Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: DougR
Date: 01 May 03 - 03:51 PM

Pretty good rant, though, Beccy. :>)

DougR

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: Little Hawk
Date: 01 May 03 - 03:48 PM

Look, if you want to remove the deadliest weapon in most North American households, it's the television. Just like in 1984. The television is the mind-controlling tool that has lobotomized North American in the last 50 years, and is now busy lobotomizing the rest of the World. Its purpose? To sell "product" and homogenize culture. Its effect? To destroy the capacity for independent thought and action.

Take your gun and shoot the damn TV! By so doing, you will instantly reduce the influence of the $ySStem on your life and that of your children by 85% in one simple, decisive action. You will have time to actually participate in life again...to read...to play music...to socialize with other people in an effective manner...to exercise...to do hobby work...to function like a living being instead of like a sponge.

If you don't have a gun, just use a handy blunt or sharp object, like a crowbar or an ax. DON'T give your TV away to the underprivileged...you will make life even worse for them than it was before. Kill the little electronic bastard NOW, and bury it in the backyard.

- LH

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: Beccy
Date: 01 May 03 - 03:37 PM

"That is why the NRA refused, even after appeals by many political, social, and religious leaders, to postpone or cancel the NRA annual meeting in Denver 10 days after Columbine."

Just one thing... The NRA did not commit murder in Columbine. Two fruitcake, homicidal, VERY disturbed boys committed that atrocity. Don't give me any vagueries about how the NRA's powerful gun lobby. Do you know what constitutes that gun lobby? Normal Americans who don't want someone to take away their firearms. It's no "evil corporate" strawman. It's your neighbors, family, and maybe even *gasp* some of your friends that pay dues to the NRA in order to have their voices heard in Washington.

I want ILLEGAL guns off of the streets. You know- those same ILLEGAL guns that were not LEGALLY sold by law-abiding citizens. You know- some of those guns that were STOLEN or ILLEGALLY PURCHASED?? We DO have laws in this country regarding everything from how you cross the street, and how you purchase a home to how you procure and maintain firearms and people break them every day. Do you REALLY think that if you made gun ownership illegal that gun violence would just magically disappear? Not gonna happen, folks.

Rant over...

Beccy

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: GUEST
Date: 01 May 03 - 09:41 AM

P.S. I want to take away their SUVs too.

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: GUEST
Date: 01 May 03 - 09:12 AM

To make any claim that Heston was duped, which I think is bullshit, is what bothers me. Heston and his handlers are, in fact, very calculating and obsessed with "getting their message out". That is why the NRA refused, even after appeals by many political, social, and religious leaders, to postpone or cancel the NRA annual meeting in Denver 10 days after Columbine.

No one seems to be disputing Moore's reporting of Heston and the NRA doing exactly the same thing--making an appearance in Detroit, Moore's hometown, just days after another tragic school shooting, involving two elementary students. Why do we suppose that is? I'll tell you why. That school shooting--of they youngest gun victim in a school shooting in the US--isn't on the national radar. Columbine is. Heston and the NRA know that.

People seem to forget that some of us aren't buying Heston's Alzheimer's act. He is a professional actor after all, people. Reagan put his professional acting skills to the same use that Heston has used his with the NRA.

Moore exposed a side of America that the right wing doesn't want us to see--the underbelly of the political, judicial, and corporate collusion to keep the guns flooding onto Main Street, in the US and around the world. He also exposed a side of certain kinds of Americans, from violent criminals, to the well armed mentally insane, to the largest lobby group in the US, to the weapons manufacturers, to the weapons distributers and sellers. At least K Mart was honest enough to pull their damn ammo off the shelves when one of the kids with the bullets still in them showed up to protest in their wheel chair. Which was the scene I found the most painful to watch in the entire film.

I have absolutely no sympathy for a rich, jaded, cynical, power mongering old man, who has done nothing but sow the seeds of hate, bigotry, and intolerance for the benefit of the right wing extremists who have taken over the US without an official shot being fired from the Beltway, but leaving the streets of the US awash in the blood of hundreds of thousands of it's citizens in the past 30 years.

Frankly, Charlton Heston won't arrive in hell soon enough for me, and I thank Michael Moore for exposing him for the fraud that he is.

Not that I feel really strongly about gun violence or anything! But I live in a major urban area, where a lot of people have died needlessly from this shit, including a lot of children killed in the crossfire. I am sick of it, and I want the guns off the streets. And I don't give a shit if that bothers the Clinton Hammonds of this world.

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: mooman
Date: 01 May 03 - 08:30 AM

The only problem I have with Michael Moore is that he hasn't gone far enough yet in unearthing the squirming vileness that is corporate USA and I also regret there aren't a few more like him prepared to challenge the corporate lies and nonsense of certain media giants.

mooman

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: Nerd
Date: 01 May 03 - 01:55 AM

The three things Moore is usually taken to task for are:

1) the Charlton Heston speech, which edited together phrases from several different speeches.

2) the claim that the Columbine students went bowling with their classmates the morning of the shooting. This is genuinely in dispute, with several eyewitnesses swearing they were there and several swearing they were not.

3) the scene in the bank where Moore gets a gun as a premium. According to the bank, normally you would have to go to a gun shop to get the gun, but Moore's producer had called ahead and asked them to have a gun in the bank. Moore says that this is a lie, and that they in fact had a whole vault full of guns. Either might be lying, but no one disputes that he showed what "really happened" that day in the bank, without "fictionalizing" anything. In any case, the surprising thing is that you can easily get a gun as a bank premium, not that the gun is physically in the bank!

I'm willing to concede that Moore's tricks, especially the one he played on Heston, may have stretched the boundaries of truth. But the only reason people are yelling about revoking the Oscar is because they don't agree with his politics. If "Winged Migration" had won, would people be complaining that "the birds wouldn't have acted that way if your plane hadn't been there?" How about "juxtaposing this shot of the flock of ducks with that one was fictionalizing the film because they were really filmed miles apart and on different days?" I think not. People normally don't care about this kind of thing, but when there's a political message they react according to their political position. Indeed, if Moore's editing had made Heston look more sensitive rather than less, the very people who are complaining would be happy as clams. So it's not about truth, it's about politics.

In the end, documentary filmmaking doesn't tell an unramified truth, and people who claim it does or think it should probably don't watch too many documentaries and therefore shouldn't be taken seriously when they say they know better than the academy.

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: GUEST,pdc
Date: 30 Apr 03 - 09:36 PM

Actually, one site, which I will link below, makes a very compelling case that Moore actually faked, through either omissions or clever editing, much of the speech that Charlton Heston was supposed to have given at Littleton, Colorado, shortly after the Columbine shootings.

I have been a big Michael Moore fan since "Roger and Me," and didn't want to believe what I read at this site. But the evidence is quite overwhelming.

Here is the site: you have to check through it fairly thoroughly.

Bowling Fact or Fiction?

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: Sam L
Date: 30 Apr 03 - 05:07 PM

Haven't seen it yet, but, there's a reasonable distinction to make between "fiction" and the hyperbole Moore sometimes indulges in, at least in his comments. In a larger sense, all documentaries are fiction, they edit, they select, they add up to an account that someone is responsible for. It'll be interesting to hear what the film contains that is allegedly fabricated.

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: Leo Condie
Date: 30 Apr 03 - 10:15 AM

I don't particularly like Michael Moore, due to various reasons, but at least somebody's out there doing anti-establishment stuff and getting recognition. unfortunately, it's not bill hicks.

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: ard mhacha
Date: 30 Apr 03 - 06:31 AM

Come back Joe McCarthy, but then Joe would be classed as a leftie in this US tyranny. Land of the free,my ass.Ard Mhacha.

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Apr 03 - 01:19 AM

Thanks Doug you answered Barry for me ;-)

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: DougR
Date: 30 Apr 03 - 01:13 AM

I saw a report on Fox News Channel (a slight pause while some of you upchuck)that consisted of an interview with the lawyer in Tucson that is suing the sponsoring organization of the Academy Awards. The complaint was that Moore fictionalized the documentary, and the rules of the Academy are that documentaries are to be just that ...documentaries, no fiction.

DougR

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: Barry Finn
Date: 29 Apr 03 - 11:42 PM

Why would you consider him an imbecile? Don't answer about his politics do better than that. Barry

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Apr 03 - 11:06 PM

That they would even give an award to such an imbecile like Moore is totaly beyond logic, but thats Hollywood for you.

Subject: RE: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: GUEST,Dreaded Guest
Date: 29 Apr 03 - 10:48 PM

I liked 'Roger and Me' but haven't seen 'Bowling for Columbine'. Don't expect I'd find much humor in disarming America, if that's what it's about.

PayPal, for example. PayPal is being sued under the new USA PATRIOT Act for financial infractions. Saw the story a couple weeks ago but didn't mark it. the Patriot act is supposed to protect against terrorism, but it's first BIG use is against a money-collection company which is doing well. This is Organized Crime strong-arming the local merchants, folks. The Mafia 'protection' racket modernized and nationalized. And if Michael Moore or anyone else ever succeeds in disarming America, it'll only get worse. The PayPal suit is what they do when we're ARMED. No telling what they'd do (the organized criminals running the US govt) if we were dis-armed.

Did a google search for 'paypal patriot act'...first story out of the gate:

"Online auction company eBay said its PayPal auction payment unit is being investigated for possible violations of the USA Patriot Act. In its 10-K financial report to the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission, eBay said its PayPal unit received a letter on March 28 from the U.S. Attorney's office for the Eastern District of Missouri about the alleged violations. The letter says that PayPal violated provisions in the Patriot Act between October 2001 and July 2002 by providing payment services to online gambling merchants..."

PayPal & the PATRIOT Act

The mafia and gambling debt collection...now codified into US law. The business of America is now to suck the lifeblood out of successful businesses...and run them overseas if possible. America's in for some hard, hard times, folks, and I'd rather face these vampires with guns. The Nazis in charge are going to grill Michael Moore on a spit while they screen 'Roger and Me' someday, and I bet he comes up with a dandy sequel to 'Columbine' in the process.

Subject: Anti-Moore 'Revoke the Oscar' website
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Apr 03 - 10:15 PM

I can't recall now where on the forum I read comments/questions as to whether there was really a website trying to foment a backlash against Moore winning the Academy Award for 'Bowling for Columbine'.

There are actually a number of them. Two particularly bizarre ones I have come across so far:

http://www.revoketheoscar.com/

and this one:

http://www.moorewatch.com

The extremes that the right wing nuts will go to these days, to destroy people with whom they disagree, still takes my breath away. It is one thing to disagree with someone's politics. But this stuff goes so far beyond that, it is incomprehensible to me.

Although I suppose it is no coincidence that the PayPal buttons are displayed on the front page of both sites. The only thing better than destroying the lives of the people whose politics they dislke is, I suppose, making money while doing it.