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Lyr Req: Irish Mattie Groves

DigiTrad:
FATTY GROVES
LORD BANNER
MATTIE GROVES


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turtles@io.com 28 May 97 - 07:52 PM
Martin Ryan 29 May 97 - 05:22 AM
Martin Ryan 29 May 97 - 10:03 AM
LaMarca 29 May 97 - 01:25 PM
Alan of Australia 29 May 97 - 08:34 PM
Alan of Australia 29 May 97 - 08:43 PM
Barry Finn 31 May 97 - 02:45 AM
GUEST,Cait 16 Sep 04 - 04:00 PM
pavane 17 Sep 04 - 02:36 AM
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Subject: Irish Mattie Groves
From: turtles@io.com
Date: 28 May 97 - 07:52 PM

hey i've been told that there is an irish version of mattie groves. if anyone can give me the title, or better yet, lyrics, i'd be much obliged. thanks! jen turtles@io.com


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Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves
From: Martin Ryan
Date: 29 May 97 - 05:22 AM

Christy Moore recorded a song called "Little Musgrave", which is essentially Mattie Groves. I'll check his comments on source later.

Regards


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Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves
From: Martin Ryan
Date: 29 May 97 - 10:03 AM

In "Christy Moore Songbook", he describes it as "made up from old versions plus verses I wrote myself, fitted to a tune from Nic Jones"

I haven't the stamina to type it all in - nor a convenient scanner!

Regards


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Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves
From: LaMarca
Date: 29 May 97 - 01:25 PM

After singing my own mix of the Nic Jones and Christy Moore versions at a festival one year, Jerry Epstein asked where the tune was from; I said I learned it from Nic Jones, and he said it was the tune used by the American ballad-monger (mangler?) John Jacob Niles, who had the unfortunate habit of copywriting all his material, traditional or otherwise. I don't know if Niles' tune was trad. or not; but it would have probably been an American variant. I haven't bothered to go look up Niles' version to see if Jerry was correct; I love the tune, and whether it's English, Irish or American doesn't matter to me that much. Christy Moore's set of words are fairly close to one of the variants given in Child; he leaves out my favorite ending, where Lord Arnold/Darnell tells his men to

"Bury my lady at the top
For she came from better kin."


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Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 29 May 97 - 08:34 PM

I also sing a mix of Nic Jones/Christy Moore/original Child text with the afore mentioned ending.. I still think that tune was written by Nic Jones or a trad tune modified by him. I'll check my record cover when I get home this evening.

It's interesting that Child doesn't mention Matty Groves (which is an American version of Little Musgrave and Lady Barnard) among the versions he published.

No sign of any Irish version though.

Cheers, alan


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Subject: Lyr Add: LITTLE MUSGRAVE
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 29 May 97 - 08:43 PM

Here are the words as I sing them:

LITTLE MUSGRAVE
Child No. 81

It's four and twenty bonny boys
A-playing at the ball
Then out came the Little Musgrave
The flower among them all.

Sometimes he lost sometimes he won
Till the noontide of the day
And four and twenty fair ladies
Went out to view the play.

And some were dressed in velvet red
And some in velvet brown
Lord Barnard's wife in velvet green
Was the fairest in the town.

She cast her eye on the Little Musgrave
As bright as the summer sun
Said Musgrave to himself
This lady's heart I've won.

I have loved you fair lady
Full long and many's the day
And I have loved you Little Musgrave
But never a word did say.

I have a bower in Buckelsfordbery
It's my heart's delight
I'll take you back there with me
If you'll lie in my arms all night.

But standing by was a little foot page
From the lady's coach he ran
Although I am a lady's page
I am Lord Barnard's man.

And my Lord Barnard shall hear of this
Oh whether I sink or swim
Everywhere the bridge was broken
He'd enter the water and swim.

My Lord Barnard my Lord Barnard
You are a man of life
But Musgrave is at Buckelsfordbery
Asleep with your wedded wife.

If this be true my little foot page
This thing thou tellest me
Then all the gold in Buckelsfordbery
I gladly will give to thee.

But if this be a lie my little foot page
This thing thou tellest me
From the highest tree in Buckelsfordbery
Hanged you will be.

Go saddle me the black he said
Go saddle me the grey
But sound you not your horns he said
Lest our coming you betray.

But there was a man in Lord Barnard's train
Who loved the Little Musgrave
He blew his horn both loud and shrill
Away Musgrave away.

Methinks I hear the morning cock
Methinks I hear the jay
Methinks I hear Lord Barnard's men
And I would I were away.

Lie still lie still my Little Musgrave
And keep me from the cold
'Tis nothing but a shepherd's boy
A-bringing his sheep to fold.

Is not your hawk upon its perch
Your steed eats oats and hay
And you've a lady in your arms
And yet you go away.

So he turned him right and round about
And they fell fast asleep
When he awoke Lord Barnard's men
Were standing at their feet.

How do you like my bed he said
How do you like my sheet
And how do you like my fair lady
That lies in your arms asleep.

'Tis well I like your bed he said
'Tis well I like your sheet
'Tis better I like the fair lady
That lies in my arms asleep.

Rise up rise up my Little Musgrave
And put thy clothing on
It'll never be said in fair England
I slew a naked man.

There are two long swords by my side
Full dear they cost my purse
But you shall have the better of them
And I will have the worse.

And the first stroke that Little Musgrave struck
It hurt Lord Barnard sore
And the first stroke that Lord Barnard struck
Little Musgrave ne'er struck more.

Then up spoke the lady fair
From the bed whereon she lay
Although you're dead my Little Musgrave
Still for you I'll pray.

How do you like his cheeks lady
How do you like his chin
And how do you like his dead body
Now there's no life within.

It's well I like his cheeks she said
It's well I like his chin
It's better I like his dead body
Than all your kith and kin.

He's taken out his long long sword
To strike the mortal blow
Through and through the lady's heart
The cold steel it did go.

A grave a grave Lord Barnard cries
To put these lovers in
But bury my lady on the upper hand
For she came from noble kin.

For I have slain the finest knight
That ever rode a steed
And I have slain the fairest lady
That ever did a woman's deed.

Cheers,
Alan


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Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves
From: Barry Finn
Date: 31 May 97 - 02:45 AM

Little Musgrave And The Lady Barnard (Child # 81) has been collected in Scotland, England, Canada & the US, as far as what I've seen it hasn't been in the Irish tradition and Child refused to collect the Irish ballads because he felt inadequate and tried in vain to encourage others to do so. The oldest English copy dates to 1658 although a stanza is quoted in Knight Of The Burning Pestle, 1611. In versions the Lady is butchered "He cut her paps fromoff her breast great pity it was to see that some drops of this ladie's heart's blood ran trickling down her knee" and some have her pregnant "I'm not sae wae for my lady for she lies cauld and dead but I'm right wae for my young son lies sprawling in her blood" and sometimes remorseful and blameless asking why someone didn't stay his hand when he slew the 'bravest fair knight' and the 'fairest lady'.


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Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves
From: GUEST,Cait
Date: 16 Sep 04 - 04:00 PM

I'm not sure if these are the Irish lyrics but it is an alternative way to sing it than the lyrics Alen gave you. Enjoy, Cait

A holiday, a holiday, and the first one of the year.
Lord Donald's wife came to the church, the gospel for to hear.
And when the meeting it was o'r she cast her eyes above
And there she saw Little Mattie Groves walking in the crowd.

Come home with me Little Mattie Groves come home with me tonight.
Come home with me Little Mattie Groves and sleep with me til light.

I can't come home an I wont come home and sleep with you tonight.
By the rings on your fingers, I can tell, you are Lord Donald's wife.

And what if I am Lord Donald's wife an' Lord Donald's not at home.
He is now in the far corn fields bringing the yearlings home.

And the servent who was standing by, hearing what was said
He swore Lord Donald, he would know before the sun would set.
And in his haste to carry the news he clenched his fists and ran
And when he came to the broad mill stream he took off his shoes and swam.

Little Mattie Groves he lay down and took a little sleep
And when he awoke Lord Donald was standing at his feet.
Sayin 'how do you like my feather bed and how do you like my sheets?
And how do you like my lady fair who lies in your arms asleep?'
'Oh, well I like your feather bed and well I like your sheets,
But better I like your lady gay who lies in my arms asleep.'

'Get up get up' Lord Donald cried, 'get up as quick as you can.
It'll never be said in fair England that I slew a naked man.'

'Oh I can't get up, I won't get up, I can't get up for my life.
For you have 2 long beaten swords and I've a pocket knife.'

'But it's true I have to beaten swords and they cost me deep in the purse.
But you will have the better of them and I shall have the worse.
And you shall strike the very first blow and strike it like a man.
And I shall strike the very next blow and I'll kill you if I can.'
        
Well Mattie struck the very first blow and he hurt Lord Donald sore.
Lord Donald struck the very next blow and Mattie struck no more.
And then Lord Donald took his wife and he sat her on his knee, saying
'Who do you \like the better of us Mattie Groves or me?'

And then spoke his own dear wife, never did she speak so free.
'I'd rather a kiss form dead m's lips than you in your finery.'

And then Lord Donald he jumped up and down she did fall.
And he struck his wife right through the heart and pinned her against the wall.
'A grave, a grave' Lord Donald cried, 'to put these lovers in.
And one for me for I shall hang, paying for this mortal sin.'

A holiday a holiday and the last one of his life.
Little Mattie Groves went to the church where he met Lord Donald's wife.


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Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves
From: pavane
Date: 17 Sep 04 - 02:36 AM

DOn't know if you are interested in seeing a 17th century print of the song at the Bodleian Library

A lamentable ballad of Little Musgrove and the Lady Barnet

Interesting that it is Musgrove, (like Matty Groves) not Musgrave


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