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Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords

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John Hardly 17 Mar 01 - 08:37 PM
GUEST,marty D 18 Mar 01 - 11:47 AM
GUEST,wannabeanurd 18 Mar 01 - 12:13 PM
Matt_R 18 Mar 01 - 12:29 PM
John Hardly 18 Mar 01 - 01:17 PM
reggie miles 19 Mar 01 - 09:25 AM
John Hardly 19 Mar 01 - 09:35 AM
John Hardly 19 Mar 01 - 09:40 AM
JedMarum 19 Mar 01 - 10:28 AM
GUEST,leeneia 19 Mar 01 - 10:30 AM
John Hardly 19 Mar 01 - 01:25 PM
Stonewall 19 Mar 01 - 11:44 PM
John Hardly 20 Mar 01 - 08:31 AM
JedMarum 20 Mar 01 - 09:10 AM
JedMarum 20 Mar 01 - 09:20 AM
John Hardly 20 Mar 01 - 01:14 PM
John Hardly 21 Mar 01 - 12:30 PM
JedMarum 21 Mar 01 - 12:46 PM
Whistle Stop 21 Mar 01 - 12:59 PM
John Hardly 21 Mar 01 - 06:20 PM
Whistle Stop 22 Mar 01 - 08:05 AM
JedMarum 22 Mar 01 - 08:38 AM
John Hardly 22 Mar 01 - 08:40 AM
Whistle Stop 22 Mar 01 - 09:00 AM
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Subject: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 17 Mar 01 - 08:37 PM

This place has taken on the feel of a real good guitar music site--'splainin' no-third chords, movable chords, altered tunings.

This is for those alternative voicings that give an unexpected sparkle to a tired old progression.

In the same way Mooh explained the omission of the third for a modal sound--instead of a C-G-F progression played straight, try 33X013-3X0033-133011 for a completely different feel, same progression,

Here's a cool one; for D-A-G...A..Bm-F#m-Em try it this way; X00770--007600-3X0203...002220..7X7770-2X2220-020033...

Just some things I learned as a fingerstyle player who's lately taken to strumming a bit.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: GUEST,marty D
Date: 18 Mar 01 - 11:47 AM

I used to (sort of) fingerpick, but thanks to the help of a few experienced Mudcatters I'm on the right track now. I may be opening a difficult can of worms, but I'm starting to get into flatpicking now. Didn't know what 'voicing' meant until now.

Martin


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: GUEST,wannabeanurd
Date: 18 Mar 01 - 12:13 PM

Okay I'm lost now. You've got X's and O's on the same chord description. I've been kind of pickin' for years and done some strummin' too but these hen scratchin's are still bogglin' me mind. Can you translate in more detail to the uninitiated? Let's start from the beginning, I have five fingers and six strings.
Oh pray continue por flavor.

Hmm, odd that it worked out that way, five fingers and six strings.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: Matt_R
Date: 18 Mar 01 - 12:29 PM

Yes, my good sir...a "0" means an open string, and an "X" means a string that isn't played, or dampened with the hand so it doesn't sound.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 18 Mar 01 - 01:17 PM

Thanks Matt!!!

When first faced with the numbering chords system it is easy to misunderstand the numbers as applying to the fingers used--IT DOESN'T.

The numbers signify the fret at which the 6 strings are stopped (top/low-E to bottom/high-E. For instance, the G that we have all come to know and love is indicated as 320003 and his brother the C chord is X32010.

In this manner you can determine the most comfortable or useful fingering to use.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: reggie miles
Date: 19 Mar 01 - 09:25 AM

Okay, I got it and am now on my way to nerdom. Yeehaa!


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 19 Mar 01 - 09:35 AM

Congrats reggie,

life will never be the same!

JH


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 19 Mar 01 - 09:40 AM

Here's another;

Used often by Ron Block;

Instead of the typical G-C-D (or D-C-G), substitute 3X0203 for the G, 332033 for the C, and change from X00213 to X00232 for the D.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: JedMarum
Date: 19 Mar 01 - 10:28 AM

I use alternate chord voicings frequently. Adding, subtracting notes even without changing the chord, to 'imply' movement. The most common ones I use are an addition D in the Gmaj chord; 332033 and an additional G for the Cmaj chord; 332013 (double up on the low G and C with your third finger) and sometimnes topping the Dmaj with an additional high A works nicely; X00235 (or thumb the low E at 2 for 200235).

There is also a wonderful Emaj alternative that I use sparingly; 022404. It's a little hard to reach this fingering - I usually use it when the chord progresion leads me into it gracefully, but it has a really full and intriguing sound. You can also add the top G# to the Emaj for interesting effect; 022104


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 19 Mar 01 - 10:30 AM

1. "'splainin'"? Is that anything like "spailpin"?

2. Alternate flat-picking with finger picking to avoid repetition injury to your hand/arm. Too much flat-picking is bad for you.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 19 Mar 01 - 01:25 PM

Jed,

I love those subs! I also like the way you described "movement" within the change--it IS a nice touch.

In addition I use 133011 instead of the usual F.

leeneia,

"Real Man" flatpickers don't GET injured. :-)


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: Stonewall
Date: 19 Mar 01 - 11:44 PM

I hope this thread stays busy. The chords are awesome. I just took a few of them and incorporated them into a very jazzy version of "what a friend." You folks have been a great help. Keep 'em comin!


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 20 Mar 01 - 08:31 AM

Alright Stonewall,

Sometimes x3x433 Is a good sub for C or Cmaj7, especially preceeding Am7 either X02010 or X05500.

Resolve F into C by 133211 to 3X3210 to 332010

JH


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: JedMarum
Date: 20 Mar 01 - 09:10 AM

John Hardly - I like that version of F too, but I think you actually change its name when you do that. I that playing the 3rd string open in an otherwise full F chord makes it an Fsus4 or sus-something. I could be wrong. We need a music theory expert to tell us ... but in truth I don't care what it's called; it sounds great and works well in place or in addition to the full F chord.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: JedMarum
Date: 20 Mar 01 - 09:20 AM

In fact, if this isn't too much thread creep ... there's a few of these kind of alternate chords (not just alternate voicings) that I use frequently. Even though they change the 'color' of the orignial chord, and its official name - they work well in conjunction with, or sometimes in place of the original chord.

Again, I use them to change the 'flavor' a bit, to imply movement in the chord progression, to lead into a chord change, etc. try these combinations:

standard A and 0022000 standrad C and 330010 standard F and 133011 standard D and X04230


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 20 Mar 01 - 01:14 PM

Jed,

No, you are absolutely right! It is I who am taking liberties by referring to these substitutions by the chords I substitute them for.

I also use that A sub in place of either A or when I'm to lazy to reach for the Am9 and I in the lower register.

Another one I like;

Here's the merry-go-round>> Bm-F#(m)-G-Em-A-D.
Here's a cool way off>> 2X233X-22122X-1X011X-01000X-X02030-X00232.

And yet another observation. Sometimes when you have the progression that goes from C-D7-G-C it's a good time to get "dim"-witted and go; 332010-201212-320000-332010.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 21 Mar 01 - 12:30 PM


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: JedMarum
Date: 21 Mar 01 - 12:46 PM

John - I couldn't make all of those work! I do sometimes use an open high E in a Bm, if I am finger picking .. it creates a rather haunting sound. XX4430


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 21 Mar 01 - 12:59 PM

It seems to me that a lot of what we're talking about in this thread comes down to substituting (sus)2 and (sus)4 chords for straight major or minor triads. It's one of the fun things about playing guitar -- you play a chord, lift up a finger and play it again, and go "ooh! I like that!" If you're inclined to figure out the "proper" chord name you can, which can then help you recognize and use the same tool in a different context. If you just want to play it without knowing what it is, you can do that too. Kind of like when the musical analysts talked about Lennon/McCartney's use of Aeolian cadences and such in their music, while John and Paul said "huh?"


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 21 Mar 01 - 06:20 PM

Hey Whistlestop,

Ignorance is bliss--and I got a pretty good buzz on! *BG* By the way, miss seeing you over at AG's Guitar Talk! If you happen to be in the general Chicago area there's going to be a pretty cool gathering of guitar players, about half pro/half amateur, and one of the editors of AG as well as the creator of the Fingerstyle Guitar site--show up if you can!

Jed, I tried 'em again and the longer one is one I use more fingerstyle..I had tried it out with the proper muting and it did work..I guess it helps with a melody in mind to slide it under.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 22 Mar 01 - 08:05 AM

Thanks JH -- I've spent a couple of months unconnected to the cyber-world. It's been good for my head, but I guess I'm emerging from my self-imposed electronic exile, and in fact I just visited the AG site yesterday. I live in the Boston area, so Chicago is not part of my usual itenerary (in fact, I've never been there). I may be doing some traveling soon with my daughter, who is looking at colleges for next year; she hasn't applied to anything in your area, but one never knows. If I end up heading out that way, I'll see if I can make it to this event.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: JedMarum
Date: 22 Mar 01 - 08:38 AM

Where in Boston?? I am an ex-pat from Boston area, now living in Texas. I used to live in Southboro with my wife and kids. I grew up in Canton ... played all the clubs in the Central MA area, and a few in Boston.


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: John Hardly
Date: 22 Mar 01 - 08:40 AM

WhistleStop,

You might want to check out--they are having a gathering in Boston too. It's going to be in June and it's at the "Pig's Eye" or "In A Pig's Eye". Looks like they have about a dozen players coming and Bill Tippin (of Tippin Guitars fame).


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Subject: RE: Nurds-Other Voicings, Other Chords
From: Whistle Stop
Date: 22 Mar 01 - 09:00 AM

Hey Jed -- I currently live in Holliston, which isn't far from Southboro, but I've bounced around the state quite a bit over the years. We've probably played in some of the same clubs, in Central Mass. and/or Boston. Did a lot of gigging with rock'n'roll bands back in the 1980's; at one time I had a regular once-a-week gig going at Copperfields (next to Fenway Park), and I played Harpers Ferry, the Winery, various other places in town. Central Mass. was my stomping grounds back in the early 1980's -- classic r'r mixed with country/western in lots of little watering holes in off-the-beaten-track towns. Still gig around the area about 3-4 times a month, mostly south and west of Boston, from the south shore out to Worcester (try to keep those 3:00 a.m. drives manageable, you know).

JH, thanks for the info about the June gathering -- sounds like it's worth checking out.


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