BS: Islamic radicalism . . .

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Greg F.
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 06:38 PM

What threat does MtheGM see from that tiny moronic fringe, to the country as a whole.

I would posit that there is a more substantial threat worldwide in the long run from members of thenot so tiny moronic fringe of which BooBad, MGM, Keith & Co. are representative.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: GUEST,Troubadour
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 05:04 PM

23 pages of vitriolic denigration of a demographic which makes up a largely inoffensive and law abiding five percent of the total population, trying hard to equate the tiny proportion of that five percent who are suspected of being likely to commit acts of terror with the whole grouping.

And the basis for that mindset is 26 verses of their 6000 verse holy book which mention the word Jihad.

MtheGM in his increasingly paranoid rants, seems singularly unaware of the fact that, barring stupid incidents in which two mentally off beam idiots kill a soldier, exchanging their two lives for his one.

A pyrrhic victory, by any standards and they didn't even get to be martyrs.

What threat does MtheGM see from that tiny moronic fringe, to the country as a whole.

The UK is nothing like the USA. Even if M's fears were realised and the whole five percent revolted, with the lack of weaponry in this country, they wouldn't stand long against the army.

So all this is just calculated nastiness inspired by fear of the different.

If I believed in a God, I would pray for deliverance from all paranoid xenophobes, theirs and OURS!

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 02:44 PM

The C&P by bobad looks pretty suspicious to me. Even if it were true why would a true Muslim refer to people that deal drugs, get drunk and harass women as Muslims as well? The people he is referring to are just criminals of no particular religion.

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 02:43 PM

"So MI5 is wrong, and we should listen to you instead Jim."
Some context:
Since 2001 there have been 4 Islamic terrorist attacks in Britain by Muslims and 4 terrorist aimed at Muslims
The vast majority of terrorist attacks have been attributed to the IRA
Those who went to fight Assad in Syria are now being counted as a terrorist threat, pretty much the same as those who went to fight in Spain were in the 1930s.
Those who fought in Syrian make up the majority of those suspected of being in favour of extremism
There are no figures to show how many of those suspected by MI5 are Muslins and how many support other causes, such as The Real IRA or racism.
Since 2001, there have been 470,678 racists identified attacks in Britain - an average of 130 per day; the vast majority of these have been on Muslims - there is no record of how many others have been reported as racist but not accepted as being such.
between 2007 and 2011 there been 87,000 reported racist incidents in British schools, an average of 130 per day.
One third of Britons questioned in surveys admitted that they hold and have openly expressed racist views - not a country that welcomes foreigners, you might say
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 12:32 PM

So MI5 is wrong, and we should listen to you instead Jim.
We will have to agree to differ on that and I will leave it there.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 09:47 AM

"are a serious threat and it is foolish to think the "spooks" are lying to you about it"
THe security services have listed elected politicians, trades union leaders (especially miners leaders), writes, journalists, civil rights campaigners, peace demonstrators.... vitually anybody vaguely left of rightist politics, as "security risks".
They have bugged their homes and opened their mail - may have 'security' records.
Anyone inciting violence and hatred should be a 'security risk' - including hate merchants like you and yours - only too often they/you aren't
It's all immaterial anyway - oyu and your smutty friends have consistently attempted to implicate "all Muslims" in terror and claimed that it is their religion or their cultural background (in your case by "cultural implants")
That is the world of the B.N.P. Muslim Watch, and all the other scum-buckets whose views you echo - not any security service I am aware of.
Of course potential terrorists should be detected and dealt with - many of them should be forced to share a cell with you and yours.
"They are in fact significantly over-represented in the prison population and the gap is widening.
The rise in the number of Muslims in British prisons has not been discussed at any great length but much of it has been put down to young Asian men's disillusionment with their treatment
Blacks and Asians in Britain are six times as likely to be stopped and searched by the police and there has been a rise in hate crimes against Asians
Muslim communities remain the most trouble-free and law abiding in Britain - law breaker face ostracisation within the communities when found committing criminal acts
This is what Cameron had to say about the Muslim communities in Britain
CAMERON
On the other hand, Anti Muslim crmes are on the rise in Britain
CRIMES AGAINST MUSLIMS
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: GUEST,Mullah Musket
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 08:23 AM

I used to have an Austin 1100.

Well, the log book said it was a Morris 1100, but the dashboard certainly came from an Austin because it had the red ticker tape speedo. The rocker cover was Vanden Plas. Dunno about the bodywork. there were very few areas where a magnet could stay attached if truth be known.

I bought it at an auction in 1981. I bid £20.00 but it failed to meet a reserve. The auction house had me speak with the owner and we agreed £25.00 to allow him to pay the commission and still get a pint out of it.

Lasted me till 1983, so it wasn't that bad. It tended to point towards Mecca a lot, but that was possibly due to worn bushings and bad tracking. It got stolen once, and after a fortnight, the insurance were all ready to cough up their estimate of value, (£300.00.) I was getting all excited when I had a call from PC Plod. It had turned up.

Bugger..

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Teribus
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 08:02 AM

"Never once witnessed a beheading in Southall or Balham, or along Merton Road" - Jim Carroll

Ooooh that was a slip Christmas.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: bobad
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 07:49 AM

Malmö, Sweden's third largest city, where one quarter of the population is Muslim, is another Muslim stronghold in Sweden where the fire department and emergency workers no longer enter Muslim immigrants' areas without police protection.

When two Swedes, one a community leader, were to visit Malmö to examine the situation on the ground, they both said it was too risky to go.

Mr. S., a Palestinian living in Malmö, arrived in Sweden as a refugee fleeing the Jordanian intelligence service two decades ago. He said, "I am a true Muslim. My wife wears hijab, I appreciate this country, and I just want to make a living but those Islamist crazies won't leave us alone. They say they support jihad, they deal drugs, they get drunk and harass women. At the same time, they look down on me because I have Christian Swedish friends. They threatened my eldest son; they said his friends are white non-Muslim Swedes. I swear to Allah, sometimes I feel I am not living in Malmö but in Afghanistan."

"My daughter does not wear hijab," he added. "She has blonde hair and could easily pass for a Swede, therefore the minute she leaves the house, the local Muslim men start harassing her, thinking she is a native Swede. They think of Swedish girls as easy and prostitutes. When I confront these men harassing my daughter, they bluntly tell me they thought she was a Swede and they would have not harassed her if they had known she was a Muslim. Tell me what should I do now? Cut my daughter's hair? Force her to wear hijab? Now I understand how Swedes feel about us Muslims harassing their sisters and daughters."

Another Palestinian, a college professor, who lives in a small town in northern Sweden, said, "I am religious, but I cannot accept what the Muslim fundamentalists have been doing to this country. I have had job offers to teach at major Swedish cities, but instead chose to go to a remote town where I would not have to see fundamentalist immigrants. Our people are playing with fire. The Swedes are very polite and tolerant by nature, but I doubt they can take the Islamic provocation of this country much longer. I am not sure what will happen, but I would not be surprised if one day Sweden bans immigration from all Arab and Muslim countries."

Mudar Zahran

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 07:38 AM

Demonising them by denigrating their religion and equating their behaviour with that of a handful of extremists and criminals,

I do not do that, but the "handful of extremists" (the security services are aware of thousands!) are a serious threat and it is foolish to think the "spooks" are lying to you about it.

As I have said over and over again, the Muslim communities are among the most law-abiding and industrious of all British citizens.

You have said it over and over again but never once supported it with any facts.
They are in fact significantly over-represented in the prison population and the gap is widening.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: beardedbruce
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 07:38 AM

Hex 15!

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 07:19 AM

"Are you saying it is not?"
I am saying, a they have in the past, that there is not enough evidence to make such a statement.
I tend to regard 'spooks', as I do politicians, as untrustworthy employees of whoever is in power at the time (and in some cases, as in the cases of their espionage activities regarding some 'unapproved of' elected politicians) a law unto themselves.
As I have said over and over again, the Muslim communities are among the most law-abiding and industrious of all British citizens.
Demonising them by denigrating their religion and equating their behaviour with that of a handful of extremists and criminals, as you and your squalid bunch of brothers have persistently attempted to do, is far more likely to make them militants that the behaviour of a tiny bunch of nutty extremists.
You have not responded to one point I have made abour racism and sectarianism in Britain, nor will you - you seig heilers provoke race and cultural hatred rather than condemn it
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 04:55 AM

Worthy effort Dave.
Afraid I was just too thick or absorbed to get it.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 04:27 AM

Not Austin, Texas. Austin 1100. Just trying to lighten things up and obviously failing...

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 03:53 AM

Musket, by "them" I meant Islamic radicals, the subject of this thread.

Jim, our own security services recognise Islamic radicalism as currently by far the greatest threat to our security and safety.

Are you saying it is not?

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 03:34 AM

"is irrelevant to our experience here."
Violent racist attacks, harassment and discrimination in Britain have been part of the lives of outsiders who have settled in Britain throughout the 20th and into this century, Jews, West Indians, European asylum seekers.... anybody of the 'wrong' colour, religion and origin.
'Paki-bashing' almost achieved the status of a national sport from the 70s to the 90s in parts of England.
Open warfare under the name of Religious differences in Northern Ireland led to loss of life here and in mainland Britain for two decades - hopefully, that is disappearing, but we are about to see yet another display of religious and national triumphalism here in a few weeks time.
Some of the worst of those once active in the Troubles have now directed their attentions to asylum seekers and Muslims - racist attacks in the part of Ireland that is still British have been reported as being on the increase.         
Someone once claimed strikes and industrial unrest as 'the British disease', that has long been replaced by racist and religious intolerance.
A couple of years ago a survey revealed that a quarter of British people admitted to holding and expressing racist views; that was confirmed by another poll this year and is now taking political shape as indicated by the fact that Ukip went into the election on a racist ticket and gained significant support.
All this has taken place because of hatred generated by people like yourself with your 'cultural implants' and hate-merchants like the B.N.P.
Well done you.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: GUEST,Musket
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 03:23 AM

Keith as ever with his inadvertent insight gets to the nub of the issue.

WE shouldn't allow etc THEM blah blah

Here's the question. Are WE UK citizens regardless and are THEY terrorists? Or don't you include Tahir and Iqbaal in your "we?"

Should Keith and his flak jacket cronies tell British people to change their culture to suit his? Perhaps if they shut that nasty mosque and started swelling the empty pews in nice loving inclusive churches instead eh?

I recall you supporting the idea of faith schools Keith. Well done, this is what you get. Assuming it is what you get. I'm not convinced of either argument just yet.

OFSTED complain of cronyism and families getting jobs. The newspapers link this with Islam. Err.. If it is true, and it may well be, it is cultural, not a facet of a religion.

Shallow people are quick to link culture to religion when it suits them. I'm a rational person but to a bloke in Jeddah, my thoughts and deeds would be seen as Christian as that is how the west is portrayed and taken up by ignorant people.

Ditto some of the ignoramuses and paranoid bigots who think they can rant on Mudcat without reality occasionally pointing and laughing at them.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 10 Jun 14 - 03:19 AM

Dave, I was referring to UK.
Greg, identify an error or misapprehension in my post.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 06:10 PM

Anyone see Wilshaw with Paxo tonight? Ever see a bloke looking so bloody uneasy and unhappy, blotchy face, ever so slightly sweaty, clearly following political orders? This bloke is supposed to be in charge of Ofsted, which, you'd have thought, should have been well sorted after all these years (by way of anecdote, the only Ofsted inspector to observe my lessons had been on the beer during his jolly at the Falcon in Bude the night before. A panic-stricken Year 8 lad who'd been sitting near him on the back row of my lab came dashing up to me: "Mr Shaw! I dunno if that bloke's all right but he's making funny noises!" When I went to investigate I found the bloke asleep, sweaty, smelly and snoring. He later told me my lesson was good...). I also know another Ofsted inspector who had had to leave teaching on mental health grounds but who got back as an Ofsted inspector after two days' training. I remember him ringing me up before he nailed his Ofsted job to ask me to ask the deputy head at my school if there were any vacancies for supply work, though he specified that he couldn't possibly manage more than a couple of days a week as his mental state wouldn't be able to take it.

Not exactly an insider's view, obviously, but a possible corrective for anyone who thinks that Ofsted is anything like a legitimate organisation. I could say a lot more, really I could!

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 05:29 PM

And as for Keith - its hopeless.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 05:22 PM

Only the toadying right-wing press can save them.

With, of course, the assistance of eejits like BS Bruce;

Who STILL hasn't presented any actual evidence that Mr. Hughes is wrong - only what someone "said" - which passes for fact in BS Bruce's world, apparently.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 05:11 PM

Austin!

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 04:06 PM

Jim, all the mass casualty attacks and attempts were made here in UK and are the only indiscriminate deliberate mass casualty attacks here since WW2 60 years ago.

Your "As there have been against Muslims by Christians and Buddists - Israel has...." is irrelevant to our experience here.

Musket, "what should we do."

We should not allow them to change our system and way of life.
We should not allow them to spread and inculcate hate between our communities.
We should be vigilant and alert.
We should not be complacent and pretend that there is no threat.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 03:40 PM

But they don't still, in the C21, run their judicial systems in strict LITERAL accordance with it, as in Yemen, Saudi, Sudan, Somalia, N Nigeria (cont p 94), do they?

Prat!

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 03:39 PM

But then YOU are fine with bullying and intimidation

Well, bearded bruce, or bb, or ...shit... Bibi... - aargh.... I'm not happy with bullying and intimidation either, and I'm also not happy with OFSTED. This lot has got let's-have-a-leftie-bashing-Islamophobic-witch-hunt-before-the-next-election written all over it. Over the previous six months to two years, that self-same OFSTED had found all the schools to be really good, often outstanding. The original Trojan-horse letter was almost certainly a fake. We are talking about schools that have achieved outstanding results in a very deprived area. The schools' reputations are undiminished. On the other hand, the government and OFSTED are in a state of severe disrepute. Only the toadying right-wing press can save them. Which they will.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Musket
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 03:35 PM

Hey Bruce! Do the Christian courts, the ones where you can swear by the bible, do they give out justice as per the bible? Eye for an eye! Help! Don't let these Christians take over! They let you keep slaves, concubines and bugger under 16s!

It's all there in their bible you know....

Prat.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Musket
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 03:00 PM

Spooky. I was listening to Vin singing that on the way home earlier.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 02:49 PM

"You're a fool,"
And you are a bigoted hypocrite.
I gave you a list of options - do you have any of your own?
God save us all from the descendants of the persecuted!
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 02:13 PM

You're a fool, Jim Carroll. I have absolutely given up any hope of ever getting any sense into your stupid, thick, illiterate turnip-head.
& I say 'illiterate' advisedly, in full consideration of its literal meaning, because you are absolutely incapable of reading with any scintilla of comprehension the most simple piece of writing set before you.

Just go away and commune with your halfwitted self; and I hope it may keep fine for you.

~M~

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 02:10 PM

When the tide turns

Just because I have just seen Vin, I love the optimism in the song and it may just have some significance that I cannot at present put my finger on :-)

DtG

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 02:02 PM

GregF,

Try reading for COMPREHENSION.



"The Office for Standards in Education, or OFSTED, said five of 21 schools it inspected in the central English city of Birmingham failed to protect students from extremism. The inspections were spurred by an anonymous letter alleging a plot called "Operation Trojan Horse" by hardline Muslims to infiltrate Birmingham schools.
...
Chief schools inspector Michael Wilshaw said there was evidence of an "organized campaign to target certain schools" by some members of their boards of governors. Inspectors said governors tried inappropriately to influence the curriculum at some schools, promoting a "narrow faith-based ideology" and in one case attempting to ban mixed-sex swimming lessons.

"Staff and some head teachers variously described feeling 'intimidated', 'undermined' or 'bullied' by governors, and sometimes by senior staff, into making changes they did not support," Wilshaw said."



But then YOU are fine with bullying and intimidation, as that is your normal mode of discussion.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 01:57 PM

I READ the entire article (which apparently you did not) before I responded to your BS, Bruce.

You have STILL supplied no evidence that Mr. David Hughes is wrong,
just more BS and childish abuse. Oh, and of course your usual idiotic "anti-Semetic" jab, which is also bullshit.

Do look up the info per the BBC mentioned by Musket. And actually read it - before you make an arsehole of yourself. Again. (Still?)

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 01:16 PM

"Worldwide, there is one religion that is streets ahead of all the others in the "unacceptable practices in the name of the Faith""
There have always been worldwide practices in faiths - some of them still happening - we're coping with some of them in Ireland and looking back on the results of others at at the moment (I can hear the news from the other room)
What the **** do you expect to be done with these people you appear to hate so much?
Ghettoise them on Salisbury Plain - or maybe there's another Guantanamo Bay going begging somewhere?
Fit them all with security tags?
Send them back to where they come from angry and with something to hate us for, into the arms of the fanatics (more or less what happened because the word stood by and did nothing about Assad's slaughter).
Maybe scientists can find a procedure to medically extract their religion from them?
Perhaps we could gas them all - perhaps not, didn't work last time?
It's almost possible to see the froth around your mouth from here in the far west
Bloody head-case - time for your rabies shot, I think.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 12:32 PM

GuineaPig GregF,

HERE is the ENTIRE article. WHat part do you have a problem with? The statement BY THE ACCUSED that he does not support with facts? THAT is YOUR standard - I guess you WOULD give him full credit and assume it is true in spite of the facts (Unless he is Jewish, of course)





LONDON (AP) — Government inspectors in Britain said Monday there was a "culture of fear and intimidation" at several schools investigated over allegations of a plot to run them along strict Islamic lines.

The Office for Standards in Education, or OFSTED, said five of 21 schools it inspected in the central English city of Birmingham failed to protect students from extremism. The inspections were spurred by an anonymous letter alleging a plot called "Operation Trojan Horse" by hardline Muslims to infiltrate Birmingham schools.

Authorities believe the letter was a hoax, but the alleged plot has inflamed tensions in Britain's second-largest city and sparked a public feud between senior government ministers over the best way to confront extremist ideas.

Chief schools inspector Michael Wilshaw said there was evidence of an "organized campaign to target certain schools" by some members of their boards of governors. Inspectors said governors tried inappropriately to influence the curriculum at some schools, promoting a "narrow faith-based ideology" and in one case attempting to ban mixed-sex swimming lessons.


"Staff and some head teachers variously described feeling 'intimidated', 'undermined' or 'bullied' by governors, and sometimes by senior staff, into making changes they did not support," Wilshaw said.

Of the schools inspected by OFSTED, five were classed as failing and placed under special measures, 12 were told they needed to make improvements and three were praised. Park View Educational trust, which runs three of the criticized schools, rejected the inspectors' verdict. Vice chairman David Hughes said the inspectors "came to our schools looking for extremism, looking for segregation, looking for proof that our children have religion forced upon them as part of an Islamic plot."

"The OFSTED reports find absolutely no evidence of this because this is categorically not what is happening at our schools," he said.


http://www.mail.com/news/world/2903676-inspectors-criticize-schools-islamist-plot.html#.7518-stage-subhero1-4




Musket,

GregF has a long history of abusing small animals. He has never denied it. STATEMENT OF FACT. But he has a problem, always running out of duct-tape...



My beard is well within the standards of Sharia law.

As for the poetry,

Qu'ran Sura 37:36 back at you.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Musket
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 12:20 PM

Bearded Bruce. If you don't understand what you are typing / pasting, either ask a friend or leave the bullshit to the real experts. Keith, Michael and Poo Bad are streets ahead of you in spreading lies and bullshit in order to demonise a huge number of British people.

Your bit about Sharia Law and guinea pigs is wonderful. I sent a link to this page to a colleague who us writing a paper on understanding fear and bigotry.

Ooh he... Under Sharia law, your beard would be removed and your sonnets burned! And then they get a spaceman to prod you before beheading you in front of ...

By the way, the OFSTED report and the reaction by heads affected is now available on the BBC News website. The most interesting bit is the role of Michael Gove and his party leadership spat with the Home Secretary.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 12:19 PM

Hi, BS Bruce-

Can you supply EVIDENCE -rather than your customary abuse & BS- that
'The OFSTED reports find absolutely no evidence of extremism, segregation, or proof that our children have religion forced upon them as part of an Islamic plot' is untrue?

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 12:02 PM

GregF,

The rest of the article (Not just YOUR quote from the person being accused):

"Staff and some head teachers variously described feeling 'intimidated', 'undermined' or 'bullied' by governors, and sometimes by senior staff, into making changes they did not support," Wilshaw said.

Of the schools inspected by OFSTED, five were classed as failing and placed under special measures, 12 were told they needed to make improvements and three were praised. Park View Educational trust, which runs three of the criticized schools, rejected the inspectors' verdict. Vice chairman David Hughes said the inspectors "came to our schools looking for extremism, looking for segregation, looking for proof that our children have religion forced upon them as part of an Islamic plot."

"The OFSTED reports find absolutely no evidence of this because this is categorically not what is happening at our schools," he said.




So YOUR post is of no value to the discussion, as you have demonstrated may times in the past.




You do know that your treatment of guinea pigs and other small animals would get you executed under Sharia Law, don't you, GregF?

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 11:53 AM

"all religions are capable of extremism and prone to abuse and to single out one of them for special treatment is to be part of that abuse."
.,,.

And more on this idiotically ingenuous [or DISingenuous] point of Jim's ~~

There is only one religion which has a political as well as religious dimension, one religion which is simultaneously effectively the governing authority of sovereign states within the world community. And in pretty well every one where it is, its rule is tyrannical oppressive, "medieval" [for want of a better word] in its penalties and sanctions for crime; which crimes are largely not even illegal in more rationally governed countries. Just show me the country where you will be hanged if you say you really would rather stop being a practising Christian or Jew or Buddhist or Hindu or Flying-Spaghetti-Monster-Worshipper. Stoned to death for what they call adultery, which isn't even in its true meaning illegal here, and they only mean 'fornication by it anyhow', and not many of our young people would even survive adolescence if...   

Just one. Go on. ONE?!

Obviously, in world terms, such a one must be 'singled out for special attention' from the community of nations; and 'singled out for special attention' to make very sure that its compulsion for spreading its word universally is not allowed to obtain too much leverage in nations where it has not contrived to get the upper hand yet.

"What "abuse", for crying out loud, does Jim see such considerations as "part of"?

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 11:44 AM

Hey, BS Bruce: ya forgot to post the last line of the article, so I'll do it for ya:

"The OFSTED reports find absolutely no evidence of this because this is categorically not what is happening at our schools," he said

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: beardedbruce
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 11:17 AM

LONDON (AP) — Government inspectors in Britain said Monday there was a "culture of fear and intimidation" at several schools investigated over allegations of a plot to run them along strict Islamic lines.

The Office for Standards in Education, or OFSTED, said five of 21 schools it inspected in the central English city of Birmingham failed to protect students from extremism. The inspections were spurred by an anonymous letter alleging a plot called "Operation Trojan Horse" by hardline Muslims to infiltrate Birmingham schools.

Authorities believe the letter was a hoax, but the alleged plot has inflamed tensions in Britain's second-largest city and sparked a public feud between senior government ministers over the best way to confront extremist ideas.

Chief schools inspector Michael Wilshaw said there was evidence of an "organized campaign to target certain schools" by some members of their boards of governors. Inspectors said governors tried inappropriately to influence the curriculum at some schools, promoting a "narrow faith-based ideology" and in one case attempting to ban mixed-sex swimming lessons.

http://www.mail.com/news/world/2903676-inspectors-criticize-schools-islamist-plot.html#.7518-stage-subhero1-4

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 11:13 AM

Oh, for heavens sake stop being so naive, Jim. Forget about what an asset Islam has been to some of the population of Wolverhampton or Bradford; and what a pest those silly Christian fools in Kansas have been.

Worldwide, there is one religion that is streets ahead of all the others in the "unacceptable practices in the name of the Faith" stakes. And it is the one too in which the duty and injunction to spread the faith is strongest by any measure.

And you know it. And anyone with the sense they were born with knows it. And if you pretend this isn't so, then you show yourself to be intellectually so far beneath contempt with regard to the topic of this thread that it will cease to be worthwhile for anyone of any sense to address another word to you on the topic, or read another one which you might post.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Musket
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 11:10 AM

A hospital trust I visited last week sent me their potted statistics.

Their catchment area is very white British, running at 83% and 12% Easten European. The small rest of the local population? Add a few takeaways and you are basically left with professionals, mainly in NHS.

Easy. 52% of the doctors, (consultant and staff grade) are Muslim.

At another hospital a few years ago whilst there on behalf of a regulator, I investigated an issue of a nurse with a long dangling chain with a crucifix being asked not to wear it, in line with the uniform code, in line with infection control considerations. She was taking this further, trust only interested in respecting foreigners etc etc, the usual caring Christian attitude we know and love....

In the meantime, I asked three Muslim nurses about bare below the elbows, touching men and other Islamic taboos. All three stated that you leave your faith at the door when caring for patients. If a trust supplies disposable arm covers, great. If not, get on with it. A Muslim doctor told me he was hugely concerned by the nurse pushing her Christianity against sensible health precautions as other people, including many Muslim healthcare professionals might follow the idea as many have a genuine cultural aversion to some of the things they are asked to do but see their care for patients as more important.

We are a multicultural society. Asking what WE do about THEM just shows the dinosaur mentality of an unfortunate chav element.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 09:45 AM

My point is as it has been in the beginning - that all religions are capable of extremism and prone to abuse and to single out one of them for special treatment is to be part of that abuse.
Of all communities in these islands today, the Muslim ones (in general) are the least likely to be part of abusing other religions - not the crystal-gazing, Cassandra-like predictions you indulge in - proven and often expressed facts.
The answer - stop persecuting people you don't like and learn to live with them - whatever the send-'em-all back merchants would wish, they are here to say and they have proven an asset.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Musket
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 08:51 AM

I'll raise you a sanatogen tablet.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 08:46 AM

Musket -- Wot I said back to him

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 08:45 AM

Oh, so that's all right then, is it? What point do you think such whataboutery makes, Jim?

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Musket
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 08:44 AM

What do suggest then Keith?

Resurrect the home guard with you as Corporal Jones? Stick sentries outside the house of Dr Mahmoud? Arrest anyone with a beard but no moustache? Tell you what, turn the rest of the population against them! Yeah, get your mates with Land Rovers and second hand cammy jackets to beat a few old Pakis up! Whilst they are at it, they can start on queers. And paediatricians, and thespians....

You really like to fantasise about a world where pretend soldiers can be useful, don't you? Thanks all the same, but we have police to deal with anti terrorism. Soldiers are there to interfere with other countries and help old ladies out of flooded houses over here.    Do you move your toy soldiers around based on your whim or do you have to throw a dice in order to move them around the kitchen table?


Michael,

Wot Steve said.

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 08:40 AM

"There have been mass casualty attacks, attempted mass casualty attacks and foiled mass casualty attacks involving Islamists "
As there have been against Muslims by Christians and Buddists - Israel has waged constant warfare against Muslims in Palestine since the creation of the state, and some British bigots have made the lives of peaceable Asians and other Immigrants to Britain both miserable and dangerous for decades, based on racial and cultural hatred as displayed by you and your friends.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 08:36 AM

Butt out, Shaw, you pathetic little pain. Away & play with your cuddly teddy -- or something...

Subject: RE: BS: Islamic radicalism . . .
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 09 Jun 14 - 08:26 AM

I've strongly suspected for a while that Michael has lost it (his recent burbling posts, often bereft of any content connected to the argument appear to be strong evidence in that direction), but he's now confirmed it by hitching his wagon to Melanie Phillips. With allies like that...


Hahahahaha!