Subject: Irish Mattie Groves From: turtles@io.com Date: 28 May 97 - 07:52 PM hey i've been told that there is an irish version of mattie groves. if anyone can give me the title, or better yet, lyrics, i'd be much obliged. thanks! jen turtles@io.com |
Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves From: Martin Ryan Date: 29 May 97 - 05:22 AM Christy Moore recorded a song called "Little Musgrave", which is essentially Mattie Groves. I'll check his comments on source later. Regards |
Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves From: Martin Ryan Date: 29 May 97 - 10:03 AM In "Christy Moore Songbook", he describes it as "made up from old versions plus verses I wrote myself, fitted to a tune from Nic Jones" I haven't the stamina to type it all in - nor a convenient scanner! Regards |
Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves From: LaMarca Date: 29 May 97 - 01:25 PM After singing my own mix of the Nic Jones and Christy Moore versions at a festival one year, Jerry Epstein asked where the tune was from; I said I learned it from Nic Jones, and he said it was the tune used by the American ballad-monger (mangler?) John Jacob Niles, who had the unfortunate habit of copywriting all his material, traditional or otherwise. I don't know if Niles' tune was trad. or not; but it would have probably been an American variant. I haven't bothered to go look up Niles' version to see if Jerry was correct; I love the tune, and whether it's English, Irish or American doesn't matter to me that much. Christy Moore's set of words are fairly close to one of the variants given in Child; he leaves out my favorite ending, where Lord Arnold/Darnell tells his men to
"Bury my lady at the top |
Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves From: Alan of Australia Date: 29 May 97 - 08:34 PM I also sing a mix of Nic Jones/Christy Moore/original Child text with the afore mentioned ending.. I still think that tune was written by Nic Jones or a trad tune modified by him. I'll check my record cover when I get home this evening. It's interesting that Child doesn't mention Matty Groves (which is an American version of Little Musgrave and Lady Barnard) among the versions he published. No sign of any Irish version though. Cheers, alan |
Subject: Lyr Add: LITTLE MUSGRAVE From: Alan of Australia Date: 29 May 97 - 08:43 PM Here are the words as I sing them:
LITTLE MUSGRAVE
It's four and twenty bonny boys
Sometimes he lost sometimes he won
And some were dressed in velvet red
She cast her eye on the Little Musgrave
I have loved you fair lady
I have a bower in Buckelsfordbery
But standing by was a little foot page
And my Lord Barnard shall hear of this
My Lord Barnard my Lord Barnard
If this be true my little foot page
But if this be a lie my little foot page
Go saddle me the black he said
But there was a man in Lord Barnard's train
Methinks I hear the morning cock
Lie still lie still my Little Musgrave
Is not your hawk upon its perch
So he turned him right and round about
How do you like my bed he said
'Tis well I like your bed he said
Rise up rise up my Little Musgrave
There are two long swords by my side
And the first stroke that Little Musgrave struck
Then up spoke the lady fair
How do you like his cheeks lady
It's well I like his cheeks she said
He's taken out his long long sword
A grave a grave Lord Barnard cries
For I have slain the finest knight
Cheers, |
Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves From: Barry Finn Date: 31 May 97 - 02:45 AM Little Musgrave And The Lady Barnard (Child # 81) has been collected in Scotland, England, Canada & the US, as far as what I've seen it hasn't been in the Irish tradition and Child refused to collect the Irish ballads because he felt inadequate and tried in vain to encourage others to do so. The oldest English copy dates to 1658 although a stanza is quoted in Knight Of The Burning Pestle, 1611. In versions the Lady is butchered "He cut her paps fromoff her breast great pity it was to see that some drops of this ladie's heart's blood ran trickling down her knee" and some have her pregnant "I'm not sae wae for my lady for she lies cauld and dead but I'm right wae for my young son lies sprawling in her blood" and sometimes remorseful and blameless asking why someone didn't stay his hand when he slew the 'bravest fair knight' and the 'fairest lady'. |
Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves From: GUEST,Cait Date: 16 Sep 04 - 04:00 PM I'm not sure if these are the Irish lyrics but it is an alternative way to sing it than the lyrics Alen gave you. Enjoy, Cait A holiday, a holiday, and the first one of the year. Lord Donald's wife came to the church, the gospel for to hear. And when the meeting it was o'r she cast her eyes above And there she saw Little Mattie Groves walking in the crowd. Come home with me Little Mattie Groves come home with me tonight. Come home with me Little Mattie Groves and sleep with me til light. I can't come home an I wont come home and sleep with you tonight. By the rings on your fingers, I can tell, you are Lord Donald's wife. And what if I am Lord Donald's wife an' Lord Donald's not at home. He is now in the far corn fields bringing the yearlings home. And the servent who was standing by, hearing what was said He swore Lord Donald, he would know before the sun would set. And in his haste to carry the news he clenched his fists and ran And when he came to the broad mill stream he took off his shoes and swam. Little Mattie Groves he lay down and took a little sleep And when he awoke Lord Donald was standing at his feet. Sayin 'how do you like my feather bed and how do you like my sheets? And how do you like my lady fair who lies in your arms asleep?' 'Oh, well I like your feather bed and well I like your sheets, But better I like your lady gay who lies in my arms asleep.' 'Get up get up' Lord Donald cried, 'get up as quick as you can. It'll never be said in fair England that I slew a naked man.' 'Oh I can't get up, I won't get up, I can't get up for my life. For you have 2 long beaten swords and I've a pocket knife.' 'But it's true I have to beaten swords and they cost me deep in the purse. But you will have the better of them and I shall have the worse. And you shall strike the very first blow and strike it like a man. And I shall strike the very next blow and I'll kill you if I can.' Well Mattie struck the very first blow and he hurt Lord Donald sore. Lord Donald struck the very next blow and Mattie struck no more. And then Lord Donald took his wife and he sat her on his knee, saying 'Who do you \like the better of us Mattie Groves or me?' And then spoke his own dear wife, never did she speak so free. 'I'd rather a kiss form dead m's lips than you in your finery.' And then Lord Donald he jumped up and down she did fall. And he struck his wife right through the heart and pinned her against the wall. 'A grave, a grave' Lord Donald cried, 'to put these lovers in. And one for me for I shall hang, paying for this mortal sin.' A holiday a holiday and the last one of his life. Little Mattie Groves went to the church where he met Lord Donald's wife. |
Subject: RE: Irish Mattie Groves From: pavane Date: 17 Sep 04 - 02:36 AM DOn't know if you are interested in seeing a 17th century print of the song at the Bodleian Library A lamentable ballad of Little Musgrove and the Lady Barnet Interesting that it is Musgrove, (like Matty Groves) not Musgrave |
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