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BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'

Gurney 25 Apr 03 - 05:17 AM
katlaughing 24 Apr 03 - 03:48 PM
GUEST,pdc 24 Apr 03 - 03:35 PM
Amos 24 Apr 03 - 02:21 PM
GUEST,pdc 24 Apr 03 - 02:18 PM
katlaughing 23 Apr 03 - 04:30 PM
GUEST,Q 23 Apr 03 - 12:17 PM
Amos 23 Apr 03 - 11:34 AM
katlaughing 23 Apr 03 - 11:08 AM
GUEST,Q 19 Mar 03 - 08:57 PM
Amos 19 Mar 03 - 08:36 PM
McGrath of Harlow 19 Mar 03 - 05:47 PM
JennyO 19 Mar 03 - 10:29 AM
greg stephens 19 Mar 03 - 09:09 AM
Amos 19 Mar 03 - 08:13 AM
Nigel Parsons 19 Mar 03 - 06:07 AM
Amos 18 Mar 03 - 10:34 PM
GUEST,Q 18 Mar 03 - 10:06 PM
Amos 18 Mar 03 - 09:43 PM
GUEST,NightWing at Work 18 Mar 03 - 08:06 PM
McGrath of Harlow 18 Mar 03 - 05:57 PM
GUEST,Q 18 Mar 03 - 04:08 PM
Amos 18 Mar 03 - 04:06 PM
GUEST,joe 18 Mar 03 - 03:53 PM
David Ingerson 18 Mar 03 - 01:02 PM
Uncle_DaveO 17 Mar 03 - 12:14 PM
Uncle_DaveO 17 Mar 03 - 12:13 PM
Amos 16 Mar 03 - 09:25 PM
Michael 16 Mar 03 - 05:38 PM
Amos 14 Mar 03 - 10:25 PM
Amos 14 Mar 03 - 10:08 PM
Ebbie 14 Mar 03 - 09:11 PM
MartinRyan 14 Mar 03 - 05:36 PM
Deda 14 Mar 03 - 05:16 PM
clueless don 14 Mar 03 - 04:49 PM
Ebbie 14 Mar 03 - 01:07 PM
Amos 14 Mar 03 - 11:42 AM
Sooz 14 Mar 03 - 11:34 AM
Amos 14 Mar 03 - 09:20 AM
greg stephens 14 Mar 03 - 05:49 AM
GUEST,Sooz(away from home) 14 Mar 03 - 02:52 AM
GUEST,Q 11 Mar 03 - 09:58 PM
McGrath of Harlow 11 Mar 03 - 06:03 PM
Amos 11 Mar 03 - 03:02 PM
*daylia* 11 Mar 03 - 12:57 PM
Amos 11 Mar 03 - 12:29 PM
katlaughing 11 Mar 03 - 12:23 PM
Amos 11 Mar 03 - 12:20 PM
katlaughing 11 Mar 03 - 10:25 AM
Amos 11 Mar 03 - 09:10 AM

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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Gurney
Date: 25 Apr 03 - 05:17 AM

The man who first (or second, they won't say) summitted Everest could turn a phrase.
"Well, we knocked the bastard off!"
What Tensing said is not recorded.
At risk of thread creep, is it only in NZ here that they have started to pronounce an E between a W and N? Growen, sowen, clowen, and even lowen for lone.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: katlaughing
Date: 24 Apr 03 - 03:48 PM

Oh, pdc!!! That's BRILL! My dad will love it!

You'd probably like these old threads:

Colloquialims - Post 'Em & Define 'em!,

Colloquialisms II,

and, Colloquialisms III


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 24 Apr 03 - 03:35 PM

I'm sorry -- ban me if you want to, but I HAVE to do this here, as this thread is about language.

Tony Blair is visiting an Edinburgh hospital. He enters a ward full of patients with no obvious sign of injury or illness and greets one.

The patient replies: "Fair fa your honest sonsie face, Great chieftain o' the puddin race, Aboon them a you take your place, Painch, tripe or thairm, As langs my airm."

Blair is confused, so he just grins and moves on to the next patient.

The patient responds: "Some hae meat and canna eat, And some wad eat that want it, But we hae meat and we can eat, So let the Lord be thankit."

Even more confused, and his grin now rictus-like, the PM moves on to the next patient, who immediately begins to chant: "Wee sleekit, cowerin, timrous beasty, Thou needna start awa sae hastie, Wi bickering brattle."

Now seriously troubled, Blair turns to the accompanying doctor and asks "What kind of facility is this? A mental ward?"

"No", replies the doctor. "This is the serious Burns unit."


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 24 Apr 03 - 02:21 PM

That's a form of de-duction, isn't it?

There are several threads of Bushwah-isms on the backtrack, PDC -- just put Bush into the display filter and set it for a year and you'll see 'em.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 24 Apr 03 - 02:18 PM

This quote:

"Call me a pedant but medically what you describe is vasectomy because it is the vas deferens that is cut. Vas is a vessel (as in tube) and can be described as a duct"

really made a vas deferens in my life. Thank you!

Also -- why isn't anyone posting the Bushisms, like "don't misunderestimate me..."


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Apr 03 - 04:30 PM

To the tune of "Happy Wanderer"

I love to go a'versioning
To every pub I know,
And as I go, I love to sing,
Each version as it flows.

Cho: Val da ree, Val da rah
Val da ree, Val da rah ha ha ha ha ha
Val da ree, Val da rah
Each version as it flows.

etc.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 23 Apr 03 - 12:17 PM

Versioning- listing all the different versions of a folk song.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 23 Apr 03 - 11:34 AM

No -- "versioning" is a common parlance in software circles where it is very important to keep track of which version of many files are compiled into which version of a build. It's a whole professional subculture. It's shorthand for "tracking the versions of files". But the way he is using it in the quote above is quite impenetrable.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: katlaughing
Date: 23 Apr 03 - 11:08 AM

In last Sunday's paper, a Microsoft exec. talking about their move away from their use of "dot Net" as a product identifier (my emphasis):

"We have moved away from using .Net as a versioning moniker to indicate that a particular product is a .Net product, ...."

Did he make that up?


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 08:57 PM

I guess Nigel destaminated. Or mountained out.
Saw the pictures of the Opera House- the protester did a nice neat job! Undoubtedly readable on spy satellite photos.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 08:36 PM

How camp of you, Kevin!


A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 05:47 PM

Or possibly:

We're camping tonight, on the old tent ground...

The best new words always seem to turn out to be old words after all.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: JennyO
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 10:29 AM

My friend, Sandra in Sydney, often asks me if I am mudcatting tonight, and of course I usually say yes.

Yesterday, an anti-war protester managed to "summit" one of the sails of the Opera House and paint a bright red "no war" on it. Today, on the news, they showed a bunch of guys up there trying to wash it off - not very successfully. The reporter was heard to say that the protester "graffitied" the Opera House.

Jenny


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: greg stephens
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 09:09 AM

I haven't summitted recently, but I did bottom while driving over a sleeping policeman yesterday.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 08:13 AM

What? You peaked instead of summiting? I say, old top -- no peaking!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 19 Mar 03 - 06:07 AM

I'm glad Dave Ingerson put the mountaineering perspective. Last time I visited Snowdon I failed to summit it, I nearly reached the summit, but I had already utilised my reserves of stamina. Clearly I peaked too soon.

Nigel


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 10:34 PM

We're tenting tonight, on the old camp ground
Give us a song to cheer
Our weary hearts, a song of home
And those we love so dear....

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 10:06 PM

To task someone (put someone to a job) is 16th century or older (OED).
To task (to tax) is even older. Use of a word as both noun and verb seems to be a function of the English language, and part of reason that it is the most compehensive language on earth.
Sometimes the meaning changes. We eat beef or skin a beef, but we beef about things or we beef up our forces.

Was looking up the words to an old song today- "Tenting on the Old Camp Ground."


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 09:43 PM

I can show you how the verb "to mudcat" has a root which was, originally, Grick! Pass the Windex!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,NightWing at Work
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 08:06 PM

Surprised no one's hit this one yet.

Don't we all mudcat a lot?

BB,

NightWing


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 05:57 PM

If I were told I was to learn "circus skills" and it turned out just to mean juggling, I'd feel I'd been cheated. I'd expect it to cover tightrope-walking and fire-eating and if possible lion-tamimg. (Though these days that's probably banned.)

But "tasks" as a verb is hardly a new word - "He tasks me; he heaps me; I see in him outrageous strength, with an inscrutable malice sinewing it." (Moby Dick, Chapter 36.) I wouldn't scruple to use it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 04:08 PM

Bush, Blair, most recently summited with the Spanish and Portuguese in the Azores. This use appeared in the 1970s.
Dictionaries often miss usages by groups such as mountaineers, like summit (verb) in mountain-climbing. The Oxford English Dictionary doesn't have it either, but, along with the Webster's Collegiate, it does have the one about leaders summiting. The latter also has "summiteering."


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 04:06 PM

Well, since we are now in the age where Newspeak and Newhistory rule, let us propose that the verb "to summit" has an honorable etymology from an ancient Latin verb,summere, originally meaning to successfully wrestle something or someone to defeat.

The first person singular of which, oddly enough, was always spelled sumo.

Summamos, amigos!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,joe
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 03:53 PM

hmm. whom to summi; or su'mit to.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: David Ingerson
Date: 18 Mar 03 - 01:02 PM

I don't have time to read more than the first few posts right now so excuse me if this has already been mentioned. In the mountaineering community the use of "summit" as a verb is practically universal and it's my impression that it has been used that way for a long time. I resist the unnecessary verbifaction of nouns, but this one seemed apt and certainly more economical than saying "reached the summit". Besides, it distinguishes those who can claim to have "climbed the mountain" when they reached only the false summit or were not able to scale the final pinnicle from those who actually summited.

On the other hand, The American Heritage Dictionary, I was surprised to find, listed summit only as a noun.

Slán,

David


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 17 Mar 03 - 12:14 PM

"if the speaker refers"


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 17 Mar 03 - 12:13 PM

Ebbie said: Ah, but clueless don, you are indeed allowed to rephrase the statement! Just as one does as needed in a song or poem or an essay... Besides which, 'The letter 'a' occurs five times in the
word' is a better sentence.


As (not A's) a court reporter, I write down and later transcribe the language of live speakers, and they choose the sentence structure; my function is only to present their speech in the most readable form I can. And if refers to sets of plural A's, that's the appropriate way to do it. I don't have the luxury of recasting the sentence.

Dave Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 16 Mar 03 - 09:25 PM

"Go verb thyself, and the gerund you rode in on," she replied nounfully...


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Michael
Date: 16 Mar 03 - 05:38 PM

As in 'To verb a noun'


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 10:25 PM

Oh, and Deda thanks for all the good sibling. You give good sib!


A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 10:08 PM

I think the use of an apostrophe before the pluralizing "s" is acceptable usage where the resultant typogroaphy would otherwise be obscure or ambiguous (as in the example of the five A's).   The problem arises when those who do not care to assimilate the subtleties of the English rule set choose to abuse it instead, creating bastard plurals like monkey's. :>)

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 09:11 PM

Ah, but clueless don, you are indeed allowed to rephrase the statement! Just as one does as needed in a song or poem or an essay... Besides which, 'The letter 'a' occurs five times in the word' is a better sentence.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: MartinRyan
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 05:36 PM

All this talk of nouns reminds me: The Irish Times , which is the nearest we have to a decent newspaper, recently had an article on a gentleman whom they described as " the renouned author"!

Regards


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Deda
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 05:16 PM

Amos and I have been sibling all our lives. Well, all of mine, anyway.

Kinko's has a dreadful commercial which touts itself as "the new way to office." Blech.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: clueless don
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 04:49 PM

Susanl (posting 09 Mar 03 - 04:36 AM), you decried "apostrophes being used for plural when they only belong to the possessive (e.g. CD's for sale)." I mostly agree with you, but might there be exceptions? For example, suppose you had a word in which the lower-case letter "a" occurred five times. Which would be correct

There are five as in the word

There are five a's in the word

[And, no - for the purpose of this example, you are not allowed to change the construction and say "The letter 'a' occurs five times in the word."]


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 01:07 PM

Does anyone else cringe at the use of 'grow' the economy? Maybe I just never noticed it before. We don't say 'grow the garden', why do we want to grow the economy? I suppose it's not a new phrase but it seems I hear it all the time now.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 11:42 AM

To task and be tasked is pretty standardized jargon in the US Navy and Army circles. The slang for it is getting a "tasker". I don't know when this crept into usage -- they use the word task for any sort of assignment -- but at least they're cleaving to the Anglo-Saxon!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Sooz
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 11:34 AM

And another one - a colleague said to me "I've been tasked to pick something up on my way to the station". Double ouch for two new ones in one day!


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 09:20 AM

Perhaps they were worried the particpant was going to "meddle" with the event? I can't believe anyone would try to verb "medal". ;>)

So, what, you go through your life ribboning and medaling and prizing and certificating and diploming, and what does it get you? A second rate piece of ideational equipment, is what!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: greg stephens
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 05:49 AM

McGrath, I think I'm inclined to agree with you, "parenting" is more specific than "bringing up". But I'm not completely convinced. You're saying many people can be involved in "bringing up"(OK it does mean vomiting, but lots of things have two meanings, one of them unfortunate): but only one or two can be parents. I think there might be a grey area here. What happens if mum and dad day(or mum and mum in the lesbian case), and Auntie Edna takes the kids on. Is she then "parenting", or only bringing up or raising? And would this change if she formally adopted them? Anyway, I just find "parenting" unaesthetic, and I don't use. Especially in the context of "parenting skills". For much the same reason I'm happy to show a kid how to juggle but I dont run circus skills workshops. But I digress.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,Sooz(away from home)
Date: 14 Mar 03 - 02:52 AM

I've just heard a new one (at least to me) on the BBC breakfast news. Roger Black was speculating wheter or not Colin Jackson would "medal" in the indoor athletics. Ouch!


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: GUEST,Q
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 09:58 PM

Looking up meanings on ballad, the verb, to ballad (to write ballads), goes back to the 16th century. There is nothing in the English language that says a noun must stay a noun or a verb a verb. The dictionary is full of these shifts in usage.
Parent in verb form has been in use in North America for about 50 years in print.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 06:03 PM

True enough Greg, but you can be brought up by lots of other people who aren't your parents. Nurture is another word meaning the same thing, and a better one, I'd say.

But I can't actually see anyway in which a frozen metaphor like "brought up" - which after all sounds like what you do when you've eaten something unpleasant - is a better way of saying it than "parent". Language changes, and sometime the changes aren't for the worse.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 03:02 PM

I would think that raising a human being would be honored as the most meaningful and often difficult and tricky work that can be done. Offices and machines and documents are a piece of cake compared to a two-year-old!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: *daylia*
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 12:57 PM

Well I kinda like the word 'parenting'. It highlights the fact that being a parent/homemaker is a full-time and most strenuous activity, even if it doesn't result in a paycheck. As a (mostly) single parent of three, I used to find it so humiliating when people would ask "And do you work too?"

I've known so many people who produced offspring, but never developed the slightest interest in or ability to 'parent'.

I'm quite relieved that time has allowed me to shelve any residual resentments!

daylia


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 12:29 PM

Yeah -- but speaking of scrota, one thing I've learned about them is you always know what's in them, and where to find it....although gettingit out can be tricky.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: katlaughing
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 12:23 PM

Well..better an empty handbag than scrotum, eh?


also running and ducking for cover


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 12:20 PM

Well, I reckon they could take turns, mothering and fathering. Depends on which side of the divide you're promoting at the time. But, ya know, it's a good point, Kat. Maybe there is a Unisex verb in there, and if parenting is the best we can come up with, so be it, but I think I'd rather stick to "nurturing" or "larnin'" or "whuppin' up alongside the haid" depending on the kind of parenting being done.
Hate to lose all them refined meanings in one portmanteau -- it gets to be like a gal's handbag -- can't find anything even if you know its in there somewhere! :>) (ducks and runs off stage left, pursued by a stereotype,....).

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: katlaughing
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 10:25 AM

Amos, you're on a real early 20th C. roll these days! "Mothering" and "fathering?" With all of the different types of families we have these days? What of the lesbian couple who raise chidren together? Do we have to assign them such traditional titles? I don't think so. I suppose one could say they "mother" a child or "father" but to me it just sounds too trad.:-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Nouns as Verbs: 'to summit Everest'
From: Amos
Date: 11 Mar 03 - 09:10 AM

I parent, thou parentest, he/she parents, we parent, you parent, they parent --- nawww, it really doesn't fly as a verb. As a noun describing the activities of a parent, maybe. What's wrong with fathering and mothering, two verbs which have, at least, a little time under their belts? (And which were probably considered outrageous misuse of language when they started verbing around).

"What's this younger generation coming to" has been a popular indoor sport for two thousand years -- the earliest sample I have seen came from ancient Rome. By and large, I'd say, it is mostly Chicken Little eating sour grapes.

A


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