BS: Are all bigots male?

Subject: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 07:37 AM

Is bigotry a strictly male preserve?

Are there no female bigots?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 07:40 AM

Word Web gives:
BIGOT
A prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions differing from his own

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 07:53 AM

In this as in all things, the male embraces the female and vice versa.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: *daylia*
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 07:53 AM

Abraham bigot Isaac. Isaac bigot Jacob. And Jacob bigot quite the Shambles ....

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 07:58 AM

Was Thatcher a bloke then?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:00 AM

In this as in all things, the male embraces the female and vice versa.

Surely the definition could be -

A prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions differing from THEIR own?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: *daylia*
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:39 AM

A prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions differing from his own often fails to complete his own Shambling(s).

(Actually, Shambles, that last sentence fragment should read "Prejudiced people who are intolerant of any opinions ..." ANd regarding "In this as in all things, the male embraces the female and vice versa" -- only when he's earned it!)

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:46 AM

One who holds a creed or opinion in an obstinate narrow-minded way, and is innaccessible to all reason in respect of it

One sign of a bigot is an inability to recognize when the cap fits, so they can wear it.

Actually I've never come across "bigot" used as a specifically male-directed term. Bigots come in all sexes, colours and political and other orientations. The most uncomfortable are the ones who are lined up on your own side in a dispute, but make you wish they were on the other side.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:49 AM

yes

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:55 AM

Nope.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 09:03 AM

Frankly, Roger, your history here makes me wonder what point you are after proving, now, without telling us first how you plan to use our words in support of some position you advocate.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: MaineDog
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 09:12 AM

Yes. However, some females are "discerning"
MD

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 10:20 AM

"Are all bigots male?"

Not remotely

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: CarolC
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 10:45 AM

Yes. Female bigots are biguettes.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 10:49 AM

how would you know Liz? You're not bigotted enough to have a valid bigotted opinion on this subject.

whereas I am a male bigot and we men, we just understand these things instinctively. that's what makes us bigotted. anybody who disagrees is.... is just bigotted. and isn't that so typical of bloody men...? Thery're all bigotted.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: fat B****rd
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 10:56 AM

No, all bigots are definitely not male. In the real world (where I work)most of my workmates are bemused rather than disgusted by, for instance,gay partnership agreements whereas one female told me she hoped men who died from AIDS went "screaming in agony".
Another younger girl who definitely subscribes to a sort of 90s/60s lifestyle also subscribes to a "Send the buggers home" attitude to well, anybody not white and English.
Two examples, but the baddies are always more vehement and agressive than we Goodies.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Amos
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 11:06 AM

Look up Susu's posts, Roger.   

A

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 11:52 AM

what about animals..

my dog hated and attacked cats..



[though maybe I was partially to blame for brainwashing him
that all cats were evil and encouraging his snarling attacks.
but I was only 8 at the time;
so where did I get that prejudice from ????]


Btw..I'm not saying if I'm man or woman.. you'll can guess!

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Greg F.
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 11:54 AM

Are all Shambles fatuous idiots?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 11:55 AM

Bigots are a subset of the group known as assholes.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: alanabit
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 12:09 PM

We are all white, male and heterosexual. do we have the right to feel discriminated against because no one makes up jokes about us?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 12:14 PM

What's a "90s/60s lifestyle"?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 12:16 PM

.. and what if my dog had been a bitch ?

would that have made any significant difference
for the safety of the local cat population ???

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 12:44 PM

Shambles,

you have forgotten to add your pet link.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 12:52 PM

http://www.nobully.org.nz/advicek.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:18 PM

You know it is still possible to make a point and even to violently disagree with another's view - without making any personal comments about the poster you may disagree with or without conducting any public conversation about them. These are the sort of good manners that perhaps need a little more general encouragement online?

Online it is always possible to ignore anything you may not care for and to make no comment at all. This would not be thought of as bad manners and in this way other posters will have no choice but to respond in kind............

And for personal comments like 'me too' or 'well said' or 'bollocks' - that are of little or no public interest and only tend to ensure that there will be a public response in kind - members always have the option of PMs provided for very purpose of these personal exchanges.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:19 PM

Responses to bullying

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:24 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Proposal for members only posting of BS?
From: MBSLynne - PM
Date: 20 Feb 06 - 03:13 AM

I've always been impressed by the amount of stuff which is allowed to go uncensored. And I DO mean that in a complimentary way. As far as I've been aware since I've been on here (Initially as a Guest) Joe seems to have tried very hard to leave threads alone and let everyone express their opinions and have their say. It mostly seems to be the very unpleasant that have been deleted, and threads that have deteriorated into NOTHING but a slanging match. There's no benefit in them at all. While I deplore the activities of people who haven't the guts to say who they are when they post something nasty, or purposely stir trouble because they are anonymous, I can't see any way of getting rid of them other than making it Members only, and I don't think that would be a good move at all, for all the reasons quoted above.

As soon as you start to say.."Right, we'll censor this or that type of posting" you could easily start a landslide...like so many other things, where to draw the line becomes a problem.

We were taught at school the quote "I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:26 PM

What saves people from bigotry is when we learn to recognise the possibility that the people who disagree with us may have a point, and that they aren't just being pig-headed bullies when they express that point, and it's not the same as the point we've been trying to force them to agree to.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:28 PM

'"I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"'

I heard that when I was in school, too. Don't believe it for a minute. It's bullshit.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Big Mick
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:41 PM

No, Roger. You are confusing intolerance with bigotry. It is not a male thing, but you knew that when you set the bait in this thread. And intolerance is not always a bad thing, where bigotry is always bad, IMHO. For example: I am very intolerant of your manipulative, whiney, pathetic need to be abused and abusive. I am intolerant of your need to cry, piss and moan that you don't get the respect that you seem to think you deserve in spite of your penchant for disabusing anyone who doesn't agree with you. You give no respect, yet you demand it. In short, I am intolerant of you and wish you would seek counseling and leave this place. All of this does not make me a bigot. It makes me dislike you and all of your posts.

By the way, folks, I believe motor city mama lives in Florida if that helps you any.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:46 PM

How many people kayak?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Once Famous
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:51 PM

That was kind of mean, Big Mick.

What if someone wished the same on you?

But to your defense, there are some people here I feel the same way about. And as long as there is this dynmaic here, overall it will never really be a very nice place to be.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: kendall
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 01:55 PM

Florida, eh? well, well, well.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 02:02 PM

To answer the original question...

No.

And what Bruce said....regarding the old cliche "I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"

Total absolute bullshit. No one who ever said that ever really meant it, they were just putting on a show. People who disagree with you or me or anyone else about stuff usually aren't even willing to slightly inconvenience themselves to defend our right to say it. I know this from long experience. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: GUEST
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 02:05 PM

Well there ain't no more of a bigoted comment like the first one.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Don Firth
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 02:38 PM

In answer to the original question, two words:   Ann Coulter.

OY!!

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 02:39 PM

No, all bigots are not male, but all spigots are.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Big Mick
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 02:44 PM

And by the way, motor city mama, the Motor City is south of Eight Mile. I believe you spent your time in Ann Arbor, yes?

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: autolycus
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 02:58 PM

Roger was thrown ,in the quote that prompted his opener by the use of "his" when it would have been better to write "their" (as Roger gas already pointed out).

As Richard pointed out, "he" is oft used to mean "he or she"(or some synonymous variant). Lots of editors defend using "his"(etc) in that way, or defend using "hers" and so on, ostensibly to get round the need to write "he or she" ad nauseam.

Roger rightly points to "they" as a solution, the best ,IMHO. It works often enough to be the solution.


   As for the thread question, (blimey, took your time,mate,dinya?), I've heard lots of female bigots of the opposite sexual persuasion to my good self thru radio transmissions.

Who do we think brings up these male bigots? Generous, open-hearted, understanding, compassionate, even-handed, fearless, liberal-minded mothers?

It's possible.

Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 03:04 PM

The question as asked is nomothetic. The answer is of course, no, but the nature of the question requires a response. The question is too foolish to 'require' an answer (as Shambles is aware), but people tend to clarify questions of that nature and then answer the clarification. I wish I did drugs because I'd probably spend a few hours trying to make sense of this thread. But I don't so I won't.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Purple Foxx
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 03:17 PM

The phrase "I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the deat your right to say it." Is a bogus quote usually attributed to Voltaire (though it is a reasonable summary of some things he did say)
I have always preferred Sartre's "I hate people who respect their Executioners." & consider the 2 quotes incompatible.
My own observation & experience long since led me to the conclusion that no sex,gender,sexual orientation ,nationality, race or creed has a monopoly on bigotry.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 03:23 PM

Defending to the deat is another matter altogether... ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 03:24 PM

Depends on whose, IMO. The leaders of countries don't mind defending things 'to the death'. Seldom their deaths, though.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Purple Foxx
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 03:25 PM

Exactly so and apologies.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 03:25 PM

People who disagree with you or me or anyone else about stuff usually aren't even willing to slightly inconvenience themselves to defend our right to say it. I know this from long experience

The point surely, Little Hawk, isn't whether other people are like that towards us, but whether we are like that to other people.

I'd say myself there are some things noone has a right to say. Whether I disagree with them or not is completely irrelevant - in some cases I might not, but feel a duty to button my lip. But outside of that people do have every right to say what they like, and whether I disagree with them or not is completely irrelevant, and I'd do whatever I could to defend that right.

I'd also draw a distinction between what we say and how we say it.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Cluin
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 03:48 PM

Why do I get the feeling you rarely ask an honest question, Shambles?

If this is one, then I respectfully answer the title of the thread: "Of course f__king not!"

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 03:52 PM

Oh, agreed, agreed...

I am just making fun of what I consider a fatuous, overly dramatic, and greatly over-used cliche. I can't make out how anyone could say it without feeling like a bit of an ass in so doing...

I'll tell you what people are willing to defend to the death . Their loved ones, their homes, their lives, their pets (sometimes), their property, their homeland, and their culture (religious or otherwise).

I would wager that no one on this forum is willing to defend to the death my right to make a verbal statement on this forum. Not a friggin' chance! (grin) Nor would I expect such a dramatic stand on their part. I mean, gimme a break...really...

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 04:04 PM

Cyber death maybe. But then what the hell, ya know? We pick our hills to die on.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 04:18 PM

There have been plenty of people whom have been willing to put their lives on the line in struggles where freedom of expression has been a central issue, and many who have died as a result. Tiananman Square is just one example out of many.

But I agree that most times it gets thrown out the quote is just empty rhetoric. Rather like "Give me liberty or give me death".

Incidentally the quote isn't by Voltaire. It appears to have been made up 100 years ago this year by a writer called Evelyn Beatrice Hall, as a summary of how she saw his thinking.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: number 6
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 04:19 PM

"We pick our hills to die on." ... George Custer certainly did!

sIx

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Don Firth
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 04:54 PM

If you get killed fighting for a particular cause, you might just be the last one, and no one will be there to take your place. I believe in fighting like hell for what I believe, then if I find I'm losing, running like hell, and regrouping to give it another shot. "He who fights and runs away lives to fight another day." Or as Patton said, "No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."

If I'm under duress, I have no ethical problem at all about lying to or generally trying to deceive my oppressor. The only way to keep fighting is to stay alive.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 04:59 PM

Patton may have said that, but that doesn't make it true.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 05:24 PM

I love these threads. They are the comic relief each day anew. A week without Shambles' complaints is a dull week. The pompousness, the questions to which there is no clear answer (I'll never forget when I answered one of his questions with a single word, 'yes', and he had to ask back what I meant because he did not understand a simple response response to one of his own questions; my God, how have I laughed then!), the statements with a question mark, the presuppositional questions, the self help threads (like the one about bullying), the interruption of threads with nonsensical links or quotes,...

My only complaint is that on days with time pressure I have difficulties to find Shambles new haunt. Though the theme never varies he manages to word the titles so cleverly misleading that on some days I had the feeling that I must have missed his newest contributions.

On these days I wish that these threads were marked in (brown?) colour so I can find them easily or that all his contributions were transferred to the old

The Shambles whine about Mudcat thread.

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 06:00 PM

I disagree with what you say, but I will defend your right to say it until I experience moderate discomfort?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 06:04 PM

LOL! Now yer talkin', Bee-Dub. That I can almost believe.

Wolfgang, you have expressed my own thoughts about Shambles' strange contributions to daily humour on Mudcat perfecty. I look forward to his next thread, so I can get a few more good laughs. The trouble is, like you said, one can sometimes miss one of them, because the titles tend to be a bit mysterious.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 06:19 PM

Shambles has made some cogent points in the past to do with censorship (in the broader sense) and he's made some pertinent remarks about clones and their functions on the 'cat and as posters. He's as entitled to his say as anyone else, IMO.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 06:21 PM

Also, Shambles at least asks other for their side of things--something that doesn't always happen around here.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Cluin
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:11 PM

But always with a not-so-hidden agenda.

Then again, he's probably not so different than anyone else, in that respect.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: bobad
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:19 PM

"He's as entitled to his say as anyone else, IMO."

And his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Cluin
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:21 PM

I've tried reading his posts to see what he's disastisfied about (apart from the obvious) but I confess they often don't make sense to me.
I don't understand Shamblese. His sentences are like he's doubling back to throw you off the trail. You end up losing the will to live halfway through.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:21 PM

"I might even agree with what you say, but if you insist on saying it over and over and over, I will defend to the death my right to a bit of hush..."

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:26 PM

Frothfleckin halda bernidian sumatsowin.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:28 PM

"And his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say."

You can say that again.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: number 6
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:30 PM

"And his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say."

do you hear it now Peace.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:31 PM

WHAT?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: number 6
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:32 PM

"And his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say and his say. !!!!!!!!!!!"

did you hear that Peace?

sIx

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:33 PM

HaHaHa: That's TWICE you said that.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: number 6
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:34 PM

It's not that funny Peace.

It's not that funny Peace.

sIx

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:37 PM

What?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: number 6
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:38 PM

It's not that funny Peace.

It's not that funny Peace.

sIx

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: gnomad
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:41 PM

McGoH: too right, think I may get that one on a T-shirt.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 08:42 PM

HAHAHA: That's twice you said THAT, too.

This will have to be my last post for a while. I am the worst compulsive poster on the Mudcat. I have been told.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: GUEST,the ghost of Guest 11:52 AM 's cat hating ol
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 11:26 PM

woof !!!

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 11:28 PM

Aha! A canine bigot!

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: GUEST,Guest 11:52 AM 's cat hating old dog
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 11:43 PM

woof woof woof.. fuckin cats, I fuckin hate 'em.. woof !!!

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Feb 06 - 05:22 AM

"Defend to the death" in that pseudo-Voltaire quote is actually ambiguous. It's never been quite clear whose death is envisaged.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: jacqui.c
Date: 27 Feb 06 - 07:31 AM

Lots of giggling from the corner here.

It's good to start the day with a laugh - many thanks laddies.

I'm thinking the same thing about the T-shirt.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Feb 06 - 08:50 AM

mcm lived one mile from eight mile for her entire growing up. first near mumford at seven mile and livernois, then at seven mile and mack, then a few blocks from the foot of eight mile which was not in eminem's old neighborhood but WAS in his new one. aa came later.
and your point is?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Big Mick
Date: 27 Feb 06 - 08:58 AM

little touchy this a.m, eh har ... errr, Imean mcm.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: GUEST
Date: 27 Feb 06 - 11:16 AM

a bigot is defined as someone intolerant of other's opinions. I tolerate them all the time. I just don't agree on some things. racism is something else again.

and you can't play the pms card, mickster...got no more hormones....and i was just trying to determine why you put this up on this thread...whatevah did you mean, kind sir????? that better?????

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 27 Feb 06 - 08:18 PM

I totally disagree with what David Irving has to say, and I will defend to the death (well maybe not that far...) the rights of the guys who locked him up.

Vell done gallant little Austria! god bless your alps and the gallant little breakfast cereal named after them!

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Cluin
Date: 27 Feb 06 - 09:25 PM

I will defend your right to agree with me until my supply of jelly beans gets low.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 27 Feb 06 - 09:41 PM

Well put.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 28 Feb 06 - 12:49 AM

What are ya gonna tell the bear when ya run outta cookies?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Bert
Date: 28 Feb 06 - 03:03 AM

Big Mick,

Perhaps if someone were to start deleting some of your messages then you might just have a little more symopathy for Shambles.

I find your nasty personal attack quite out of character with the Big Mick that I have known.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Davetnova
Date: 28 Feb 06 - 03:36 AM

Does bigotry depend on context? Trevor Phillips, head of the commision for racial equality (so he can't possibly be a bigot) has said that in Britain everyone has the right to offend anyone they please and that if muslims don't like it they should fuck off. If I said that I WOULD be a bigot.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: s&r
Date: 28 Feb 06 - 04:29 AM

I read the first three posts as a question of English - does 'his' no longer mean 'his or hers' as I was taught?

'Their' is great with a plural subject but you can end up with nonsense like: 'each trolley is equipped with a notice stating their proper use' (B&Q)

Stu

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: autolycus
Date: 28 Feb 06 - 05:40 AM

s&r,

Try imagining that you are female and you read, "Everyone must have had his patience tried." I'd have thought you (as a female) might object. Women didn't used to 'cos they 'knew their place', knew better than to make a fuss, didn't have too much self-respect, etc.

In virtually every case, if you use "they" or 'their' instead of 'he/she', 'he', 's/he' etc., you will have made perfect sense. I say virtually because there is the occosional formulation where 'they' or 'their' might be confusing.

The trolley example is very odd. Since when did the word 'trolley' (in the English Language) have a gender?

As for bigotry,

1. The question looks answered to me.

2. The basis of the falsISH attribution to Voltaire is nice and clear at the very end of McGrath's link. Voltaire wrote some like the quote, so Ms. Hall was correct when she said it was a summary of his position.

3. Found this quote under bigotry in a quotations book,

      "We have just enough religion to make us hate, but not enough to make us love one another."
































    Jonathan Swift.




Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 28 Feb 06 - 05:47 AM

That quote ties in with the one I use about NI, I don't know where it came from though, it says..........

There are too many Protestants and too many Catholics, and not enough Christians.

Always thought it had a ring of truth about it.

Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: s&r
Date: 28 Feb 06 - 06:26 PM

For me Ivor it was just English, not necessarily always logical: I saw no more prejudice in 'the manager picked up his pen' than 'the burglar picked up his swag'. In either case (to me) the gender was not specified unless it needed to be for some reason.

Stu

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: autolycus
Date: 02 Mar 06 - 05:32 AM

Stu,
If I understand you aright, I'm saying that our use of "his" leads us to assume so often that the person is a man, when it might be a woman.

Thus we get the familiar scenario of, for example, the nurse saying to the patient,"The doctor ios just coming", and the patiuent being TAKEN ABACK when a woman walks in.

In better words, constantly saying "he", where "they" works, leads us into expectations unfair (to say the least) to women.

Best wishes

Ivor

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: kendall
Date: 02 Mar 06 - 07:32 AM

What Mick had to say didn't strike me as a personal attack, simply one man's opinion. An opinion that happen to agree with.

To me, a personal attack is when someone uses filthy language and/or calls someone nasty names.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: GUEST
Date: 02 Mar 06 - 08:34 AM

definitely no. considering all the BNP female candidates, bigots are definitely not all male!

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 09:11 AM

"Defend to the death" in that pseudo-Voltaire quote is actually ambiguous. It's never been quite clear whose death is envisaged.

For some reason it seems that some of our posters may choose to consider such things as unclear or to go out of their way to discuss anything other than the very clear implications in this quotation.

One thing is sure - that should any poster be foolish enough to make a stand to try and ensure that all views expressed on our forum receive equal treatment and remain as worded - this attempt will not receive very much support...............But they can surely rely on on many personal judgements being posted about them.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

What Mick had to say didn't strike me as a personal attack, simply one man's opinion. An opinion that happen to agree with.
To me, a personal attack is when someone uses filthy language and/or calls someone nasty names.

The particular personal judgement made in that post may not have contained what you may judge to be 'filty language' or 'nasty names' but there are plenty of other examples from that poster that do. But is any personal judgement (good or bad) made in public about another named poster really what our discussion forum is for?

Kendall I will look forward to reading your public condemnation of the next personal attack (as now defined by you) that I will inevitably receive. Especially when it comes from one of the usual suspects who appear to be unable to make any post that does not contain personal judgements, 'filthy language' and 'nasty names'.

Is it really not possible to JUST discuss the issue on our forum anymore?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 09:23 AM

There are some people who will not discuss things unless it is on their terms. As a one sided argument is a waste of time, I wonder why you indulge in it.
You are possibly the only person who is NOT discussing it Roger. You persistently refuse to address any of the myriad points which have been raised, preferring insted to re-post the same threads ad infinitum. Whether these threads are for you or against you do not seem to matter, and you appear to be posting against yourself at times.
One thing is for sure though, when I see these old threads of yours reappear I know who has refreshed them, you sure don't suffer from a small ego that's for certain.
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 09:43 AM

The thread got all this way without anyone from Oz mentioning the Pride of Australia, Pauline Hanson?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: SINSULL
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 09:48 AM

17

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 09:52 AM

I may disagree with what you say-

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 09:52 AM

100

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 10:31 AM

What Mick had to say didn't strike me as a personal attack, simply one man's opinion. An opinion that happen to agree with.
Kendall

Opinion has caused more trouble on this little earth than plagues or earthquakes.
Voltaire

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: SINSULL
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 10:37 AM

71

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: SINSULL
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 10:39 AM

Damn CAPSLOCK! I meant 17.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 11:39 AM

are all gigots lambs?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 12:26 PM

Are all Spigots Dudley Moore?
G.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 01:13 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_Hanson

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: jeffp
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 01:46 PM

Judge a man by his questions rather than by his answers.
Voltaire, quoted by Shambles

Are all bigots male?
Shambles

The rest is left as an exercise for the reader.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 02:05 PM

When you go in search of honey you must expect to be stung by bees.
Joseph Joubert

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: jacqui.c
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 03:06 PM

42

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: wysiwyg
Date: 14 Mar 06 - 03:11 PM

Giok, I'm sure you know the answer-- only the unidexters among them are likely to be Dudleys. :~)

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 01:33 PM

While Europe's eye is fix'd on mighty things,
The fate of empires and the fall of kings;
While quacks of State must each produce his plan,
And even children lisp the Rights of Man;
Amid this mighty fuss just let me mention,
The Rights of Woman merit some attention.
Robert Burns

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:01 PM

Is it really not possible to JUST discuss the issue on our forum anymore?

Are you trying to suggest that this is what you do yourself?

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:13 PM

Yes - I do try.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:21 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: WYSIWYG - PM
Date: 26 Feb 06 - 09:03 AM

Frankly, Roger, your history here makes me wonder what point you are after proving, now, without telling us first how you plan to use our words in support of some position you advocate.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:25 PM

Well done Roger, that is the first time I have seen you give a straightforward answer to a direct question. Perhaps you should try it more often.
Giok

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 02:45 PM

Some women like to sit down with trouble as if it were knitting.
Ellen Glasgow

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 03:21 PM

He is mad past recovery, but yet he has lucid intervals.
Miguel de Cervantes

Wolfgang

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 03:26 PM

I hear the plaintive voice of W.C. Fields: "On second thought, screw 'em."

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: jacqui.c
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 05:15 PM

69

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: SINSULL
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 05:30 PM

Good one, Jacqui! heh heh

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 05:48 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: CarolC
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 05:58 PM

Yes - I do try.

LOL

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:12 PM

We do not have to visit a madhouse to find disordered minds; our planet is the mental institution of the universe.
Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:17 PM

"What a gorgeous day. What effulgent sunshine. It was a day of this sort the McGillicuddy brothers murdered their mother with an ax."

WC Fields

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:33 PM

Either that wallpaper goes or I do!

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:36 PM

My Cairn terrier's name is Meggie McGillipuppy.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:50 PM

Anyone who sees and paints a sky green and fields blue ought to be sterilized.
Adolf Hitler

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: jacqui.c
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:52 PM

96

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 06:55 PM

"Start every day off with a smile and get it over with."

WC Fields

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:26 PM

All male bigots are male.

All female bigots are female.

............

Not all males are bigots.

Not all females are bigots.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:33 PM

Nor do all people use calculators.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:38 PM

The power of Thought, the magic of the Mind!
Lord Byron

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 07:43 PM

A Short Introduction to the History of Human Stupidity by Walter B. Pitkin

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: jacqui.c
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 08:21 PM

Bugger Bognor

George V

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: Peace
Date: 15 Mar 06 - 08:23 PM

Bush, Bolton to Congress: Screw You!

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: The Shambles
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 06:50 PM

Woman is the dominant sex.
Men have to do all sorts of stuff to prove that they are worthy of woman's attention.
Camille Paglia

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: jacqui.c
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 06:52 PM

69

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: number 6
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 07:10 PM

BTW ... that is me up above doing a sommersault.

here's me doing a whole bunch of sommersaults 696969696969


sIX

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 07:30 PM

"somersault" is how I'd spell it - I gather it's supposed to be from the French "sobresault" - with the "sobre" being a variation on the Latin "super". So it's about jumping over. In this case, jumping over yourself.

Doesn't seem that probable to me either. "Super" to "sobre" sounds fine - but "sobre" to "somer" sounds rather strained. You'd have expected it to turn up in English as "sobersalt" or something like that.

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: number 6
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 09:49 PM

It's the New Brunswick (Canada) spelling McGrath ... originates from old United Empire Loyalist merged in with some Irish, with a sprinkle of French.

sIx

Subject: RE: BS: Are all bigots male?
From: jacqui.c
Date: 16 Mar 06 - 09:58 PM

Now that's one hell of a mix.