Review: Walter Pardon - Research

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 05:27 PM

Hello Sandman.

Thank you for your contribution. You can see pictures of the farmhouse in the film made by Edge TV. It has an attached barn and outhouses. Much more like a farmhouse than a mere farm cottage. I don't need to ask Jim Carroll: I can look at the pictures. And so can you. Here is the reference again (it is in the original post).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=51&v=B95JAQe1Wtc

Obviously it wasn't a farm-workers' cottage when Pardon himself lived in it, as he was not a farmer. But it would be interesting to know on a social history basis how come he continued to live there: maybe it was in effect a lifetime lease he 'inherited', as happened in my own family at a time before renting got so systematised and time-limited, maybe some landlord could not find a better tenant and farming methods had moved on.

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 05:17 PM

Hello and thank you for the discussion.

1 Responding to a point about copyright in the recordings made of Walter, this idea came from a discussion on the Mustrad web site. The link ref is and the quotation is "Some months later … I heard from another source that Topic had decided against the second record as the copyright to four of the Bill Leader recordings they wanted to include was owned by Dave Bulmer of Celtic Music, and thus that its production costs would be too high. Back to Mike Yates … we agreed that MT would, again, publish the record." The author is Ron Stradling.

2 Language like 'song carrier' and 'traditional singer' beg a lot of questions. It is the ideology (whether or not this reflects the truth) and the way it has affected the comments made about Pardon in the writing about him that I have encountered which interests me. Also the passion with which some people are attached to these concepts. Nobody appears to know what traditional singing was like (and this has been discussed on Mudcat).

3 Regarding Victorian Popular Music: I refer you to the material on Mustrad, especially the sections tracing the origins of material Pardon sang. I was very much taken with the number of songs for which specific composers could be found.

4 Regarding what Pardon said about himself and the songs, this raises questions about what you might call 'qualitative research methods'. And about the reporting of findings. I hint at some of these issues in the intial discussion paper. I'll repeat part of my thoughts here: for me the starting point has to be what seems to be the earliest interview with Pardon (one I think has been selectively quoted from in the past, the one you can listen to on the British Library Site. He says they did not think of themselves as singing 'folk songs' and that they called them 'old songs'. He says he heard some folk songs at school. He himself said he believed that his grandfather got them from broadsides. If that source doesn't count as Victorian popular music ….

5 I would not argue that Pardon probably came to believe that he was important. A number of the references I cite lead to people stating that they told him they thought he was, partly to persuade him to be recorded if I remember correctly. It seems to be crystal clear that his understanding would have been 'polluted' (your word, not mine, with respect) by the milieu into which he found himself pulled. One could suggest, though I accept this might be a viewed as or even be bit provocative, that he 'went native'?

6 I am not particular seeking to imply that Pardon was in any sense exploited, or that the copyrighting of his work was improper or not normal. I hope nothing I wrote gave that impression. However, I do have an impression that there was a clear attempt for whatever reason to market his singing on a commercial basis. Whether a project was financially viable is an explicit criteria discussed on Mustrad. If anything the point I was making was that the revival, like it or not, and possibly in opposition to the inclinations of some of its leaders (and perhaps to my own, I am no fan of capitalism) was involved in commercial projects. So I am writing if you like against any romantic notions that there might be that the revival was commerce free in some idealistic romantic sense.

7 It is incorrect and I feel a little unfair to state that I think a 'traditional singer' should be an illiterate peasant untouched by outside influences.

8 Thank you for the reference to Peta Webb. I had found that and already referenced it in my draft, together with comments about how some of what it says in that conflicts with/differs from accounts found elsewhere. My point was one about how different writers create different pictures/tell different stories about the same figure. You will find the reference in the list of interviews. Happy to add any other examples people have to the resource list. This is one reason for posting a draft.

9 On the concept of 'folk song' being an academic one, I can think of a lot of highly non academic people, including some people who appear hostile to 'desk jockeys' who use the term freely!

10 Regarding 'debunking' that isn't how I would put it. Deconstruct might be something like it. Investigating how the various accounts reflect the ideologies/views/ideas of those who put them forward, as, I suppose the contributions made to my draft may begin to illustrate anew. So for example, some of the points where different accounts emerge in the literature, including precisely what Pardon said about the songs and comments on his style and its origins seem to me to be underpinned by the prior beliefs of those making them.

11 In a sense I am trying to do some basic history. These accounts of Pardon are secondary sources. The question to ask is precisely what 'bias' (trying to use the word non-judgmentally) the person who produced that source may have.

12 In my draft, I refer to work produced by Jim Carroll, and to the discussion of it after he typed some of it into a Mudcat thread. I comment on this in respect of research methods. I would ask you to find it and consider for yourself whether or not the questions asked are open or closed, leading or otherwise etc. Clear or open to interpretation both by Pardon and by those reading it? Do we get dates, contexts?

Thank you for reading and contributing. Any further references would be appreciated.





11

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: The Sandman
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 05:02 PM

as far as i understand Walter did not live in a large farmhouse, Jim should know.
Who Did Walter leave his house to? a large farmhouse , i very much douBt it PSEUDONYMOUS

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: Howard Jones
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 02:09 PM

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say by this article. It seems to me, although this may be coloured by some of your comments on another thread, that you are somehow trying to debunk the idea of Walter Pardon as an important traditional singer. You even seem to suggest that he was really no such thing. I'm sure Jim will be along in due course to challenge this but in the meantime here's my two penn'orth.

Firstly you seem to have a misguided idea of what a traditional singer should be. The idea that a folk singer should be an illiterate peasant untouched by outside influences was inaccurate even in Cecil Sharp's time. Pardon was a man of the 20th century, more or less contemporary with my own father, and of course he had some education and was literate. Of course he was exposed to the gramophone, the radio and the television, and it would be naive to expect that his singing style might be completely untouched by these influences. However it would also have been influenced by the singers in his family and his village. His style was his own, as to some extent is any singer's, and from one point of view is representative only of him. Most other traditional singers had their own individual styles. Nevertheless it is an example of a mid-20th century singer who has been part of a singing tradition passed on over at least three generations, but not one which existed in a state of isolation.

You also seem to cast doubt on his sources. Broadsides and written sources do not disqualify someone from being a traditional singer. Singers took songs from wherever they could find them and written sources have long been known to be part of this. You also wonder where he got found the words to his uncle's songs when he came to write them down. Could they not have been in his head? 150 songs is a respectable number, but I expect most modern singers know at least that many. I reckon I could muster a similar number if I put my mind to it, although of course it would take time to dredge them all from the recesses of my memory. What made him exceptional was that most other traditional singers had been recorded when they were much older and could recall only relatively few songs.

The concept of "folk song" is an academic one used by outsiders, and I doubt any source singer thought of their material as "folk song". I'm sure Jim will explain exactly how Pardon thought of the different songs in his repertoire. When Pardon associated the term with school I suspect he may have been thinking of Cecil Sharp's piano arrangements which were inflicted on generations of schoolchildren, and which would appear very different to his own songs.

However it is probable that he took his position in the folk revival seriously and wanted to maintain and increase his repertoire. I am reminded of another traditional singer, Fred Jordan, who was not averse to adding songs to his repertoire from revival singers, and who rather played up his "country yokel" image.

You seem to imply he was exploited when his songs were recorded. It is usual for copyright in a recording to belong to the record producer, who has after all paid to produce it, and is also better placed to enforce copyright claims. The copyright is in the recording itself, not the songs on it. What we don't know is what financial arrangements Bill Leader made with him. From what I can gather he seems to have been trusted by most of those he recorded.

You seem to think that Pardon is disqualified, or at least devalued, as a traditional singer because he was exposed to outside influences, had a broad repertoire which did not just include folk songs, and was involved with and perhaps influenced (polluted?) by the folk revival. Instead he should be seen in context, as an example a modern 20th century person who was a successor to an older singing tradition and singing culture, which still continues today in parts of East Anglia.

Did he receive undue attention simply because he being slightly younger than most of the other traditional singers he had survived for longer and was able to be recorded and to perform outside his local environment? Perhaps, after all there were so few traditional singers left by then so any that were left were seized on, but his clear ability as a singer, as a song carrier and as an interpreter of those songs should stand for itself.

Incidentally, this article by Peta Webb on EATMT is worth a read.

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: Brian Peters
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 01:56 PM

Good that this thread is now up and running, though I don't have much time to contribute just now. Briefly:

"...he and his family did not think they were singing folk songs. He states that he did learn some folk songs at school."

My understanding is that traditional singers in general didn't refer to their repertoire as 'folk songs', at least until they met academics or folk revivalists who did. It was usual (and Jim will tell you more) to call them 'old songs', or 'Daddy's songs', etc. If WP differentiated the 'folk songs' he'd learned at school from those in his family repertoire, we can only assume that his school was not using Sharp and Baring-Gould’s book, since WP would have surely recognized common titles, and the general style. Perhaps he was taught that the ‘National Songs’ Sharp so despised were actually folk songs?

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 01:16 PM

Sorry pfr And another relative I had played pub piano purely by ear, despite being very deaf, and could not read one word of music. No idea at all how he learned: should have asked. Much much too late now! People do have amazing musical talent without training!

Sorry I was thinking that Pardon might have at some level been influenced by his military service. I realise you were on a different track. I must not fall into the trap of not reading before responding, there is enuff of that …

Bacon and egg butty time.

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 01:12 PM

PFR

I too had wondered about the military bit. It is often said that soldiers did sing a lot, so it makes sense to assume that some influences may have crept in there.

I had an ancestor who was a military music professional and blush to think of some battles he would have fought in. I know that if you went down this route you did get a good grounding, and many made a career in music after leaving the army. But I doubt they would have given training apart from marching in time to a carpenter in Aldershot! My ancestor was more or less a rag and bone man (scrap metal dealer) in later life, though he also did concerts in the park.

I agree about self improvement late Victorian early 20th century. Libraries, I remember those!

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 01:09 PM

not forgetting worker's social clubs in provincial towns in the early 20th century..

Centres for a pint, some grub, entertainment, recreation, and education...

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 12:50 PM

Sorry better link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=86&v=XKmYiSA_Xyg

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 12:49 PM

Thank you starship. I do reference this in the opening piece, but it is useful to have a quick link.

Put a bit of powder on it:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=put+a+bit+of+powder+on+it+father&view=detail&mid=E67624FB087B38234C8CE67624FB087B38234C8C&FORM=VIRE

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 12:48 PM

Also, his brother in law, my great uncle, was a self-taught multi instrumentalist.
Uncle had a spotty pre ww2 work history in menial factory jobs and such.
He also had a reputation as a bit of a work shy layabout.
That I again guess would give spare time for self education and free thinking,
until being shoved into essential war factory work..

Sometime along the way he learnt to read music for playing in pub sing songs...

Which is how I remember him from the 1960s...

Working class self education movement and public libraries
matterd significantly in the early 20th century...

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Starship
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 12:44 PM

http://www.mustrad.org.uk/articles/pardon2.htm

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 12:35 PM

Just a suggestion..

according to family legend..

[ I really must do some proper family tree digging..]

My grandad went straight from orphanange to army as a band boy.
I'm guessing the military might have educated him to read music...

If so army service might be a factor in late 19th cent / early 20th cent,
labouring class music education & skills...???

While a soldier, and later as a respected Dunkirk veteran,
my grandad also played popular songs in dance bands and pubs...

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 12:22 PM

I can see lots of little mistakes myself already, eg having established that Roger Dixon was not a nephew I then refer to Pardon as his uncle! But it is a start in drawing stuff together.

I did search MUDCAT using Walter Pardon as a search term before posting, by the way, and I think the main bits are represented or mentioned. But as it says, this is a draft and open to revision.

One thing I would like to know (and maybe Mudcat isn't the place) is whether the Thomas Cook Gee on the electoral register for Norfolk prior to 1915 is Walter's grandfather. Because there were some requirements, and it seems to me that a man in a position to learn to read music may have been a little higher up the social scale than the lowest paid ag lab. It would be nice to fill in a bit more social history, but that's just me. Things fluctuated, I have ancestors who could write and had some sort of small-holding, then in the next generation they are signing with crosses and working in pits (but still getting TB).

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 12:14 PM

Ray

I don't know what is available now, though E Bay might be a place to look! We could compile a list of what is now available new and put it here. There is a discography in the Mustrad materials, and one online too at discogs, though this does not seem to be complete.

See also the marketplace here:
https://www.discogs.com/sell/list?artist_id=1705261&ev=ab (NB I'm sure other sources are available, as they say, and I am not recommending any. I use Spotify, which has plenty.)

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: r.padgett
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 12:06 PM

Yes as Brian Peters says on another thread Walter Pardon appeared at Whitby ff circa 1977 ~I remember being there! He sang two songs and then Watersons sang and he sang two and so on I remember ~ chorus songs I believe

That was the only occasion I saw him!

Quite a bit of biography and notes on his early vinyl and latterly CDs ~like "Put a bit of powder on it father" all I suspect still available from Musical Traditions?

Ray

Subject: RE: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 11:51 AM

All a bit too much to take in right now,
but I'm doing a bit of homework
inbetween domestic chores, and dealing with today's new problems..

The last time I made any effort to find out about 'source singers'
was a good 10 to 15 years ago,
and I've forgotten nearly all of it by now..

So this is a useful refresher, thanks...

Subject: Review: Walter Pardon; Research
From: GUEST,Pseudonymous
Date: 05 Nov 19 - 11:36 AM

A basis for discussion.

Walter Pardon: Fact, Fiction, and Ideology.

Walter Pardon (1914 – 1996) was a carpenter, singer and melodeon player (largely self-taught) from Knapton, Norfolk.

Let us try to sort out a few facts about Pardon upon which everybody might agree. This is more difficult than one might think. As soon as one starts to compare different sources it seems that material presented as ‘fact’ by one source is contradicted by another, and is, after all, not so much a fact as an inference. Therefore, what follows is intended as a first draft, to be corrected in the light of any further evidence.

The Facts?

There seems to be general agreement that Pardon was discovered as a singer in the 1970s, during a 20th century folk “revival”. According to Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Pardon (accessed 3rd Nov 2019), this discovery happened when Pardon’s younger relative, Roger Dixon, to whom Pardon had sung songs when he was a boy, persuaded him to record a number of songs on tape.

Another useful source is the MUSTRAD web site has a section on Pardon, incorporating sleeve notes from a 2000 issue of a selection of his work (Article MT052). Mike Yates and Rod Stradling provided this resource. I refer to it as ‘MUSTRAD’ throughout. However, as will become clear, the Mustrad material includes contradictory information and the material in it needs evaluating carefully to distinguish fact from opinion.

Pardon’s parents were called Thomas and Emily (nee Gee), and he was their only child. It seems to be common ground that Pardon came from a musical family. He grew up and lived in a farmhouse previously occupied by his maternal grandfather, Thomas Cook Gee. The 1861 census gives Thomas’s address as ‘Hall Street, Knapton.’ The Hall in question would be Knapton Old Hall, a late 16th century farmhouse which is now a listed building. Pardon’s farmhouse was called Parr’s Farm Cottage.

Thomas Cook Gee is said to have played clarinet in a church band. Pardon has been cited as stating that Thomas could read music. Thomas and his wife Ruth had 12 children (source Familyhistory.org), at least five of whom in their turn made music or sang: Pardon’s mother, Thomas, Walter (a melodeon player, see the full MUSTRAD piece which is below), Alice and Billy. Some of the male members of the family had in the past been involved in singing in the public house. It would appear that Pardon himself did not, the tradition having died out by the time he came to a suitable age. Walter was literate, education being compulsory in England when he was born. He knew some history, citing the date of Forster’s Education Act in an early interview. In the 1930s, during a time of economic depression, Pardon spent a lot of time with his uncle, Billy (1863/4 ? - 1942), who is believed to have taught Pardon a number of songs. During World War Two, Pardon served in the British Army, again as a carpenter. He never married, and he lived for most of his life in the house where he had grown up.   From 1957, when his father died, Pardon lived there alone. There was a long period, possibly stretching to 20 years, when Pardon did not sing, but played tunes to himself on a melodeon.

Pardon had access to much of the standard technology of his time: he had a collection of 78rpm records and a radio.

Pardon’s route on to the folk scene seems uncontroversial. As has already been explained, Pardon was ‘discovered’ by a second cousin (sometime incorrectly described as a nephew), Roger Dixon, who became a teacher of history and then later the Rev Roger Dixon < https://www.mardles.org/index.php/magazine/blogs/item/169-roger-dixon-s-important-role-in-the-discovery-of-traditional-norfolk-singer-walter-pardon> (accessed 4th November 2019). Dixon had taken an interest in Pardon’s singing while a boy. Eventually, Dixon persuaded his uncle to record himself singing, and the question of whether Dixon lent Pardon a reel-to-reel tape recorder or whether Pardon has its own has different answers in the material. Dixon passed the recordings on to a ‘revival singer’ called Peter Bellamy, a former pupil of his. Bellamy contacted Bill Leader, who was among other things a sound recordist, who issued two albums of Pardon’s work and retained the copyright of at least some of it.

After his discovery, Pardon sang in public for eight or nine years, mostly, it would appear, in The Orchard Gardens public house quite club close to home. A number of records of his work were issued. He was interviewed a number of times and was the subject of two films.      
According to Jim Carroll, writing on the Mudcat discussion forum <23rd March 2009 >, it was not always possible for Pardon’s booking agent, Carroll’s partner Pat Mackenzie, to obtain gigs for Pardon: ‘Oh, we don't book singers like that; we only cater for the modern stuff.’
Pardon’s public singing career came to an end in 1989, when he felt that his voice was no longer up to the job. His singing, and some of his spoken words, may be heard free online using ‘Spotify’.

The Sources

I have already referred to the Mustrad information. This discussion of the background to the issuing of some CDs of his work, apparently dating from 2000, may be found on the MUSTRAD web site here (accessed 3rd Nov 2019). It is liner notes to a double CD release. This material, valuable in many ways, raises a number of important questions about the presentation and framing of Pardon and his work.
A number of people took recordings of Pardon’s singing, including himself (for Roger Dixon); Bill Leader; Mike Yates; Jim Carroll and Pat Mackenzie (some of whose recordings were proposed for a release that did not happen, various perspectives on this are expressed online); Sam Richards and Mike Yates.   Yates produced what was intended to be a recording of the whole repertoire, and wrote a series of pieces on this, for MUSTRAD.

Pardon was interviewed by a number of folklorists and journalists. Accounts of some of these interviews have been published, and recordings of at least one are available on line at https://sounds.bl.uk/World-and-traditional-music/Reg-Hall-Archive/025M-C0903X0048XX-0700V0 (accessed 3rd Nov, 2019). Unfortunately, we do not always have dates for these recordings, though the BL one is dated. Transcriptions by Jim Carroll and Pat Mackenzie of one (or more?) interviews with Pardon were posted onto a Mudcat discussion thread headed ‘Traditional Singers Talking’ by Jim Carroll in 2014. These are undated, unfortunately. However, they raise important and interesting questions about research techniques and interviewer bias which I shall discuss below. Moreover, the thread itself is a source of lively debate about a number of related issues.   

As already indicated, two films were made about Pardon: one, called ‘The Ballad and The Source’, was by a visiting American called John Cohen; the second, narrated by Brian Gaudet, was made by Edge TV long after Pardon’s death. This latter film may be viewed on YouTube. It shows Pardon’s home to be called Parr Farm Cottage or house, currently valued at over half a million pounds (Zoopla).

I have already mentioned the MUSTRAD site’s section on Pardon. Also available on that MUSTRAD site is a piece that Pardon himself wrote for publication, following discussion with active members of the folk revival at that time. This piece was a reminiscence of a local pipe and drum band in which some of Pardon’s own family had played. http://www.mustrad.org.uk/articles/pardon2.htm#kdfb (accessed 3rd Nov 2019).

In addition, in 1981 Pardon was interviewed by Peta Webb for a BBC2 television programme called ‘The Other Music’. See < https://eatmt.wordpress.com/walter-pardon> accessed 4th November 2019.

Other material relating to Pardon available online includes a number of obituaries,

Problems With The Data

1 Where did Walter get his songs?

I’ll begin by noting that it is not always possible to establish precisely where Pardon learned a particular song. I don’t know if this is important, but it seems to be true, and worth stating on that basis. While some sources seem to suggest that he learned all of them from his uncle Billy, it has been stated (Mustrad) that he sometimes gave contradictory accounts of where he learned a particular song to different interviewers.   Peta Webb writes that Pardon told her he learned some from his mother and some from other uncles.   Mustrad cites Mike Yates as believing that Pardon got most of the words for one song in the CD compilation from a book called ‘The Wanton Seed’ by Frank Purslow.   Finally, Mike Yates asserts on Mustrad (Article MT054 - from Musical Traditions No 1, Mid 1983) that Billy owned a book entitled: “The National Agricultural Labourers' and Rural Workers' Union Song Book.” Some of Pardon’s material is in this book and may therefore have come from it via Billy. Mike also asserts that he does not think that Walter would link together the material in this essay, which is headed by a quotation from Marx, in the same way that he does.

And where did Grandfather Thomas get the songs he supposedly passed on to Billy? MUSTRAD demonstrates how many songs sung by Walter can be demonstrated to have 19th century origins: on one level they look like the popular music of Thomas’s time. Pardon seems to have asserted that his uncles Billy and Tom learned their songs from, their father, and that he got them from broadsides. He gives Billy as the source of this information. MUSTRAD provides us with further food for thought, and, for once, the information is presented as a conjecture rather than as fact: ”The late Al Sealey told me of an informally organised 'pub circuit' of music hall gigs which used to operate in East Anglia right up to the early 1930s, where second-string semi-pro performers would put on shows of their own songs together with the popular hits of the day. This might help to explain the huge number of good, though not widely known, music hall type songs still to be found in the area.”

2 Where did Pardon get his style?

Similar problems about obtaining precise knowledge extend to assertions about the origins of Pardon’s style. If memory serves me right, this is another area where Mustrad presents different theories, ranging from his style comes direct from Billy (implication being presumably it is authentic/tradition/folk, to assertions by Pardon that his style is his own, especially the downwards swoop he uses time after time at the end of a word.

3 How did Pardon conceive of the songs he sang?

In an early interview , Pardon is quite explicit that he and his family did not think they were singing folk songs. He states that he did learn some folk songs at school. This interview seems to me to be important because it could be argued to represent Pardon’s thinking at the start of a career in which he would be associating with many people with strong, often ideologically-based, views about what ‘folk music’ is/was/ought to be.

4 How Did Walter Remember So Many Songs?

While Pardon in one of his earliest interviews described writing down words of songs Billy sang, as Billy had missing fingers and could not write. Martin Carthy in the Edge TV film asserts that Pardon kept them alive by rehearsing them in his head. Somewhere else it is said that Pardon started writing songs down after Billy died. But if so, who is to say where he found the words he wrote down?

MUSTRAD SITE

Again, I emphasise that this site is a valuable and interesting resource. If interested, search the site using ‘Walter Pardon’ as a search term. Many of the pieces seem to have been produced as part of commercial packages of Pardon’s music. But as soon as one begins to read it carefully, one realises that in places it offers contradictory information, and that much of the text represents inferences, generalisations and opinion, rather than facts. This is not necessarily a criticism; but it is, I believe, a fair observation. To be fair, in a piece on ‘The Socio-Political Songs of Walter Pardon’, Mike Yates writes: “It should be stressed at once that these songs have been placed together by myself: and not by Walter, who I suspect would not link them together in the manner that I do.” What is welcome here is Yates’ ability to recognise and acknowledge his own ideological framework. At several points material on the Mustrad pages acknowledges that contradictory information relating to Pardon is already in the public sphere.

Another interesting comment is one made by Roly Brown http://www.mustrad.org.uk/reviews/pardon1.htm (accessed 5/11/2019) to the effect that nobody has considered the possible links between Pardon’s work and his collection of 78 rpm records. My thought here is that the last thing that the folklore establishment would be interested in doing is comparing the singing style on these 78 rms with Pardon’s own. Some of the songs are now digitally available, and there seems to me to be very strong similarities, in, for example, some of the trills Pardon uses from time to time.


This MUSTRAD site includes a list of songs in Pardon’s repertoire, together with comments on the authorship and dates of origin of some of these songs.   (NB This information may or may not represent the current state of knowledge and thinking on the songs.) The web site is ‘signed’ at the bottom by Rod Stradling and Mike Yates. Michael Yates certainly wrote four sections: ‘Walter’s Recorded Legacy’, ‘The Walter Pardon Discography’, ‘The Walter Pardon Repertoire’ and ‘The Listings of Walter Pardon’s 78 RPM Gramophone Records’.

This site is divided into sections, including one entitled ‘In his own words’. It refers to ‘several conversations and interviews (see Credits below)’ but the credits have proved impossible to locate, and on that basis, it is difficult to know when Pardon said what and to whom. Another section is headed ‘Personality’. This includes information about Pardon’s house. Because the author regarded Pardon as having ‘major status as a singer’ by this time, and says that the meeting giving rise to this section took place not long after a US visit, we can date the visit to sometime in or just after 1976. Pardon is described as an avid reader who liked to discuss what he had read.   As is to be expected, the pieces are something of a mixture of fact, opinion and anecdote. At one point, the writer mentions notes he took when he met Pardon, but the online text seems to have been produced decades later and it isn’t clear exactly what the notes were about.

While journalistically it makes sense to create word pictures of a person drawing on a range of interviews given over time to different people, what this makes it difficult or impossible to do is to trace how the subject of the piece changed over time.

A person who, early after his discovery, was denying singing folk songs cannot have spent so much time surrounded by the ideologues of the revival without picking up on their attitudes, without understanding, in a sense, what they want from him and the language in which they discuss song. The 'data' on Pardon as a traditional singer supposedly produced by so many interviews is hopeless polluted by all this, not to mention the leading questions that his interviewers appear to have been so fond of using.

I think this may be true especially of a man with a sense of history, demonstrated in the early interview where he cites the date of Forster’s Education Act. For me, claims about what Walter said or thought taken from interviews in which the most obviously leading of questions are asked, claims often designed to support a narrative in which Walter features as a ‘traditional’ or ‘folk’ or ‘source’ singer are hopelessly bogged down in a methodological and philosophical mess.

One can see that Pardon ticked a number of boxes for the enthusiasts of the 70s revival: he was elderly, he was rural, he sang old songs, he sang in tune, he was amenable to being recorded (in circumstances where he lost the copyright, I note) and he seems to have enjoyed performing in public.