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capos

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breezy 08 May 04 - 11:21 AM
Mark Clark 08 May 04 - 12:34 PM
breezy 08 May 04 - 12:39 PM
Mark Clark 08 May 04 - 01:01 PM
Don Firth 08 May 04 - 01:08 PM
breezy 08 May 04 - 01:08 PM
Once Famous 08 May 04 - 01:12 PM
breezy 08 May 04 - 01:17 PM
Don Firth 08 May 04 - 01:33 PM
breezy 08 May 04 - 01:47 PM
Amos 08 May 04 - 01:59 PM
Herga Kitty 08 May 04 - 02:12 PM
Mooh 08 May 04 - 02:32 PM
McGrath of Harlow 08 May 04 - 02:34 PM
Strollin' Johnny 08 May 04 - 03:18 PM
mooman 08 May 04 - 03:37 PM
Mark Clark 08 May 04 - 04:37 PM
Richard Bridge 08 May 04 - 05:48 PM
catspaw49 08 May 04 - 06:02 PM
McGrath of Harlow 08 May 04 - 06:06 PM
GUEST,Proulx You 08 May 04 - 06:34 PM
McGrath of Harlow 08 May 04 - 07:02 PM
breezy 08 May 04 - 07:59 PM
breezy 09 May 04 - 03:47 AM
Richard Bridge 09 May 04 - 07:17 AM
Strollin' Johnny 09 May 04 - 01:47 PM
Spot 09 May 04 - 02:53 PM
Mark Clark 09 May 04 - 04:47 PM
Lanfranc 09 May 04 - 06:52 PM
breezy 09 May 04 - 07:00 PM
Once Famous 09 May 04 - 10:32 PM
Richard Bridge 10 May 04 - 03:26 AM
GUEST,GLoux 10 May 04 - 02:44 PM
McGrath of Harlow 10 May 04 - 03:46 PM
Strollin' Johnny 11 May 04 - 11:17 AM
Richard Bridge 11 May 04 - 08:31 PM
Cluin 11 May 04 - 11:58 PM
DonMeixner 12 May 04 - 12:42 AM
Strollin' Johnny 12 May 04 - 08:29 AM
McGrath of Harlow 12 May 04 - 09:11 AM
breezy 12 May 04 - 03:27 PM
McGrath of Harlow 12 May 04 - 04:11 PM
Strollin' Johnny 13 May 04 - 07:57 AM
breezy 13 May 04 - 08:06 AM
Strollin' Johnny 13 May 04 - 08:17 AM
dick greenhaus 13 May 04 - 01:56 PM
Cllr 13 May 04 - 02:10 PM
Mooh 13 May 04 - 11:58 PM
Cluin 14 May 04 - 12:22 AM
GUEST,spikeis 14 May 04 - 04:30 AM
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Subject: capos
From: breezy
Date: 08 May 04 - 11:21 AM

trying out the G 7 starting today £25 any one else had one or are they very new?

appears to allow space behind on higher frets thus easing accessability

also a Kyser

been using the shubb for 4/5 years

comment invited.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Mark Clark
Date: 08 May 04 - 12:34 PM

I just looked through all the capos listed at MusiciansFriend.com and could find no capo called a G 7. If it's a Kyser, I'd recommend against it. I think all Kyser capos are, as jOhn from Hull might say, rubbish. Kyser relys on the two main features that cause capos to be rubbish, one is a spring mechanism that doesn't let the player control the pressure on the strings and the other is any part that sticks out from the side of the neck restricting hand position. The Kyser capos have one other bad feature… they are really ugly.

My advice is stick with the Shubb or, if you really just have to have a new capo, buy something on the order of the John Pearse Ol' Reliable™. I think there are even smaller, lighter capos made on the order of this one—can't remember the company—but I think they are handmade and quite dear. Good though.

      - Mark


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 08 May 04 - 12:39 PM

perhaps this G7 is at the cutting edge so I just wonder if I'll be the 1st to try it.

you squeeze em on and theres a litle lever to release.

prtty nifty, I'll be interested in the longevity of the mechanicals.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Mark Clark
Date: 08 May 04 - 01:01 PM

Can you post a link to any image or disctiption of this G7 capo? It would help if I had some idea of what you're looking at.

      - Mark


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Don Firth
Date: 08 May 04 - 01:08 PM

No idea of what a G 7 capo is, but there are capos 'til hell won't have it HERE.

I've been using a Shubb lately, but my real favorite is probably one of the oldest style capos made, the çejilla (pronounced "suh-HEE-yuh," the first ones shown on this web site), made of wood, often ebony, with a small peg attached to a nylon string (usually a piece of old 3rd string). Put the body of the çejilla behind the fret of your choice, stick the peg in the hole on top, and wind it down as tight as you need it to be. Simple, neat, traditional. But they probably work well only on nylon-string (classic and flamenco) guitars. I was introduced to this kind of capo when I took some flamenco guitar lessons in 1962.

With the çejilla, it's a good idea to glue a strip of felt or leather to the bottom, with enough to wrap around the back of the guitar neck, otherwise, over a period of time, the string can mar the finish.

These days they're kind of expensive compared to other capos, but once you've seen one (where the holes are bored for attaching the string, for example), they're easy enough to make.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 08 May 04 - 01:08 PM

www.G7th.COM

will try it myself


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Once Famous
Date: 08 May 04 - 01:12 PM

contrary to what Mark Clark says, and as a musician for 40 years, the Kyser quick change capo is the finest I have ever used and the Shubb is actually double rubbish. It is the most reliable capo used and according to people I have talked to at Elderly Instruments, their largest seller and most popular.

It is definately made for quick changes,and has never been in my way.whether I am fingerpicking or doing a banjo killing bluegrass strum.

I own five vintage acoustic guitars which obviously includes Martins and Gibsbosn and there is Kyser quick change in beautiful black color in ach case, not to mention a banjo version in my banjo's case. That, and a Shubb 5th string capo get my banjo ready to play in any key as quick as possible.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 08 May 04 - 01:17 PM

well have you seen it yet?

Don, Martin be prepared.

I'll use it tonight and see if I agree with the luminaries listed on their web site


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Don Firth
Date: 08 May 04 - 01:33 PM

I've had no problems with the Shubb and most of the people I know use them. Dead simple, easy to use, small enough so it doesn't get in the way, and it works. After seeing a few Kysers on "Austin City Limits," I bought one, used it for awhile, and now it's laying in a desk drawer. I didn't like it. I can crack walnuts with my left hand, but I still found the spring on the Kyser so ridiculously strong that the idea that it's "quick-change" sort of goes out the window. Also, it makes the guitar neck look like its grown a set of antlers. If it works for MG, then good. But to others, I would say caveat emptor. Try one out before you buy it.

The G7th looks interesting. Compact and neat. Anyplace in the U.S. sell them?

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 08 May 04 - 01:47 PM

I found the shubb when used on the 7th fret or higher gets in the way where as this g7 does not, or is that because I use it upside down? Also you can scratch the back of the guitar neck with nails when raising the lever.

My guitar - Brook Tamar -has a thinish neck and the shubb cannot be tightened any more.

With the G7th you apply the pressure you require.

The Kyser is a good exercise for grip strength so is well worth having one to retain muscular strength in the wrist and can be moved with one hand, the G7th requires both hands for it to be moved.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Amos
Date: 08 May 04 - 01:59 PM

I've found the Kyser to be easy to move quickly. Occasionally some microtuning needs to be done.

This one looks aesthetic. Love to see it in action.

A

http://www.g7th.com/info.htm#


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 08 May 04 - 02:12 PM

Breezy

You could try emulating MCP and playing without a capo....

Kitty


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Mooh
Date: 08 May 04 - 02:32 PM

We've discussed capos here much too much, but I'm addicted and can't stop.

Haven't tried the G7 but noticed it advertised somewhere. Been a loyal Shubb user for years and only use the horrendously non-adjustable Kysers for partial capoing virtual tuning stuff cause they're easy to cut up.

Visited a (new to me) suppier this morning and he showed me a web presence for the new Dan Crary capo. Looks like a deluxe Paige/Pearse/Golden Gate/Elliot sort of thing. Not cheap. There are a few high end capos in the bluegrass community.

Mooh.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 May 04 - 02:34 PM

Well, I find myself agreeing with Martin Gibson for once!

Kysers are fine for me - they are the only capo I've come across where you can easily and quickly move them around in the middle of a tune without putting yourself out of tune. (And the reason that is handy is, when you're in a session set, and there's too many guitarists playing in the same space, capoing up can be a good idea.)

As for the "part that sticks out from the side of the neck restricting hand position", changing the capo round can normally solve that one.

But that G7 looks pretty. Tell us how well it works, breezy. But £25! Maybe the price will come down...


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 08 May 04 - 03:18 PM

Never seen one, let alone tried one, but I see from the website that Noel Sheehan's involved with the design and manufacturing company. Noel runs an excellent musical instrument and equipment business in Leicester and organises Guitar Avalon, and because of his expertise I'm inclined to believe the capo will be a good piece of kit.

I've been a Shubb devotee for years but I'm tempted to splash out a few drinking vouchers and try one.

Let us know how it goes Breezy?

Johnny :0)


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Subject: RE: capos
From: mooman
Date: 08 May 04 - 03:37 PM

I'm not keen on the Kyser or spring loaded Dunlop as the springs are rather stiff and allow no adjustment of pressure on the strings, sometimes putting the tuning out. I do, however, use the latter if accompanying Irish music in DADGAD for quick key changes. I haven't seen or tried the G7 yet.

My favourites are the Victor capo (now distributed by Dunlop) which I use on my resonator and jazz guitars and the Bird of Paradise capo which I use on my Lakewood (primarily fingerstyle) which has a custom wide fretboard. I also like the Paige design and use one of these on my octave mandolin. All the above are precisely adjustable to give any desired string pressure. The BoP also works very well on my classical.

Hope this is of some use.

Peace

moo


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Mark Clark
Date: 08 May 04 - 04:37 PM

Don, I liked the çejilla. I actually made one of those many years ago when I owned a quality flemenco guitar1 and wanted to have an authentic capo to go with it. I liked it very much though I never made one for a steel stringed instrument. I figured it wouldn't be strong enough. I also liked the Sterner Eccentric Capo at the bottom of the page you linked. This one looks like a real improvement. I can understand Martin Gibson liking the Kyser, they look flashy and since he's only been a musician for 40 years, he probably lacks the experience needed to percieve its many flaws. <g>

The G7 capo actually looks pretty interesting. It's pretty small and the pressure can be controled. It might be worth a try. I'll be interested in breezy's impression after using it for a while.

The Dan Crary model that Mooh referenced looks nice too. I'm not sure I'd go the $65 USD for it but one never knows.

      - Mark

__________________
1. About the same time you were taking flemenco guitar lessons.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 08 May 04 - 05:48 PM

I look forward to hearing of real experiences: I find it hard to conceive that it can really have zero backlash, and the slightest backlash is going to make it ineffective.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: catspaw49
Date: 08 May 04 - 06:02 PM

I dunno' why I opened this one, but I'm glad I did! This is the first interesting and new capo thread we've had in a coon's age!!!!!

Hey mooman......I like the Bird as well except it tends to get in the way of my poor left hand position for some reason. If I was better, maybe it wouldn't!!! It shouldn't when you look at it, but it seems to for me. The thing works really well though on a wide variety of necks.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: capos
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 May 04 - 06:06 PM

"backlash" - a new term for me in this context. Does it mean putting it out of tune, Richard?


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Subject: RE: capos
From: GUEST,Proulx You
Date: 08 May 04 - 06:34 PM

This is the best one I've ever used.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 08 May 04 - 07:02 PM

But you couldn't move it around during a tune, I'd say.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 08 May 04 - 07:59 PM

it works very well.

its consigned the shubb to retirement for now

the G7 holds down all the strings equally especially the top and bottom as the fret board is slighty curved and you the user determine the pressure.

didnt consider opening the kyser tonight.

longevity is the next question as early shubbs fell apart as the rivets gave way and the arms went out of line and the screw rubber on one went walkies.My recent shubb has stood upwell but is too short and does not allow for the fret -board curve.


can capo on the 9th fret and play comfortably and as I tune this Brook model 4 frets high by using 009 - 45 guage strings I can play in a higher range and she sings sweetly sounding more like a mandolin.

this is also much aided by fred kelly speed picks and nickel silver finger picks shaped for clean bright picking.

Go for it Strollin man


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 09 May 04 - 03:47 AM

the Elliot looks efficient,though I would prefer a flat head nut to tighten it into position, round nuts are difficult to turn.
As they are individually hand/machine crafted they are of course fairly expensive.
Design wise is traditional
Wouldnt mind one but I think it not as practical to use as the G7th


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 May 04 - 07:17 AM

"backlash" is the freedom of movement in a mechanism. In this case, you squeeze the capo on, and because nothing ever fits perfectly, when you let go, the capo relaxes its grip just a little bit. COmpare it to a handbrake on a car if you like (yes, I know the mechanisms are different).

I quite like the Kyser pro-am (the cheap one) which does need two hands, but you squeeze it on, and then tighten up the thumbscrew just enough to hold it there (which also takes out the backlash).


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 09 May 04 - 01:47 PM

I'll give it a go Breezy, won't cost any more than a week's fags would if I was a smoker!

I find my Shubbs knock the 1st and 6th out of tune on both my Martin and my Lowden no matter what tension I set the screw at (the Lowden's the worse of the two). Hopefully the G7th will solve that, and I won't need to use two capos when I'm using both guitars.

Johnny :0)


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Spot
Date: 09 May 04 - 02:53 PM

Hello everybody...had G7 capo for a couple of weeks now...I cant fault it yet...!! Smooth, slick, precise, doesnt seem to alter intonation drastically...I reckon they 're pretty good..!!! Will come back if any probs....
Regards to all....Spot


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Mark Clark
Date: 09 May 04 - 04:47 PM

breezy, The round screw heads are actually better. As you point out, the flat ones give you more leverage but if you use the screw to apply tension on the capo, you'll wear it out pretty fast. Much better to apply the tension by pressing down with your picking hand and just use the screw to take up the slack. With the round screw head, you can easily take up the slack just by running a finger along it's knurled edge; much faster than turning a flat thumb screw one turn at a time.

      - Mark


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Lanfranc
Date: 09 May 04 - 06:52 PM

The G7 seems to have a lot in common with the Bird of Paradise that I have been using for a couple of years now, along with a couple of Shubbs.

I still haven't found anything better than a Heriba Capo for 12-strings.

I'll see if Breezy will let me borrow his G7 next time we meet!

La lutte continua!

Alan


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 09 May 04 - 07:00 PM

only if you you quit fagging it i.e. smoking


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Once Famous
Date: 09 May 04 - 10:32 PM

McGrath, it seems like more and more ARE finding that they agree with me on many things I post, or they get freaked out. No middle ground it seems.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 May 04 - 03:26 AM

Rick Fielding's customary explanations of why capos put guitars out of tune were correct. If MG is using his Kyers accordingly he will not have major tuning probs (whatever the "fine" guitars in point). It would be the same if he used Shubbs or anything else - so long as he followed Fielding rules. I find this to be true on two Hagstroms, a Martin, and a Mugen (another name for Daion or Yamaki), as well as my camping guitar (a Morris) and nearly true for a Framus 12-string (but the pressure differentials between the strings in the octave pairs still has some effect). I have just introduced a friend to the physical truth (You canna change the laws of physics, Jim) and now he sees it to be true on his two Taylors. It worked on a Seagull and a Garrison we had through the house recently as well.

I have only ever had one capo break in use: it was a Kyser. The only troubles I have seen with Shubbs are suffered by people who overtighten them or turn the screw while the capo is on.

But I'd still like to try one of these G7s and see how it stood up to wear. Also, if (or once, as wear develops) there is any backlash, it will make the Fielding method much harder to use.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: GUEST,GLoux
Date: 10 May 04 - 02:44 PM

Did you know that there is a capo museum ?

-Greg


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Subject: RE: capos
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 May 04 - 03:46 PM

Rick Fielding's customary explanations of why capos put guitars out of tune were correct.

Give us a link please.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 11 May 04 - 11:17 AM

There was a long-ish post by Rick maybe a couple of years ago about the best way to capo-up. You Mudcat experts will probably find it easier than me. I do it the way Rick said and it does work.
Johnny :0)


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 11 May 04 - 08:31 PM

Hvae done some of the search.

Bored now: example

Subject: RE: Tuners Revisited
From: Rick Fielding - PM
Date: 08 Apr 01 - 04:36 PM

Hey Clinton, do you remember Bourne and MacLeod? When things got really noisy, MacLeod (the tiny Scottish piper and tough guy) would pull out a .45 (with blanks thank god) and shoot it off a couple of times. Geez, did it get quiet fast!
No need to tune after you put your capo on, if you simply place it right next to the fret. It won't stretch the strings that way. The best capos for keeping in perfect tune are Shubbs and Dunlop C clamps. Keysers are the simplest to use, but because you can't adjust the tension, are a bit iffy for keepiing the guitar in tune. Another trick that is INCREDIBLY useful (if you care about perfect tuning) is to cut two tiny "V" shapes in the rubber, under the two bass strings. This REALLY WORKS! I've been doing on capos for 12 strings for twenty five years, but it works great on Kaysers (if I keep spelling it differently eventually I'll get it right), and with the grooves, the capo doesn't have to be as close to the fret.

Rick


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Cluin
Date: 11 May 04 - 11:58 PM

Yep, RF was right on with his suggestion. (Damn, I miss him around here)

I use a Shubb for studio work because of the adjustment ability, but a Kyser most of the rest of the time because of the convenience. Most of the problems with throwing the guitar out of tune can be worked out with a good set-up; obviously a high action will compound things. I might have to tweak my low E and B strings a bit sometimes when they get a bit older, but it's no great hardship. When not in use, it's clamped on the headstock--where it helps with the sustain, don'tchaknow?   ;)   

I've never found the Kyser to get in the way at all and I quite like the looks of it. I had the spring blow in my first one after a few years, but I have 2 more and they are holding up well. They get a LOT of use, sometimes up to the 8th or 9th fret.

The Shubb is the one I use the few times I use a capo on my mandolin. Yeah, I do use one there sometimes, when the song is in Eb, or Ab or F#....


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Subject: RE: capos
From: DonMeixner
Date: 12 May 04 - 12:42 AM

I have this beautifully machined brass capo the works off a worm gear. It draws the strings in very smooth and even and it desn't knock any part of it out of tune. It is slow to use but very effective. My only big complaint is that it does get in the way of the left hand a tiny bit.

Don


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 12 May 04 - 08:29 AM

My shiny new G7th Capo arrived from Sheehan's this morning. I gave it a five-minute try at lunchtime on my Martin and my Lowden and it seems excellent on both. Time and lots of playing will be the final judge!
Johnny :0)


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Subject: RE: capos
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 May 04 - 09:11 AM

I find I've been doing it Rick's way already, so that explains why I don't seem to put the guitar out of tune. As for cutting the grooves in a Kyser - I've found that the grooves just happen naturally; you just have to break the capo in, by leaving it on the strings when you put the guitar away while it's new.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 12 May 04 - 03:27 PM

Last night did 2 sets and the G7th was O K.
Today I tried the G7th inverted for 3 hours and it was even more effective.

When used this way up it can also be manoeuvred with one hand.

I prefer it to the shubb already.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 12 May 04 - 04:11 PM

It's a silly name though - type "G7 + capo" into Google, a search engine, and you get over 200 results, all about G7 chords.

Type in G7th of course, and you get it first time. But I bet they'll lose a lot of sales they'd have otherwise got through that.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 13 May 04 - 07:57 AM

Tried my G7th last night and early opinion is that it's excellent. Simple to operate, not too bulky, ho huge ugly 'horns' sticking up making it look like an outsize bulldog clip, nothing to adjust, just squeeze it on to the strings. My only worry is that the mechanism may wear in time and make it difficult to get the right pressure, but that's something that only time will prove.
Johnny :0)


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Subject: RE: capos
From: breezy
Date: 13 May 04 - 08:06 AM

welcome to the club, I agree time will tell.

do you use it hinge on top or under, Ive gone over the top, as usual.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Strollin' Johnny
Date: 13 May 04 - 08:17 AM

Hinge on top. Other way up it gets in my way (same with the Shubb).


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Subject: RE: capos
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 13 May 04 - 01:56 PM

Just to toss a new hat into the ring, I like the Wilkerson capo. The late Jonathan Eberhard introduced me to it a dozen years or so ago, and I've liked it evers since. Lightweight (aluminum construction), narrow, one-hand operation, easily replaceable contact surface. And you can still get one for under nine bucks. For banjo and narrow(not classical) necked guitars.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Cllr
Date: 13 May 04 - 02:10 PM

I knew an artist who lost his just before a gig, it was terrible. He was completely in-capo-ble the entire evening. cllr


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Mooh
Date: 13 May 04 - 11:58 PM

There's a retired gentleman down the road who hand makes capos one by one in his garage and sells them in select shops around Canada. Charlie Johnson capos come in brass, aluminum, and in a couple of configurations. For a look-see, they are in the capo museum mentioned earlier in the thread.

Once in a while I'll use one he made special for me out of brass and aluminum which I swear sounds better than his other models on one of my guitars especially. Not as quick as my favoured Shubb, but for friendly support and solidarity with a good guy, there's nothing like using his capo! When we discovered each other in a music store, we couldn't help but be friends!

Peace, Mooh.


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Subject: RE: capos
From: Cluin
Date: 14 May 04 - 12:22 AM

So how do you pronounce it?

Most everybody I know says CAY-poh (long A), but I knew one guy, a former teacher, who called it a CAH-poh (short A).


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Subject: RE: capos
From: GUEST,spikeis
Date: 14 May 04 - 04:30 AM

should be pronounced with a short a, as its from the italian capotastro!


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