BS: UK General election December 12 2019

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Stanron
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 09:38 AM

Joe Offer wrote: has fascism triumphed in the UK?

No but the suggestion is not exactly a surprise. I think it could be a mistake to equate the Labour party in the UK with the Democrat party in the US but here goes anyway. Ten years ago perhaps the Labour : Conservative divide was closer to the Democrat : Republican position we see today. On general principles I think that the UK has always been much further to the left than the USA. The evidence is in our Health Service, our National Insurance scheme and the general level of benefits.

Over the last ten years the Labour party has moved further to the left than it has ever been before. A sub group called Momentum has gradually taken over local party groups and now controls the whole party including the leadership. It is the Momentum line that Tony Blair was a 'Tory' and the MPs who supported him were traitors.

As Labour moves to the left there is a space in the center into which the Tory party has drifted without even trying. My point is that Labour has moved so far to the left that the center is described by them as the far right. You must have seen on this forum how easy it is to be called a Fascist if you disagree with the hard left.

It's not Fascism, it's Centrism.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 09:56 AM

Stan - conversly, UK right wing extremists are also seen to grab the 'centre' even further right...

Sensible moderates find themselves caught in a no-man's land minefield...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 09:57 AM

well, Joe, here is one section of the Conservative Manifesto. I leave it to you to decide whether a fascist would like to have got a mandate for this:

After Brexit we also need to look
at the broader aspects of our
constitution: the relationship between
the Government, Parliament and the
courts; the functioning of the Royal
Prerogative; the role of the House
of Lords; and access to justice for
ordinary people. The ability of our
security services to defend us against
terrorism and organised crime is
critical. We will update the Human
Rights Act and administrative law to
ensure that there is a proper balance
between the rights of individuals, our
vital national security and effective
government. We will ensure that
judicial review is available to protect
the rights of the individuals against an
overbearing state, while ensuring that
it is not abused to conduct politics by
another means or to create needless
delays.

=====

A remit to alter all the checks and balances in favour of the Government? That is not what I would call centrist.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:04 AM

Au contaire.

The right wing of British politics has come to the fore in the past few years. The "success" of the likes of Farage and the ERG has mirrored the rise of far right groups across Europe.

Whilst the Labour party has always had a minority of far left wingers they are nothing like as powerful as far right wing groups in the Conservative party.

Stanron is quite correct though when he suggests that all politics in the US is quite a distance to the right of what we consider to be "centrist"

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:09 AM

Once again Stanton is putting it from the perspective of the right. Far right factions within the Conservative party, such as the ERG, and outside influences such as UKIP (now the Brexit party) have pushed politics so far to the right that what was once a moderate left is now portrayed as Communism. I would agree though that the current administration are not fascist. It is my hope that the influx of, hopefully, centrist Tories will pull them back to just right of centre. I would also agree that Momentum has had a detrimental effect on the Labour party but not in the way he describes. The parliamentary Labour party are no further left than many mainstream political parties in Europe. Momentum, which is not the PLP, are further left and have created rifts in the party that allowed the Tories to take advantage of the in-fighting within Labour. The lesson the Labour party need to take from his is to get back together to fight the Tories instead of fighting each other!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:09 AM

Please note my post was in reply to Stanron!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Mrrzy
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:26 AM

My condolences. -A Mrrican

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:30 AM

Joe: Don't accept DMcG's comments at face value:
well, Joe, here is one section of the Conservative Manifesto. I leave it to you to decide whether a fascist would like to have got a mandate for this:

"After Brexit we also need to look at the broader aspects of our constitution: the relationship between the Government, Parliament and the courts; the functioning of the Royal Prerogative; the role of the House of Lords; and access to justice for ordinary people. The ability of our security services to defend us against terrorism and organised crime is critical. We will update the Human Rights Act and administrative law to ensure that there is a proper balance between the rights of individuals, our vital national security and effective government. We will ensure that judicial review is available to protect the rights of the individuals against an overbearing state, while ensuring that it is not abused to conduct politics by another means or to create needless delays."

A remit to alter all the checks and balances in favour of the Government? That is not what I would call centrist.

The section he quotes only talks of reviewing the various relationships, NOT altering them in favour of the Government. In fact the only section which mentions what action may need to be taken is: We will ensure that judicial review is available to protect the rights of the individuals against an overbearing state
That is exactly the opposite of what DMcG is claiming.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:42 AM

Nigel - ideological 'fascism' is more a pernicious pervasive state of mind
effectively controlling the masses, than any words printed in statutes...

ie.. the north, midlands, and Welsh working class have now been persuaded
to actively choose to collude in their own domination...

[pop quiz - 10 bonus points to anyone who knows the big academic word for this process...]

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:43 AM

Whinge whinge. whinge!

No second referendum now boyos.

How's the reality sandwich going down? more lemon perhaps?

Truly a popcorn moment! Even the pound is celebrating, rising above 1.2 to the euro for the first time in a coon's age.

We will take back control-get used to the idea. No point in even pretending to take the lefties seriously!

Any toys left in the pram?

A little toon to chee4 you up. Start substututing around 3 minutes in:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yy9GmieAEaQ
Jo Swinson    No more
Nigel Dodds    no more
Zac Goldsmith no more
David Gauke (Ind) no more
Dennis Skinner no more
Anne Main (Con) etc.
Dominic Grieve
Stephen Gethins
Laura Pidcock:
Mary Creaghy.
Caroline Flint
Jo Platt (Lab)
Anna Turley (Lab)
Helen Goodman (Lab)
Susan Ellan Jones (Lab)
Emma Reynolds (Lab)
Vernon Coaker (Lab)
Gordon Marsden (Lab)
Paul Williams (Lab)
David Hanson (Lab)
Phil Wilson (Lab)
Richard Burden (Lab)
Jenny Chapman (Lab)
Lisa Forbes (Lab) –
Emma Dent Coad (Lab)
Nic Dakin (Lab)
Laura Smith (Lab)
Ruth Smeeth (Lab)
Gareth Snell (Lab)
Paula Sherriff (Lab)
Tom Brake (LD) –
Sue Hayman (Lab)
Sarah Wollaston (LD)
Anna Soubry (TIG).

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:53 AM

Corbyn wanted 16 year olds to have the vote. Mainly because they couldn't remember how bloody awful nationalised industries were.

Wonder how youngsters have would felt if they couldn't go into a store and buy the phones they so love.

there was a six month waiting time for a phone. No one was allowed to buy an answer machine. There was a year waiting list and you had to rent it from the government.

There was a time when you had to get cookers from the gas show room and the electricity show room.

You can say - well it wouldn't be like that nowadays - but it would be something - if it wasn't phones or washing machines. Bloody little Hitlers telling you what you could do and what you couldn't. One of the buggers threatened me with prison when I bought an answer machine from Tandys.

the corbynistas are all saying it was all about Brexit. But if that was the case why did Dennis Skinner lose his seat?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 10:58 AM

”pop quiz - 10 bonus points to anyone who knows the big academic word for this process...]”

Errrrrrmm....Self-nemetic?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:05 AM

Al - If the next general election is 5 years from now,
thankfully a lot of our current old sour complainers on the left and the right
will be too dead to make life a misery for everyone else...

I'll be 65 if I outlive the family curse [no male relatives ever make it to 70..]..

Perhaps I might by then have earned sufficient bitterness
become a miserable old bastard,
going on and on about the old days when blah blah blah drone drone drone...???

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:13 AM

Iains - while you are blinded by your own bile.. remember it's Fri 13th..

Take the blinkers off and carefully look out for ladders and banana skins...

I predict a lot of pumped up fools will accidently expire prematurly from over-celebrating this weekend...

Sensible folks best stay out of pubs and off the roads after closing time,
until the triumphalist bully euphoria subsides...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:13 AM

Now Nigel, read carefully what I said. I said a fascist would love that remit. I have said here and elsewhere that that clause could mean anything between nothing at all and near enough the Enabling Act. we do not know where on the spectrum that will end up. But we do know that in the last few months the Government has complained that

- Parliament is blocking the Government
- The supreme court is blocking them and may need political involvement on appointments
- Cases brought by Gina Miller should have been declared outside the scope of the court.
- They argued the same in the Scottish courts
- They 'reminded' the BBC of an upcoming licence review and speculated the licence model might be dropped
- They threatened C4 in a same way


Every time, the Government objected to anyone else having any sort of authority over it, or even, in the case of C4 showing them in a bid light. So given all that, I doubt if 'rebalancing' powers can mean anything other than strengthening the Government.

Finally, of course, I did not tell Joe what to think. I quoted a section of the manifesto and asked him to decide how an actual fascist leader would regard it.

Like others, I am not claiming the current Government is fascist. But I am claiming this section of the manifesto creates an opening.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:14 AM

John, you know the drill! :-)

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:21 AM

Ooooh. My last post was number 666. How beastly :-)

DMcG. You made a few errors in that last post of yours. Expect to be Nigeled at any moment!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:29 AM

Finally, of course, I did not tell Joe what to think. I quoted a section of the manifesto and asked him to decide how an actual fascist leader would regard it.
That is what your opening comment to Joe said, but you then did a summary: A remit to alter all the checks and balances in favour of the Government? That is not what I would call centrist.

As I explained, it is not a remit to alter all checks and balances in favour of the Government, but I can see how a paranoid might read it that way.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:35 AM

It does not take paranoia, Nigel. Just thinking about what the Government would want to do about the examples I gave.

As I said and repeat yet again, the government may not do anything untoward about these. But it has the opportunity.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:40 AM

Sorry, DtG!

But I expect I can live with that.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:52 AM

Iains - while you are blinded by your own bile.. remember it's Fri 13th..

BILE = anger, bitterness, or irritability.

Sounds more like you leftie boys to me, I'm too busy celebrating.
Was it not one of your little charmers suggesting leaving faeces on school desks(From: Dave the Gnome - PM
Date: 12 Dec 19 - 04:11 AM
Seen on Facebook earlier.
If your polling station is in a school and you vote Tory, you may as well shit on a child's desk on the way out :-) )
The behaviour of two year olds or lefties taking a well deserveed drubbing.


ps it was friday the 13th for commie compo. God moves in not so mysterious ways!   Luvvin it!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 11:58 AM

Iains - just be careful your celebrating don't land you in A&E...
not the most cheerful of places to be kept hours waiting to see a Dr
at this time of year...

hah.. just imagined the various bizarre self inflicted injuries tories are noted for...
a whole queue of em lining up in casualty
with various strange objects lodged in their throats and bumholes...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 12:31 PM

Tribalism was mentioned earlier. Lovely take on that by Jez Lowe

This is not my tribe dual

Bit of relief from all the sabre rattling :-)

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 01:20 PM

I think I'll just leave this here. High time our electoral system was modernised, from the antiquated FPTP system we currently have, to the kind of PR system being used in other, more enlightened, countries.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 01:40 PM

"Mr Corbyn faces calls to quit immediately after he lost 59 MPs and Boris Johnson won the Tories its biggest majority for a generation - but he has instead vowed to cling on into 2020. Labour is already engulfed in a brutal civil war today as moderates warned of another '20 years of Tory rule' unless Mr Corbyn and his supporters were removed from positions of power. But the Labour leader said today he would remain leader until a contest to replace him likely is held in the 'early part of next year' - meaning his departure could still be months away. In his first interview since defeat, Mr Corbyn has denied he was to blame for the devastating defeat and said: 'This election was ultimately taken over by Brexit and we as a party represent people who voted both Remain and Leave'

The loopy leftards at their best! Off into the wasteland with them! A binary choice and kama sutra compo puts on his Janus mask and recites the labour suicide manifesto.
What a star! You really could not make it up.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 02:01 PM

Iains - let's guess from the tone of forced hyperbole.. guido...???

Crikey.. do we have to wait all that time until early 2020..

We'll everyone of us be senile by then...!!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 02:38 PM

Iains - "Off into the wasteland with them! A binary choice and kama sutra compo puts on his Janus mask and recites the labour suicide manifesto.
What a star! You really could not make it up."

Well somebody made that up..
clearly someone with pretentious poor writing skills made that up...

You..???

The election is over, you won..
Whoever your handlers are, whoever set you in motion,
they can switch you off now...
Unless you have been left on auto,
programmed to shift into bad winner mode..
until your batteries run down...???

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 02:43 PM

Since June 2016 you have been squealing:
the referendum result was a fix,
people did not know what they were voting for,
that they were stupid,
that we need another referendum.

Well we had an election instead.
We won again - and still you leftards cannot accept it. Are you all going to continue drivelling for another three years?
Metropolitan Labour gave away seats in the labour heartlands. You all thought because you appeared to be winning in the blogosphere that you would walk it.

Well those labour seats that voted for brexit voted conservative to get brexit, Looks like humpty dumpty compo miscalculated with his sitting on the wall. All he achieved was aggravating his piles.
How sad!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 02:46 PM

no one won. (certainly none you'd care about) maybe the Labour party if it sorts itself out. It couldn't carry on with that idiot.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 05:25 PM

The Conservative Party has now been installed like a official version of Windows 10, the labour party is like a bad version of Windows 98 which will never install because the file system is wrong!!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 13 Dec 19 - 05:39 PM

"The Conservative Party has now been installed like a official version of Windows 10"

..so it'll work seemingly ok for a few weeks
until the next random major failure...???

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: robomatic
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 02:56 AM

Early this morning in explaining (not really) the events surrounding yesterday's important U.K. election, an English commentator described Corbyn as "an unreconstructed Marxist." I haven't the background in the politics on your side of the pond, but if it is an apt description, it explains a lot to me.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 03:03 AM

It would be more meaningful, and you may get more understanding, if we knew who your mysterious, unidentified ‘commentator’ is.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 03:57 AM

Then you are attending to the wrong kind of "commentator." Whatever else Jeremy Corbyn is, he is not a Marxist. Your posting history suggests to me that you regard being branded a Marxist as some kind of slur (many wouldn't, but hey ho). I suggest that you do your homework before you perpetuate slurs in future.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 04:17 AM

You say "if it is an apt description" , Robo. It isn't.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 04:19 AM

au contraire commie corbyn is very much a marxist. Now he is a dead duck in the water marxist.
Even the bastion of leftards, the guardian agrees. You can rest assured whenever shaw pontificates on a subject subsequent events prove him wrong.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/nov/19/marxist-corbyn-revolution-ken-livingstone-labour
I suspect the guardian knows more about such things than a retired opinionated teacher.
The Sun does not mince words.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10394665/corbyn-speech-manifesto-hate/
He is a thoroughly nasty piece of work. However the British Public recognized his total inadequacy and gave his arse a royal kicking in the polls. The worst labour result in 80 years.
Bye bye Compo
Bye bye labour
welcome to brexit.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: DMcG
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 05:41 AM

One thing that I have been discussing with people this morning is what happens at the next election. There is a widespread view that the 'red wall' voted in favour of the Conservatives because of either or both of Brexit and Corbyn.

Come the next election, the Conservatives will want to hold onto as many of those seats as they can and neither of those two drivers will be in play. So it is likely that they will spend a fair proportion of this Parliament trying to consolidate that hold. Quite what they will do remains to be seen, but it may well be more 'leftish' than we might normally expect.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 06:21 AM

The smart New Zealanders can at least see the enormity of the wilful act of self-harm ordinary British people have just committed upon themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 07:23 AM

As we can see Iains is determined not to acknowledge Boris's appeal
that "now is a time for healing divisions..."

Iain's is a perfect example of the kind of nasty hostile tory
that Boris will have perpetual struggle with
in maintaining party discipline in government..

Nice guy Dave Cameron tried and failed in his PR project
to present the Tories as a humane compassionate party..

Time will tell how well Boris will succeed in reconciling any positive intentions with the overwhelming weight of vile c@nts in his party...???

His survival depends on it...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 07:29 AM

One is only a nice tory if possessing all of Lord Sutch's first 6 singles!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 08:22 AM

Larry didn't like Cameron, and I trust his instincts on that one.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 09:39 AM

Oh Dear, the leftards are acting like rugrats having just had their favourite toy confiscated.

Meanwhile the last rites for compo.
Dies iræ, dies illa
Solvet sæclum in favilla,
Teste David cum Sibylla.         l.
Quantus tremor est futurus,
Quando Judex est venturus,
Cuncta stricte discussurus!

Sure looks like the pollsters took their lead from Sibyl as far as compo was concerned.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 10:02 AM

.. at least Stanley Unwin's "Unwinese" made some sense...

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 11:05 AM

One of the bast pieces I’ve read, in the aftermath of the GE....

”So congratulations if you wanted Boris Johnson as pm.

Please don’t celebrate too much though as you have work to do. You see us remoaners have spent three and a half years now telling you brexit was wrong but we’ve finally and completely lost. There’s pretty much nothing we can do now to stop it.

So, it’s over to you leavers. You need to get yourselves into gear to make it work. We need to see some of these benefits you’ve been able to see yet unable to properly articulate since 2016.

I hope you don’t mind but I’ve taken the liberty of writing a to do list for you.

1. Get brexit done please. When we say done we mean as promised so we’ll be looking for trade deals with the EU, Japan, Australia and Canada etc. In fact there’s about 40 deals covering 70 countries that need to be done please. Also with the US that doesn’t involve the nhs or chlorine. We want what you promised us. That was that we’d be no worse off than when we were an EU member. You need to crack on as this was promised by the end of Jan. You have seven weeks.

2. The nhs. We want the cash that was promised please. £350 million per week is about 72000 nurses so please get recruiting. This is important.

3. Scotland. Ok so these guys were promised they would remain in the EU if they remained in the UK. They’re pretty pissed. In fact they’ve voted almost exclusively for the SNP so they might want to leave. Equally you said the UK wouldn’t split so you’ll need to both grant Scotland its independence and keep it as part of the United Kingdom. Good luck squaring this circle. NB. This is urgent.

4. Northern Ireland. Oooookay then. You’ve really buggered this one up. There’s a chance they could look to reunify with the republic now because they didn’t want to brexit. Regardless you’ve caused instability there where we and they can least afford it. NB. This is also urgent.

5. The economy. Johnson keeps talking about unleashing the potential of the country. We need to see this soon if possible. We don’t want to see the downturn that “project fear” predicted. We don’t want to be poorer. We don’t want to lose out.

6. You’ll also need to “bring the country back together”. This might be tricky as a lot of people seem to be really really angry with each other.

That’s as far as I’ve got. Should keep you busy. So go and get all british about things. Roll up your sleeves, pull your socks up, dig deep and deliver what you promised.

And remember if you fail to deliver any if this it’s on you, brexit and Tory voters. You wanted this so badly and now you have it. We honestly hope we’re wrong and that you can make a success of this but if you can’t then we will forever tell you that we told you so.”

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Iains
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 12:33 PM

The leftard rugrats make dammed poor losers. The tactical voting did not achieve much did it.
Bojo took his mojo into Sedgefield (bliar blairs old constituency0
It is bnow staunch Tory.
Howsabout that then! Care to give an explanation?

Metropolitan labour dropped a bollock. On an election based on brexit, offering yes and no on an election manifesto is the act of mental deficients. That is why the valiant tories licked snivelling labour by a 2:1 crushing defeat. Iedeology bullshit obviously did not baffle brains this time around - apart from the hard left posting here of course.

A little toon for the rugrats!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=So4KG40vf-o

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 12:40 PM

project fear didn't just promise a downturn in the economy - you and your mates actually achieved it.

however, the revelation of the day is that Labour thought Corbyn was a vote loser and they didn't dare use his image on the campaign literature.

So if Labour thought that, it seems like it was only you lot who were actually taken in.

So all this abuse of Iains, and all that stuff on facebook and Mark Steel calling us fuckwits - it was really all about you being dupes of Momentum.

Doesn't it give you just a moment's thought about your right to be so nasty to people who have been proved right? We told youCorbyn was unelectable and YOU didn't listen

No ones fault but your own.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 12:57 PM

Who are you talking to, Al?

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 01:03 PM

Al - would you be more specific just who you are railing at...

Iains - would you be more specific just who you are hurling childish abuse at...

At least for my benefit, so I know clearly if I'm a 'leftard' and a 'dupe' or not...???

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 02:08 PM

Backwoodsman: Just to correct a couple of comments in your copy/paste:

One of the bast pieces I’ve read, in the aftermath of the GE....

”So congratulations if you wanted Boris Johnson as pm.

Please don’t celebrate too much though as you have work to do. You see us remoaners have spent three and a half years now telling you brexit was wrong but we’ve finally and completely lost. There’s pretty much nothing we can do now to stop it.

So, it’s over to you leavers. You need to get yourselves into gear to make it work. We need to see some of these benefits you’ve been able to see yet unable to properly articulate since 2016.

I hope you don’t mind but I’ve taken the liberty of writing a to do list for you.

1. Get brexit done please. When we say done we mean as promised so we’ll be looking for trade deals with the EU, Japan, Australia and Canada etc. In fact there’s about 40 deals covering 70 countries that need to be done please. Also with the US that doesn’t involve the nhs or chlorine. We want what you promised us. That was that we’d be no worse off than when we were an EU member. You need to crack on as this was promised by the end of Jan. You have seven weeks.
I expect to see us out of the EU by the end of January, in fact, this has been promised. There will still be negotiations needed to confirm our ongoing trading position with the EU

2. The nhs. We want the cash that was promised please. £350 million per week is about 72000 nurses so please get recruiting. This is important.
£350 million was not promised. This has been explained before. The comment on the bus listed what we pay to EU each week, and suggested we could spend it better, with more being paid to NHS. Nowhere did it claim that the whole amount would go to the NHS.
Oh, and £350,000,000 per week equating to 72,000 nurses? This means nurses are paid over £4,000 per week. Figures worthy of Diane Abbott

3. Scotland. Ok so these guys were promised they would remain in the EU if they remained in the UK. They’re pretty pissed. In fact they’ve voted almost exclusively for the SNP so they might want to leave. Equally you said the UK wouldn’t split so you’ll need to both grant Scotland its independence and keep it as part of the United Kingdom. Good luck squaring this circle. NB. This is urgent.
No. Scotland were not promised that they would remain in the EU if we went for Brexit. They were told that if they went for independence (at that time) they would no longer be part of the UK, and so would lose their membership of the EU. If they were no longer part of UK then they would no longer be part of EU. If they remained part of UK then they would remain part of EU as long as the rest of UK did. This may be difficult to understand, but please try.

4. Northern Ireland. Oooookay then. You’ve really buggered this one up. There’s a chance they could look to reunify with the republic now because they didn’t want to brexit. Regardless you’ve caused instability there where we and they can least afford it. NB. This is also urgent. There have always been calls in Ireland for re-unification. Whether Brexit makes those calls stronger is debatable.

5. The economy. Johnson keeps talking about unleashing the potential of the country. We need to see this soon if possible. We don’t want to see the downturn that “project fear” predicted. We don’t want to be poorer. We don’t want to lose out. The pound has already rallied, and the FOOTSIE 250 has also seen improvements. It seems the financial industries can see benefits which you cannot.

6. You’ll also need to “bring the country back together”. This might be tricky as a lot of people seem to be really really angry with each other. If Labour had won, and if they had proved to be a Remain party (rather than sitting on the fence) there would still have been a need to "bring the country back together". So this is a rather pointless point

That’s as far as I’ve got. Should keep you busy. So go and get all british about things. Roll up your sleeves, pull your socks up, dig deep and deliver what you promised.

And remember if you fail to deliver any if this it’s on you, brexit and Tory voters. You wanted this so badly and now you have it. We honestly hope we’re wrong and that you can make a success of this but if you can’t then we will forever tell you that we told you so.”


Next time, try and come up with your own arguments, rather than some unattributed copy'n'paste.

Subject: RE: BS: UK General election December 12 2019
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 14 Dec 19 - 02:09 PM

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