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Help: Mistery chords

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dorareever 23 Aug 02 - 03:40 PM
Clinton Hammond 23 Aug 02 - 03:55 PM
C-flat 23 Aug 02 - 06:26 PM
Genie 23 Aug 02 - 08:12 PM
dorareever 24 Aug 02 - 10:16 AM
Mudlark 24 Aug 02 - 12:53 PM
Mark Clark 24 Aug 02 - 12:56 PM
GUEST,Fred Miller 24 Aug 02 - 06:41 PM
Clinton Hammond 24 Aug 02 - 07:21 PM
Mark Clark 25 Aug 02 - 03:05 AM
Clinton Hammond 25 Aug 02 - 10:57 AM
dorareever 25 Aug 02 - 01:23 PM
Helen 31 Jul 03 - 07:37 PM
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Subject: Mistery chords
From: dorareever
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 03:40 PM

I have always been a guitar idiot savant.More idiot than savant,really.My total inabilty to play a barré (don't tell me I just need practice...I practiced and practiced...I can't.It would be easier for me to sing in a deep bass voice while walking on my hands :))prevents me from being a good guitar player I guess...I have always been happy to stick to my 12 chords or little more.There's so much you can do with 12 chords.But...I don't want to limit myself if ain't physical inability that stops me,so lately I started to play different chords,that sound very well but I don't know how to call 'em.Maybe for you is all very simple and known,but I'm ignorant and need some advice. I tell you how I put my hands..and maybe you can help me... 1)This one is easy,and it works like a Bm substitute,so maybe is some kind of B-ish chord.It's simply a Em chord with the middle finger moved down to the G string. 2)now...this sounds complicated...I put a capo to the 3rd fret,then do a C maj chord BUT with the index up to the G string

tnx in advance.


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 03:55 PM

Lemme show ya something...

A handy way of chord notation...

320003

That's a "G" chord...

022000

That's "Em"

000000

That's just an open strum... (I used to know what 'chord' that was, but I've forgotten)

So, from the top (Bass) strings down, use numbers to tell us where you're fretting the string...

and it works the same with a capo on... just count frets relative to the caop...

That make any sense at all???

,-)


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: C-flat
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 06:26 PM

The first chord is E7sus4 and the second is a slight variation of a D6. The correct(no such thing really) way to play it would be to include the note that your index finger is vacating when you shift across to the G string.
You might find this useful.


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: Genie
Date: 23 Aug 02 - 08:12 PM

C-flat, thanks so much for that link! Also for that notation system (why didn't I think of that?).

FWIW, here's another website that may help.

dorareever, re barre chords, I used to think the same way as you -- for over 30 years, in fact. I would force myself (after the first 20 years) to play (badly) an Fm or an occasional F# as barre chords, because some songs just had to have them and I didn't know how to do them any other way. Then in 1995 (?) I sliced off the tip of my left index finger (since I wanted more protein in my salad). After a day or two I was able to go back to playing, for gigs that didn't demand "fancy" chords or fingering, but only if I played such chords as C and G as barre chords.

Since that episode, I've become quite comfortable with playing simple barre chords (like the movable F and Fm chords and Bm chords) and actually prefer to use them in some songs instead of the "first position" chords. As the saying goes, "necessity is the mother of invention."

Genie


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: dorareever
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 10:16 AM

Thank you everybody! Mmm...slicing off my finger for playing barre doesn't sound appealing.My hands are so small already!! :)


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: Mudlark
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 12:53 PM

Dora...Thanks for posting this...I've been trying, practicing, etc. to play barre cords for 40 years with little success...I can sometimes manage a blurred Bm. (Amos showed me a good cheat on this...just slide an Am up two frets and avoid the high/low strings...works a treat for finger picking, especially for songs in which the Bm is followed by a real Am.) Anyway, glad to have some company in my barre chord misery!

And C-flat...thanks a lot for the link...looks very helpful.


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: Mark Clark
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 12:56 PM

Clinton,

0x000x is an E-7 (Em7) so doubling the E by playing 0x0000 would still make it an E-7. Dropping the normal B to an A to play 000000 might be called an inversion of an E-11 (Em11). The 9th is missing and the 11th isn't on top but I think E-11 is a valid name for the open strings played as a chord.

I actually use this in the E-7 form but I play it an octive higher as (12)x(12)(12)(12)x noting the bass E with the middle finger and catching the rest with a ring finger barre.

Of course, thanks to inversions, E-7 is also G6 and A would be the 9th so I guess the open strings could also be called G6-9 (G six-ninth).

      - Mark


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: GUEST,Fred Miller
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 06:41 PM

Took me a long time to get barre chords, and can't do them well too long on a guitar with tough action. But that Bm that Mudlark mentioned brings up another option--muting in barre positions. Depending on what you're doing you can use them different ways, but the idea is instead of holding the barre you simply mute, and hold down a triad or more. Be careful of harmonics in those 5, 7 positions. It can have a nice sound for some things.

People tell me I'm "almost" an idiot savant, all the time. If I've understood you about your capoed c-shape--do you mean the high-e-which-is-now-a-G string? That's the 4th, or more exactly, 11th you're holding down, adding to an Eb. Eb11? Or, do you mean the g-string which you are still calling the g-string though it's Bb? Then you are adding the maj 7th and the sixth. Others are more precise than I about names reflecting the sequence/order of the notes--Mark seems right on it--I think it might depend on how I sound it, and am a bit of a shirker--I think of it either as just as my cmin sus 2 but with the Eb bass instead of the C, or as the Eb maj7 with the 6th, depending on what I was using it for, or if I was even thinking about it.


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 24 Aug 02 - 07:21 PM

Ya... what Mark said...

LOL!!

Ya lost me after "Clinton," mate...

,-)


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: Mark Clark
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 03:05 AM

Oops, sorry Clinton, I thought I was being clear. You had said earlier that you couldn't remember what chord was formed by the open strings in standard tuning. My post was just aimed at deriving names for the chord.

First, I extended your chord notation from above by allowing for the possibility of unplayed strings. I used the letter x to indicate that the string isn't played. I'm accustomed to writing E-7 for E minor seventh but decided to include the Em7 notation as well to avoid confusion.

I started with a standard four-note Em7 chord (E,G,B,D) just as a begining reference indicating that the A and treble E aren't played. Then, to get to the name for all six open string played as a chord, I added back the treble E figuring “no harm no foul,” the name wouldn't change by having a second E note in the chord. To play the open fifth string, the normal B in an E chord drops down to A which is the fourth or eleventh note in the E major scale so I called the chord made by the open strings (000000) Em11.

Of course a G6 chord is a four note chord containg the notes G,B,D,E, the very same notes that you find in an Em7 chord, just used in a different context. So the last bit is just finding a name for the chord made by playing all six open strings starting from a G6 instead of an Em7.

Better?

      - Mark


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 10:57 AM

You obviously know a thing or 3 about music Mark...

Much much more than I do...

;-)


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: dorareever
Date: 25 Aug 02 - 01:23 PM

Fred,I tell you the single notes I play: Capo to the 3rd fret:

B/G/D These are notes as they would sound without a capo,anyway.

Maybe is a different way to do a "known" chord,but we tried to figure out what it could be using a keyboard and the names on the display were bordering on the completely crazy.So I guess it's better to see by myself,maybe using the sites they give me (thanks again!). Sure,I have to study a bit of teory,I think.


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Subject: RE: Help: Mistery chords
From: Helen
Date: 31 Jul 03 - 07:37 PM

Hi chord experts. We need some help over in another thread. Come on over and see what you can do, please.

Callin' Me Home Steve Miller - Chords

Helen


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