Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Sep 21 - 09:09 PM

I've wondered if Boxing Glove is slang or a euphenism for a condom

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Jack Campin
Date: 24 Nov 13 - 10:53 AM

I think you should sell boxing gloves at gigs with your picture on (or perhaps Lena Bourne Fish's picture), complete with a tube of Vaseline (or perhaps rigging block grease to be authentic). And send a free one to Disgusted Listener for inspiring the idea.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: DebC
Date: 24 Nov 13 - 09:03 AM

I found the song in the Flanders Collection and the source singer was Lena Bourne Fish. I do love all the different explanations for the boxing glove line and we will never really know the true intent of the parodist's reason for including it.

Thanks for the discussion. Lively and informative.

Debra Cowan

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Nov 13 - 09:13 PM

I think that the "boxing glove" was selected to give a nonsensical pairing with "love," and no erotic thoughts were in the mind of the composer of those deathless verses.
I have the Scottish School songbook, and the song appears in other children's songbooks; I haven't checked for original author of the parody or the date.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Nov 13 - 03:04 PM

"Thanks, Jim"
You are welcome Debra - I wonder how your listener would have reacted to the delightful Golden Rivet legend - where young recruits were enticed to bend over by a story that one of the rivets placed low down near the ship's deck is made of pure gold; or the trick of getting a newby to hang half-in, half out of the ship's porthole by being told that the ship runs on wheels - "I cant see any Wheeeeeeeeeels!"
Or even being a youngster being invited to partake in slice of 'Navy Cake'.... - all common examples of nautical erotica.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: meself
Date: 23 Nov 13 - 02:35 PM

Well, I'm afraid I'm with the 'angry radio listener' insofar as the image of public schoolboys with or without boxing gloves, etc., adds nothing to my enjoyment of the song. But no doubt there's something wrong with me ....

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 23 Nov 13 - 02:34 PM

I wonder how far that boxing glove-masturbation connection spread and if the composer knew it.
New to me.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: DebC
Date: 23 Nov 13 - 11:55 AM

Thanks, Jim. I was confronted by a very angry radio listener a few years ago in which she said that I had taken a delightful children's song and with the story above had turned it into pornography. What a load of BS, IMO.

I am glad to know that the story as told to me by someone else might have some truth to it.

Debra Cowan

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 23 Nov 13 - 08:19 AM

The boxing glove was a long-standing (pun intended) motif of both sea and Army folklore, as a 'cure' for masturbation.
Along with 'the golden rivet' it was a well known sexual reference right up to the time I served my apprenticeship as an electrician for a ship-repair company on the Liverpool Docks in the 1950s/60s
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 22 Nov 13 - 09:32 PM

We sang the "Capital Ship" song when I was in grade school in the 1930s.

We used a phoney h'english h'accent. (Blow ye winds oy yo)

Boxing glove rhymes with love, boxer shorts don't.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,Hilary
Date: 22 Nov 13 - 03:34 PM

But who sang it when we were youngsters in the 50's? i want to find that recording.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Mooh
Date: 12 Mar 13 - 03:17 PM

More trivia.

Completely aside from everything, I didn't know I actually had the words for this. I was just going through some old songbooks of my Mum and Dad's and one fell open to the page with the lyrics for "A Capital Ship". They're given as alternate words to "Ten Thousand Miles Away". Key of D, 2/4 time, piano and solo vocal arrangement.

The book is The Scottish Students' Songbook, the introduction of which is dated 1891, the first preface is dated 1891, the second preface is undated but has to be after 1900 (by a reference made therein), in the back is a preface to the third edition dated 1892. Perhaps a little confusing. Anyway, there was a companion volume of British Songs published later. Publisher of both, Bayley & Ferguson, London and Glasgow. I suspect it came from Scotland with my grandparents, or was found here by them sometime after they arrived. The book would have been new then.

An aside to this aside, another book fell open to The Land Of The Leal, which I now remember fondly but wouldn't have much cared about when I was young. Mum used to play such things at the piano. I have a single memory of her crying at the piano, I think the music reminded her of her parents who died when she was young, an only child.

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Charley Noble
Date: 30 Oct 11 - 11:50 AM

Know that more thousands of us are eagerly awaiting the resolution of this thread.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 29 Oct 11 - 09:15 PM

I've always thought that Walloping Window Blind was a funny parody of 10,000 miles away.Loved it as a kid.Still like it.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,Allegra
Date: 29 Oct 11 - 12:03 PM

"I'm off to my love with a boxing glove 10000 miles away." This guy's a ring fighter, going from England to Australia to compete in the national boxing match and use the winning money to rescue and marry his girl, who was shipped By the British Government to Australia by the British Government -- where it sends its convicts. (see portion of lyrics below)   Boxing matches in Australia and Ireland are like hockey to Canadians -- the fans go nuts!

Oh, dark and dismal was the day,
When last I saw my Meg
She'd a Government band around each hand
And another one round her leg
And another one round her leg, my boys
As the big ship left the bay,
"Adieu," said she, "remember me,
Ten thousand miles away!"

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 21 Nov 10 - 03:17 PM

By sheer coincidence I bought a book for 50p today that had the song text in it. The book is dated 1928, published by The Co-operative Holiday Association. The cover says 'Summer Holidays in The Lake District, Programme, Songs &C'. No. 83 is 'A Capital Ship'. I have another edition from 1929 titled 'Summer Holidays at Whitby'. This has mostly the same songs with about 10 changed for similar songs from the likes of Lucy Broadwood's 'English County Songs'.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Crowhugger
Date: 20 Nov 10 - 02:07 PM

To all who revive this thread from time to time, a heartfelt "Thank you!" for the many memories it brings. As a child aged 10 yrs, 'A Capital Ship' was the first song I learned outside the realm of home that really tickled my fancy. When learning guitar at age 12 or 13 I delighted in making it my own to sing; at that stage of life most of my repertoire was learned from my mother, being shortly before I discovered records as a source of songs.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,Bill
Date: 20 Nov 10 - 01:11 PM

I used to think "boxing glove" was really "box & gloves" suggesting dressing up to see his love with gift in hand.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: LadyJean
Date: 02 Sep 10 - 12:16 AM

The author of Davy and the Goblin specialized in nonsense of the Alice in Wonderland type. As with Jabberwocky, sometimes it didn't make a great deal of sense. If you can find the book, Sindbad does explain some of the lyrics, though, as the Goblin explains, you can't believe a word he says.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Howard Jones
Date: 09 Jun 10 - 09:35 AM

I've always known the "government ship" version, never heard the "boxing glove" one. It strikes me as the sort of nonsense re-working which kids delight in, which has somehow stuck.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Jun 10 - 07:27 AM

Also, in that old songbook, the Chinese junk was "chubby and square", not "stubby and square" as in some other versions.

George

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Jun 10 - 10:25 PM

This song camne to my mind today, and I could not remember all the words, so I did a Web search in Google and found several versions. As children in the 1950s, my sister and I used to sing it from an old, old songbook my parents had at home. This book combined two of the verses to shorten the song:

"All nautical pride we laid aside
As we ran the vessel ashore
On the Gulliby Isles where the Pooh-Pooh smiles,
And the Rubbily Updugs roar.
We sat on the edge of a sandy ledge
And shot at the whistling bee-ee-ee,
While the cinnamon bats wore waterproof hats
As they dipped in the shining sea."

In this songbook version, the line about the captain's dining was, "Off toasted pigs and pickles and figs,
and gunnery bread each day."

And it was "rugbug bark" and the "rugbug tree" in the songbook we had. (Some of the versions of lyrics I saw today had "rugabug" or "rubabug".)

George

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: LadyJean
Date: 27 May 10 - 11:17 PM

It's Boxing Glove. I've known the song for half a century, since my mom read me "Davy and the Goblin", which is where it first appears. Davy is a sort of Alice In Wonderland story, where a boy goes on a "Believing voyage" and meets characters from fairy tales, including Little Red Riding Hood and her father, Robin Hood. When the goblin introduces him to Sindbad the Sailor, Sindbad sings "The Walloping Window Blind", one of several nonsense songs in the book. You will note that the party is off on the morning train, to cross the raging maine. Crossing the sea in a train would be more than a bit damp, and he is indeed, off to his love with a boxing glove then thousand miles away.
Julie Andrews sang it on the Muppet Show and punched a muppet each time she sang the chorus.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: DebC
Date: 27 May 10 - 05:00 PM

The folksinger mentioned by Guest, George above might have been me. I was told that at a folk club a few years ago after I sang the song. Whether this is true or not I have no idea, but it makes for funny stage banter.

Deb Cowan

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 27 May 10 - 03:18 PM

Hence the 'or not!' agreed

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 26 May 10 - 10:58 PM

Thanks, Steve. I thought there might be a few more rhymes, but I couldn't think of them.

As for turtledoves, I did put 'dove' in the list.

Visual rhymes aren't nearly as satisfactory, are they?

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 26 May 10 - 07:03 PM

Leeneia,
What about the good old faithful turtle dove?
Or if they're a bit shy you could always give 'em a shove.
Or under the stars above.

And then there's plenty of visual rhymes
cove, drove, move, stove, rove, hove, Hove, grove, Jove, prove, trove, wove, or not!

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 26 May 10 - 06:18 PM

I've heard the Admiral sing the boxing glove version for many years.

Kitty

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 26 May 10 - 06:09 PM

it is a sad thing about English, that there are so many songs about love and so few words that rhyme with it.

of
dove
glove

I'm afraid they have led to some pretty pathetic rhymes over the years. Even the talented Irving Berlin produced a weak one:

...a rubdown with a velvet glove.
There is nothing you can take
to relieve that pleasant ache.
you're not sick; you're just in love.

But what can we do about it? Nothing.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,George
Date: 26 May 10 - 05:42 PM

I heard a folk singer on the radio explain after she sang the song that boys in English Boarding schools had to wear boxing gloves to bed to stop them from masterbating. The song is about a young man dreaming about his love who is far away. So the lyrics about taking a train and crossing the raging seas to see her is in his dream.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 27 Oct 09 - 03:42 PM

I slipped a cog and called Geoghegan's "Ten Thousand Miles Away" a variant on Carryl's poem; the reverse is true.
Geoghegan died in 1889; an unattributed copy in the Bodleian Library is dated 1840-1866 (Harding B11(3763)), posted in thread 62524, linked at the top of this thread.

This song caught on with sailors and is included in Hugill's "Shanties from the Seven Seas."

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 27 Oct 09 - 01:42 PM

meself, as noted, the boxing glove chorus, first appeared in the children's magazine, St. Nicholas, in a revised version of Carryl's poem.
I also doubt that it was a mondegreen in this unattributed revision, just an attempt to make the poem more palatable to small children.

The music's composer is J. B. Geoghegan; it is the tune to his "Ten Thousand Miles Away" (lyrics in the DT ), another variation on Carryl's poem.

In his children's book, "Davy and the Goblin," Carryl did not give a title for his poem, but it was later called "The Walloping Window Blind" by some and "A Capital Ship" by others (the latter adding confusion between the original and the revision).

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,Jon Dudley
Date: 27 Oct 09 - 04:20 AM

This is also a favourite of dear old Bob Lewis. We always asked him to sing it at the extremely alcoholic singarounds at the White Horse Sutton and were convulsed with laughter at the ridiculous imagery every single time. The same with the late-lamented Ron Spicer with his "The goose and the gander walked over the green, the goose she went barefoot for fear of being seen" - he was never allowed home until he'd sung that one.

There was an ancient joke about a boxing glove and a pound of liver but I think it better not to venture into such waters. I'm sure it has no relevance to the song in question....

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: meself
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 10:49 PM

I would be surprised if "boxing glove" were a mondegreen. I can only imagine that it was deliberately contrived as a bit of nonsense befitting the rest of the nonsense of the song.

I agree that debate over the line is "futile" - but certainly not because it was a late addition, but rather because it is so obviously whimsical nonsense, and is meant to be taken as such.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: DebC
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 08:54 PM

I am sure that they relate in that they have traveled from person to person to person, with each person making changes along the way as folk songs usually do.

I got my version of "Walloping Window Blind" from Lena Borne Fish who sang that version for the Helen Hartness Flanders Collection. What is fascinating about this version is that there are two verses at the beginning of the song that are not in the poem. I suspect (and others as well that I have spoken with) that Mrs. Fish wrote the verses to explain how the ship got it's name.

When I perform this song, I always have a few older folks who recall the song from when they were children and most do remember the boxing glove line.

I have always suspected that the boxing glove line was some sort of mondegreen that might have occurred as the song evolved from "A Capitol Ship" to "Walloping Window Blind" with a bit of "Ten Thousand Miles Away" thrown in.

This is just my experience with the songs and what I found in doing some research in Flanders.

Deb Cowan

Subject: ADD: Ten Thousand Miles Away
From: Snuffy
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 08:17 PM

No boxing gloves or morning trains in the original song, only in the later parodies. Here's how I sing the vanilla convict version.

TEN THOUSAND MILES AWAY

Sing ho! for a bold and a gallant ship,
And a fast and favouring breeze,
A bully crew and skipper too,
To carry me o'er the seas;
To carry me o'er the seas, my boys,
To my true love far away,
For I'm taking a trip on a Government ship
Ten thousand miles away.

CHORUS: Then blow, ye winds hi-ho!
A-roving I will go.
I'll stay no more on England's shore
To hear the music play
I'm off on the morning tide
Across the ocean wide
I'm taking a trip on a Government ship
Ten thousand miles away.

Oh, dark and dismal was the day,
When last I saw my Meg
She'd a Government band around each hand
And another one round her leg
And another one round her leg, my boys
As the big ship left the bay,
"Adieu," said she, "remember me,
Ten thousand miles away!"

My true love she was beautiful,
My true love she was young,
Her eyes they shone like diamonds bright
And silvery was her tongue
And silvery was her tongue, my boys
But now she's far away
For she's taken a trip on a Government ship
Ten thousand miles away!

I wish I was a bosun bold
Or even a bombardier
I'd build me a boat and away I'd float
And straight for my true love steer;
And straight for my true love steer, my boys
Where the dancing dolphins play,
Where the whales and the sharks are having their larks
Ten thousand miles away.

Oh, the sun may shine through the London fog
And the Thames run fine and clear,
Or the ocean brine be turned to wine
If ever I forget my dear
If ever I forget my dear, my boys
Or the landlord's quarter-day
If ever I forget my own true love
Ten thousand miles away.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 06:12 PM

That odd 'boxing glove' chorus had an earlier form, in the song "Ten Thousand Miles Away," written and composed by J. B. Geoghegan.

Chorus-
So blow the winds, Heigh-ho,
A-roving I will go,
I'll stay no more on England's shore,
So let the music play!
I'll start by the morning train,
To cross the raging main,
For I'm on the move to my own true love,
Ten thousand miles away.

This song, with music, in Scottish Student's Song Book, 1896 edition. The music is that used for "A Capital Ship," in the same edition but printed without music.

I dont know how these songs relate to each other.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 05:02 PM

Leeniea is correct, the original poem by Carryl does not mention a boxing glove.
Written in 1884, his poem has no chorus, which is where the boxing glove appeared.

The song was printed in St. Nicholas magazine for children, with the boxing glove chorus, in the 1890s. The "Scottish Students' Song Book" of 1896 published this version, crediting St. Nicholas magazine but not citing an author.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: meself
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 03:55 PM

Not sure I understand your point - you found a version without a boxing glove, so that proves - what? and why?

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,TJ in San Diego
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 03:55 PM

Whatever is meant with the "boxing glove" reference, my five-year-old grandson roars with laughter when he hears the song, one I've done for 50 years or more.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,leeniea
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 02:59 PM

I googled this poem and found a version on Poemhunter.com which has nothing in it about a boxing glove.

The boxing glove line and all ensuing debate constitute a chimera. It's hard on all the guys who want to bring up masterbating, but there it is.

Meanwhile, unless somebody finds an old book with the poem in it, debate over various versions, either with or without a boxing glove, is probably futile.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: meself
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 02:50 PM

What ever made you think that?

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,geomancere
Date: 26 Oct 09 - 02:28 PM

I always thought this referred to the Boxer Rebellion in China in 1898. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxer_Rebellion.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,Grumbler
Date: 20 Aug 08 - 07:16 AM

My mother told me the 10,000 miles away referred to Australia. The boxing glove, just nonsense. How absurd to visit your love with a boxing glove. Think Waltzing Matilda. I do think the kangaroo reference to a shortage of women makes sense. Please tell me my sainted mother was not slyly teaching us about self abuse.
We had a different version about the captain--that "it oft appeared when the gale had cleared that he'd been in his bunk below." I couldn't remember the lead-in to this line, which is why I Googled it, but see no one else seems to have our version. As a child, I loved singing this around the piano with immediate family as well as uncles, aunts, and cousins. There were a number of other nonsense songs in the family's repertoire, some ancient, some not. Apparently, the family has been signing Ol' Crumbles since the days of Cromwell (Ol' Crumbles) and the old woman (the queen). Political satire, of course.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: GUEST,Gay Keep
Date: 22 May 08 - 01:19 AM

I've been singing this with our Sea Music group Dogwatch for 30 years and I'm always amazed at the number of people who request it by a variety of names. Skip Henderson here in the bay area recently recorded it on his CD Poet & Pirate Overtures. I have a book titled "Songs of Western Colleges" published in 1902 where the song is called "Blow Ye Winds High- Ho", it has 5 verses. Here is a link to the online book, http://www.archive.org/stream/songsofwesternco00tullrich

The first person to request this song(in about 1979) was a woman in her 80s who told us it was sung to her in the nursery around 1900. She was thrilled when we told her we knew it.

More recently I was emailed by a man who found our bands webpage searching for the lyrics and a recording of the song for his father who in his 90s. This song has legs! They always sang it when camping and traveling. My kids love to sing it too.

I've also seen it in 1930s Navy Song Books.

Glad to hear from this thread that others have recorded it and it still has plenty of fans to pass it on to future generations.

Gary Keep

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Gurney
Date: 22 May 08 - 12:23 AM

There have been conclusive demonstrations on this thread, Howard, your essay into linguistic analysis being one.

It seems obvious to me that you are completely on the wrong track (or tack, as this is a nautical theme) and that the gentleman's proffered piece of pugilistic equipment is merely an attempt to reduce the terrible effect of her knuckle butty, demonstrated last when he put the hard word on her.

Simple explanations are always best.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Howard Kaplan
Date: 21 May 08 - 11:06 PM

We need to apply some linguistic analysis here. If Boxing Day is the day after Christmas, then clearly a boxing glove is a day after glove. Allowing for the inevitable loss of punctuation in the oral tradition, this must be the notorious day-after glove, an ineffective precursor to the morning-after pill. That would seem to be a sensible thing to be taking on a visit to one's love, in the days before its ineffectiveness had been conclusively demonstrated.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Amos
Date: 21 May 08 - 10:51 PM

Oh, sorry. I thought there was some question about it... :>(



A

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: EBarnacle
Date: 21 May 08 - 10:05 PM

Amos, I'm preeeetty sure we all know that. Allow us our simple pleasures.

Subject: RE: Help: Capital Ship's 'boxing glove'?!?!
From: Amos
Date: 21 May 08 - 11:26 AM

The Walloping Window Blind is a nonsense song. The humorous implication that one must be prepared to defend oneself physically when reuniting with one's love is razor-sharp nonsense.


A