM

Rap, dear, that's just the beginning. They eat spotted dick, too.

Never mind that. Unfortunately, the article said that "small amounts of dark chocolate, cheese and red wine" are good for us. Who wants to bother with small amounts? Particularly of chocolate.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 08:29 AM

Guinness!

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: olddude
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 12:45 PM

My mom, eat this mystery casserole, it's good for you... Yikes

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Senoufou
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 02:05 PM

I could weep. I get terrible vertigo if I eat dark chocolate or runny cheese such as Camembert, both of which I absolutely adore. I think they maybe trigger a form of 'painless migraine' - I end up in bed with the room spinning around above my head. Since giving both up (sob) I haven't had an episode.

I'm a bit sceptical about all these conflicting health warnings. I reckon if you eat a varied diet (a little of what you fancy...) you'll be all right.

Crumpets dripping with butter and Old Speckled Hen ale are very very very good for you...

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 12 Apr 16 - 02:07 PM

This is great news! Decadence is good for you! Has any research been done into the health benefits of hummingbird tongues?

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 01:25 PM

Recent studies suggest that vegetable fats are not better than animal fats for reducing heart disease, and may be worse!
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/apr/13/replacing-animal-fat-in-diet-may-not-reduce-heart-risk-says-study

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Senoufou
Date: 13 Apr 16 - 01:31 PM

Hooray Keith!! That's very good news! (puts great dollop of butter on yet another crumpet)

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 03:18 AM

Yes, but I deprived myself of butter for most of my adult life because of bad science.
They even pushed transfats on us as healthy when they are almost toxic.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Mr Red
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 05:08 AM

Recent studies suggest that vegetable fats are not better than animal fats for reducing heart disease, and may be worse!

I doesn't surprise me. We evolved to be hunter gatherers. Mixed diet would have favoured genes to cope with it. Statistically Europeans cope better with alcohol than certain Chinese, because we discovered fermentation as proof of potable water. They discovered boiling was better at purifying, so drank less alcohol.

But there is plenty of evidence to support the anecdotal concept that "starvation diet" and "fasting days" benefit longevity. Maybe something to do with giving the organs time to de-clutter.

Moderation in all things. Except moderation!

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Senoufou
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 06:04 AM

My husband doesn't tolerate dairy foods very well. He's from a rainforest tribe and I suppose keeping cattle wasn't on their agenda.

Starvation diet and fasting days eh Mr Red? I'll consider it, but Tesco will have to refuse to sell me crumpets. Wouldn't that mean one's blood sugar gets too low? I think I'd go all trembly and spaced out.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 06:14 AM

Moderation in all things. Except moderation!

No - Moderation in all things, including moderation!

Inescapable moderation is just another term for boring. Being allowed to pig out once in a while^* is good for the soul.

DC

^*Even pigging out should, of course, be done in moderation

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 06:31 AM

" It's good for you."
Guinness - or so I'm told
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Stanron
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 08:47 AM

I think the admonishment regarding small amounts is valid. I'm continuing to experiment on this matter and so far I've discovered that although cheese and chocolate do not mix well with red wine, Carlesberg special brew or Aldi's budget beer, they are quite acceptable separately. Tonight I might experiment with some Liebfraumilch but it will have to be a whole bottle because it would be irresponsible to throw any away.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Jack Campin
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 09:37 AM

Recent studies suggest that vegetable fats are not better than animal fats for reducing heart disease, and may be worse!

If you mean the one reported in the last few days, that's not what it implies. It was a comparison of dairy fat and high-omega-6 corn oil, which has been known to be pro-inflammatory for years. (I've been avoiding the stuff for more than 10 years because I am prone to auto-immune inflammatory skin conditions). The fact that it causes heart disease should have been no surprise to anyone.

A different way to spin the conclusion would be "corn oil kills you even faster than butter". The study didn't draw any similarly negative conclusions about vegetable oils with less omega-6, like grapeseed, peanut or rape.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 12:56 PM

BMJ conclusion.
"Available evidence from randomized controlled trials shows that replacement of saturated fat with linoleic acid effectively lowers serum cholesterol but does not support the hypothesis that this translates to a lower risk of death from coronary heart disease or all causes. MCE findings add to growing evidence that incomplete publication has contributed to overestimation of benefits, and underestimation of potential risks, of replacing saturated fat with vegetable oils rich in linoleic acid."
http://www.bmj.com/content/353/bmj.i1246

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Senoufou
Date: 14 Apr 16 - 03:10 PM

I reckon the enormous amount of publicity regarding the horrors of 'bad' cholesterol was aimed at selling billions of pounds' worth of statins. It's now emerging that statins are not all they've been cracked up to be.

I personally think stress is a major factor in heart disease.

To minimise stress, a nice large glass of Old Speckled Hen ale is perfect. (No, I don't receive commission for sales of this ale)

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Mr Red
Date: 15 Apr 16 - 08:40 AM

No - Moderation in all things, including moderation!

No! If you moderate moderation you have - er um - gluttony? Double negatives and all that.

Being allowed to pig out once in a while* is good for the soul.

My point originally about hunter gatherers gorging on roast meat occasionally. A few million years evolving as h-g and 10,000 as farmers means we have more genes for meat than for milk, butter & cheese and grains (including beer). And maybe 100 years' worth of genes for trans fats etc. Eating lettuce ain't rocket science!

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Apr 16 - 11:07 AM

Neither are your genetics theories, Mr Red! 😂

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Apr 16 - 11:15 AM

I didn't know anyone still drank Liebfraumilch! I shall experiment tonight with a bottle of Nero D'Avola and whatever I can steal from Mrs Steve's chocolate stash without it being noticed that a depletion has occurred (I got wise years ago to the fact that the stash must always be kept abundant, for this very reason). She hasn't noticed the missing Poundland box of Maltesers that I wolfed one night last week after she'd gone to bed...

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Mr Red
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 10:21 AM

Neither are your genetics theories, Mr Red!

We can all be negative without offering any knowledge. Intelligence would offer alternatives.

So how many years would you say we have been farmers? When did the Aurox become extinct and the bovine we have today allow us to milk it? 11,000 years ago? Is the New Scientist that wide of the mark?

When did the troll gene become more dominant than the intellectual one?

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Stanron
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 10:51 AM

Steve Shaw wrote: I didn't know anyone still drank Liebfraumilch

I don't think I will in future. That last bottle was borderline nasty. I'm having a few days off experimenting as I have an appointment with a nurse on Wednesday. Good news or bad, I might resume after that.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: olddude
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 11:32 AM

Oh boy steve, if you're Mrs is like mine, you could lose a hand stealing her chocolate. Mine has a bear trap over hers Lol

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Senoufou
Date: 16 Apr 16 - 11:58 AM

I tend to think, like Mr Red, that wheat and dairy intolerance might be linked to humans not farming until relatively late in our evolutionary timeline.
It's obvious that early Man didn't till or harvest, or have herds of milking cattle. But what about rice? Most people can digest rice fairly easily, but that is a grain which has/had to be cultivated. And our much-loved spuds only arrived here in the 16th century. Yet they too are normally well-tolerated. My husband had never seen a potato in his entire life pre-UK, but loves them! Wheat is merely starch, so we could surely digest that with no trouble. It's milk with lactose that causes some folk problems, yet mothers have breastfed their babies from time immemorial...

olddude, since being told by the doc to avoid chocolate and runny cheese, I'm putting all my efforts into eating far more crumpets to make up the difference. It's hard, but I'm doing my best...

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 17 Apr 16 - 03:44 AM

Gluten in wheat is a problem for many.

Subject: RE: BS: It's good for you.
From: Senoufou
Date: 17 Apr 16 - 04:19 AM

Ah yes, Mr Red, I'd forgotten about gluten. Do you remember those strange crispy rolls called Energen? I wonder if they still sell them. I believe they were gluten-free.
In 'Domestic Science' at school, we were told to take a handful of flour and rinse it under the tap while squeezing it. The water washed away all the starch, and what was left (a delightful squishy mess) was apparently gluten. I tried this at home and got a clip round the ear from Ma, for wasting good flour!