Lyr Req: Matty Groves

Subject: Matty Groves
From: GUEST,Shogie
Date: 24 Oct 01 - 04:47 PM

Does anyone have the words for Matty Groves. I looked in the database but all i could find was Fatty Groves!! I know Isla St.Clair sings it and the first verse is

Sing high sing low sing holiday its the best day of the year young matty groves to church has gone some holy words to hear.

Anyone know it?!?!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 24 Oct 01 - 04:52 PM

Try Mattie Groves

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: MMario
Date: 24 Oct 01 - 04:54 PM

Mattie Groves

also here

and here

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: pavane
Date: 25 Oct 01 - 03:25 AM

Shogie - have you heard Sandy Denny sing it? Well worth seeking out. It's on Fairport Convention's Liege & Lief.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Maryrrf
Date: 25 Oct 01 - 09:50 AM

Couldn't agree more about Sandy Denny on that Fairport Convention album. I had always heard (and sung) the Joan Baez version which I like but I recently heard Sandy Denny and was absolutely flabbergasted - it's great, genius, wonderful - I can't praise it enough. That has to be the definitive version of "Matty Groves"! Check it out!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Mrrzy
Date: 25 Oct 01 - 10:01 AM

Shep Ginandes did the ultimate version, to my mind, very close to the Joan Baez one. I never liked Doc Watson's version where HE seduces Lord Arling's wife instead of the other way around, it makes it more OK that he dies, somehow. Less tragic than if it was her idea. (Hmmm - wonder why that would be?)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: celticblues5
Date: 25 Oct 01 - 10:54 AM

You should also try to get your hands on Christy Moore's version, Little Musgrave, my personal favorite - very atmospheric. Maybe it's his glorious voice, but I like the version of the lyrics too.
I've never liked the versions where the lord of the manor cuts off his lady's head and "bounces it against the wall," which provokes an almost comic image rather than the intended. I feel the more powerful version is "He's taken out his long, long sword/to strike the mortal blow/through and through the lady's heart/the cold steel it did go."

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 25 Oct 01 - 11:07 AM

Christy learned "his" version from a Nic Jones record, but previous discussions have dealt with all that.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: pavane
Date: 25 Oct 01 - 12:36 PM

This song is interesting in that it shows some of the censorship which British songs underwent in migrating to the US. Where in the English version, he wouldn't have it said that he slew a naked man, in some US versions it is an unarmed man.

(It is well known that the language itself was 'puritanised', for example small birds in UK called tits, or titmice, became chickadees, cockroaches just roaches, and cockerels became roosters.)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 25 Oct 01 - 05:03 PM

Staff Folk (from Swinton) do a strange ending

Well thats the way this song's been sung since man came out of his tree
But Matty he's pissed off with it in this new century...

I'll let you figure out how it goes from there.

Or request it at Swinton on Saturday!

DtG

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: IanC
Date: 26 Oct 01 - 02:55 PM

Pavane

Not altogether. "Naked" in this context actually means unarmed. Just a case of the language being updated (though I'm sure there was originally the intended pun).

Cheers!
Ian

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: GUEST,Pete W.
Date: 26 Oct 01 - 04:06 PM

I always thought it was literally naked. After all, Mattie had just been caught in the arms of Lord Arlen's wife (or Lord Donald's - depending on which version). I'm sure some sing the line '...And I not a pocket knife' as a coy reference to no pockets, therefore no clothes.

Incidentally, if you can, listen out for Meet On The Ledge's version (brilliant folk-rock band based in the English Midlands) - it'll blow your socks off.

Pete W.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: IanC
Date: 26 Oct 01 - 04:25 PM

PeteW

The double meaning's probably important, but the pocket knife reference and the "let it never be said in fair England I slew a naked man" make it clear that it's the old English usage meaning "weaponless" which is intended here.

Cheers!
Ian

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: pavane
Date: 26 Oct 01 - 07:38 PM

Do they?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Fiolar
Date: 27 Oct 01 - 09:59 AM

I agree with the term "unarmed." Otherwise why would Lord Barnard offer the "best of" his two swords to Matty/Little Musgrave?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: GUEST,Pete W.
Date: 27 Oct 01 - 09:11 PM

'cos he was an honorable upper-class twit! And anyway, of course Mattie is unarmed if he's literally naked. Where would he hide his own sword?

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Joe_F
Date: 28 Oct 01 - 07:42 PM

For a thoroughly biased discussion of the motives of these characters, see "Manly Man Matty Groves" by Leslie Fish, in _The Incomplete Leslie Fish_.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Snuffy
Date: 28 Oct 01 - 07:58 PM

And for a discussion of who comes out of the story with any credit and who is a total reprobate see this thread Matty Groves - who's the 'baddy'?.

There's some great interpretations in this one - a classic thread.

WassaiL! V

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: DancingMom
Date: 28 Oct 01 - 09:54 PM

I love the Fairport Convention version.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: mkebenn
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 08:03 AM

While I like Denny's version, the live version F.C. recorded later had more power to my ears..Mike

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Noreen
Date: 29 Oct 01 - 07:14 PM

Thanks, Snuffy- the snivelling little page (called Gavin) always gets a hiss from the listeners when Catrin sings this. That was a fun thread. :0)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Matty Groves
From: Le Scaramouche
Date: 13 Jul 05 - 06:33 PM

I couldn't seem to find this discussed, but where did Fairport learn theirs from?
My apologies if this has been discussed before.