BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 02:06 PM

walky - good..

NHS and care staff, other essential frontline workers,
need the scarce supply of surgical masks far more than you or me..

If you are convinced masks are such an effective foolproof protection,
nothing to stop you making your own to wear..


I already suggested to you in a previous thread cricket box and jock strap..

Or if you have an anorak, parka, or cagoule, wear it back to front with the hood over your face..

There's no limit to creative ideas if you have a mask bee in your bonnet..

But beekeepers masks are probably not too protective...???

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 02:14 PM

"I made my comment in response to Jim's post"
I'm still waiting for you to Justify that post Doug
You can't still be defending Dom the Demic's good name, surely
Sorry to pursue this but when our fate is put in such hands as his to the extent it has we really need to understand where he's coming from and whose support he has
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Iains
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 03:09 PM

Jim when you do not livein the UK   why shitstir about being a possible victim of the NHS and the tories? It makes you appear to be a fool.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 03:27 PM

Iains - I welcome Jim's [mostly] wisdom..

What he has to say is far more intelligent and relevant than too many Brit fools
who live still live here...

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 03:49 PM

Take no notice PFK
I was born in the UK, I have near relatives living in the UK and I feel a great allegiance to the UK, despite my reservations at what people like Iains have done to it and are doing to its reputation
My nephew has an excellent job for Westland (whatever it calls itself now) and stands to lose it thanks to ******* Brexit
Do you think for one minute I'm going to stop worying about him and the rest   at the sound of the jackboot kicking down the door
THey can't retreat to their farm in Kerry when they run out of cash and are faced with stacking shelves at Morrisons
Sod the flagwaggers of little brain, I say
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 04:02 PM

Jim - of course, I'm sure he extends "when you do not livein the UK   why shitstir"

to all the ex pat m/billionaires who live on exclusive exotic faraway gated estates and islands,
who insistently finance interference with our British home democracy...

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 04:45 PM

...including foul-mouthed Paul Dacre, recently editor of his favourite rag the Mail, off-shorer par excellence. He had plenty to whinge about when it came to our beloved country, so beloved to him that he can't stand to live here... Half a million quid from EU farm subsidies even though he's a rampant Europhobe...I won't go on...

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 04:54 PM

From Marina Hyde in the Guardian:

"In the UK on Thursday night, millions stood on doorsteps or leaned from their windows to applaud NHS and care workers, a vastly moving moment confused only by the participation of many Conservative MPs and ministers who in 2017 not only voted against a pay rise for nurses, but loudly clapped its defeat – and whose funding priorities have left some frontline NHS workers threatening to resign over lack of protective equipment. The World Health Organization recommends the sort of full-body armour you’d want to attend dinner at Michael Gove’s; current government largesse allows for a Kiss the Cook apron and a cardboard Simon Cowell mask."

How searingly true. The sheer HYPOCRISY of any Tory who had the bloody neck to go out and applaud. Shit on the sorry lot of them. Well said, Marina, as ever.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Iains
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 05:35 PM

Jim has yet to answer the question. So far all he has done is take us for a merry jaunt around the houses while wabbling on about whataboutism. You may fool your acolytes, but not me.
I see Mr Varadkar has just banned you from leaving your house come midnight. The over 70's are coconed by decree.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 05:53 PM

The PM and Prince Charles were rightly tested for Cornovirus. They are both special because of their special responsibilities. But doctors and nurses treating COVID patients are entitled to ask why they can’t get tests. They are special cases too

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 06:16 PM

Boris, maybe. BigEars? Nowt special there. He got tested because he atops the pyramid of privilege. He's far less use than tens of millions of ordinary working people, many of whom, thanks to this inept government, are in the firing line, and a good number of whom will die, again thanks to the dilatory and complacent attitude of this government.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 06:30 PM

I could agree with you but then we'd both be wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 07:43 PM

From the Guardian:

"Boris Johnson was accused of failing to heed his own advice to the public over how to contain coronavirus on Friday as it emerged that he and other key government figures had themselves contracted Covid-19.

On a day of extraordinary developments at the heart of the operation to counter the virus, both the prime minister and health secretary, Matt Hancock, said they had tested positive. The chief medical officer, Prof Chris Whitty, also reported symptoms and went into self-isolation.

But while Johnson said he would be able to continue to run the government’s response to the crisis alone in his Downing Street flat, public health experts rounded on his attitude to the infection and accused him of being “nonchalant” and “slow” to behave appropriately.

The prime minister has previously been accused of failing to keep an appropriate distance from other senior figures in public, and has continued with parliamentary duties this week, raising the possibility that he may have infected others in the cabinet and beyond."

Inept, complacent, irresponsible...

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 07:50 PM

Tho' from the Daily Star:

"SCRUB YER KNOBS AND KNOCKERS!"

It was a reference to doorknobs and knockers. Just so as you'd know...and I saw it on the Beeb News Channel, just in case anyone thinks I might be buying that rag!

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 27 Mar 20 - 07:58 PM

Funny that, Gove popping up on TV again...

How many more of his rivals will suddenly test positive in coming days...???

Pandemics really are a most useful perfect murder weapon...

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 03:20 AM

"Jim has yet to answer the question. "
Unlike you, who has tripped over yourself to reply to each question that has ever been put to you as you have a long reputation of doing
Unfortunately, personal abuse doesn't count as an answer to most intelligent people, which is also firmly embedded in your reputation
Would you like my calculation of how many times you have indicated that those livin in Britain (born there or not) are forbidden to comment on what happens there, and how many times I have responded ?
I don't suppose you will respond this time - so here's to the next time eh
You really aren't very good at debating are you ?
This is why people have been instructed by the mods not to respond to you
only do because I'm feeling somewhat charitable to people at the present time - you're at the top of my St Vincent De Pauls list at present
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 04:33 AM

Would you like my calculation of how many times you have indicated that those livin in Britain (born there or not) are forbidden to comment on what happens there, and how many times I have responded ?

I would be most interested. I look forward to seeing your lie exposed.

I note the weasel word "Calculations". Try putting money where mouth is and offer proof.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 04:59 AM

"I would be most interested. I look forward to seeing your lie exposed."
Off the top of mu=y head - four times at least
A little stupid tioo call something you have just clearly stated and I have replied to just a few posting up "a lie" doncha think ?
You really are hopeless at all this, aren't you
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 05:24 AM

Doctor! Doctor!

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 05:30 AM

Like most people, I guess, and as I’m in the ‘seriously at risk’ category, I’m very concerned about Covid-19 and the government’s inept handling of the situation. I’m pretty sure that none of the easily-deceived neophyte Tory voters from former ‘Red Wall’ districts at the last GE expected such a shambolic, bumbling performance from their new heroes at the first sign of a real problem.

But what I’m just as concerned about is what Dom & Dumber, and their band of acolytes, are up to while everyone is 100% distracted by Covid-19 and wall-to-wall TV coverage of same. A disaster is a very convenient cover for governmental chicanery on other fronts.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: peteglasgow
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 05:51 AM

yes BWM, that is a worry.....or a disaster. as late as last autumn and their leadership contest there were many tories willing to contemplate 'anyone but johnson' - we were told he was widely disliked in the party, and an ego-driven fool etc. (yes, nicky morgan) at the time there were several saner voices in the party grieve, stewart etc who seemed to talk with some insight and intelligence. these guys were backed by the party elders - major, heseltine, ken clarke etc but all their voices went unheeded and they were disappeared from the party. none of them come out of this with any credit - i want to hear some form of opposition to johnson from an organised group of saner tories - but there isn't any. nothing. don't they care about their party? their country? european liberal democracy? while the newer breed bay and cheer at johnson's inane and dangerous capers is there nothing that can dissuade these tories that they may have backed the wrong man taking the wrong line? their past behaviour has led to an NHS and other vital services struggling to survive and starved of resources - now dedicated workers and many other vulnerable people are dying because of boris johnson and others. has anyone changed their mind? and now with the best advice to impart to us on tackling the virus, boris johnson and his nhs lap dog have the virus - you idiots. boris johnson is killing nurses - does any tory have any doubts about him yet? he is a living example of someone getting what he always wanted and finding it a nightmare - well, i hope he suffers this for a few more sweaty, drunken hours before disappearing somewhere unpleasant and letting someone grown up try to make sense of this situation.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 05:56 AM

"Doctor! Doctor!"
Too late, I'm afraid
The damage has long caught hold
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 06:04 AM

I recommend garlic & coriander nan bread with ginger preserve if you can't get bread!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 06:40 AM

Over seven in ten now think Boris and co. are doing well, up from 59% last week, with just two in ten (21%) now thinking they are doing badly, down from 31% last week. The biggest shift has been among those who voted for the Labour Party in December, with a majority (56%) of them now thinking the Government is handling this crisis well, compared to just 38% a week ago.

Who would have believed it? Just shows how totally divorced from reality the left posting here are.
Terrible things are facts.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: peteglasgow
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 07:11 AM

i'm asking if anyone has any doubts about him. what would it take? our wee town is grieving this morning following the death of our good friend Allan. down my street a retired theatre nurse who had gone back to work is at home ill with the virus. now is not the time to bang on about politics and such but i hope before my time is up that, for once, these ruthless tory bastards get their time in court.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 07:13 AM

And the mob howled for Barabbas, and at the end of the sixties 84% of Brits wanted to keep on stringing people up, and Trump won an election. Public opinion isn't facts. Not really.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 07:19 AM

Surely its the actual decisions that count, not how many people agree with that
You,ve kicked majority decisions into touch whenever they run against your own beliefs
Yor argument is populism - they're doing what people want - in fact the people haven't been asked what they want - it would take a nation wide survey to do that
As you've often said - snap 'surveys' can produce any result you want as UGove is constantly proving
The Government has dragged its feet over and over again, weeks behind Ireland on closing schools, crammed race meetings that should never have taken place - only now are adequate facilities being constructed to cope with victims
China constructed these immediately and in a matter of days and they appear to have the problem cracked while Britain is only just starting
Still milking an international disaster to score political points - I see
Even Johnson and his team are pleading for national unity to tacjle this problem while you continue to drive a wedge among the people
You reall aren't prepared to share anybody's hymn book are you
No wonder even your own side doesn't want to talk to you - you embarrass them
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 07:39 AM

Magnificent display of idiocy in this mornings Times
Johnson and his crowd of ministers crammed shoulder to shoulder dow a fight of stairs in number ten (presumably on their way to discus 'social distancing' and other ways to beat the virus) - two of them have the virus
"Do what I say and not what I do" eh !!!
Barm-pots all
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 08:19 AM

Or maybe it's Johnson's new plan for a Cabinet reshuffle !!
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 08:41 AM

Even Johnson and his team are pleading for national unity to tacjle this problem while you continue to drive a wedge among the people

Do try pulling that mighty oak from your eye, it may enable the brain to engage.

National Unity = support Boris. Not a difficult concept to grasp for most of us.

I suggest you review recent posts of both yourself and your acolytes. You are a comical fellow!

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: peteglasgow
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 08:50 AM

just carry on bickering guys - nothing else is happening out here

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 09:29 AM

There is a lot happenning. UK's first NHS Nightingale hospital set up in response to coronavirus pandemic. The hospital, based in Canning Town, east London, is set to open next week with 500 beds but there are plans to expand that to 4,000. NHS clinicians and managers are working with military planners and engineers to create, equip, staff and open the NHS Nightingale London, The ExCeL London Centre is being refitted to take hundreds of beds with oxygen and ventilators.Others are planned.
It comes as more than 38,000 former healthcare professionals and soon-to-be qualified students step forward to join the fight against Covid-19 in the coming weeks.

According to the government a total of 15,266 former staff responded to a call to action from officials, with 5,117 doctors, 5,605 nurses and midwives and 3,686 pharmacists and other professionals pledging to return to the frontline of the health service

This is joined up thinking from a competant gov ernment responding to a crisis that never before has been faced by the modern world. Their heroic efforts should be applauded not be subjected to the endless petty sniping seen on this forum.

And next week, 5,750 final year medics and 17,000 final year nursing students in England will also be asked to consider starting placements with support from seasoned workers, the Department of Health and Social Care said.
But NHS England is actively preparing for a number of scenarios as the outbreak continues and is working with clinicians and teams of military planners around the country.”

Scotland’s chief medical officer, Dr Catherine Calderwood, separately said numerous sites were being considered north of the border with the nation “on the cusp of that rapid escalation”.

This is an unprecedented response to a demand on health facilities that no country in the world is equipped for.

How do y'all think compo would be facing up to the cgallenge were we sad enough to have him as leader? He was mentally challenged to create even an election manifesto!

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 09:48 AM

You do have a point there Iains, but they will argue the hind legs off of a donkey!!

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 10:13 AM

The response of the Tories to this crisis (bearing in mind how they've severely run down the NHS over a decade) has been shameful. It's been inept, late, confused and indecisive. If you want to see how it should be done, look at South Korea. EARLY clampdowns, testing, testing and more testing, and aggressive contact-tracing. Nothing like that here. We are still doing way under a quarter of the testing that South Korea achieved after all this time. It feels like there's nobody driving. Front-line NHS staff are being put in harm's way in their thousands every day. The safety equipment and testing just isn't there. The government's ineptitude is killing people. Valiant attempts by Tory voters here to defend the indefensible is...well, just wacky...

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 10:46 AM

"National Unity = support Boris. Not a difficult concept to grasp for most of us."
Rather "My leader, right or wrong"
You ignore his virtually walking arm-in-arm with a fellow Coronavirus victim and a bunch of other politicians while at the same time demanding that the rest of Britain "social distances"
You choose to ignore the crass decision of allowing a huge national race meeting to take place despite being urged not to
They are two weeks behind Ireland in closing schools
Today, he has been slated by those health workers on the front line risking their lives and health for providing not them with adequate protection equipment
The man apparently doesn't do joined-up thinking and appears totally unaware of his own public displys of idiocy

It's become obvious that some among us have places loyalty to the party far higher than the health and welfare of the British People
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 11:36 AM

In the UK as of the 20th March 960/million were tested for covid-19.
This compares with:
Taiwan 900
Swirzerland 481
Sweden 1412
Spain 646
S. Korea 6148
Russia 918
Poland 334
Japan 117
Italy 3498
Ireland 1350
Germany 2023
France 559
Iran 957
It is so much better to argue with accurate data instead of hearsay and bluster. Doncha think?

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: An Buachaill Caol Dubh
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 11:56 AM

How's the chocolate ration? Or what about things on the Malabar Front?

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: peteglasgow
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 01:32 PM

a little while ago i put a message on here about a good friend of ours who died last night. it's not that unusual these days- there are many folk in serious danger and many millions who are terrified and in need of some solidarity and friendship. feel free to ignore this everyone but 'if you are happy and you know it clap your hands' is at least grossly insensitive and possibly psychopathic.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 01:51 PM

Sorry for your loss, Pete.

I have stayed off and watched this thread head for disaster. I can only remind you all of what I said 5 days ago. It has become impossible to discuss politics in any meaningful way on here. The wreckers have won.

I suggest, yet again, that anyone with any sense has no interaction at all with those wreckers.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 02:36 PM

"Sorry for your loss, Pete."
Second that
So far no-one we know has been effected
It was heart-warming to learn that Cuba, which appears to be relatively untouched have sent dozens of volunteer doctors to Italy and are responding to other world wide requests (though I doubt if that will get much publicity 90 miles away)
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 02:52 PM

”Sorry for your loss, Pete.”

And I echo that sentiment Pete. Sincere condolences.

”I have stayed off and watched this thread head for disaster. I can only remind you all of what I said 5 days ago. It has become impossible to discuss politics in any meaningful way on here. The wreckers have won.

I suggest, yet again, that anyone with any sense has no interaction at all with those wreckers.”

And those are the most sensible and truthful words posted by anyone on this thread. Unfortunately, a few people who really should know better seem incapable of comprehending this simple fact, and so another worthwhile thread gathers momentum towards its death.

None are so blind as they who will not see.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 03:28 PM

Last week I was called a "paragon"..

Now it seems I'm being called "an acolyte"...

Fine by me, can't beat Desmond Dekker's greatest hit to cheer us up...


[probably my worst joke for weeks...???]

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: DMcG
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 03:36 PM

Re: Ring-a-ring of Roses.

For reasons I don't fully understand there was an author on the BBC2 Newsnight programme last night.

She came out with the canard that 'Roses' is about the Black Death. NO IT IS NOT. STOP SPREADING THAT ERROR!



Oh, I was cross!

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 03:51 PM

The Tump administration is demanding that countries do not accept Cuban help FFS
Jim Caarroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 03:56 PM

”Now it seems I'm being called "an acolyte"...“

Not be me.

If it was my use of that word you’re referring to, read again. I was referring to acolytes of Dominic Cummings and Boris Johnson - ‘Dom & Dumber’. I really don’t perceive you as one of those...

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 05:06 PM

BWM - nah.. course not you..

but the bloke who should never be acknowledged [ideally, if we don't succumb to weakness...]

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 05:14 PM

From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 10:46 AM
. . .
They are two weeks behind Ireland in closing schools

The Taoiseach closed schools at the end of day 12 March Here
England closed schools at the end of day 20 March Here
Eight days is a lot less than two weeks.

This is not nit-picking, it is pointing out inaccurate statements being put forward as facts.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: DMcG
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 06:41 PM

Various reports are in live feeds, on the ITV site and elsewhere that the government is denying it has placed an order for Dyson ventilators. It says it has "expressed an interest" in ordering 10,000 once the ventilator has passed regulatory approval but will not order them until then, which as yet it it has not. It looks like 'ready in early April" should be interpreted as "ready in April for the first iteration of regulatory testing. It might pass first time, or several more iterations may be required."

Meanwhile a substantial order appears to have been placed elsewhere for designs that are already approved.

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 07:13 PM

"Eight days is a lot less than two weeks."
The decision was made a week before as was the British one, and the schools prepared to close - as I said, two weeks
The decision to close the schools in Northern Ireland were even later, even though it was suspected that a teacher had died of the virus
Stop wriggling and nit-picking - your Government had lagged behind behind from the word go
I see none of you are raising your hands in horror at Trump, your master's puppet-master, rejecting Cuba's offers of assistance and The Morning Star appears to be the only British paper to carry the story - only learned about it because a singer friend put it up on Facebook
I'd have thought that would have sickened all decent people - it is lethal gamesmanship politics and there is a blanket of silence surrounding it
Dangerous times
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: UK politics. Last ditch attempt
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 28 Mar 20 - 07:36 PM

Don't know if your reports are accurate Mac, but I would be interested to know if THIS IS TRUE
Jim