More Shakespeare: Hamlet

Subject: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Peter T.
Date: 27 May 00 - 05:38 PM

The new Shakespeare film that has just come out, Hamlet, is surprisingly fine: the sort of thing that should be done to Shakespeare -- push it imaginatively. It updates the play to the year 2000 (the sort of thing that is usually done badly and I always hate) -- the Denmark Corporation and its troubles with the slacker son of the dead CEO. The film cuts the play to ribbons (a 4 and a half hour play down to less than 2 hours), and almost nobody in the film has the slightest idea how to speak Shakespeare's poetry -- but it still works -- just because there is some imagination at work. The translation into visual equivalents is particularly neat, and there are lots of nice visual jokes. The best thing is that the film captures the total ghostly weirdness of the play: its only flaw is that it refuses to push the ideas it is working with in about 50 other directions. It is certainly far better as a pure film than any of the other Hamlets.

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: JenEllen
Date: 27 May 00 - 05:51 PM

I was quite fond of the supporting cast in the Gibson one...although Bonham-Carter works a nerve at times..it was well enough.

I hadn't heard anything about this one. Cast? Company?

Until then, just sticking with Adam McNaughtan, Jen

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Peter T.
Date: 27 May 00 - 06:19 PM

Ethan Hawke is a sort of Kurt Cobain Hamlet; Kyle MacLachlan the corporate Claudius; Bill Murray as Polonius; Sam Shepherd as Hamlet pere. Nobody else well known. Nobody is a standout actor here: it is really not about acting -- it is a director's film. The Ophelia in this one is pretty dreary too -- but a great concept (she is like all my "artistic" young women students). I agree with you about Helena B-C - totally irritating (she has been lots better). Ophelia is pretty tough to carry off -- Jean Simmons was, well, Jean Simmons. Kate Winslet wasn't too bad in Branagh's film, I thought. The best thing about the Branagh film was Derek Jacobi's Claudius (what an incredible actor he is).

Best scene in a Shakespeare film ever. The candidates are:
The wooing scene in Branagh's Henry V - Emma Thompson and Ken.

The moor scene in Peter Brook's King Lear.

The masked ball in Zefferelli's Romeo and Juliet.

The temptation scenes in the BBC Othello between Anthony Hopkins and Bob Hoskins

Laurence Olivier's Richard III (pick a scene)

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Peter K (Fionn)
Date: 27 May 00 - 06:26 PM

I thought Nicol Williamson's Hamlet was about the best, but never found anyone to agree.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: GUEST,Bill H
Date: 27 May 00 - 07:03 PM

I have not seen the current film yet. Hamlet, of course, is always open to great interpretation---as is so much of Shakespeare's work.

In our era it may well be that Branagh is the best and most creative interpreter we have. His 4 hr plus Hamlet to me seems like the definitive version. His Henry V being the antiwar version---and the photography---amazing.

As to one writer's comments about Mel Gibson's Hamlet---quite presumptious to think that Shakespeare needed extra lines written (so it seemed like his) to explain the plot to the audience. I would relegate that version to same area where such classics as Heaven;s Gate, and, hopefully, John Travolta's newest epic from the writings of the Scientology founder go---there must be a delete button for bad films.

Bill H

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 May 00 - 07:09 PM

The Russian one was pretty good

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: JenEllen
Date: 27 May 00 - 07:21 PM

I did see the commercial for the '20th century' Romeo and Juliet, and it seemed too busy, I never bothered to watch it. I'll have to check out Hamlet.

As far as theatre goes, call it what you will, but I prefer the auditory. I'd rather sit in the back of the theatre with my eyes shut, and just listen to the story being played out. If the voices and emotion carry that far, I consider it a success.

Best of the best? All of those choices are simply wonderful...but for myself (sly grin) the absolute favorite scene? Olivier's Richard the Third. Was it scene three?

Richard's
'The curse my noble father laid on thee
When thou didst crown his warlike brows with paper...'

Poor Marge ;)

~Jen

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: sophocleese
Date: 27 May 00 - 08:08 PM

I fell in love with Laurence Olivier (like a million others have and will do)when I saw Richard III. I just saw Al Pacino's, Looking for Richard, which bored me. My favourite updating of Hamlet is Bob and Doug MacKenzie's movie, Strange Brew.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: JenEllen
Date: 27 May 00 - 08:58 PM

LOL soph....I'd kiss you if I didn't have puke breath...

~Elle

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: alison
Date: 27 May 00 - 09:16 PM

I was pleasantly surprised by Mel Gibson in Hamlet, although he'll never be a Branagh or and Olivier....

did anyone see the fairly recent "A Midsummer nights dream"... with Michelle Pfeiffer? Just wondering if it's worth getting out on video.... I love the play...

saw it done once in Belfast by the RSC, all the faeries were dressed as nughty school kids (like St Trinians).......

also saw it done here in Sydney in the Botanic gardens, we had to follow a faery carrying a blazing torch through the park in the dark to a little amphitheatre which they had transformed into fairyland..... wonderfully atmospheric, with faerys appearing out of bushes and trees, and Puck flying about on an aerial slide.....

slainte

alison

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 27 May 00 - 09:21 PM

As McGrath said, the Russian film was pretty good.  I remember particularly the "To be or not to be" soliloquy; not for the acting, but for the setting: beetling cliffs and a very serious sea.  See it if you get the chance!

Malcolm

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: bflat
Date: 27 May 00 - 09:29 PM

I do believe that anyone who attempts to give a performance or perhaps their interpetation to Shakespear's work wants to reach out to another individual and enrich their life by a single act. I do not critize any effort that may encouarage another to dig for himself the essense of the original writer's intenet. Sometimes we are spurned and sometimes we are encouraged. Let us each search for meaning without arbiters.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Chocolate Pi
Date: 27 May 00 - 09:33 PM

Throne of Blood : Toshiro Mifune as MacBeth
the ghost scenes in the Olivier Hamlet
for sheer scenery-chewing, the Liz Taylor Antonly and Cleopatra
Branagh's Midwinter's Tale; the play-within-the-play is the Hamlet to end all Hamlets; the guard comes out, says, "Who's there?" and shoots the audience with his laser gun. And then the bit about "Hamlet, cast off thy father's colored nightie ..."
we did a (IMSHO) great Pericles at my highschool last year.

Chocolate Pi

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: catspaw49
Date: 27 May 00 - 09:40 PM

Peter, thanks to you, I may actually watch this one. Normally, I can't take these things at all.

....anybody remember the screen credit years ago on some Shakespearean thing or another that said, "Additional Dialogue by Artie Schwartz" or something to that effect?

Spaw

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Mbo
Date: 27 May 00 - 09:54 PM

I've seen a lot of Hamlets in my time (including the German version with Maximillian Schell, and though I haven't seen the Oscar-Winning Olivier version, I'd have to say that MOST definately the best version is the BBC production. Sir Derek Jacobi is simply stunning as Hamlet...he acts so fluidly, it hardly seems like a Shakespeare play, and more like real life. Patrick Stewart is awesome as Claudius, he has the "damned smiling villian" part down pat, but he portrays him in a beautifully sympathetic way, it's hard to hate him. Eric Porter is the BEST Polonius I've ever seen--he is hilarious in his old man ramblings. My and my sister have this thing where we imitate the actors..."ahhh look to it my friend...!" Hmm..doesn't work without her voice saying it!

--Mbo

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: alison
Date: 27 May 00 - 09:55 PM

If you want to see something good..... check out "Rosencrantz and Guildernstern are dead"... brilliant and funny...

the whole "Hamlet" story as viewed through the eyes of these two characters

slainte

alison

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 27 May 00 - 10:03 PM

Absolutely.  I was lucky enough to see it at the Young Vic in 1970-ish, and it made all the difference to my understanding of the original play.

Malcolm

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Mbo
Date: 27 May 00 - 10:25 PM

Yep! That's a riot! Another play my sister and I just start doing scenes from, out of the blue, much to the confusion of others! "What's the first thing you remember? No good, it's gone..."

Last year, at my community college, we performed a dramatic reading of Hamlet. I played Hamlet. My sister said I was better than Branaugh, but nowhere close to Derek. Oh well, there's a goal to strive for! Won't see me in McGill's too soon!

--Mbo

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: JenEllen
Date: 27 May 00 - 11:08 PM

Yeah, alison, R&GAD, one of my all time favorites. Gary Oldman's baby-blues don't hurt anything either...

Mbo, my sis and I always prefered:
"You would think...that this would fall faster than this....
And you'd be absolutely right!"

*Bit of a creep here, it's apparently left my brain..
Which was the one with Branaugh, Thompson, Denzel Washington, Michael Keaton, Keanu Reeves???? I just remember being pleasantly suprised...*

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Mbo
Date: 27 May 00 - 11:16 PM

Elle, that was Much Ado About Nothing. Yet ANOTHER fav of my sister and I. BTW we're the Shakespeare fans in family, can you guess? Man, that folding-chair scene was a PWO! Also Michael Keaton as Dogberry "Your Honour, please note this man has just informed me that I am an ass..." Kenny's "Love's Labour's Lost" is coming out in a few weeks, both of us CAN'T WAIT!

--Mbo

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: sophocleese
Date: 27 May 00 - 11:26 PM

Alison, the fairly recent Midsummer's Nights Dream with Michelle Pfieffer also has Kevin Cline. Apparently he blows everyone else away. I haven't seen it but my dad loved it.

I also really liked Twelfth Night with Bonham-Carter and Imogen Stubbs.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: JenEllen
Date: 27 May 00 - 11:28 PM

Thanks Mbo...s'what I thought. And LLL is 'coming out'? Forgive the medialogically impaired, out WHERE? Theatre, video, television??? Thanks, Elle

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Mbo
Date: 27 May 00 - 11:32 PM

At the movies, Elle! It's gonna be great! I've heard good things about it already! Ask Peg, she knows!

--Mbo

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: JulieF
Date: 28 May 00 - 11:48 AM

An interesting production of A mid Summer's Night Dream was done the touring company Northern Broadsides. I saw at our local industrial museum in a big shed. One of the highlights were the faries clog dancing - it just seemed to be so right for the occasion.

Julie

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Peter T.
Date: 28 May 00 - 12:00 PM

Stay away from the film version of Rosencrantz and Guildenstern - one of the most boring movies ever made of one of the funniest plays. What they were thinking of, heaven knows. Slow, tedious, unfunny.

The recent Midsummer Night's Dream has Kevin Kline, and that is about it. The music is completely irrelevant Italian opera, with no relation to the play at all. Michelle Pfeiffer is dreary -- and I am a big fan of hers! It was really disappointing.

Derek Jacobi's Richard II is my favourite. Man, oh man. Haven't seen the Hamlet, must go to my library and get it out.

Love's Labour's Lost looks pretty scary: it is Ken Branagh trying to do a 30s musical. This is a very formal play -- a great deal of complex language in sonnet form. The snippet I saw with Alicia Silverstone (yes) was dreadful. I fear the worst.

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 28 May 00 - 12:25 PM

Personally, I'd like to see how Tom Bosely would do in my Play.

Eddie de Vere

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: MarkS
Date: 28 May 00 - 12:30 PM

Gibson did a great Hamlet, but the film cut too much of the dialogue and eliminated many characters entirely. A really great production would have been the Gibson cast in the Branagh production, but eliminating the tedious crowd scenes and reaction shots. Oh, and what in the world was Jack Lemmon doing in Hamlet? He came across like he did not know he was in a play!

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: GUEST,iCKLE dORRITT
Date: 28 May 00 - 03:56 PM

A few years ago I saw Much ado about nothing in the West end with Mark Rylance and Janet McTeer. It knocked Ken Brannagh's film version into a cocked hat -no wonder she got an Oscar nomination she is absolutely amazing. the audience were laughing outloud, which is not usual for Shakespeare .my own favourite play is King Lear followed by Richard Two.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: sophocleese
Date: 28 May 00 - 04:04 PM

I think the best part of Brannagh's Much Ado Nothing is the opening. That's great fun.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: TheOldMole
Date: 28 May 00 - 04:29 PM

Spaw...it was The Taming of the Shrew. By William Shakespeare...additional dialog by Sam Taylor.

This was the 1929 version, a very early talkie. The ad campaign: "All Talking! All Laughing!!!"

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 May 00 - 06:18 PM

For a potentially great Hamlet, see Richard Grant's soliloquy at the end of Withnail and I. (Closely modelled I believe on the late John Gielgud's rendering.)

I thought the recent film of Midsummer Night's Dream pretty good fun. Was Kevin Kline the one who played Bottom? I never know the names of these guys. Whoever he was, he was OK.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: MarkS
Date: 28 May 00 - 08:20 PM

Talk about the plays connecting with the audience. A few years ago the Pennsylvania Shakespeare festival did "The Taming of the Shrew". Whenever an actor mentioned the word "Pisa", the actors all leaned to one side. After about the second time, all of the audience members were leaning to one side whenever the word "Pisa" came up in the script. It may sound hokey, but it was magical!

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: JenEllen
Date: 28 May 00 - 11:19 PM

MarkS,
I was lucky enough to see a park performance of Midsummer Night's Dream with a three year old in attendance in the audience. Right up front, and running like a wild thing. In cases such as this, it usually gets pretty ugly pretty fast, but this child became enraptured with story. Even these seasoned performers were stifling giggles with this little girl pointing towards the stage and calling out "Wake up! He's behind the trrrreeee-eeee!" Lucky for all of us that Shakespeare lends himself to interpretation...
~Elle

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Chocolate Pi
Date: 29 May 00 - 12:17 AM

MarkS, they did that in the production of "Shrew" I saw a few years ago at the ART in Cambridge. Of course, it was an odd production in many ways; Kate and Petruchio in a boxing ring, a group of drug lords chasing the characters from the framing story ...
but on the topic of "Shrew," someone has to start quoting,
"Brush up your Shakespeare,
Start quoting him now ..."


Chocolate Pi (reading Frantz Fanon)

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Peter T.
Date: 29 May 00 - 10:07 AM

Girls today in society, dote on classical poetry,
So to win their hearts you must quote with ease,
Aescyhlus and Euripedes,
But the poet of them all
That will start 'em simply ravin'
Is the poet people call,
The Bard of Stratford on Avon....
All I can remember are:

"With the wife of the British Ambassada,
Drop a crack out of Troilus and Cressida
If your blonde won't respond when you flatter her,
Tell her what Tony told Cleopatterer,
If she says that your conduct is heinous
Kick her right in the Coriolanus!

Brush up your Shakespear, and they'll all kowtow!!

yours, Peter T.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: GUEST,poobah891
Date: 29 May 00 - 07:42 PM

Mark S suggests Gibson should have been cast in Branagh's version of Hamlet. That is about as good as having Jack Lemmon in the part he played in the film. I never did understand that. Talk about an actor looking uncomfortable and inept---yet a great actor in other areas.

As to leaning like the Tower of Pisa---well, I guess you had to be there. Sounds Hokey. Great for 4 yr olds I suppose.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 29 May 00 - 08:06 PM

I suppose I should mention the Ian McKellan "metal box" production of Hamlet -1971-ish- did anyone else see that?

Malcolm

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: darkriver
Date: 29 May 00 - 11:33 PM

'Spaw & TheOldMole--

The movie My Own Private Idaho was very, very, very, very, loosely based on Henry V--primarily where Hal throws off his wanton ways and becomes a serious kinglet (translated into contemporary corporate Seattle, if you can imagine such a thing). The end titles list "Additional Dialogue: William Shakespeare"--purdy cheeky thought I.

doug aka darkriver

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 30 May 00 - 12:25 AM

My favorite Shakepeare film moments

Al Pacino, explaining the meaning behind and then performing Richard III's opening speech "Now is the winter of our discontent made glorious summer by this sun of York.." Also great performances by Kevin Spacey and others, in Looking for Richard.

Kenneth Branagh exhorting his demoralized and outnumbered army to victory with the St Crispian's Day speech from Henry V.

The moment in the Kevin Kline Midsummer Night's Dream when the "rude mechanicals" are presenting their ridiculous version of Troilus and Cressida to the hysterically laughing nobles, and suddenly the actor portraying Thisbe transcends the material in the "asleep my love?" soliloquy, to move the jaded audience, and us, to tears.

Orson Welles intoning
" tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow
creeps in this petty pace
to the last syllable of recorded time..." over a swirling and chaotic cloud of mist, in his 1940s Macbeth.

Ben Kingsley as the Clown at the end of Twelfth Night strolling along the bleak Cornwall cliffs and singing
A great while ago the world begun
With hey, ho, the wind and the rain
But that's all one, our play is done,
And we'll strive to please you every day.

Say what you will about the actors or the particular films, these moments are pure magic.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: GUEST,Mrr-the-Trekkie
Date: 30 May 00 - 01:07 PM

Anyone see that thing on Klingon Shakespeare in the Park? People all gotten up in Klingon suits with weaponry and everything, talking about how Hamlet was better in the original Klingon, and then someone goes to do the soliloquy - starts To be or not to Be... and before he can continue another Klingon leaps out of the bushes behind him with brandishing a bathlet and shouting NOT TO BE! And the battle was joined.
I'm not sure, but they might be right, it MIGHT be better in the "original" Klingon!

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Margaret V
Date: 30 May 00 - 01:59 PM

I know "Pericles" isn't everyone's (anyone's?) favorite, but I saw an amazing production of it in London, 1983, directed by David Ultz at the Theatre Royal. Ultz's vision rooted out the text's dramatic interest and brought it to the surface, illuminating the critical themes of birth, death, and rebirth through great production choices in music, set, and the actors' delivery. Is it possible anyone else saw this? Chocolate Pi?

The same year I saw Sinead Cusack and Derek Jacobi in "Much Ado About Nothing." I'm sure that will always be the standard against which I'll measure all other productions of the play (haven't yet seen the Brannagh film. . .). They were brilliant!

Margaret

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Caitrin
Date: 30 May 00 - 07:55 PM

A favorite Shakespeare movie moment of mine is Mercutio's Queen Mab speech in the most recent Romeo and Juliet. I absolutely LOVE that interpretation of it...just the right edge of madness.
Peter, the wooing scene from Branagh's Henry V is one of my favorites, too.
I also especially like the Army kid's rendition of the St. Crispin's Day speech in Renaissance Man. Not exactly the same thing, but it's a wonderful moment!

We read R&G Are Dead in my English class this year...great! My friends and I go into the question game every now and then.

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: GUEST,Philippa
Date: 31 May 00 - 06:37 PM

all you need is a song. examples: Tom Joad by Woody Guthrie, Hamlet by A. McNaught

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: jayohjo
Date: 01 Jun 00 - 06:11 PM

R&G Are Dead is my most favourite play in the world ever..... just felt I should get that in (but Peter T, way back - absolutely right - the film murdered all the humour)

Linked to R&G, and the linking of texts with action off stage, a friend of mine is putting on a performance soon of 'Lear's Daughters' - written by a women's group, and based loosely on King Lear, and the relationships of all the women in the play - the daughters, the nurse, the two queens and the androgynous Fool who observes it all. It's top! Explores all sorts of complexities, and misogyny (or not? - depends how you view Shakespeare) (In fact, if anyone is in the West Yorkshire area, go see - this wasn't originally intended as a plug, but never mind - LBT Huddersfield, end of June)

No more plugs, promise. Jayohjo XX

Subject: RE: More Shakespeare: Hamlet
From: Mbo
Date: 01 Jun 00 - 06:18 PM

The Fool in King Lear is a riot! I saw King Lear with Ian Holm--superb performace, especially by David Burke! Our favorite! His birthday was May 25th, BTW!

--Mbo