BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 28 Dec 10 - 10:31 PM

Yeah, Bobert. Back table of the Blue Moon Tavern. Heard it all before.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: open mike
Date: 28 Dec 10 - 11:05 PM

equal time for salamanders and jerrymanders and other amphibians...

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Dec 10 - 12:01 AM

The revolution I propose is not a bloody one, Don. I propose the mobilization of millions of people in a peaceful, nonviolent revolution, rather like what brought down the Soviet Union and the Warsaw Pact in 1989. There was only one place where it turned bloody... in Romania. It is possible to make a peaceful revolution if enough people mobilize spontaneouly in the streets and demand change, and if they have the will to hold firm in their resolve, and if the will of the government security forces is shaken so badly that many of them join those people. It can happen, and it has happened in some places.

I do not recommend a bloody revolution. Nor shall I ever recommend launching a war against anyone either. I do not wish to see any blood shed by anyone...so do NOT suggest that I am salivating for anything of the sort. Absolutely not!

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 29 Dec 10 - 01:00 AM

I wasn't really including you in the "bloody revolution" bit, Little Hawk. But judging from many of the things you've said regarding the way things work in the United States (most of which I agree with you about), you do sound rather defeatist. Maybe not, but it sounds that way.

The Coffee Party folks are fully aware of the situation. And the fact that it's pretty dire. But--they're not defeatist about it. They're convinced that something can be done about it. And they're setting about doing it, with some intelligent planning.

I find that preferable.

Don Firth

P. S. Now watch how long it takes for you-know-who to tell me I'm naive, idealistic, and especially unrealistic.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Dec 10 - 01:36 AM

What you describe the Coffee Party people doing sounds very good to me, Don, and I wish you the best of luck. I can't be defeatist about the USA, because I'm not myself a part OF the USA. I am viewing the situation from outside your borders, and I consider the present ruling order in the USA to be the enemy of not only their own people, but in a sense...of the entire world. I view the USA rather like someone in France or England in the mid-30's might have viewed the formative years of Nazi Germany (though I'm not suggesting that the USA has gone quite that far down the road to perdition yet...but the tendencies to do so are there quite strongly). There were progressive forces in Nazi Germany who resisted the Nazis too, both before and after Hitler's rise to power, and they deserved support from outside Germany. I support any Americans who resist the corrupt corporate order they are presently under. I don't recommend that they resist that order through violence, though, I recommend that they resist it through peaceful and positive social, political, and individual action.

You see, I want to see the present ruling forces in your country defeated....but not through violence! I want to see them defeated through people becoming aware of the real situation and not passively supporting them any longer, not buying into the wars they sell and the divisions they promote. I want to see people wake up.

The defeat of the present corrupt order that rules America (I'm not referring to Mr Obama when I say that) would not be a defeat for the people of America, Don...it would be a victory for the people of America and for the world.

My feeling is that the present system Americans are under will inevitably bring itself down...by bankrupting itself. That will be very hard on people, not just in the USA, but all over the world. I'm sorry to see it happen that way. I imagine if I'd been witnessing the fall of the Roman Empire, I'd have been sorry to see that happen that way too...but it did inevitably happen. It always happens when an empire simply goes too far in its ambitions and spends too much on war, and the American empire has, in my opinion, gone too far. I await its fall, but I do not wish violence on anyone.

Something else will rise out of whatever change occurs. Something always does. Rather like the phoenix...societies are born again.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 29 Dec 10 - 02:04 AM

Then, Little Hawk, I'd say we're pretty much in agreement.

From what I've seen and read of the folks in the Coffee Party (a very informal group of intelligent, educated, and concerned citizens--not a "political party" as such, but there are a lot of them, and they're growing in numbers), I find I am a lot more optimistic than I have been in awhile.

Among other things, they're looking at other historically peaceful countries around the world where there is not that ridiculously huge a spread between the wealthy and the not-so-wealthy, with good, working social programs, and with a populace that is happy and contented (and there are a fair number of them, so it's not some idealistic but impossible dream) to see how they manage it.

As Bobert says, "It ain't rocket surgery."

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 29 Dec 10 - 02:30 AM

Excellent! As I say, I wish you good luck in bringing about reform. There are definitely feasible ways of doing it.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 12:15 AM

Weren't the folks who got to the lifeboats earliest, had the best chance to survive, April 14, 1912????

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 12:45 AM

Where are you planning to emigrate, GfS?

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 02:14 AM

Froth: "Where are you planning to emigrate, GfS?"

Rolls eyes....Jeeez!

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Ebbie
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 11:31 AM

I'm house sitting these days, with access to television.

Yesterday there was a show on 'No Labels', with a host and four panelists. The panel consisted of David Gergen, Joe Manchin, Joe Scarborough and Evan Bayh.

As I intimated above, there are people out there - clear thinking, aware, focused, pragmatic - who give me hope.

Incidentally, I had not heard of him before and I haven't looked him up yet, but Joe Manchin is impressive.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 11:59 AM

I know a number of Americans who emigrated to Canada (mostly in the late 60s, early 70s) and none of them have regretted it.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 01:49 PM

Thought about it a few times myself, Little Hawk. I've visited Vancouver, B.C. (a couple hours' drive north of Seattle) dozens of times. Nice city. Nice people. Lots of folk singing going on.

If push comes to shove here, then. . . .

Don Firth

P.S. You think the country's going to hell, GfS, and you have no contingency plans? (The only "froth" around here is between your ears.)

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 02:11 PM

..and if you think that this country is going to hell in a hand basket, and the effects of that will stop at the border, then you are loopier than I originally thought!

Jeez, the more radical 'liberal' they think they are, but are really not, the more asinine they get!!!

Then they fancy themselves as a 'liberal activist', and think it gives them license to act out totally bizarre in public!!!...but it 'feels good'.....
......So does masturbation...but that doesn't mean you should do it in public!

Have a calm day,(Take your meds)

GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 02:36 PM

That's purdy funny, GfinS...

BTW, where are all these "liberal activists"???

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 02:43 PM

Jeez, GfS, put a cork in it! More and more, you're coming on like the south end of a northbound horse.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 03:55 PM

That's purdy funny, too, Don...

Yeah, GfinS has been a tad on the cranky side of late... I think it's "horror"mones myself... I donno???

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 04:18 PM

Well Bobert, It sounds like you're having a fun time!! Too bad there's snow on the ground.....but at least you really won't be able to see the stuff you won't be mowing!!

Wink,
GfS

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 05:30 PM

Waht??? Ya' mean to tell me that ya' don't have to mow with several inches of snow on the ground???

Sheet fire, Gf-ser... Wished you tolt me that earlier... Woulda saved me a gallon of gas and alot of havin' to get off the mower and push it outta snow banks...

Grrrrrrr....

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 05:32 PM

""The Tea Party makes a gawdawful amount of racket for a bunch of people with the collective I.Q. of a newt.""

And what have newts ever done to you, that you treat them so unfairly?

If it weren't for newts I'd have nothing with which to compare my state of inebriation.

I can't see myself saying "I'm as pissed as a teabagger!" It just doesn't have the same ring to it.

Don T.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 05:34 PM

Newts may not be terribly smart, but at least they are inoffensive. Let's hear it for Newts, I say!

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Bobert
Date: 30 Dec 10 - 07:42 PM

Newts rock!!!

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 31 Dec 10 - 06:06 PM

I think Knute Rockne was football coach at Notre Dame many decades ago.

As I recall, Pat O'Brian played him in a movie way back. Ronald Reagan (back when he was in his real profession as an actor) played "The Gipper."

Is that one of Knute Rockne's grand kids playing the Geico gecko?

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 31 Dec 10 - 06:18 PM

'Scuse me. That's Pat O'Brien. The movie was "Knute Rockne, All American" (1940).

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Stringsinger
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 04:49 PM

Hillary, the secret admirer of Ayn Rand, the associate of Brownbeck and the infamous C Street "Family", as she masquerades as a liberal, would keep the U.S. in Afghanistan for many years.

Hillary Hawk.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 05:09 PM

There are a great many politicians around now who masquerade as liberals. Tony Blair was a prime example. I think Obama is probably another one. Hillary? For sure! My impression is that they all receive their marching orders from the same set of corporate boardrooms.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: olddude
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 05:11 PM

I would take Hillary Clinton in a fucking coma over anything out there right now. She is an amazing person both in politics and outside of politics and is a person who actually cares about this country. I speak from experience as someone who actually knows the lady instead of what people read in a rag magazine ...

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 05:18 PM

Trouble is, you gotta take the full package.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 05:28 PM

You're the very guy to solve the problem oldude, if you are a pal of Hill n' Bill you must know what her plans are?

Surely it cant be to spend more quality time with that old Lothario?
She doesn't look the type!

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 05:45 PM

I respect Hillary's ability, and I think she's a bright lady, olddude. What I fear is that her party is in the control of entrenched corporate forces who have an ongoing agenda that revolves around continued military spending and reckless military adventures around the world. Anyway, I think it is cool that you have personal acquaintance with her, and I must say I'd be delighted to know her personally and to hear firsthand what she had to say about things.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: olddude
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 06:01 PM

My kid worked side by side with her in Washington DC for a year. I think if she would have been President a lot of things would be different but that is my opinion. I don't know what her and Bill are going to do .. That is a better kept secret than their daughters wedding. I also don't know what drives her to keep putting up with politics. She is way way too smart for it I think and they both deserve better. I don't think one person can change the Corporate politics this country has turned into or even make a difference anymore. Maybe it is just me being cynical but nothing changes no matter what party or who is in office.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 06:18 PM

Teabagging has a funny visual, I'm sorry.

And it's grammAr school, anyway.

I'll ask my kith and kin in State...

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 06:36 PM

"nothing changes no matter what party or who is in office"

Yeah, that's the problem, olddude, and the same thing has been going on in Canada for some time. Voters here feel helpless to do a thing about it, and because of that fewer people are voting in each succeeding election. I still vote...not because I think it will change anything...it doesn't...but just so that no one can say I didn't.

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: olddude
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 06:55 PM

I should qualify my statement to say if she was pres some things maybe different, but I doubt she or anyone could do very much. I should not have said things would be different, they wouldn't be, nobody can fight the corporate wall street machines I think

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 07:12 PM

One things sure, to beat the system, you dont want a Mr Obama fighting your corner, you want an egotistical populist ideologue.

Do you know any?

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 07:30 PM

Chongo!!! ;-)

Oh, and maybe Ms Sarah too...

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: akenaton
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 07:34 PM

Who's Chongo "popular" with?

Well there are a lot of monkeys on these threads!....:0)

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Bobert
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 07:44 PM

The problem with the Chongz and the populist ideologues is that after you strip them off the noise there ain't nuthin' left...

George W., case in point...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: Hillary Clinton to resign?
From: Don Firth
Date: 01 Jan 11 - 09:15 PM

Gee whiz, folks, let's all voluntarily march to the slave labor camps!

Gawd, what a collection of defeatist wimps!!

Don Firth